Oh OK.... The domain computers would always be 802.1x authenticated. No metter what their login state is. That makes sense.
Thanks!! K-Dee -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bugbear Sent: Friday, August 06, 2010 1:22 PM To: PaulDotCom Security Weekly Mailing List Subject: Re: [Pauldotcom] Locking down Ports and DHCP Kevin, If they shut down that's an issue only WOL can solve If they log off, not an issue if your also authenticating domain computers (still on production LAN) Hope that helps. Tim On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Dahl, Kevin <[email protected]> wrote: > Thanks Tim..... The remediation server is one option, however it seems like > that would be more geared towards guests, or a guest network. Which as you > say, who cares..... > > But... how would I push patches to my own desktops during > non-production hours if I have 802.1x implemented on my network? > (Assuming users shutdown or logout each night) > > > K-Dee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bugbear > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2010 5:31 PM > To: PaulDotCom Security Weekly Mailing List > Subject: Re: [Pauldotcom] Locking down Ports and DHCP > > Kevin > > I'm not 100% sure what your asking. In my situation, we just check if the > computer/user has valid domain creds, if not we quarantine them. > Not valid means they are guest and not my responsibility to backup or patch. > > If you are doing full NAC/NAP with remediation, then those products often > provide a remediation server that offers patches/links to patches (i.e. > latest WIN patches, virus defs). Problem is if user/guest doesn't have admin > rights then what? In my opinion, just easier to have guest jacks with air > gaped network (could do vlan;ing if you prefer) and limited internet access > available. > > Hope this clarifies some things. > > Tim > > On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 2:26 PM, Dahl, Kevin <[email protected]> wrote: >> How do those of you who are using 802.1x solve the problem with >> patching and/or nightly backups ?? >> >> K-Dee >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] >> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jody & >> Jennifer McCluggage >> Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 8:00 PM >> To: 'PaulDotCom Security Weekly Mailing List' >> Subject: Re: [Pauldotcom] Locking down Ports and DHCP >> >> I agree with Tim about recommending 802.1x. You can set it up so >> that the switches will not allow access until the end-user >> authenticates themselves on the network (via Windows RADIUS service, >> IAS, communicating with a domain controller). The 8021.X clients on >> Windows XP SP3 and higher are pretty stable (it will work on lower >> versions but >> SP3 added some 802.1x improvements). As Tim pointed out, more and >> more embedded devices such as printers are now also supporting >> 802.1x. For other embedded devices (older printers, copiers, UPS, >> etc), you can utilize MAC address filtering. This is less of an >> issue with these since they tend to be fairly static (i.e. >> they won't be moving around much) and usually have some additional >> compensating physical controls. You will probably want to use MAC >> Address filtering with your servers too. 802.1x tends not to work >> well with servers since it requires authentication prior to granting >> port access. If someone has physical access to the ports that your >> servers are using, port authentication is the least of your problems! >> >> Also as Tim said, keep in mind that you are adding some additional >> moving parts so more things can go wrong (8021.x client issues, >> switch issues, or RADIUS server issues - over the years I have had to >> deal with all three at one time or another but nothing real major). >> That being said, except for the occasional minor headache, I have >> had very little issues with it over the years. Also keep in mind that >> the workstation will not have access to the network until the user >> authenticates with an approved domain level account. >> >> Let me know If you want some examples on how to set up using Cisco >> switches and Windows workstations and radius/domain server. >> >> Jody >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] >> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bugbear >> Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2010 9:04 AM >> To: PaulDotCom Security Weekly Mailing List >> Subject: Re: [Pauldotcom] Locking down Ports and DHCP >> >> First and foremost get your company policies and procedures in place >> if you have not yet. Also, you will need "buy in" from the support >> staff because their helpdesk calls are going to increase. >> >> With that said, I would look at 802.1x >> >> Assuming you are a Windows shop and your switches support it (most >> modern switches do), take a look. I have leveraged it somewhat >> successfully. I personally do not do any NAP/NAC (remediation), I >> just very simply use Radius to auth the domain computers and domain users. >> If joined to the domain and a member of this group then they are on >> the production LAN, if not the switches will dynamically VLAN them to >> a Quarantine VLAN. >> >> What you do with "guests" is up to you from there. You can wait for >> the helpdesk call or you could provide restricted internet access. If >> the later, consider the appropriate egress filtering, logging, >> alerting, IDS, etc... >> Also consider using PAT to give that network a unique public IP. >> Lastly, consult your legal team to draw up some language for "guests" >> to click through via Web Auth/Captive Portal (most modern switches >> support this too). >> The language should note that your Company is not responsible / >> liable and you hold the right to monitor unencrypted traffic on the >> network (careful with what type of monitoring - headers verse full >> content) >> >> Most Printers, Scanner, AP's etc.. support 802.1x these days. An >> alternative (not a very good one) would be port security via the mac >> addr (but that will only keep the layman off). >> >> Now the part your probably going to struggle with. The supplicant. >> There are many. MS Windows XP SP3 and above has one built in and >> supports GPO control. There are also products like Juniper/Odyssey >> and Cisco Clean Access (Which i think just got EOL). >> >> They all suck (excuse me have their limitations). The Windows >> supplicant in Windows 7 seems to have been approved quite a bit >> however. In XP there were issues with legit end users being temp >> flipped to quarantine (while radius auth's them < the default >> behavior). Once flipping back and the DHCP client will sometimes not >> get an updated IP for that subnet. To date I have not found a workaround, >> except Windows 7. >> >> Also, if your admins are using logon scripts and not doing so through >> GPO they will need to as they will not run post Auth >> >> Other tech out there includes tracking/alerting after the fact >> (someone being on your network). >> >> Hope this helps >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 5:36 PM, Tyler Robinson >> <[email protected]> >> wrote: >>> I am coming into an environment of over 1000 clients everything is >>> setup DHCP except printers and servers I am trying to work towards a >>> much more secure network but am at a loss of how to start locking >>> down >> >>> switches and DHCP I want to make sure no one is plugging in >>> unauthorized devices or rogue devices for that matter so just >>> wondering how everyone else is securing there networks as always >>> pauldotcom listeners are the best and all help is welcomed. >>> >>> TR >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pauldotcom mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom >>> Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pauldotcom mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom >> Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pauldotcom mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom >> Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com >> _______________________________________________ >> Pauldotcom mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom >> Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com >> > _______________________________________________ > Pauldotcom mailing list > [email protected] > http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom > Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com > _______________________________________________ > Pauldotcom mailing list > [email protected] > http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom > Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com > _______________________________________________ Pauldotcom mailing list [email protected] http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com _______________________________________________ Pauldotcom mailing list [email protected] http://mail.pauldotcom.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pauldotcom Main Web Site: http://pauldotcom.com
