Thanks Yury Tello; for sharing your experience!
On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:03 AM, Yury Tello <yte...@cubicerp.com> wrote: > +1 to Carlos and Ana. > I had the same trouble to selling the OPW and to renew the partnership. So > far I am without partnership and the only change has been that I have USD $ > 3,000 more in my pocket. But need renew soon because i need sell some OPW > for some customers who want migration service to V8. > > So I think that the OPW has high value for migration, but has little > impact on other services offered . Maybe OpenERP SA may rethink this > product to get more revenue. > > About PULL strategy , I think it's good for OpenERP SA , considering that > currently sells services directly to end customers . Last December a client > who was trading with me, received an email with a quote from OpenERP SA > with a lower price, of course the client is upset with me because he > thought I was cheating. > > So I think PULL strategy is good for OpenERP SA. > > Finally, I think this is a good first step to listening to customers from > OpenERP SA (partners , end customers and community). > > Regards > > P. D. All issues raised here were discussed with OpenERP SA before the end > of my partnership and unfortunately they did not listen. > > > 2014-02-16 19:26 GMT-05:00 Ana Juaristi <ajuaris...@gmail.com>: > > Carlos.... +1 to everything you are explaining in a so clear way. >> About: >> >> *The services you offer to partners are somewhat rigid in some cases. I >> would love to sell an Enterprise contract with every OpenERP >> implementation. But this is not possible. The OPW is not made for >> end-users, us partners we have to take part in the process.* >> Just an example: >> As partner wanting to pivote or at less make compatible my actual >> bussiness model with this new app aproach, asked to OpenERP sales people >> about possibility of taking 10 users on Saas in advance for reselling but, >> using them on several customers (lets say 5 different customers single user >> and 1 single customer with 5 users for example) that would be 6 different >> DBs... They say in that case, I would not benefit any discount of final >> price but if I sell 10 users to a single customer I benefit 50% of final >> price. It has nosense I think. One 10 users customer is not going to take a >> SAAS aproach or at less it would be very difficult to sell. >> On the other side, I say... ok so I give you the single user customer and >> you invoice yourself to him... Answer: could be, but in that case that >> customer is not count as part of your partnership level, better if you >> invoice to him. So, you are asking to me to take care of a customer that >> I'm not taking any benefit or trying to sell more users that they need >> (complex both cases... ) so yourself are cutting our wings to fly and yours >> to grow up. >> >> That's only an example (I could give you 3-4 more) where you are NOT >> considering your partners channel as your customers. If people wants to >> make bussiness with you, you can not close the door. Whatever they are >> offering you should at less consider it for opening new win-win ways. Even >> if at the end you decide not to go that direction because is not strategic, >> valuable for you, at less you should consider all proposals. You always say >> that we must benefit of bussiness you are offering to partners but it's not >> like that. Partners should give you benefit without having to force them to >> sale or something, simply because you are offering so good services that >> they are wanting to buy them to you. By now, services offered to partners >> is only discounts on services offered to final customers. That aproach is >> wrong, because final customers are much more close to partner than to you >> (unless he is your own final customer). It's much more easy for partners >> selling their own services to final customers thant trying to sell yours >> only for discounts and small amounts of not visible valuable services (even >> if they are valuable, don't misunderstand please). >> >> I have discused this point with Nhomar several times. He can not >> understand that we and most of partners I know can not sell OPW to >> customers. I'm trying from begining. I never succed. Why? Maybe because I >> don't know selling it (could be so training needed) or because customer >> consider your company far-far away... He only wants system working and for >> him we are first point of solution. They understand nothing about launchpad >> or reporting bugs or creating patches and for sure they don't mind if bug >> is from core or localization or custom module. He needs global support and >> it can not be offered (by the moment) directly from you. For them, it >> doesn't matter where is or who is OpenERP, S.A they only want a phone >> number (my number) to call and solve the problem (inmediatly) >> So... IMHO it's needed reviewing the way OpenERP is offering his services >> to partner thinking on partner. Not in final customers and discounts for >> their services. >> >> Things that I'm ready to pay for without thinking very much on it: >> >> - Technical training renewal from version to version >> - Good technical doc for each new version. >> - Good reference site >> - Videos and good training material. >> - Specific industries cases of use / success >> - Modelizing different industries sectors using OpenERP standar >> modules without using custom modules. >> - Shared nice real solutions. >> - Good qualified leads. I said qualified... :) >> >> I say again. It's not wanting to fight. It's just telling you several >> things that we are missing from begining. >> >> Thank you very much: >> Ana >> >> >> 2014-02-17 Carlos Vásquez <carlos.vasq...@clearcorp.co.cr>: >> >>> Hi Fabien, >>> >>> I do like your thoughts about the marketing strategy in general. I agree >>> with the communication techniques you propose. >>> >>> >>> *ERP vs. Apps* >>> >>> As our fellow partners stated, the main discussion point is which image >>> we do want to market to our customers. Speaking about the ERP vs. Apps >>> approach, I kind of agree with both you and the other partners. We do not >>> spend one cent in marketing, we only follow-up sales of people that contact >>> us. For now it has been enough to keep us busy and running. Those people >>> who contact us are almost always looking for an ERP. We usually have to >>> sell an implementation project where other ERP solutions are also >>> participating, sometimes there are big ERP solutions (SAP, Dynamics, >>> Oracle, etc), and usually there are local ERP solutions. I think dropping >>> the ERP solution as a marketing point, would affect us in this market. >>> >>> But, we have more and more calls from people looking for a cheaper and >>> faster solution for their problems. An ERP implementation is not affordable >>> nor suitable for their business. We are getting ready to offer OpenERP in a >>> way very similar