Fool me once - shame on you. Fool me twice.....you know the rest. On 22 Aug 2013 15:36, "David Kean" <david.k...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> Have faith my friends. Have faith. Do not confuse the strategy of a > single p & l of that of the company or that of DevDiv.**** > > ** ** > > *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto: > ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Joseph Cooney > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 21, 2013 10:22 PM > *To:* ozDotNet > *Subject:* Re: Future of .NET**** > > ** ** > > The mono project and xamarin seem to be doing great things with and for > .net. Apart from some bright spots, devdiv have jumped the shark.**** > > On 22 Aug 2013 15:16, "Greg Harris" <harris.gre...@gmail.com> wrote:**** > > I was told at Uni (1980) that COBOL was going to die real soon... Since > then COBOL paid off all of my first mortgage.**** > > It was not until about 1994 that COBOL stopped earning for me and I am > sure that there are a lot of people out there still paying their way with > it.**** > > .NET may be on the start of a down turn, but if it is, it has a long way > to go, for now I am happy to stay with .NET, but Microsoft scare me, they > have to look out for what they think is best for Microsoft and we could get > swept up with the good or the bad of that, we have to accept that we have > little control of the ride we are on! Would other options be better, I > doubt it, just different.**** > > ** ** > > Interesting to look at the job trends, look at: > http://www.simplyhired.com/a/jobtrends/trend/q-asp.net+programmer%2Cruby+programmer%2Clamp+programmer > **** > > ** ** > > [image: Asp.net Programmer, Ruby Programmer, Lamp Programmer trends graph] > **** > > ** ** > > There is a down trend which is not good, I don't know why the data stops a > year ago????**** > > It may have all changed in the last year?**** > > ** ** > > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:37 PM, Scott Barnes <scott.bar...@gmail.com> > wrote:**** > > In 2008 there was a tipping point in the .NET scene overall and the > timing was likely due to the post .NET adoption peak or high as to grow > further meant you had to go to outlying areas of the market. It also had to > do with the amount of investment and evangelism that went on in Academic > institutions also dropped significantly (due to scenarios where teachers > didn't like ASP.NET or WinForms due to their blurring of basic OOP > principles mixed with costs associated - compared to python, java, php, etc) > **** > > ** ** > > Microsoft decided to react and it's really been a 3-5 year campaign on > driving adoption in the outlying areas - specifically going after pretty > much the entire landscape(s) of competitors at once ... i mean if they > aren't fighting and campaigning to convince you all that Google is the > enemy then its Apple and when not Apple it's back to the LAMP is evil etc. > **** > > ** ** > > The problem is they've lost perspective by shifting everyone from > strategies that start and finish on the fiscal year time lines they in turn > have created this area of uncertainty where you have a lot of .NET coders > out there writing WinForms, WebForms, Asp MVC, WPF, Silverlight etc all > being told they really need to stop doing this and go with HTML5/JS for > Windows8/Wp8 or C++ for more intensive scenarios. If you then still reject > they then concede XAML/C# is fine but you still need to write code > differently because even the name spaces are different (yet you can't > figure out why given well..they behave and act the same as their > counterparts...) which you then realise that was a forcing function on > adopting new over old. > > By not giving a transition period between 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011 to now.. > they've basically pushed the crowd of .NET further away from a sustaining > model of adoption. It then asks everyone who are loyal to the brands and > technology that comes out from Microsoft to consider two things - "Can you > trust us to stick this strategy out given our past" and "Have you really > considered us against the alternative?" > > If this were a political party soliciting you for your vote its as if > they've told you "vote for us and will probably tax you more can't say for > sure" :) > > So yeah, adoption cycles are going to fluctuate around what happens post > Winforms/Wpf of past... I'd wager that gaming industry will influence the > outcome given they have a lot more to win/loose around this entire > uncertainty (given device/desktop/console buying power is massive).