Bjorn and Julio, you've got it right.  

I've now a contract with Volvo Aero Services for web design and multivalue
database support.  Ever since Volvo bought AGES, it's been a huge
technological step backwards from Linux and PHP to M$ and ASP.  The big
companies DON'T CARE that M$ puts out a security-hole-ridden, barely
documented, admin-intensive product. And of course, management don't
care--they don't have to deal with the day-to-day grind of trying to keep
Win and its attendant components up and going.

In my own business I've seen how the use of open-source, solid,
proudly-written-and-supported software takes great amounts of time away from
administrative busy-work and gives it back in the form of more time to
develop new products and sales.  It's a very simple equation, actually.  As
a super-small businessman, anything (like Apache and PHP) that puts time and
money back on MY side of the tally-board is a Good Thing.

I call the sort of problem we're discussing the "In-Flight Syndrome."  You
know, where a Big Corporate Executive goes on a junket somewhere and sees a
glossy ad in a glossy in-flight magazine and arrives back at the home office
to insist that current baby-and-bathwater be thrown out in favour of
something glossy but wholly inappropriate.  Or, "If I haven't seen in in a
glossy magazine, it isn't what the Joneses are doing, therefore neither will

In VAS's situation, it's SAP.  Now, mind you, SAP has no component that even
remotely deals with the way aircraft parts brokerages actually do business.
There's no module for FAA repairs, no way to deal with special consignment
deals, and worst, no way to deal with the all-important documentation.  In
this business, "no documentation" equals "no sale."  

Would YOU get on an aircraft if you suspected that undocumented parts were
on it?  I think not and I wouldn't get on it either.  Airlines simply won't
buy from brokers who cannot prove the authenticity and condition of
life-limited parts.

But that hasn't stopped Volvo in the least.  Obviously, corporate Powers
That Be in Sweden are conveniently immune to such things as the law (Thou
shalt document well all thy parts back to birth).  The corporate philosophy
is "If it runs on Windows, then it's Good Thing and We Must Use It," however

Face it:  most large businesses have more dollars than sense.  This sort of
problem isn't limited to PHP, Apache, or Open Source products in general.
Plain, honest horse-sense is what's missing.  I see it happening at VAS and
I see it happening it a lot of other large companies.

If the people in charge of IT took a good look at what's available and
appropriate, there would be a lot more money made and a lot more happy
technicians.  "Happy technician" will also probably be loyal and productive.
My prediction is that those of us who embrace Open Source and place such
products in our businesses to limit downtime and administrative burdens will
be the most profitable in the upcoming years.

Conversely, those like Volvo Aero, who insist on throwing good money after
bad, will likely be out of business soon.  The Cult of Microsoft is still
strong in upper management, simply because they don't know (and are
unwilling to countenance) any better.

That's what I call a self-correcting problem :-)

Respectfully to all,

-----Original Message-----
From: Bjorn Van Simaeys [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2001 6:15 PM
Subject: Re: [PHP] Re: PHP in corporate settings?

That's right. I have been working for a large computer
company (2800 people), and my project manager had
never even heard about PHP and such.

Bjorn Van Simaeys

--- Inércia Sensorial <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>   I don't think the problem is the open source
> nature. Corporate people
> usually do not see flaws on it. But they do not see
> the advantages too
> because there is little advertising.
> --
>   Julio Nobrega.
> 2B||!BB - That's the question.
> "Jeff Lewis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> 00dd01c1203b$60d62210$76a1a8c0@LEWISJCIT">news:00dd01c1203b$60d62210$76a1a8c0@LEWISJCIT...
> I still rarely ever see PHP mentioned in job
> listings and the like.
> Especially here in Canada I find it very hard to
> find any kinds of contacts
> for companies using PHP.  My previous employer that
> I was with for 3+ years
> insisted on Micro$oft products and wanted to go with
> ASP.
> My current employer, a HUGE media/newspaper in
> Ontario goes with strictly
> Java.
> Is it that people still are hesitant to go wth open
> source based technology?
> Jeff Lewis
> -- 
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