On Dec 31, 2008, at 6:37 PM, Kevin Callahan wrote:
On Dec 31, 2008, at 6:35 PM, Stefano Mori wrote:On 2009-Jan-01, at 02:23, Kevin Callahan wrote:There were no Hamas on the boat. What's your point.Fundie terrorists don't abide by rules about international waters,these weren't terrorists - even if Israel says they "believe" they were terrorists - they weren't. Why they believed they were terrorists needs to be investigated. Okay .. so your house has been broken into in the past .. now you look out your window and you see this guy walking up the street towards your house ... you don't know who he is or what he's doing .. but he's near your property .. or maybe he steps on your lawn... you take him out, right? Is that how the law works in England? let's say you have posted a sign on your lawn saying "No Solicitors", yet they walk up your driveway ... ignoring the sign -- can you shoot them?
I guess in England, you can shoot the unlucky bastard! true? Maybe there are no "Good Samaritan" laws applicable to seafaring vessels ...
• Similarly "Good Samaritan" laws take precedent over property laws where applicable. Civilians are afforded certain protection in emergencies - people cannot generally sue their would-be rescuers for breaking ribs attempting CPR, or damaging property while helping a person in need. Obviously, professionals (EMT, Doctors, etc) are held to a higher standard, even when they're not "on the clock."
• Property owners and their agents (for example, security guards) may only use reasonable force to protect their property. For example, setting booby traps on a property to hurt trespassers and shooting at trespassers are usually forbidden except in extreme circumstances. Several US states, however, preserve to varying degrees the Castle Doctrine, a concept from English common law allowing the use of deadly force against trespassers. The US state ofTexas in particular has especially broad guidelines for the acceptable use of deadly force.[1]
• Not all persons seeking access to property are trespassers. The law recognizes the rights of persons given express permission to be on the property ("invitees") and persons who have a legal right to be on the property ("licensees") not to be treated as trespassers; for example, a meter reader on the property to read the meter. A police officer seeking to execute a warrant is a licensee. A surveyor studying the land for government use (usually map making). Someone such as a door- to-door salesman or missionary (a Jehovah's Witness or Mormon for example), would be a solicitor and not afforded the invitee exclusion to enter the private portion of the premises, and therefore be atrespasser. In a more recent case, Jehovah's Witnesses refused to get government permits to solicit door-to-door in Stratton, Ohio. In 2002, the case was heard in the U.S. Supreme Court. The Court ruled in favor of the Jehovah's Witnesses, holding that making it a misdemeanor to engage in door-to-door advocacy without first registering with the mayor and receiving a permit violate the first Amendment as it applies to religious proselytizing, anonymous political speech, and the distribution of handbills.[3]
• Most jurisdictions do not allow "self-help" to remove trespassers. The usual procedure is to ask the trespassing person to leave, then to call law enforcement officials if they do not. As long as the trespasser is not posing an immediate threat, they cannot be removed by force. It is usually illegal to arrest a trespasser and hold them on the property until law enforcement arrives as this defeats the purpose of allowing them to cure the trespass by leaving. A large exception to this rule are railroads in the United States and Canada, who employ their own police forces to enforce state or provincial trespassing laws. Railroad police have the ability to independently arrest and prosecute trespassers without the approval or assistance of local law enforcement. Further, in many jurisdictions, trespassing on railroad tracks is considered a very severe offense comparable to drunk driving, with severe fines imposed on the tresspassers. Some jurisdictions even going so far as to impose fines higher than that of a drunk driving or marijuana possession conviction.
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A sign warning against trespassing at Mater Dei High School in New Jersey
• Most, though not all, jurisdictions allow "Benevolent Trespassing" for extreme situations. For example, if you have a car accident and somebody is injured, you may legally force entry into an empty building to call an ambulance. Similarly, if a structure is burning, one may forcibly enter to rescue persons trapped inside. The law assumes people will make a reasonable effort to notify property owners if possible.
• Similarly "Good Samaritan" laws take precedent over property laws where applicable. Civilians are afforded certain protection in emergencies - people cannot generally sue their would-be rescuers for breaking ribs attempting CPR, or damaging property while helping a person in need. Obviously, professionals (EMT, Doctors, etc) are held to a higher standard, even when they're not "on the clock."
• Marking property as private property can be done in a variety of ways. The most obvious way is to put up a sign saying "No Trespassing" or "Private Property". However, a continuous fence has the same effect in most places. Many jurisdictions allow the use of markers when fencing would be impractical or expensive. For example, Ontario, Canada allows the use of red paint on landmarks such as trees to mark the boundaries of private property.
• Property owners may allow some trespasses while excluding others. For example a sign saying just "No Hunting" could conceivably allowhiking, snowmobiling or bird-watching, but would give notice to hunters that they would be trespassing if they entered onto the property.
• Trespass is not limited to human beings. For example, the owner of cattle or dogs may be responsible for an animal's trespass in some jurisdictions. Further by causing an object to enter a property one can commit an act of trespass, whether it be earthworks, flood water, or objects thrown onto the property or allowed to travel onto the property.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trespass
if anything they try to take advantage of any weakly defended stretch of water. Small fast boats have been used in numerous attacks, recently Mumbai. Being a Colonel Blimp about it will only play into their aggressive fundie objectives, eg. obliteration of Israel. Israel is trying to defend its waters with blockade zones which have clearly marked navigation corridors for permitted shipping. You know what happens in America now when a plane leaves its flightpath? International laws are starting to change as countries try to deal with terrorism, piracy and smuggling. That small vessel was not carrying terrorists, but you only know that once you catch it and board it. In the meantime, it was deliberately trying to run a blockade. I may be the nicest guy in the world, but if I try running past a line of security guards protecting a checkpoint, what are they going to do? What would you do? What's *your* point? Stefano_______________________________________________ OSX-Nutters mailing list | [email protected] http://lists.tit-wank.com/mailman/listinfo/osx-nutters List hosted at http://cat5.org/
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