OK, I'll take a look at these.

On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 11:41 PM Linas Vepstas <[email protected]>
wrote:

> I'll be blunt: as to theoretical underpinning, I think that the ideas that
> the network generation code is based on is of fundamental importance.
> They're deeply related to vast tracts of mathematics and logic, and are, to
> a very large degree, virgin unexplored territory, both in terms of
> computing and algorithms, but also in terms of fundamental mathematical
> theory. (It's taken me a decade to figure this out, its hard to give a
> quick synopsis, other than to say that lambda calculus is a special case.)
>
> I have two (unpublished, but going to be submitted for publication) papers
> on this.  One is mostly "just words" and some pretty pictures. The other
> has formulas. The words-only intro is here:
> https://github.com/opencog/atomspace/raw/master/opencog/sheaf/docs/sheaves.pdf
>
> The with-formulas one is here:
> https://github.com/opencog/learn/raw/master/learn-lang-diary/skippy.pdf
>
> --linas
>
> On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 6:41 PM qwerty mnbvc <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for your answers, I will interpret it as that both of you are the
>> experts. I should immediately say that I have limited experience with
>> research and mediocre programming abilities (and I’m not being modest), but
>> that I’d like to improve.
>>
>> I’m currently being mentored by one of my professors to do a research
>> project. My professor has advised me to write a few different research
>> proposals and ultimately choose one to work on.
>>
>> Because the sky is the limit I’ve been using SWOT analysis to help me
>> filter those choices and one of my interests is goal planning. That’s why I
>> was curious about where OpenCog is at with regards to goal planning and was
>> looking for papers on your work.
>>
>> What do you guys think? Could you offer some suggestions of things that
>> might need to be researched and implemented to improve OpenCog’s goal
>> planning functionality? Or maybe point me to some papers that would help me
>> to come up with my own ideas?
>>
>> I did see this on the wiki:
>> Planning via Temporal Logic & Consistency-Checking
>>
>> I will look into this idea and keep digging around for others.
>>
>> Thanks
>> Q
>>
>> On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 8:04 AM Linas Vepstas <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry, a part two to the below, I hit send too fast.  See below.
>>>
>>> On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 9:51 AM Linas Vepstas <[email protected]>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 9:15 AM Ben Goertzel <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Linas, what sort of algorithm is used for the constraint-solving here?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Heh. Marvelous question! For just right now, in version 0.1, its
>>>> something I call "aggregation" (its supposed to remind you of DLA
>>>> "diffusion-limited aggregation") and its quite "simple": (well not all that
>>>> simple under the covers, but easy-to-understand) -- given an existing
>>>> collection of unconnected connectors, try attaching one more node. Repeat
>>>> until there are no more unconnected connectors.
>>>>
>>>
>>> So, for example, if one of the unconnected connectors is "I'm here on
>>> this side of the doorway", and another unconnected connector is "The other
>>> wide of the doorway is unoccupied", and one of the nodes is "try opening
>>> the door", that node would be attached, thus completing the motion-planning
>>> problem.  This may sound vague right now, and that's why an explicit demo
>>> is needed. I think it should be possible and not hard.
>>>
>>>
>>>> Aggregation is like generalized A*-search. Now, in A*-search, one only
>>>> ever attaches a single edge at a time, and the space is always 2D (or 3D I
>>>> guess..) In my case, the space doesn't have a dimension (or rather, doesn't
>>>> have to have), and you don't have to add just a single edge at a time - you
>>>> can add a three-pointed hyperedge, etc. (I guess that now I need to write a
>>>> A*-search demo for this...)
>>>>
>>>> I say "just right now" because it is clear that other algos are
>>>> possible; I'm pondering them now but have not yet created any specific
>>>> plans. If you care to propose any, let me know. I'm interested in
>>>> alternatives, because its clear that its hard to control the shapes of the
>>>> generated network by using aggregation.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The source of the constraints is that the connectors are typed. They can
>>> be connected only when the types match.  I think that this is equivalent to
>>> the kinds of constraint problems that ASP (answer-set programming) solves
>>> but not sure, I might be imagining things. Since all ASP solvers use SAT
>>> solvers under the covers, I guess that using SAT should be possible in this
>>> case too, but .. well, version 0.1 so far...
>>>
>>> I have not thought very much about other ways of specifying constraints.
>>>
>>> Search guiding is done by weighting.  So far, I have only very simple
>>> weighting.  I imagine that ECAN can be layered on this, but it would
>>> require a ground-up new implementation of ECAN. Other weighting and guiding
>>> schemes are possible. Anything that returns a number that says "hey this is
>>> not a fruitful direction to search in".
