On Oct 21, 2016, at 2:23 PM, Clément Bera <[email protected]> wrote:
On Thu, Oct 20, 2016 at 9:07 AM, Aliaksei Syrel <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Stéphane
Indeed, build is broken :)
Yesterday I took a very brief look at bloc and can confirm that development
version is loadable in Pharo 6 and is completely Sparta based. (all examples
work for me)
You are right, live environment on embedded systems is great goal to achieve.
Sparta must not prevent pharo from getting there. It is true that plugin is
relatively big (windows 7mb, osx 15mb, linux 18mb). However, it is all-in-one
build and size can be reduced dramatically.
As I understand, Pharo for PC should not make any assumptions about user's
hardware. If gpu accelerated backend can not be used there should be still a
performant fallback backend which also needs a fallback that is guaranteed to
work even on Personal Calculators. (Taschenrechner). That is why library is so
big. For example for mac and windows Sparta is shipped with 3 (!) backends that
together build fallback chain, for instance on windows: direct2d1.1, skia,
cairo. Compiling library for mac without Skia reduces binary size from 15mb to
10mb. Removing GL package and leaving only software backends may reduce size
even more.
It is a bit different on embedded systems, since hardware configuration is
already known and there is no need to have so many fallback backends. Library
itself allows developers to add new exotic backends quite easily.
Let's take Pharo6 for mac. It is shipped with the following libs:
Cairo (1.4mb) + Pixman (2.8mb) + Freetype (0.8mb) = 5mb
Moz2D is self contained and does not require any additional libs.
Moz2D = 15mb, Moz2D without Skia = 10mb. Moz2D without Skia and GL = ?
(estimate around 6-7mb).
As you can see we get almost the same numbers :)
Yeah but none of the libs (Cairo, Pixman, FreeType) are required to run Pharo,
they're required only if you use them. I compile VMs without such libraires and
Pharo works just fine as a development environment and for simple things like
web servers. The Squeak VM for example have around 2Mb footprint in total,
including 1Mb for the C runtime (initialized and uninitialized data, executable
code) and 1 Mb for the machine code zone and can run most Pharo features just
fine, including for examples web services and the IDE.
Right now the VM cannot start completely headless, the headless mode just hides
the main window, so if the main window start-up depends on Sparta, it's not
possible to run Pharo headless without many Mb of memory footprint.
Which leads the first question...
Is it possible to start your Bloc Pharo image on a 2Mb footprint VM ? By asking
this question, I imply, if there is no Cairo/Pixman/FreeType/Sparta plugin, can
the image run headless and can it run UI applications ?
The last problem is that Pharo can currently run UI application like the IDE on
a 2Mb memory footprint VM. Let's assume Pharo with Bloc/Sparta/etc. can be run
either headless on a 2Mb memory footprint VM or with a UI on a 7Mb+ memory
footprint VM. It means now people doing UI would need extra memory, for
example, in the case of android deployment where the android app includes the
VM and the image, the app memory consumption at runtime would be at least 5Mb
bigger.
Is the community ok with this or will we need to maintain both the Sparta
back-end and a Bloc to BitBlt back-end as a fall-back to run on smaller VMs ?
Cheers
Alex
On Oct 19, 2016 22:16, "stepharo" <[email protected]> wrote:
Hi Aliaksei
It looks gorgeous.
I tried to launch the Bloc image from the CI and it crashes during startup on
my mac. I reported that to Glenn and Alain but so far I simply cannot see Bloc
code. Is it working for you? I mean is it me that is using the wrong VM.
Then I have a question:
- do you think that we can have a fallback in terms of back end for the
case where we could like to run Pharo on coffee machines but get a live
environment on such machines? This is related to the discussions we got this
summer about the memory footprint that Moz2D will put on us.
I do not mean that we must have one but I think that this is important to check
because we can say that Pharo is small but if we need 20 mb libraries for
rendering there are some cases where this can kill its usage.
Stef
Le 19/10/16 à 18:06, Aliaksei Syrel a écrit :
Hi
I am happy to announce the release of Sparta v1.1 for Pharo 6.
https://github.com/syrel/Sparta/tree/v1.1
It can be bootstrapped with the following script:
Metacello new
baseline: 'Sparta'
;
repository: 'github://syrel/sparta:v1.1/src'
;
load: #file:core
Examples are on class side of: MozExamples, MozTextExamples
(for linux users: if you use 32bit pharo on 64bit linux, sparta will not work,
since 32bit plugin depends on 32bit GTK which conflicts with 64bit GTK. Either
use 32bit linux or 64bit pharo. I tested sparta with 64bit vm on mac and linux
- it works, but some features fail because FFI is not ready)
Release of v1.1 is focused on hardware acceleration, windows support and text
rendering.
What is new:
- Default backends on all platforms changed from software to hardware
accelerated.
- Now also works on Windows! Default backend is Direct2D for drawings and
DirectWrite for text. On multi-gpu machines per-app-default setting is
respected. In case of Nvidia it can be changed in nvidia control panel. Sparta
is x2 faster on discrete gpu than on integrated one.
- Added initial text support, for instance rendering and high precision
measurement.
- Per-platform settings system is now image based. Allows to enable/disable
hardware acceleration, change default backends, change font-mappings tables.
Some text examples:
(rendering)
<Mail Attachment.png>
(measurement)
<Mail Attachment.png>
Cheers,
Alex
