Since The Victor III started out as the "Victor M" (Monarch) model in 1901, and then was transitioned to Victor III nomenclature around 1905 when the tapered arm was first used, and there was some overlap in production with the M Model series, there could have been some use of parts from the earlier Monarch used on your machine, especially since your machine has and early 4 digit serial number, and a very early bottom sticker date from 1902, which you would expect to find on the earliest of the III models which had a rigid arm and concert sound box, and forward positioned crank. This is extremely interesting. That horn is still a mystery, since it does not match up at all to any that Victor was producing for any of its machines at the time, but it fits perfectly into the elbow intended for your Victor III. It is somewhat similar to the round pedaled horns used on the Victor O, but much larger in length and horn opening. Hopefully someone can identify that horn, the maker, and whether it was from a separate Company that made the horns.
Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron L'Herault" <[email protected]> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2013 11:43:19 PM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] early Vic III ? I can send pictures to you, if you'd like. What parts do you want to see? Ron L -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ken and Brenda Brekke Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2013 10:17 PM To: 'Antique Phonograph List' Subject: Re: [Phono-L] early Vic III ? Is it possible to have a link to pictures? It sounds interesting. Ken B. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ron L'Herault Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2013 8:42 PM To: [email protected]; 'Antique Phonograph List' Subject: [Phono-L] early Vic III ? I've just acquired a machine with a plate that reads "Type Vic III" with serial number 8212 and am wondering if I have got a frankenphono or maybe a machine in transition. It has a slotted winding shaft but it is located to the rear of the case. I'm sure the crank has been "fudged." It is tubular an tapered but the "down" part is not parallel to the side of the case and the wall thickness of the slot end is thicker than that of my Vic Type 6 crank (which fits the III perfectly, BTW). The escutcheon is just a flat plate with two screw holes and a rather large center hole that matches the case hole. I have not found a plugged hole to indicate that a new crank hole has been made either. There are no extra holes in the motorboard. The motor is a Victor motor. It has lead gov. weights. Cabinet size is in the right range. I thought that the reproducer was an early one but even that is in doubt. It had the flat end balance springs and the round needle chuck but the needle chuck has solder showing where it attaches to the rest of the needle bar. It could have been swapped from another reproducer although I don't know why the whole needle bar would not have been used. jamb nuts are the earlier round, grooved edge type rather than nuts. The horn seems to fit correctly, has a rivet and bayonets into the elbow. It is petaled and appears to be brass. Oh, and one last clue, the antiques dealer mentioned that the previous owner had lots of machines and many of them were sold at auction. She acquired it last May along with a Victrola IX which I did not inspect. What are the thoughts of our listmates on this one? Ron L _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org _______________________________________________ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
