Sure. Thanks Dante. Thanks Michel for the link!
On Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 4:56 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson < [email protected]> wrote: > Hi Brent, > > there is some convergence happening via > > http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php > > *" Let's get some cool people together and live in a tribe / family / team > / intentional community. Experiment with better ways to live, and make the > world a cooler place. We'll work together to survive and look after each > other. "* > > Email : > > http://bwcd.vdcn.org/doku.php/email_list > > /// > > Further approaches can be discussed there ? > > > > > > On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Michel Bauwens <[email protected] > > wrote: > >> hi Brent, I have aggregated the wide variety of open business models at >> http://p2pfoundation.net/Category:Business_Models >> >> not only are there solutions, but there are plenty of solutions, the key >> question is of course finding the one that fits with your particular >> project ... >> >> but the general scheme, building a community around a commons, and create >> a market entity around it (such as a coop), works well >> >> Michel >> >> >> On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 10:59 PM, Brent Shambaugh < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> Since around mid-march or so I've spent time trying to refining the >>> ideas from my Distributed Economy blog ( >>> http://www.adistributedeconomy.blogspot.com/) into a proposal. I kind >>> of felt like I was teaching myself all of computer science. Even though I >>> felt I was learning quite a bit, it came at a considerable cost to myself. >>> It is hard to think in a peer-to-peer fashion while questioning the fabric >>> of academia and industry. I felt that I did not fit in anywhere and was >>> unsure build a business model around it. Physically, it seemed that way >>> too. I also became very cynical. I grew isolated, but thought I needed time >>> for self-study so what I was writing was credible, competitive and lucid >>> enough that I could put faith in it to be confident with others. Still, >>> it's scope was huge, enough to be not taken seriously by itself I guess. I >>> felt I basically was trying to change the operating system of the planet, >>> and everything else was built on top of that (businesses, academia, >>> etc...). Was the value network the business model? That, and maybe support? >>> Do I just try to start something like Linux and hope for the best? That's >>> the sort of scale I was envisioning. Fortunately, the web efforts have done >>> a lot of the groundwork. It's more of a use then. It's hard to say I did >>> much beyond understanding and some aggregation of connections that others >>> might not have seen. People tell you to hold on to some things in private, >>> while at the same time you want to integrate with the rest of the >>> community. Maybe what I have is significant, maybe it is not. It would be >>> great to share it. I believe enough in it to think it could help people. >>> I'm almost done with what seems to resemble a 20 page outline. I do not >>> want to fragment the community (or be fragmented from it), but at the same >>> time I need some sustainable way to survive. Paradoxically, it seems it >>> needs the support and the efforts and the ideas of the community to >>> succeed. Are there any solutions? I'm sorry if I come off as arrogant in >>> any way. >>> >>> -Brent >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:50 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks Eric >>>> >>>> Yes, I'd be glad to follow up on the thinking and research you are >>>> doing around metacurrency, and participate in the scheduled hang out. >>>> >>>> further note : >>>> an interesting reply by June on this thread, >>>> also available on the public p2pf list archive >>>> >>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >>>> >>>> >>>> - [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is >>>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks >>>> !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01085.html> >>>> Dante-Gabryell Monson >>>> - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested >>>> is understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks >>>> !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01087.html> >>>> June Gorman >>>> - Re: [P2P-F] Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested >>>> is understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks >>>> !<http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg01088.html> >>>> Dante-Gabryell Monson >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:43 PM, Eric Harris-Braun < >>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi All, >>>>> >>>>> It turns out that where the technical side of the MetaCurrency Project >>>>> has led us has lots to do with Semantic Data or rather, from our point of >>>>> view, Semantic Computing. Ceptr, the computing stack we are designing to >>>>> build our tools out of, pushes Semantics down into the lowest levels of >>>>> the >>>>> stack, in a way that we haven't seen with the approaches inherent embodied >>>>> in RDF/URI. >>>>> >>>>> For folks interested in our approach, I'm scheduling a tech hang-out >>>>> in the next week or two. If you want to be notified of it please drop me a >>>>> line. >>>>> >>>>> -Eric >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 11:51 AM, Dante-Gabryell Monson < >>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> *pre-note : I try to