>>>
>>>>
>>>> However, I think that the aggregation algo is plenty good enough for
>>>> natural language -- I'm thinking of using this to replace sureal. As
>>>> "starting points" you can specify "to eat" and "Ben" and "pizza" and it
>>>> should generate all sentences with those words in it (in whatever word
>>>> order is correct, for the specified formation rules). So far, only a few
>>>> tiny examples of it doing this, with extremely limited vocabulary.  Its
>>>> version 0.1...
>>>>
>>>> --linas
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 3:11 AM Linas Vepstas <[email protected]>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> > There is also the brand new version 0.1 generator code. It can be
>>>>> thought of as kind-of a planner, in that a set of "start points" can be
>>>>> specified, and a set of "end points" as well, and it will generate all
>>>>> paths between the two.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > More precisely, it will generate a network of all possible
>>>>> interconnected paths between the endpoints, with the intervening network
>>>>> subject to rules of formation. So its not only a path planner, but also a
>>>>> constraint solver.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I have not yet written any demos showing "classical" planning, such
>>>>> as "to get through a doorway, you must first open the door", but this 
>>>>> would
>>>>> be an excellent example to have. If you're interested, I'd be happy to 
>>>>> help
>>>>> you write it
>>>>> >
>>>>> > It currently works for various simple demos, but that's it - its
>>>>> version 0.1 - (so I don't even know if the "open the door" example can
>>>>> work. I think it will...)  Here.  https://github.com/opencog/generate
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Ben, since you didn't mention the generator in the list below, I'm
>>>>> thinking that you're not really fully aware of it, or of what it can do 
>>>>> (or
>>>>> rather, the goals of what it can do).  Take a moment of pondering it ...
>>>>> >
>>>>> > --linas
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On Fri, May 1, 2020 at 12:54 AM Ben Goertzel <[email protected]>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> OCPlanner is deprecated a while ago and not yet replaced!
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> OpenPsi handles basic goal/context/procedure based action selection
>>>>> >> but not planning except at the trivial level
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> PLN logic works OK now (with scalability issues though) and could be
>>>>> >> used as the basis for a temporal logic implementation of planning,
>>>>> but
>>>>> >> that needs to be done still
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> ben
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> On Thu, Apr 30, 2020 at 9:48 PM qwerty mnbvc <[email protected]>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Hello,
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > I'm a student and I would like to learn more about OpenCog. What
>>>>> module deals with goal planning in general? Not like motion planning. Is 
>>>>> it
>>>>> OpenPSI or maybe OCPlanner? I noticed that OCPlanner was implemented by
>>>>> Shujing Ke, is this the "expert" I should reach out to for more info? I
>>>>> haven't been able to find any papers about OCPlanner (theory or 
>>>>> otherwise).
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > Thanks
>>>>> >> > Q
>>>>> >> >
>>>>> >> > --
>>>>> >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the
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>>>>> >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>>>> send an email to [email protected].
>>>>> >> > To view this discussion on the web visit
>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/3c5ff62b-be11-46cc-81c9-89b06e14f218%40googlegroups.com
>>>>> .
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> --
>>>>> >> Ben Goertzel, PhD
>>>>> >> http://goertzel.org
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to
>>>>> >> live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the
>>>>> same
>>>>> >> time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn,
>>>>> >> burn, burn like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders
>>>>> >> across the stars.” -- Jack Kerouac
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> --
>>>>> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>>>>> >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>>>> send an email to [email protected].
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>>>>> .
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > --
>>>>> > cassette tapes - analog TV - film cameras - you
>>>>> >
>>>>> > --
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>>>>> send an email to [email protected].
>>>>> > To view this discussion on the web visit
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>>>>> .
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Ben Goertzel, PhD
>>>>> http://goertzel.org
>>>>>
>>>>> “The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to
>>>>> live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same
>>>>> time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn,
>>>>> burn, burn like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders
>>>>> across the stars.” -- Jack Kerouac
>>>>>
>>>>> --
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>>>>> Groups "opencog" group.
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>>>> an email to [email protected].
>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
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>>>>> .
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> cassette tapes - analog TV - film cameras - you
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> cassette tapes - analog TV - film cameras - you
>>>
>>> --
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>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/opencog/CAHrUA37VST2NsJkTkHTtJ%3D3Qo6vxcFzC-2Lg38b%2B9rUnp5bpfA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>> --
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>> .
>>
>
>
> --
> cassette tapes - analog TV - film cameras - you
>
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