Hi Everyone, a problem with Ian's score is that it's not an ordinal scale, but a partial order. E.g. for the skin type variable, "healthy" is ordered in relation to the other elements, but "tissue paper"* is not ordered in relation to "dry" or "oedematous". In the openEHR Archtype Profile the VCOV rule disallows DV_ORDINALS with identical values in the C_DV_ORDINAL list, thereby only allowing total orders. This could be changed though!
Don't know how this scoring system is used, but "oedematous" and "dry" can not reasonably be seen as terminological synonyms! Regards, Daniel *what does "tissue paper" really mean in this context, especially in relation to dry?? Fri 2011-09-23 klockan 13:58 +0200 skrev Rong Chen: > Hi Ian, > > > > I my opinion either the ordinal nor ordinal constraint prohibit > ordinal terms with duplicated values in the same ordinal constraint. > > > It's probably the editor that needs to be fixed to cope with this > requirement. > > > Cheers, > Rong > > > On 2 August 2011 00:22, Ian McNicoll > <Ian.McNicoll at oceaninformatics.com> wrote: > > Hi Thomas, > > > > I am not quite sure what you are saying here, though I agree, > in essence, the scoring system, like most others, is > flattening a variety of patient findings into a single term > which also then carries a score. The problem is that whilst > the ordinal terms are unique, the related values are not and > can have duplicates. > > > So is this a valid ordinal ? ordinal constraint? > > > Ian > > Dr Ian McNicoll > office +44 (0)1536 414 994 > fax +44 (0)1536 516317 > mobile +44 (0)775 209 7859 > skype ianmcnicoll > ian.mcnicoll at oceaninformatics.com > > Clinical Modelling Consultant, Ocean Informatics, UK > openEHR Clinical Knowledge Editor www.openehr.org/knowledge > Honorary Senior Research Associate, CHIME, UCL > BCS Primary Health Care www.phcsg.org > > > > > > On 1 August 2011 17:04, Thomas Beale > <thomas.beale at oceaninformatics.com> wrote: > > If we consider this an ordinal based model, in which > numbers which have multiple possible values, e.g. skin > type: 1 is for tissue paper dry, oedematous, etc - > this would be modelling using terminological synonyms > for a notional term whose meaning was something like > 'waterlow skin type 1'. > > - thomas > > > > > On 01/08/2011 16:17, Ian McNicoll wrote: > > > > I have come across an interesting example of where > > we might want to model an ordinal constraint where > > the values associated with each term are not unique. > > The example is the Waterlow Score > > http://www.judy-waterlow.co.uk/downloads/Waterlow% > > 20Score%20Card-front.pdf If you look at the > > bottom-right corner "Major surgery / Trauma" you > > will se that two terms have identical values. > > Currently the openEHR Archetype Editor will not let > > me add duplicate values with separate terms. It is > > not clear (at least to me) from the specifications > > that this behaviour is correct. Is this a CR for the > > Archetype Editor, a CR to the Ref Model, or a clever > > alternative modelling suggestion to me? Regards, Ian > > Dr Ian McNicoll office +44 (0)1536 414 994 fax +44 > > (0)1536 516317 mobile +44 (0)775 209 7859 skype > > ianmcnicoll ian.mcnicoll at oceaninformatics.com > > Clinical Modelling Consultant, Ocean Informatics, UK > > openEHR Clinical Knowledge Editor > > www.openehr.org/knowledge Honorary Senior Research > > Associate, CHIME, UCL BCS Primary Health Care > > www.phcsg.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > openEHR-clinical mailing list > > > > openEHR-clinical at openehr.org > > > http://lists.chime.ucl.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical > > > > > -- > Ocean Informatics > Thomas Beale > Chief Technology Officer, > Ocean Informatics > > Chair Architectural Review > Board, openEHR Foundation > Honorary Research Fellow, > University College London > Chartered IT Professional > Fellow, BCS, British > Computer Society > Health IT blog > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > openEHR-clinical mailing list > openEHR-clinical at openehr.org > http://lists.chime.ucl.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/openehr-clinical > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > openEHR-technical mailing list > openEHR-technical at openehr.org > http://lists.chime.ucl.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/openehr-technical > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/private/openehr-technical_lists.openehr.org/attachments/20110923/4a0e7709/attachment.html> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ocean_full_small.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 5828 bytes Desc: ocean_full_small.jpg URL: <http://lists.openehr.org/mailman/private/openehr-technical_lists.openehr.org/attachments/20110923/4a0e7709/attachment.jpg>
