I just tried turning off ClearType on Windows and found that the result was pretty ugly. I assume that with ClearType turned off, the results should be comparable to what JavaFX is producing with grey-scale smoothing.
I noticed that the same web page rendered text differently between Chrome and Firefox - Firefox seemed to have darker text. So even among native apps you can get different results for the same font. Scott On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 3:21 PM, Phil Race <philip.r...@oracle.com> wrote: > John T, > > Per a couple of earlier emails in this thread John H is deliberately > disabling LCD text > so has grey scale, hence you can't compare directly with a native app > since they all use LCD. > > Any comparison has to be > 1. Using the same string > 2. Rendered in the same fashion : LCD or greyscale, hinted/unhinted. > 3. Using the same font (face, size etc) > 4. Using the same colours (fg&bg) and watch out for the UI controls - they > used > to tweak your text colour so that (eg) black became dark grey, reducing > contrast > which reduced legibility, thus also invalidating any test. I am not sure > if this is still the case, > but contrast is very important for text and you should make sure its as > high as possible. > > -phil. > > > > > On 8/22/2013 11:35 AM, John C. Turnbull wrote: > >> Am I the only one who looks at that screenshot and thinks that the fonts >> look really bad and obviously different from a native app? Its not just >> the Plot section, its all text on the screen. >> >> This is what I am talking about. I wouldn't even describe the >> differences as "subtle" as to me there is a dramatic difference in quality. >> >> Can this be fixed or are JavaFX apps always going to stand out for all >> the wrong reasons like this? >> >> On 23/08/2013, at 0:05, John Hendrikx <hj...@xs4all.nl> wrote: >> >> Those are all normal controls, the plot section is just a Label for >>> example. >>> >>> On 22/08/2013 13:39, John C. Turnbull wrote: >>> >>>> John H, it may be just me but pretty much *all* the fonts in your >>>> screenshot >>>> look quite poor and noticeably different from native font rendering. >>>> If you >>>> look for instance at the text in the "Plot" section, to me that text >>>> looks >>>> awful. >>>> >>>> Is that inside a WebView or some other control? >>>> >>>> -jct >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: >>>> openjfx-dev-bounces@openjdk.**java.net<openjfx-dev-boun...@openjdk.java.net> >>>> [mailto:openjfx-dev-bounces@**openjdk.java.net<openjfx-dev-boun...@openjdk.java.net>] >>>> On Behalf Of John Hendrikx >>>> Sent: Thursday, 22 August 2013 17:29 >>>> To: openjfx-dev@openjdk.java.net >>>> Subject: Re: Poor quality font rendering >>>> >>>> >>>> I took another good look, and I see what is bothering me is mostly how >>>> the >>>> glyph "2" is rendered on my system (it has a thick appearing curve >>>> attached >>>> to the base). I've included a screenshot of my application that uses >>>> several different sizes fonts, but it seems only the ones in the top >>>> bar are >>>> rendered somewhat wierd. >>>> >>>> http://ukyo.xs4all.nl/**Digit2RenderedPoorlyInTopBar.**png<http://ukyo.xs4all.nl/Digit2RenderedPoorlyInTopBar.png> >>>> >>>> I'm on Windows 7, JavaFX 8b99, 32-bit, using D3D pipeline (I get this >>>> stuff >>>> in log in an infinite loop, so must be D3D I think): >>>> >>>> D3D Vram Pool: 129,613,674 used (48.3%), 129,613,674 managed (48.3%), >>>> 268,435,456 total -- >>>> com.sun.prism.impl.**ManagedResource.printSummary(** >>>> ManagedResource.java:134) >>>> 75 total resources being >>>> managed >>>> >>>> -- com.sun.prism.impl.**ManagedResource.printSummary(** >>>> ManagedResource.java:153) >>>> 4 permanent resources >>>> (5.3%) >>>> >>>> -- com.sun.prism.impl.**ManagedResource.printSummary(** >>>> ManagedResource.java:154) >>>> 2 resources locked >>>> (2.7%) >>>> >>>> -- com.sun.prism.impl.**ManagedResource.printSummary(** >>>> ManagedResource.java:156) >>>> 43 resources contain interesting data >>>> (57.3%) -- >>>> com.sun.prism.impl.**ManagedResource.printSummary(** >>>> ManagedResource.java:158) >>>> 0 resources disappeared >>>> (0.0%) >>>> >>>> -- com.sun.prism.impl.**ManagedResource.printSummary(** >>>> ManagedResource.java:160) >>>> >>>> I also have this in main, before Application.launch is called: >>>> >>>> System.setProperty("prism.**lcdtext", "false"); >>>> >>>> In .root in CSS I have: >>>> >>>> -fx-font-family: "Arial"; >>>> -fx-font-size: 16px; >>>> -fx-font-weight: normal; >>>> >>>> So all the fonts you see should be Arial (but the sizes and weights are >>>> tweaked depending on location). >>>> >>>> --John >>>> >>>> On 21/08/2013 20:51, Felipe Heidrich wrote: >>>> >>>>> John H: >>>>> >>>>> In JFX we decided to go with sub-pixel positioned text (as opposite to >>>>> >>>> pixel grid aligned). >>>> >>>>> That said, on Windows for grayscale text, we are not doing that (yet). >>>>> Are >>>>> >>>> you running Windows, with D3D pipeline ? >>>> >>>>> I would need to see a picture to be sure I understand the problem you >>>>> >>>> describe. >>>> >>>>> Felipe >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Aug 21, 2013, at 10:19 AM, John Hendrikx wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I think I also noticed a change in font rendering around b99 >>>>>> somewhere... >>>>>> >>>>> the fonts seem to be thinner than before, or perhaps more poorly >>>> aligned >>>> with pixel boundaries. I'd prefer glyphs laid out in the same way each >>>> time, ie. letters are always on a new pixel boundary, so the same letter >>>> will look the same regardless of what preceeds it. I have LCD rendering >>>> turned off as I donot appreciate colored fringes on my glyphs. >>>> >>>>> On 21/08/2013 14:53, John C. Turnbull wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I have only really tested JavaFX extensively on Windows so my >>>>>>> comments here apply mainly to that platform. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It seems that even with a font smoothing type of LCD, font rendering >>>>>>> in JavaFX is not at the same level of quality of native >>>>>>> applications. My current experiences are with JavaFX 8 b103 and I >>>>>>> find that all rendered text in JavaFX appears of a significantly >>>>>>> poorer quality than that which I would see in Word for example or >>>>>>> even in IE10 (which I believe uses the same text rendering engine). >>>>>>> >>>>>> Also, these observations are based on text in "standard" >>>> >>>>> controls and the quality of font rendering is dramatically worse >>>>>>> within the Canvas control. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I am not an expert in font technology but I have read many times >>>>>>> that the levels of antialiasing for text that can be achieved in a >>>>>>> GPU-based renderer are always going to be less than that achieved in >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> >>>>>> CPU-based renderer. >>>> >>>>> This is often explained on the basis of graphics card drivers being >>>>>>> optimised for performance and the rapid rendering of triangles >>>>>>> commonly required in games rather than for rendering quality when it >>>>>>> >>>>>> comes to text. >>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> Is this the reason why JavaFX font rendering appears less legible >>>>>>> and of a lower quality than native apps? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If so, how does IE10 for example achieve a higher quality of >>>>>>> rendering when it seems to also use DirectWrite? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Is the quality of JavaFX font rendering ever going to improve? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -jct >>>>>>> >>>>>> >
