Perhaps, the next intl conference on the commons should be held in Greece...
Roberto Verzola On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 00:52:05 -0700 "Wolfgang Hoeschele" <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Friends, > > Very interesting discussion! > > I wonder is there opportunity (or need) to promote commons or p2p > concepts directly with the Greek government? How much are they in > touch with these movements in Greece and internationally? Can it be > useful to them if networking with us shows EU negotiators that 1) > there are proponents of a new approach around Europe and elsewhere > (i.e., Syriza is not alone in searching for new alternatives that > break the "grow like mad or die" alternative?), and 2) there are > actual models that can be implemented and there are people both > inside and outside Greece who can help make it possible? > > It seems to me that there is very little time available for the Greek > negotiators to achieve a breakthrough and thereby allow space for new > approaches to flourish in Greece, or else to fail, leading to a > resumption of austerity policies (with, I fear, disastrous results > for Greek politics, because I have no idea to whom Greek voters would > then turn). So, if we can do something internationally to help in > this process, it might be very important to do so now. Since there > are Greek participants in this list, I would very much like to hear > from you what you think about this. > > By the way, personally this also interests me because as a teenager, > when my father was working in Athens, I lived there - so there is > that personal connection! > > Best wishes, > Wolfgang > > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [commoning] [P2P-F] Greek Vice-President explicitely > endorses commons strategy before parliament > From: George Papanikolaou <[email protected]> > Date: Wed, February 11, 2015 10:09 pm > To: Eleftherios Kosmas <[email protected]> > Cc: Vasilis Kostakis <[email protected]>, > [email protected], Commoning > <[email protected]>, > "[email protected]" <[email protected]>, > Commoning List <[email protected]> > > Eleftherios thank you for the translation. > Knowing Greek politics and considering that Dragasakis is the nr 2 > (not to say nr 1) in the Greek government, I think this is an > important statement. It shows profound thinking and his openness to > the commons ideas. > > Best regards > George > > On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 11:51 PM, Eleftherios Kosmas > <[email protected]> wrote: Sorry for my previous half finished > message. > > Hi guys. I checked the speech of Mr Dragasakis I will try to > translate some parts of it. Bear in mind that due to the cultural and > linguistic differences of the Greek language with English I might not > be able to convey it properly (I am not a trained translator) > > "Title: Speech during the government's policy statements" > > The most interesting part at least for my shelf as a member of a > commons based collective like hackerspace.gr and a strong supporter > of the commons personally and in public is the following. > > I would like to, conclude with the permission of the President, with > a general thought. Often in everyday life we all live events > happening that only hindsight their importance. We live, then, and > now a historic era, characterized not only by the crisis and the > collapse of obsolete models, but we live a crisis that eventually > spawned new models and new social organization models, as was done in > the past. In this sense, then, this is an opportunity to take up the > deficits of the past, to close this modernization deficit, but by > addressing the contemporary social problem of unemployment, social > security and social exclusion. This could establish a new paradigm in > Greece and other countries of southern Europe, combining advanced > forms of democracy, social self-motivation, social justice on a > strong foundation of common goods, a society-centric model, which > would give dignity and confidence in society hope to the people, > optimism in the new generation. Thus, Greece from being the > Guenna-pig of austerity and destruction could be the a ground of > pioneering ideas and policies, and the benefit would not be just for > us. The world would become a security goal in a region of insecurity > and "aged" Europe could re-discover through the symbiosis of > different development models inside. Let's not rush some say that > these are utopias, because there are utopias that are realistic. Are > those whose implementation depends not on supernatural powers, but by > the unity and collective action of ordinary people in Europe, in > Greece and worldwide. Thank you. > > > Greek speakers could find the original here. > > http://www.dragasakis.gr/omiliesparembaseis.php?id=1041 > > I hope this could help a bit on the conversation. > > > On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 11:43 PM, Eleftherios Kosmas > <[email protected]> wrote: Hi guys. I checked the speech of Mr > Dragasakis I will try to translate some parts of it. Bear in mind > that due to the cultural and linguistic differences of the Greek > language with English I might not be able to convey it properly (I am > not a trained translator) > > "Title: Speech during the government's policy statements" > > The most interesting part at least for my shelf as a member of a > commons based collective like hackerspace.gr and a strong supporter > of the commons. > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 10:50 PM, P2P Foundation mailing list > <[email protected]> wrote: understood Vasilis, > > but the big danger is that all the energy goes to crisis management, > and that the real transformative work is put on hold for when > conditions are right .. > > so the only way out is to work on both simultaneously, i.e. work on > the crisis while also setting in place the framework for this longer > term change, > > Michel > > On Wed, Feb 11, 2015 at 11:02 PM, Vasilis Kostakis > <[email protected]> wrote: Michel, > > The passage you shared was written from memory and I cannot find > anywhere on the web (perhaps in video format) the explicit reference. > However, I think that my memory is good and more or less this was > what the vice-present said. Moreover, allow me to share George > Papanikolaou's reaction in relation to my message, in which he > highlights that Dragasakis's basic idea was that "the european south > can open the way to new productive relations". In addition to this, > George emphasizes that "the priority now is to stabilize the > situation and give us time for experimentation". > > Let's see... > > v. > > On 11 February 2015 at 17:30, Michel Bauwens > <[email protected]> wrote: This is very important news: > > perhaps George or Vasilis can find the explicit reference ? > especially in english ? > > see: > > " Dragasakis's (vice-president of the government) finale during his > speech in the parliament, where he explicitly referred to new > bottom-up, Commons-based productive models which will have a global > orientation and will fuel Greece's post-crisis sustainable > development." > > -- > Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at: > http://en.wiki.floksociety.org/w/Research_Plan > > P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - > http://blog.p2pfoundation.net > > Updates: http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens > > #82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/ > > > > -- > Dr. Vasilis Kostakis > > Senior Research Fellow > Ragnar Nurkse School of Innovation and Governance > > Research Director > P2P Lab: http://p2plab.org > > > > -- > Check out the Commons Transition Plan here at: > http://en.wiki.floksociety.org/w/Research_Plan > > P2P Foundation: http://p2pfoundation.net - > http://blog.p2pfoundation.net > > Updates: http://twitter.com/mbauwens; http://www.facebook.com/mbauwens > > #82 on the (En)Rich list: http://enrichlist.org/the-complete-list/ > > _______________________________________________ > P2P Foundation - Mailing list > http://www.p2pfoundation.net > https://lists.ourproject.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/p2p-foundation > > > > > -- > http://elkosmas.gr > > > > -- > http://elkosmas.gr > > ------------------------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > Commoning mailing list > Commons-Institut e.V. 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