Dne 15. 12. 2012 12:12, piše Igor Stasenko: > On 15 December 2012 10:27, Janko Mivšek <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Is there any technical reason that the old FileDirectory stuff doesn't >> stay and work in parallel to a new FileSystem? Maybe in some package >> marked obsolete. Both use the same plugin and the same primitives, so >> where is the problem? > Yes, there's one big reason: maintainability. And manpower. > Who would like to maintain FD? Any takers? Gain with a (in this case very small) bit of manpower to ease upgrade to new FS by providing existing FD for a while outweighs the loss by not doing that. As a professional organization providing a professional product Pharo should think rather that way. Janko > >> >> I also think that for a professionally viable product a clear migration >> path should be provided. Progress yes, but user base must have a >> guidance how to slowly migrate to the new functionality. If possible >> with some automated procedure to migrate our code. >> >> In case of FileSystem/FileDirectory, this is certainly quite a big >> change and will break a lot of code. Be sure therefore that you guide us >> as much as possible, otherwise there is a danger to loose a lot of user >> base behind. >> > But there is a well-written documentation of FS. > I wonder, if there's any documentation for FileDirectory ever existed. > >> Best regards >> Janko >> >> Dne 15. 12. 2012 08:55, piše Stéphane Ducasse: >>> Chris >>> >>> Could you give us a break pleaseeeeeee? >>> We are spending all our energy to build a better system that other people >>> can use to make a living. >>> May be we should just create a system for having fun in our teams? Because >>> at the end of the day >>> we just need to produce ideas and some prototypes (not even build them as >>> researchers). >>> >>> I really think that there are still plenty of places where the system is >>> not good. If you disagree then you may want to >>> spend more time trying to extend it and build something real with it. (Here >>> this is the place where you should react and prove >>> to the world that you are a cool entrepreneur) ;D >>> >>> Now nobody force you to: >>> - be in this mailing-list (you are welcome here but can we avoid this >>> kind of endless useless discussions) or >>> phrase your points with code snippet that can help the system. >>> >>> - use pharo in fact you are not using it so you are living in an >>> happy world. So this is perfect. >>> >>> Did you read the Pharo motto? >>> >>> Stef >>> >>> >>> On Dec 14, 2012, at 5:55 PM, Chris Muller wrote: >>> >>>> I'm tired of talking about this but I just can't let this go.. I >>>> don't know if its just romantic, starry-eyed mountain climbers or >>>> intentional false-propaganda but... confusion reigns here! :) This >>>> example is bunk. >>>> >>>> Sean chose a method in ZipDirectoryMember written by Ned Konz in 2002 >>>> which, for whatever reason, is admittedly not great code but that's >>>> not the point -- Sean is trying to use this example to demonstrate how >>>> using FileSystem will let you "scale new heights" over FileDirectory. >>>> The real equivalent to what Sean wrote is: >>>> >>>> "FileDirectory" >>>> localFileName: aString >>>> | file | >>>> super localFileName: aString. >>>> file := FileDirectory directoryEntryFor: aString. >>>> file exists ifFalse: [ ^ self ]. >>>> self modifiedAt: file entry modificationTime. >>>> >>>> "FileSystem" >>>> localFileName: aString >>>> | file | >>>> super localFileName: aString. >>>> file := aString asFileName. >>>> file exists ifFalse: [ ^ self ]. >>>> self modifiedAt: file entry modificationTime. >>>> >>>> Ahhhh, I've broken all my systems but look how I'm scaling new heights >>>> with FileSystem! (not!) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Dec 12, 2012 at 10:39 PM, Sean P. DeNigris >>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> Chris Muller-4 wrote >>>>>> While someone in the Pharo >>>>>> community said FileSystem over FileDirectory is "huge", I see it as an >>>>>> incremental API change >>>>> >>>>> Can you still say that after reading >>>>> http://forum.world.st/The-Magic-of-FileSystem-td4635471.html ?! >>>>> >>>>> FileSystem has hugely decremented the number of times I've wanted to throw >>>>> my computer at a wall ;) FileDirectory occurred to me like graffiti >>>>> painted >>>>> on a great work of art. >>>>> >>>>> Multiply the above by every dark corner of the system and you have the >>>>> barrier to the next stage of evolution. For myself, every time I've >>>>> embarked >>>>> on a bold new idea for our IDE, after getting bogged down in a mess of >>>>> objects - like FileDirectory et al, or Paragraph and friends, or Morphic >>>>> layout objects, and on and on - I reached a point where I was not willing >>>>> to >>>>> put in the tremendous effort required to understand the system (if even >>>>> possible). And because few of the design decisions are documented, I >>>>> didn't >>>>> know how to clean things without breaking them. So, I gave up and just >>>>> went >>>>> back to the standard tools. >>>>> >>>>> I hate to keep repeating myself, but the Pharo manifesto is very clear, >>>>> and >>>>> makes these types of arguments moot: >>>>> - Better for the better >>>>> - Beauty to learn from >>>>> - Not backward compatible >>>>> - Clean, lean and fast >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> Sean >> >> -- >> Janko Mivšek >> Aida/Web >> Smalltalk Web Application Server >> http://www.aidaweb.si >> > > > -- Janko Mivšek Aida/Web Smalltalk Web Application Server http://www.aidaweb.si