understand if we can , possibly collectively, * >>>>>> *write an article that could be published on the p2pfoundation blog,* >>>>>> *as to better explain, in words and with images / graphics , * >>>>>> *some of the potentials of building on, for example, Linked Data - >>>>>> and/or similar technologies enabling us to more easily redefine our >>>>>> realities collectively -* >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> *If anyone wrote on these topics, or is interested in combining our >>>>>> efforts and research in writing about these topics, or if some can help >>>>>> in >>>>>> making such article in a enjoyable reading moment ( combining it with >>>>>> nice >>>>>> imagery and stories ? Like some science fiction authors manage to do - >>>>>> yet >>>>>> talking about the present ? ) it would be great. I mean, not only about >>>>>> one specific application or project, but about the potential to work >>>>>> together on various applications based on common protocols. * >>>>>> >>>>>> *Some call it a "Global Brain" , or a "Web Operating System" , ... * >>>>>> >>>>>> *Below is what I want to say to open up the topics for now ... I am >>>>>> open to brainstorm further, and progressively collectively organize an >>>>>> easier to understand blog post, or series of blog posts, on such topics.* >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks Bob, Thanks Helene, >>>>>> >>>>>> for your replies. >>>>>> >>>>>> I sent this message initially motivated by the realization, after an >>>>>> email exchange with Michel. >>>>>> >>>>>> Michel pointed that in his view there seemed to be little interest >>>>>> regarding Linked Data / Semantic Web approaches on p2pf related forums. >>>>>> >>>>>> So I wondered if this was really the case, and if so, what could be >>>>>> the reason, >>>>>> and how could it be better communicated. >>>>>> >>>>>> Possibly showing how different projects may have an interest in using >>>>>> such technologies in their research and development of applications, >>>>>> showing overlap of different applications that want to embody such >>>>>> technologies, >>>>>> and overlap and re-use of the data generated by each of these >>>>>> applications to enable yet new applications. >>>>>> >>>>>> For example, Bob in collaboration with Sensorica for Open Value >>>>>> Network tools... >>>>>> >>>>>> Although the technologies can be re-used and adapted for a variety of >>>>>> applications, >>>>>> hence Netention ( mostly Seth coding for now ) researching >>>>>> approaches, and inviting others into such research and development, which >>>>>> hopefully can be re-used for Open Value Networks, or for alternative >>>>>> forms >>>>>> of learning building on available information on our wiki's , etc >>>>>> >>>>>> Other projects, such as metamaps, are also interested ( or already >>>>>> including ) such approaches ... >>>>>> >>>>>> Pavlik was already talking about FOAF ( one aspect / approach using >>>>>> Linked Data concepts ) many years ago. I now notice Pavlik is regaining >>>>>> interest, including in Schema and Json , ... midst others, in support of >>>>>> Sharing Economy applications ? >>>>>> >>>>>> /// >>>>>> >>>>>> But in a larger sense, I feel it is about contributing to the >>>>>> development of remedies regarding Anoptism ( which Olivier talks about , >>>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Anoptism , while facilitating at first >>>>>> Holoptism ) >>>>>> >>>>>> In the understanding which I developed by interacting with Seth and >>>>>> others via lists such as "Global Survival >>>>>> List"<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/global-survival> >>>>>> , >>>>>> >>>>>> such Web 3.0 approaches get us closer to the concept of " Noosphere " >>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noosphere >>>>>> >>>>>> Or should I be already speaking of Web 4.0 , since I can notice a >>>>>> convergence with artificial intelligence. >>>>>> >>>>>> See : >>>>>> >>>>>> http://novaspivack.typepad.com/RadarNetworksTowardsAWebOS.jpg >>>>>> ( and another graph about internet evolution >>>>>> http://www.didael.it/sito/evoluzione_web.htm , also calling some >>>>>> phases we have technologies for and for which we need more collaboration >>>>>> in >>>>>> research to reduce the threshold for its usage , "the metaweb" >>>>>> http://koolaidantidote.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/metaweb_graph.gif >>>>>> ) >>>>>> >>>>>> Emergent Collective Consciousness, Approaches to Collective >>>>>> Intelligence, to Emergent forms of Networked Political Economies, ... >>>>>> >>>>>> and can be combined with , for example, understanding in the field of >>>>>> Artificial Intelligence. ( could be interesting to refer to the Global >>>>>> Brain Institute ? http://globalbraininstitute.org/ ) >>>>>> >>>>>> There are so many implications regarding decision making, >>>>>> collaboration and collective intelligence, learning, resource allocation >>>>>> , >>>>>> and even finance... >>>>>> >>>>>> I see a lot of parallels between the potentials of Linked Data >>>>>> approaches, >>>>>> and the spirit of the Meta Currency project. >>>>>> >>>>>> Although there are indeed different potential approaches and >>>>>> technologies, >>>>>> and hopefully we can choose inter-operable ones. >>>>>> >>>>>> There are series of existing Ontologies. RDF Schema being one >>>>>> approach which seems to be receiving wider acceptance. >>>>>> There is also the use of Json. >>>>>> >>>>>> Then there is the potential combination between Folksonomies and >>>>>> Ontologies, into Folksontologies... And I did not even mention other >>>>>> interesting approaches ( slightly different then the W3C approach ? ) , >>>>>> such as that of Pierre Levy >>>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_L%C3%A9vy and IEML >>>>>> http://p2pfoundation.net/Information_Economy_Meta_Language >>>>>> >>>>>> At least in spirit, in my understanding of it. - for each >>>>>> application, various combinations of technologies may been considered, >>>>>> >>>>>> yet I see potential in enabling inter-operable formats, and data that >>>>>> can be re-used along compatible data graph approaches... >>>>>> >>>>>> How can this best be explained with imagery that anyone could >>>>>> understand, >>>>>> and beyond any one specific project ? Enable the imagery of a new >>>>>> way of creating and using data... re-using such data, enabling us to >>>>>> contextualize and choose the ( political and economic ) "games" we play >>>>>> based on such contextualization layers ? >>>>>> >>>>>> Enabling us to interact with others, and across various applications, >>>>>> beyond any proprietary approaches, and beyond any social silos... >>>>>> >>>>>> Yet at the same time, enabling "machines" to understand ... >>>>>> >>>>>> Opening up whole new dimensions in terms of what seems to be widely >>>>>> called "The Internet of >>>>>> Things"<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_of_Things> / >>>>>> Spimes <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spime> , including in support >>>>>> of the Sharing Economy, or better still in my view, A Contribution >>>>>> Economy >>>>>> based on Peer Production in support of the Commons. >>>>>> >>>>>> That this can be enabled by experimenting further with various >>>>>> existing modules and protocols... reducing threshold for their usage, >>>>>> reducing the threshold for generating data together, reducing the >>>>>> threshold >>>>>> for organizing ourselves using such data ... >>>>>> >>>>>> There are many more themes this relates to. >>>>>> >>>>>> For example, Architecture - Urbanism, etc >>>>>> ( such as Modular Parametric Design , based on Lego Like components >>>>>> that can easily be re-assembled ? ) >>>>>> >>>>>> There are also many risks - and in my view, a need to think how we >>>>>> can be ahead of understanding the technology, to avoid it being used to >>>>>> trap us in it - and instead use it to liberate and empower us. >>>>>> >>>>>> Please feel free to correct me where you see fit, complement views, >>>>>> give your own perceptions, etc >>>>>> >>>>>> There is existing code from various projects for such kind of "Web >>>>>> 4.0" browsing - there has been already a lot of research. >>>>>> >>>>>> In my view, one of the main challenges now, is to get people to work >>>>>> together on open sourced code and libre licenses, >>>>>> >>>>>> for developing inter-operable tools using such open protocols... >>>>>> >>>>>> Making the various interfaces easier to understand and use... >>>>>> >>>>>> But first, in my view, we need to see if people grasp these concepts, >>>>>> and understand that these potentials are very real and are current - and >>>>>> we >>>>>> can participate in their development, and hopefully soon benefit from its >>>>>> potentials. >>>>>> >>>>>> Also, there is funding available - for those of us who are good with >>>>>> funding applications - and can enable access to such larger partnerships >>>>>> -, >>>>>> willing to contribute to the work of programmers, or willing to motivate >>>>>> programmers to converge around a commons oriented approach - >>>>>> >>>>>> see : http://fisa.future-internet.eu/index.php/FIA_Research_Roadmap >>>>>> >>>>>> http://cordis.europa.eu/fp7/ict/ssai/fp8preparations_en.html >>>>>> >>>>>> Note : There are also all kinds of existing video materials that can >>>>>> be used to illustrate such concepts... I am willing to bring them >>>>>> together. Those who can do video editing, I d be interested in >>>>>> supporting >>>>>> research for creating a new video document too, in addition to blog >>>>>> articles. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Forwarded conversation >>>>>> >>>>>> Subject: Do we know about Linked Data ? Are we interested is >>>>>> understanding its potentials ? Quick survey - Thanks ! >>>>>> ------------------------ >>>>>> >>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <[email protected]> >>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:50 AM >>>>>> To: p2p-foundation <[email protected]> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> What would be your answer ? ( reply on this list or in private to me ) >>>>>> >>>>>> *A ) Interested in ( getting to know more about ) its potentials* >>>>>> *B ) Not interested* >>>>>> >>>>>> and >>>>>> >>>>>> *1 ) Never heard of Linked Data >>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data>* >>>>>> *2 ) Know about it* >>>>>> *3 ) Actively researching Linked Data >>>>>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data> applications ( in support of >>>>>> p2p >>>>>> 4 commons ? )* >>>>>> >>>>>> ( or whatever other replies you wish to give ) >>>>>> >>>>>> // >>>>>> >>>>>> Context of my question : >>>>>> >>>>>> Michel noted that in his view Linked Data has not been a topic with >>>>>> much interest on the p2pf related forums. >>>>>> >>>>>> I wish to understand if this is simply because not many of us know >>>>>> about Linked Data, and its potentials ? >>>>>> >>>>>> Or is it simply because it seemed too complex or technical to bring >>>>>> it up on this specific list ? >>>>>> >>>>>> I know some of us are working on Linked Data applications, >>>>>> including in support of Sharing Economy