Abby I must agree with Trish, those of us working within the system instead of criticizing from afar do get offended and defensive when such broad statements about midwives and midwifery education are made that are so negative. We all on this site, I would argue, believe in the rights of women, value of birth without medicalisation etc etc But to make a difference we have to acknowledge the many grey areas of our work and do our best. We are all very passionate people and I think it extremely worrisome that any one on this site would think any of us would say that 'just a mum' opinions are any less than 'professional' ones. I would have to say that this shows that you are not getting what some of us are trying to say, argue and defend. (I do not mean to speak for anyone specifically) The whole point of our passion and work is 'just mums' - the value and worth we put into the diversity and value of all women. Might I add I am also a mum and when I write here I do not distinguish between my professional or personal self. It is not relevant in the context of what people may or may not value in what I say. There are so many positions available to us and when there are so many obstacles traumas and general crap we have to deal with day to day in aiming to improve childbirth practices and options it is incredible frustrating to have it simplified generalized and vilified. Burn out rate is very high for those of us ( and I do not aim to speak for anyone specifically except myself) 'in the system' because we care and try so hard. Getting together is often a great way of venting worries and frustrations, I wonder if you just haven't heard much of the good stuff - because it is out there. I would also have to argue that many women out there who do not experience the type of birth we desire or see as wonderful and achievable do not see themselves as victims of an uncaring system. I would have to say that many of the women in my study would be pissed off if you categorised them as making poor choices, lacking insight, dreams or hope. There are huge changes that need to occur across the board to change women's perceptions of safety, risk, choices and value in the experience of childbirth. We are not there yet, there is not (and I do find this unfortunate) a majority consensus amongst women about choice, control and safety in childbirth. Its not just about obstetric nurses versus traditional midwives versus doctors versus ideology etc etc. It is huge, complex and highly historical. I think these are some of the things some of us are trying to get to in our work and study? We too are wise have a voice and care passionately about women. Belinda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Abby and Toby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2004 12:00 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Students, training and other things was Re: uterinerupture 1998
> Hi Trish, > > > Abby, if I didn't think I was trying to impart a degree of wisdom, and > assist students to find their own wisdom, together with the women (heard > of the follow-through experience???) and the lovely midwives in hospitals > who assist them with onsite learning, and the VERY occassional homebirth > midwife who can take a student... then I would give it up. With > (diminishing) respect, evaluate a curriculum or two, enrol in a midwifery > program, and don't generalise what you see in a workshop of 10 > midwives to what is taught in every curriculum in Australia. > > I don't know why, because I disagree with the training that I know of, this > means that disrespect is okay. Whoa. I am just a mum, passionate about women > and birth, with a voice. Please disagree with me, but I don't think comments > like (diminishing) respect are necessary or helpful. I'm not really into > personal attack in disagreements......well only with my husband! Maybe > because I am only a mum and not a midwife then you see my opinion as > threatening or not worth noting, so that warrants disrespect?? I don't > know.........whatever. > > I am not generalising from one workshop I attended. I believe in testimony > as a conveyancer of truth. I have listened to qualified midwives, student > midwives, teaching midwives, international midwives and student > midwives,that have quit their courses because of lack of education, > testimonies and stories of there education, or lack there of. I don't know > where they went to school or trained, I do know they are/were unhappy with > it. > > I'm going to leave it there Trish. I think you are seeing what I am saying > in a really wrong light. > I do not, never have and never would claim to have all the answers or even > one answer. I do not claim to know how to fix the worlds problems or stop > all maternal deaths. What I do know is that most birthing practices in this > country suck! Women are being treated poorly by alot, not all, caregivers > and something needs to change. I am a dreamer and a hoper. I find nothing > wrong in dreaming of a better future for women in birth. > > I don't want to argue about this curriculum says this and this says that > blah blah blah, I wouldn't even know. I only know what women have shared and > what I have read. > > It would be a great shame if you quit midwifery. You seem a strong, > knowledgeable woman committed to women, change and education. I think it is > wonderful that teachers like you exist. > > Love Abby > > -- > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe.
