I understand completely, I agree and strongly vote for A as well.
> On 19 Feb 2017, at 21:05, Torsten Bergmann <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> In the past in Pharo it was possible to open Spotter, type in the name of a
> framework/project to load
> from catalog, perform a search and just hit ENTER to easily install the
> project.
>
> This was following the Spotter idea that it is easy to access most
> informations of Pharo
> with the Spotter tool.
>
> There always was and still is a setting in "Settings" -> "Catalog" ->
> "Display catalog projects in Spotter".
> This setting is ENABLED BY DEFAULT but could be switched off in the settings
> tool or custom preference
> scripts if this is problematic for someone.
>
>
> Now in Pharo 6 there is an additional class "GTSpotterExtensionSettings" to
> activate/deactivate
> Spotter extensions. While nearly all of the Spotter extensions are enabled
> the one for the catalog
> integration is DISABLED BY DEFAULT.
>
> This leads to several effects:
>
> 1. While in the past it was possible in a fresh Pharo image to search and
> install out of
> the box it is (as of today in the not yet released Pharo 6) not possible
> anymore to quickly
> start by searching and installing from catalog using Spotter.
>
> 2. It is very confusing that in the settings "Display catalog projects in
> Spotter" is enabled but a search
> in Spotter gives no results. Most people will not not know about the
> second setting and easily
> get lost and think this behavior is just broken.
> Also this second setting for the Spotter extension is much more hidden
> between all the other
> Spotter extension enablements very and hard to find.
>
> 3. Several of my youtube videos demonstrating Goodies like DesktopManager,
> QuickAccess,
> MessageFlowBrowser, ... directly start by loading the tools from Spotter.
> Anyone newbee who will
> follow these will not only be confused - but also stuck in trying Pharo
> when he learns
> from these videos.
>
> I was asked several times on Slack and via Mail from people who were not
> able to reproduce ... this
> is really annyoing. Especially this gives the wrong impression to
> newbees. Things should be easy
> not complicated.
>
> To my knowledge disabling the Spotter search in Pharo 6 came up due to some
> Pharo teaching in regions
> with slow internet connection. I understand that we would like to support
> these Pharo users too as best
> as possible in their out of the box experience ... but (without being able to
> prove) I think that 90% or
> more Pharo users have a regular internet connection. Otherwise it would be
> hard to work with updates,
> project loading, PharoLauncher, STHub or Iceberg/GitHub.
>
> Also my own personal experience is that even on low bandwidth network this
> Catalog Spotter search for
> me was always fast enough (as I often use Pharo in trains with slow
> connections or on a Pi with slow
> connections and less processing power). I do not know about all others from
> the community.
>
> I invested hours in the past in developing and introducing the initial
> configuration browser to Pharo,
> later improved and helped shaping its replacement CatalogBrowser, also
> contributed this spotter search
> for the catalog items so things are more accessible, easy and enjoyable.
> That's why I also invested
> hours in udpating configs or pushing you to put things into catalog.
>
> Because accessibility is key. Only when things are easy to access and
> understandable people will
> enjoy Pharo.
>
> Currently in an out-of the box image this easy access to the projects via
> Spotter is blocked.
> Additionally I have to explain to anyone who asks me that there is a second
> non-obvious/more hidden setting
> leaving an unpleasant feeling how many others unknown to me will struggle
> with this issue.
>
> I see two solutions:
>
> A) We enable both settings by DEFAULT to bring back the Spotter search and
> installation
> of catalog items - with the clear benefit of having
> - the previous behavior in Pharo back
> - the out of the box ability to search for catalog projects in any
> fresh image
> - no confusion among the user base anymore regarding the settings
> - we have unbroken Youtube videos that newbees can continue to follow
> - if a user asks (like often) how to get Seaside, Artefact, Mongo,
> Teapot or other projects we can
> just tell him "search in Spotter and you should be fine" as most of
> them have a config in
> the catalog.
>
> Remember that not all of us know about all the github pages or nice
> Metacello expressions.
> So the easier things are found and accessible the better it is.
>
> B) If A is still a "No go" for the community we should at a minimum switch
> the defaults of
> the two settings:
>
> => we ENABLE the Spotter extension (GTSpotterExtensionSettings perform:
> #GTSpotter_spotterCatalogProjectsFor: with: true)
> => we DISABLE the catalog setting (CatalogSettings
> displayCatalogProjectsInSpotter: false)
>
> With this at least we have no confusion among the user base anymore
> regarding the settings.
>
> I would clearly and strongly vote for option A as my preferred one.
>
> I agree there are regions/continents with very low bandwidth - but Pharo will
> rival with state of the art
> technologies where loading/installation megabytes from the web is often not
> seen as an issue. There are
> many package registries out there (from debian packages) up to Maven, npm in
> JS, ... or look at Docker.
> Shuffling megabytes around is a reality in todays technologies.
>
> So to be honest I never understood this whole "bandwidth" discussion and even
> if this comes up it could
> be solved with a note in the download/welcome screen or pointing to a custom
> preference script for low bandwidth
> situations.
>
> Sorry for having to bring this up again ... but I would like this to be
> solved BEFORE Pharo 6 will
> be pushed out of the door. Keeping it like it is without further actions
> would be really stupid.
>
> Thanks for you comments, ideas or votes.
>
> Thanks
> T.
>
