HO and the rest of OS loving colleagues,
i love this discussion on OS certification. also, I have been asking myself
over and over again if the IAF certification is really worth it...
this whole discussion is also a good input to discussions on building a strong
"National Quality Infrastructure" (NQI - I do some consultancy in this field
but not on the technical aspects, more on OD and facilitation of those who are
part of it) - which includes certification, accreditation, testing, standards,
regulation, metrology, etc.
the discussion touches on these important topics: "when certification is
necessary or not", "when certification may work or not", "how to make sure you
are hiring a really competent certified service provider or producer of a
product", "does certification help you meet your needs and results you want to
active?", etc.
This could already be a good OS topic - for the association of certification
bodies, certifiers, and if I may now add the "uncertifiers"... I could feel
again the rebel in each of us...
Best regards
carms
If there is to be any peace it will come through being, not having. -- Henry
Miller
________________________________
From: Lisa Berkley <[email protected]>
To: World wide Open Space Technology email list
<[email protected]>
Cc: World wide Open Space Technology email list
<[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, 9 August 2013, 8:50
Subject: Re: [OSList] Certification?
Harrison,
All i can say is: Amen to that!
Sent from my iPhone
On Aug 8, 2013, at 16:36, Harrison Owen <[email protected]> wrote:
Jeff – as a sometime perpetrator and totally confused (certifiable) I can
attest that if at any point I were to intimate that I actually knew what I was
doing, that would be a significant error. However I feel quite comfortable in
my not-knowing if only because the “process” (OST) is not something I “do.”
Under the best of circumstances my contribution is to invite folks to do what
they already know how to do – to be what they already are. It always works, and
it works even better when I get out of the way.
>
>Harrison
>
>Harrison Owen
>7808 River Falls Dr.
>Potomac, MD 20854
>USA
>
>189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)
>Camden, Maine 04843
>
>Phone 301-365-2093
>(summer) 207-763-3261
>
>www.openspaceworld.com
>www.ho-image.com (Personal Website)
>To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of OSLIST Go
>to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>
>From:[email protected]
>[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jeff Aitken
>Sent: Thursday, August 08, 2013 7:17 PM
>To: World wide Open Space Technology email list
>Subject: Re: [OSList] Certification?
>
>having been trained by the motley lot who dreamed up this stuff, i can attest
>that even that great privilege does not mean that i know much or should be let
>near the folks in your organization.
>
>jeff.
>On Thu, Aug 8, 2013 at 3:53 PM, Peggy Holman <[email protected]> wrote:
>To be certified confused…where do I sign up?
>
>Chris -- thanks for your decidedly clear and unconfused comments on
>certification.
>
>I seem to recall in some past conversation that rather than certification,
>lineage is alternative to the client conundrum of who am I hiring? To be
>trained by the creator, or by someone who trained with creator, on down the
>line seems to have worked for a variety of practice traditions through the
>ages.
>
>Still no guarantee, as Chris noted below.
>
>appreciatively,
>Peggy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Aug 8, 2013, at 10:35 AM, Chris Corrigan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
>Ohh I love this topic too, because as we go on and on it becomes clearer and
>clearer to me that Harrison's original idea (which predated Open Source) was
>sheer genius. There is an expression in english: "Closing the barn doors
>after the horse has left." It's too late to certify people in Open Space
>Technology, and thank God!
>
>You simply cannot certify people as a way to protect the brand and the reason
>is simple.
>
>Certification is based on an industrial quality assurance model In other
>words, every product leaving the factory is guaranteed to work the way we say
>it is going to work. If it doesn't you can have your money back and we'll
>give you a new one that works. Every product can be tested before it leaves
>the factory to be sure it works reliably,
>
>You simply cannot do that with facilitators. No amount of certification will
>guarantee that a client will get what they want every single time. And a
>facilitator taking a single training in Open Space or some other method will
>by definition NOT be perfect leaving the factory. You need to develop a
>practice, and even still there are contexts and situations that will challenge
>and surprise you. "Be Prepared to Be Surprised" is the only certification I
>can reliably give to anyone that has trained with me. We are not engineers,
>architects or doctors. We are people whose skill is in responding well to
>myriad and changing contexts.
>
>The International Association of Facilitators went down this route. I have
>seen some horrible facilitation done by people who are certified by the IAF.
>So much so that I have no faith in that certification as standing for
>anything. It is a worthy idea but it simply cannot be implemented.
>
>Open Space is a brand like brainstorming is a brand, like using markers and
>flipcharts is a brand, like parliamentary procedure is a brand. In a few more
>decades, with any luck, the world will have forgotten where it all came from
>and it will just become a basic operating system of groups. In the last 10
>years that prospect has really come on as people have stolen, mashed up, mixed
>together, modified and redesigned Open Space Technology. Participatory
>process is becoming an acceptable way of doing things, and will only become
>more so. Most conference goers for example are now able to report on
>conference evaluations that they would have rather had a world cafe or an Open
>Space than a keynote address. I see it all the time. There is a fluency in
>the world with this method and others.