applications. >>>>>> >>>>>> I personally have been interested in some of its applications for a >>>>>> few years, without being a programmer. I collaborated with a programmer >>>>>> over the last years, to explore some of the approaches that can be taken >>>>>> to >>>>>> create certain applications. >>>>>> >>>>>> /// >>>>>> >>>>>> The first aim I have with this email is to have some kind of quick , >>>>>> hopefully sufficiently representative set of replies. It does not have >>>>>> to >>>>>> be on the public list - you can also reply to me in private if you like. >>>>>> >>>>>> From there on, I wish to open up another thread to further explain >>>>>> what Linked Data can be used for with those of us who may have explored >>>>>> the >>>>>> topic and may see potential in supporting such research as to manifest >>>>>> them >>>>>> into certain applications, in support of , for example, p2p commons >>>>>> oriented political economies. >>>>>> >>>>>> Cordially, >>>>>> Dante >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ---------- >>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <[email protected]> >>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 6:56 AM >>>>>> To: Connor Turland <[email protected]>, Bob Haugen < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Ishan Shapiro <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Benjamin Brownell <[email protected]>, Arthur Brock < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Eric Harris-Braun <[email protected]>, " >>>>>> [email protected]" <[email protected]>, elf Pavlik < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Dan Robles <[email protected]>, S >>>>>> H <[email protected]>, Helene Finidori <[email protected]> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> sent this to p2pf list ... >>>>>> Cordially, Dante >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ---------- >>>>>> From: *Helene Finidori* <[email protected]> >>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 9:33 AM >>>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <[email protected]> >>>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <[email protected]>, Bob Haugen < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Ishan Shapiro <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Benjamin Brownell <[email protected]>, Arthur Brock < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Eric Harris-Braun <[email protected]>, " >>>>>> [email protected]" <[email protected]>, elf Pavlik < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Dan Robles <[email protected]>, S >>>>>> H <[email protected]> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Good idea. >>>>>> >>>>>> Wasn't this what we were trying to do at the Ouishare labs camp last >>>>>> May? Find ways to de-silo-ize the web, enable interoperability and info >>>>>> to >>>>>> 'find each other' based on people's (agent's') intentions and capacities? >>>>>> >>>>>> It would indeed be interesting to 'package' the 'value proposition' a >>>>>> bit :) in a compact and direct 'aha that's what I could use it for , or >>>>>> that's how it could concretely benefit society' generating way. And yes, >>>>>> create a collective... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ---------- >>>>>> From: *Bob Haugen* <[email protected]> >>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 10:03 AM >>>>>> To: Dante-Gabryell Monson <[email protected]> >>>>>> Cc: Connor Turland <[email protected]>, Ishan Shapiro < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Benjamin Brownell <[email protected]>, >>>>>> Arthur Brock <[email protected]>, Eric Harris-Braun < >>>>>> [email protected]>, "[email protected]" <[email protected]>, elf Pavlik < >>>>>> [email protected]>, Dan Robles <[email protected]>, S >>>>>> H <[email protected]>, Helene Finidori <[email protected]> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> We are doing some of what Linked Data requires: providing >>>>>> derefenceable URIs for all objects. Most have them now; all will have >>>>>> them eventually. >>>>>> >>>>>> We are not currently using or investigating RDF. We are starting to >>>>>> offer JSON as a serialization format, which so far is the only format >>>>>> that has been requested. Would happily learn and use RDF if needed. >>>>>> We also plan to offer value streams (like activity streams but of >>>>>> value-creating and using activities). The pace of offerings depends >>>>>> on somebody wanting to use them. >>>>>> >>>>>> ---------- >>>>>> From: *Dante-Gabryell Monson* <[email protected]> >>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 9, 2013 at 4:35 PM >>>>>> To: Helene Finidori <[email protected]> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ... while at the same time enabling people to understand that this is >>>>>> a research project, >>>>>> >>>>>> that we do not have ready products, and that people are invited to >>>>>> contribute to make such visions into reality... including via their own >>>>>> projects, >>>>>> >>>>>> using standardized modules and/or offering frameworks people can >>>>>> re-use for their own purposes... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> P2P Foundation - Mailing list >>>> http://www.p2pfoundation.net >>>> https://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - http://blog.p2pfoundation.net >> >> <http://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation>Updates: >> http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens >> >> #82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/ >> > >
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