Thanks Erik, for your reply. I did some more thinking in the meantime.
In SNOMED you have disorders, and they have attributes, and we all know
there are thousands of them. Writing so many archetypes is impossible,
and probably not necessary, but when you take in account to limit the
number of used paths, (this helps also limiting the length key-index for
a key value store), and you really think smart how to do it, so it can
be generated.
Because SNOMED is in fact a description of many clinical meanings with
post-coordinate expressions and allowable attributes, just like
archetypes are a way to describe the same, it seems quite a potential,
especially because it can be used to generate archetypes, I had never
thought of the idea until yesterday. So I haven't worked it out.
I don't know which part is of high quality and how you define high
quality, (or do "they" define it?), and also to consider, are archetypes
always of high quality?
Archetypes are version-able, so, they could follow SNOMED versions. You
cannot build the world in one day. It has to grow, but a lot of work can
be done in one major blow.
In the Netherlands we can use SNOMED for free, so that is a good thing.
By the way, the semantics which are baked in the OpenEHR RM make it a
bit more difficult. I think that a data-storage, modeled like CEN13606
would make it easier to do this. But it may also be possible in OpenEHR,
we must work it out, to find it out.
Bert
On 29-04-16 14:15, Erik Sundvall wrote:
You can do some very clever things with Snomed CT especially if using
"post-coordination" in a good way. Sadly many current EHR-systems
can't utilize that power of Snomed CT fully. Clever archetyping with
e.g. some built in post-coordination-generating logic combined
with some extended (AQL?)querying-capabilities in openEHR storage
systems could help openEHR-based systems jump ahead of a lot of the
EHR competitors regarding efficient Snomed CT use...
It is often good to look at Snomed CT when designing archetypes.
Especially the high quality parts of Snomed CT (there is constant
maintenance and cleanup going on). I believe this is happening
more already when designing archetypes today.
Regarding licensing I believe there has been a discussion going on
between IHTSDO and the openEHR foundation for a long time, perhaps the
management board has an update?
I believe we might need to add a function to repositories/CKMs that
removes Snomed bindings/codes from archetypes if downloaded by
non-licensed users. (A lot of the structure/content itself is based on
(non protected) general medical knowledge and I believe IHTSDO
concludes it can be partly reused without license, thus not stopping
global use of Snomed-inspired archetypes.)
Others will surely add more to the discussion.
//Erik Sundvall
Sent from mobile...
fredag 29 april 2016 skrev Bert Verhees <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>:
Part two is of course, generating templates, and we almost have
the GUI's in place.
It is the enormous collection of medical datastructures which can
be the source of many generated EPD-software.
Bert
On 29-04-16 08:50, Bert Verhees wrote:
Hi,
I got an idea when reading the nice story from Heather on
LinkedIn. In fact it is hers idea, but in a opposing way.
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/journey-interoperability-part-i-heather-leslie
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/journey-interoperability-part-ii-heather-leslie
I wonder in how far it is feasible and useful to create
archetypes from SNOMED concepts, it would be possible to
generate them, with attributes and so on.
In a few hours time, one would have a complete forest with
archetypes, including ontology in more languages.
Maybe some smart handling, filtering, combining can create a
better collection, also looking at the paths, so that there
are similar paths for similar situations, to keep the number
of different datapoints low, which can help creating a faster
key-value storage.
I don't know how it is about copyright, with members, and
licensing, that should be looked at.
The argument that SNOMED is fragmented should not count, I
think (however without having an expertise on this), because,
when working with handwritten archetypes will always be
incomplete and fragmented.
Bert
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