On 10/14/07, Bob Blakely <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >From my point of view... > > Only so many photons are captured by a sensor element (pixel, if you will) > of a given size and that to a certain efficiency. There is an upper limit. > Further, everything that has a temperature generates noise in proportion to > that temperature. There is a lower limit. > > The upper limit can only be expanded by increasing the element size to > capture more photons per element. Maintaining the effective resolution then > means increasing the overall sensor size (to full frame?) The lower limit > can only be pushed further down by operating the sensor at a lower > temperature. Currently, the K10D shows noise beginning on the side where > most of the hotter the electronics is located. Red pixels light up first, > then green, then blue. Noise temperature can be further reduced by active
I thought that the photosites were not color sensitive, i.e. they are B&W with a Bayer filter pattern in front, so they all would light up equally with temp, no? > cooling. I suspect that this is not likely to happen with digital cameras > any time soon, sensors for astrophotography and other scientific purposes > excepted. Everybody knows this, and ultimately the larger sensors will > prevail. When this happens, lenses with APS size image circles will become > as useless, practically speaking, as 8 tracks. > > Have you noticed that the upper ISO limits for digital sensors and film are > about the same, 1600 and sometimes 3200? Tere is a reason for this and > ultimately it is the physics of noise that produce thes limits. > > Noise power, N = k*T*B*Nf, where: > > k = Boltzmann's constant; > T = Absolute temperature; > B = Noise Bandwidth of the sensor or film; > Nf = Noise figure, a measure of sensor efficiency. > > Bottom line... there are rules and nature enforces them. > > So... where's my effecient full frame sensor? > > Regards, > Bob... > -------------------------------------------------------- > "Art is not a reflection of reality. it is the reality of a reflection." > -Jean Luc Godard > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joseph Tainter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <pdml@pdml.net> > Sent: Sunday, October 14, 2007 10:49 AM > Subject: Re: Next move from Pentax: anyone in the know (even under NDA) ? > > > > P. J. Alling wrote: > > > > Sony has been slow up to now because they are feeling things out, they > > are probably still integrating the K/M engineers and project managers > > into Sony's culture. Sony sales managers insist on the cameras being > > profitable, and they are milking the old K/M system as much as possible. > > However they know to maintain and increase their market share they will > > have to match the big boys, and that means a FF body, (as far as I know > > they don't even make any reduced frame lenses), so look for a FF body > > soon. > > > > That means that Pentax will have to get a FF body to keep from becoming > > locked in a contest for 4th place with Olympus and the 4:3 system.. Hoya > > will probably not like the odds at that point. They too are interested > > in the camera line being profitable. If it isn't, and shows no signs of > > becoming so, that's all there will be. > > > > ----- > > > > This analysis is spot on. Higher-sounding specs drive the marketing, > > which drives camera development. Pentax may be in a real bind here. They > > are having terrible problems with the Hanoi plant, and for some time now > > have been unable to produce the DA and DA* lenses in sufficient > > quantities to meet demand. This is part of what is delaying the > > introduction of the telephoto lenses that so many people want. Imagine > > the problems if they also have to produce full-frame lenses again while > > continuing the DA line. > > > > If Pentax brings out cameras based on a 24 x 36 sensor, perhaps they can > > resurrect some of the FA and FA* lens designs. But I'll bet that the > > bodies of those lenses will need to be redesigned for more economical > > manufacturing. And both wide angle and wide-to-tele zooms will need to > > have redesigned optics. I understand that there is a shortage of optical > > engineers, and that Pentax cannot simply go out to college fairs and > > hire more. The other manufacturers are also facing this problem. > > > > So if the market shifts to affordable cameras with 24 x 36 sensors, > > Pentax will have a dilemma. They can ignore that market and lose, or > > they can enter that market and lose anyway because they don't have > > lenses. I am told that Pentax regrets closing their lens production > > plants in Japan. > > > > Joe > > > > -- > > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > > PDML@pdml.net > > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and > > follow the directions. > > > -- > PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List > PDML@pdml.net > http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net > to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow > the directions. > -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
