On Saturday, May 26, 2012, Rob Weir wrote: > On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 6:18 PM, Kay Schenk > <kay.sch...@gmail.com<javascript:;>> > wrote: > > On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 8:23 PM, Kevin Grignon < > kevingrignon...@gmail.com <javascript:;>>wrote: > > > >> Hello all, > >> > >> Thanks for input. > >> > >> Here is what I understand the community is saying: > >> > >> AOO community = team > >> [UX] = mailing list topic prefix > >> User experience - design and development topic related to the end user > >> experience > >> People who contribute to user experience activities - a self-selected > group > >> of individuals working on a common user experience- related tasks for a > >> period > >> of time > >> Pronoun "I" is preferred to "we" > >> > >> Got it. This makes sense. > >> > >> I'm still adapting to the "Apache" way. I appreciated the ongoing > feedback > >> and guidance. > >> > > > > Kevin, > > > > I think you've got it! Yes, Apache is much flatter structure than what > you > > (many of us) were used to previously. The major advantage that I have > found > > is that everyone gets to know what everyone else is working on. It may > seem > > daunting at times, but it has a lot of advantages -- mutual decision > making > > giving everyone a say, no surprise actions by one group over another. > > > > One way to think of it: the "natural" evolution of a "team" is to > start with common interests, then to form a self-identity around that > common interest and team, an "us" versus "them" world view, then for a > formal leadership hierarchy to arise to "manage" and coordinate the > various boxes. This is a common structure that we see throughout the > world, from armies to corporations to governments to religions. The > legacy OpenOffice.org project did this as well, and to support it had > hundreds of mailing lists for the various projects, its councils and > steering committees, its designated leads and deputies, etc. > > On the one hand this is a very efficient way of doing this, if > efficiency is the primary goal. It is also great for those who get in > "on the ground floor". For initial stakeholders, who get embedded in > leadership positions, this is a wonderful model. But I think it shows > more tensions as the project grows, and more people join, and their > goals conflict with the views of the legacy leaders. A hierarchical > organization is challenged when dealing with this. And I think such > organizations are also challenged with developing innovation. > > KG01
Good stuff. Thanks for sharing. Regards, Kevin > In any case, self-identification is not a bad thing. I think it is > great to say "I am focused on Foo". The risk comes when I try to draw > a box around a group of individuals and say "We are the Foo team", and > by implication the others in the project are not, or their opinions > are less valued in these matters, or they are consulted less, etc. > > Now this does not mean that there are not de facto leaders and de > facto teams. Everyone knows who has the greatest expertise on the > website, or the download scripts. But no one has a title of "web > master" or "distribution lead". It comes from "taking the lead". > > So I would not be surprised if there is a small group of contributors > who develop the reputation for being UX experts and whose guidance is > automatically sought on related issues. In fact this is happening > already. But this can occur without designating teams or team leads, > drawing boxes around groups of individuals, etc. > > -Rob > > > > UX is of course critical to the success of Apache OpenOffice, so I think > > you'll find everyone here has an interest in this topic whether they > > participate in the UX discussions a lot or a little. > > > > > >> Regards, > >> Kevin > >> A contributor to the self-selected group of individuals working on a > number > >> of common user experience-related tasks for the next little while :) > >> > > > > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Thursday, May 24, 2012, Yong Lin Ma wrote: > >> > >> > Whatever it is named, I think it is good for people who are > >> > experienced in UX design identify themselves out here. Designers need > >> > other's help to implement their ideas. The bar for UX design of such a > >> > product is very low. Everyone can have its own opinions or brilliant > >> > ideas. But it is also easy to mess up a product by combining many good > >> > ideas together. If things going well, there will be situations that > >> > people get different opinions about a ux change and the fall into > >> > endless discussion. I would trust UX designer's choice in case like > >> > that, if we a decision must be made in the end. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 8:52 PM, Paulo de Souza Lima > >> > <paulo.s.l...@varekai.org> wrote: > >> > > 2012/5/24 Rob Weir <robw...@apache.org> > >> > > > >> > >> On Wed, May 23, 2012 at 10:39 PM, Kevin Grignon > >> > >> <kevingrignon...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> > >> > On Mon, May 21, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Juergen Schmidt < > >> > >> jogischm...@googlemail.com > >> > >> >> wrote: > >> > >> > > >> > >> >> Am Samstag, 19. Mai 2012 um 00:18 schrieb Paulo de Souza Lima: > >> > >> >> > 2012/5/18 Juergen Schmidt <jogischm...@googlemail.com> > >> > >> >> > > >> > >> >> > > Am Freitag, 18. Mai 2012 um 15:22 schrieb Paulo de Souza > Lima: > >> > >> >> > > > 2012/5/18 Jürgen Schmidt <jogischm...@googlemail.com> > >> > >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > On 5/18/12 10:32 AM, Kevin Grignon wrote: > >> > >> >> > > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > > Erik, > >> > >> >> > > > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > > Good stuff. Will do. > >> > >> >> > > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > do we really need such a separate page for UX community > >> > >> members? I > >> > >> >> > > don't > >> > >> >> > > > > think so and I personally think it goes in the wrong > >> > direction. > >> > >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> > > > There's nothing to loose, in my view. But I wouldn't call > UX > >> a > >> > >> >> > > "community". > >> > >> >> > > > I would call it a "team". > >> > >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > > >> > >> >> > > > > I am personally interested in many different areas of > the > >> > >> project > >> > >> >> and > >> > >> >> > > > > don't want to put my name on X different pages. My > >> > contribution > >> > >> in > >> > >> >> the > >> > >> >> > > > > different areas will be also different and will change > from > >> > >> time to > >>