to your SaaS offer. This offer will be ready very soon and >>> we already have several customers waiting to test it. Also, we started >>> doing fast, out-of-the-box implementations about 3 months ago to gain >>> experience for our new "SaaS" offer. It has proven to be very successful. >>> These customers are more prone to identify themselves with a solution >>> marketed as business apps running together. Here I do understand your point >>> and it will help to bring more customers for this line of service. >>> >>> >>> *Open Source* >>> >>> Also, the first kind of customers are usually more interested in an Open >>> Source solution and they often understand its benefits and it can be an >>> important sale point for them. The later kind of customers, usually do not >>> know about Open Source, and they do not care. They need a good, affordable >>> and reliable solution for their needs. Open or closed is the same for them. >>> So again, we do have here 2 ways of marketing this because there is in fact >>> (as Ana said) 2 targets. >>> >>> The one thing that help us in the sale process is that our customers can >>> easily find us in the partners directory. The new partners page with >>> automatic country filter is doing a great job with this. Also the way you >>> redirect all kind of leads to us. >>> >>> >>> Maybe it is a good idea to separate the ERP/OpenSource and the >>> Apps/Product approach. Is it really necessary to choose only one way? I >>> always like simplicity, but in this case, focusing only one target may be >>> wrong, it is worth the discussion. >>> >>> >>> *Pull strategy* >>> >>> There is one more thing I think I can give some valuable feedback. The >>> services you offer to partners are somewhat rigid in some cases. I would >>> love to sell an Enterprise contract with every OpenERP implementation. But >>> this is not possible. The OPW is not made for end-users, us partners we >>> have to take part in the process. We have worked out several bugs with the >>> support team. Our experience has been varied. Sometimes the person assigned >>> to the bug can solve the problem in a reasonable time frame, other times we >>> have ended up fixing it ourselves. In all cases we have to spend at least a >>> couple of hours in total of our time. If our customer reports a bug, we >>> have to test to know where is the problem. If there is something wrong with >>> some official code and there is an OPW contract we can send it to your >>> team. In most cases, your team needs several replies from us. They usually >>> do not do a very good job finding the problem, we have to do some heavy >>> testing for them as they keep rejecting the issue of proposing some >>> simplistic workaround. For important bugs, we end up spending more than 2 >>> hours answering mails and doing remote desktop demo sessions. At the end we >>> have to integrate and deploy the solution. I explain all of this because we >>> have to charge several hours to our customers on top of an Enterprise >>> contract. And we also need to support the localization and customizations. >>> The total cost of support gets expensive. Of course your contract also >>> includes migration. But if we want to use this service, we also need to >>> charge some extra fee to migrate the localization and customizations. This >>> is the main reason we do not sell Enterprise contracts very often, and the >>> ones we have sold, are not renewing. >>> >>> For partners which do develop and do heavy customization, I find the >>> Enterprise service and its pricing method very rigid. I am worried because >>> we could work much better with your team and get you to earn more money, >>> which is good for all of us. And for our new "SaaS" offer, I contacted you >>> guys to work out something to include support from your team in our cost >>> structure, but the only thing you have to offer is the regular Enterprise >>> support with the usual "per user" pricing method. This will at least >>> duplicate our cost for each user. This is not acceptable, nor is reflecting >>> the reality. You know that in this kind of service, the amount of support >>> is deluded because everyone is using the same exact code base. So we >>> decided to go on our own, without your support. We ran some numbers, and we >>> think it will be cheaper to support the platform ourselves, even with the >>> migration process. >>> >>> So as of now, I do not think you have good service offer for us. The >>> pricing structure do not work outside Europe of North America. I know and >>> appreciate you are making efforts to adapt your prices. It has been a very >>> good first step. But it is not enough. You have to differentiate >>> configuration only partners, from development ones. We are more than open >>> and willing to work with you. So, even if you make a great marketing >>> strategy, the pull strategy you propose will not work very well in our >>> particular case. I think it is the best way to go, we need to improve who >>> does generating partners revenue will create revenue for OpenERP S.A. >>> >>> >>> *Recap* >>> >>> All of this said. I do appreciate your efforts to involve the community, >>> and do think that there are great things we (the partners) can do with you >>> (OpenERP S.A.). A marketing investment in marketing will benefit us. And I >>> do trust your judgment to integrate internal ideas with community >>> suggestions into an excellent marketing strategy. >>> >>> Regards, >>> -- >>> Carlos Vásquez >>> CTO · Director de Ingeniería >>> CLEARCORP S.A. >>> >>> carlos.vasq...@clearcorp.co.cr >>> Cel: +(506) 8351 4484 >>> CR: +(506) 4000 CORP (4000 2677) >>> US: +1 (786) 472-4267 >>> skype: crvasquez >>> twitter: cvclearcorp >>> >>> 300 m. Este de la Escuela >>> Calle de Platanares >>> 11402 San Jerónimo, Moravia >>> San José, Costa Rica >>> (GoogleMaps: http://goo.gl/8YqM4S) >>> >>> http://www.clearcorp.co.cr >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community >>> Post to : openerp-community@lists.launchpad.net >>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community >>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> CEO Avanzosc, S.L <http://www.avanzosc.es> : Office phone / Tfono >> oficina: (+34) 943 02 69 02 >> Ana Juaristi Olalde <http://www.anajuaristi.com/>: Personal phone: 677 >> 93 42 59. User/usuario skype: Avanzosc >> www.openerpsite.com >> >> >> *El contenido de esta comunicación y de toda su documentación anexa es >> confidencial y se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario. 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Arenales 395 Of. 507 - Lima 1 - Peru > > _______________________________________________ > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community > Post to : openerp-community@lists.launchpad.net > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openerp-community > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > >
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