>
>I fundamentally distrust anyone who makes a concerted effort to certify Open
>Space. If Harrison Owen, the guy that put it all down on paper, refuses to do
>it for excellent reasons, then I wonder what gives anyone else the right to do
>it.
>
>And for me that is a terrific example of how to steward something that really
>has an impact in the world. Offer it up and let it go and only defend it from
>those that would try to own it. Thankfully Open Space Technology I think is
>at a place in the world where it defies ownership. Anyone who tries it will
>simply be laughed off the stage.
>
>Chris
>
>
>
>On Thu, Aug 8, 2013 at 9:29 AM, Kári Gunnarsson <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>I love the Certification dialogue and I think that the recurrence of
>the dialogue is necessary. As I have looked around of things that
>trace there roots to open space or give the impression to be similar
>is some way. Some of these processes have the Certification hierarchy
>protecting the Quality of the Brand and the revenues steaming from the
>property that the brand name is.
>
>The hierarchy of the Certification process associated with Brand names
>is a way to close space and create tension witch in turn will fuel the
>flow of cash from the people that can pay, excluding the people that
>can not. It is an exercise in creating a closed system to fuel a
>business plan. And naturally, any start up consultancy offering some
>tools will need some flow of cash to pay the phone bill.
>
>When I was at Wosonon in Berlin back in 2010, I head one participant
>saying. "You always have the clients that you deserve".
>
>By knowing that the space for clients is well open and the law of
>mobility is active from them is perhaps a little scary. This scare can
>be remedied by letting go of the outcome and commit time to prepare to
>be of more benefit for my future clients.
>
>Here I have opened up many lines of thoughts that stay with me when I
>think about this topic. What I would like to have written down is some
>sort of vision on how to go about using the open space as a central
>idea and core philosophy in a practise.
>
>On Certification, my vote would go for "no central Certification", but
>I don't mind that various offspring's of Open Space go ahead and
>create there own brand name with the associated cash flow headaches
>and salaried sales staff of Certification trainings in there bid to
>get a bought with a handsome cash out from lager companies.
>
>That said, I would like to see more people get interested in the
>"boring" methought of meeting, working and begin together called open
>space.
>
>By the way, I am bored to tears by people hearing about open space and
>begin pissed off by the way open office layout (also called open space
>in my country) has been ruining there work experiences.
>
>This is starting to be a long rant, Ill stop now.
>
>With the breeze from Iceland
>Kári
>
>
>On 8 August 2013 14:50, Harrison Owen <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Certification (whatever that might mean) seems to be a perennial topic. I
>> suppose that is understandable, but for myself it is a horrible idea. My
>> reasons are several. First of all it is too much work. The thought of
>> developing the criteria, programs, and even worse, “protecting the brand” is
>> totally exhausting. We’d have to have certifiers to certify the certifiers
>> and so on ad infinitum. Second reason – Open Space seems to be taking care
>> of itself. When folks come on with “A little Open Space,” “Sort of Open
>> Space,” “Modified Open Space,” ... the participants (increasingly)
>> understand that they aren’t getting the genuine article—and say so. I recall
>> one instance where a large gentleman stood up in the middle of the “program”
>> and loudly proclaimed, “This sure ain’t Open Space! I’m out of here.” And he
>> walked. I guess you could call that “Market Certification.” Best of all ---
>> it works all by itself. One more thing not to do!!
>>
>>
>>
>> Harrison
>>
>>
>>
>> Harrison Owen
>>
>> 7808 River Falls Dr.
>>
>> Potomac, MD 20854
>>
>> USA
>>
>>
>>
>> 189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer)
>>
>> Camden, Maine 04843
>>
>>
>>
>> Phone 301-365-2093
>>
>> (summer) 207-763-3261
>>
>>
>>
>> www.openspaceworld.com
>>
>> www.ho-image.com (Personal Website)
>>
>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of OSLIST
>> Go to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OSList mailing list
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>> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]
>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below:
>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
>>
>
>
>
>--
>Kári Gunnarsson
>[email protected]
>gsm: +354 8645189
>_______________________________________________
>OSList mailing list
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>
>
>
>
>--
>---
>CHRIS CORRIGAN
>Facilitation - Training - Process Design
>Open Space Technology - Art of Hosting
>
>http://www.chriscorrigan.com
>Upcoming workshops
>
>Wise Leadership in Practice
>August 22-25, Sänna Cultural Manor, Estonia
>
>Art of Hosting - Art of (Inter)action
>October 8-10, 2013, Montreal, PQ.
>
>Art of Hosting - Participatory Leadership and Social Collaboration
>November 11-14, 2013, Bowen Island, BC, Canada.
>
>
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