**** > > ** ** > > That's where a lot of start-ups occupy today - gaming/kickstarter style > space.**** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > > **** > > --- > Regards, > Scott Barnes > http://www.riagenic.com**** > > ** ** > > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 1:35 PM, Andrew McGrath < > andrew.mcgr...@workslink.com.au> wrote:**** > > .NET 2.0 coding still has some uses....**** > > ** ** > > Had to stick to it to create a .NET IDE for the web....using Visual Web > GUI (essentially .NET WinForms that runs via your browser) and Xamarin.*** > * > > ** ** > > Can now write .NET code once and run it on web, natively on Android, iOS, > Mac and PC....useful in some scenarios.**** > > > AFAIK, still need native on mobile devices to be able to interact with > SQLite as I don't think Javascript + PhoneGap gives you that.**** > > ** ** > ------------------------------ > > *From*: "Nathan Schultz" <milish...@gmail.com> > *Sent*: Thursday, August 22, 2013 1:17 PM > *To*: "ozDotNet" <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> > *Subject*: Re: Future of .NET**** > > ** ** > > I don't think Microsoft was ever popular with the Startup community. The > last time I did anything in that area LAMP was all the rage. > I have one mate in the Start-Up community who has used ASP.NET MVC on a > project, and said it stacks up okay against Rails. But he hated Entity > Framework (he said he wasted days trying to get it working properly). He's > since moved on to using Google's Go progamming language. **** > > Certainly I like the direction Microsoft is going by cherry picking the > best out of other technologies (e.g. lamda expressions, dynamic language > run-time, and MVC). Compiler as a Service also seems to have interesting > possibilities. It's certainly not growing stale like COBOL. It's when I > have to help out with Java projects (despite some good libraries), it feels > like a time-warp back to .Net 2.0 days.**** > > ** ** > > On 22 August 2013 09:47, Greg Harris <harris.gre...@gmail.com> wrote:**** > > Microsoft are trying to fix the startup thing with Biz Spark ( > http://www.microsoft.com/bizspark/)**** > > But when they make super stuff ups like the non support of Silverlight you > do have ask what the @#$%^&* they are doing !!!!!**** > > ** ** > > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 11:42 AM, Craig van Nieuwkerk <crai...@gmail.com> > wrote:**** > > I don't think this will necessarily filter into the enterprise in a big. > .NET and Java are both really strong in enterprise, as are Oracle and SQL > Server but not that strong in startups. Enterprise and startups have > different requirements. **** > > ** ** > > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 11:37 AM, Michael Ridland <rid...@gmail.com> > wrote:**** > > ** ** > > Does this eventually filter into enterprise and if so what does that mean > for .NET?**** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 11:35 AM, Michael Ridland <rid...@gmail.com> > wrote:**** > > ** ** > > Python / Django / Rails. **** > > ** ** > > I think you would be hard press for find a .NET job on AngelList. Well > actually I can see 53 companies out of 3916 that use asp.net. **** > > https://angel.co/ifttt/jobs**** > > ** ** > > I'm not bashing just noting my observations and wanted opinions?**** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 11:14 AM, Rob Andrew <rand...@voyageconnect.com> > wrote:**** > > Michael,**** > > ** ** > > What is the development platform of choice for the cool kids you are > seeing?**** > > ** ** > > Just wondering.**** > > ** ** > > Rob**** > > > > > *----- Original Message -----* > *From:* Michael Ridland [mailto:rid...@gmail.com] > *To:* ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com > *Sent:* Thu, 22 Aug 2013 10:38:49 +1000 > *Subject:* Future of .NET**** > > Hi**** > > ** ** > > It's clear that in the Start-up and Web communities the choice for > development platforms is not .NET.**** > > ** ** > > Does this mean eventually this will filter up? I'm wondering what this > means for the future of .NET? **** > > ** ** > > I once had a developer say .NET is the new COBOL.**** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > >
