Of course this is spliting hairs BUT there are no absolutes in science
which is why it is often so much fun and why nobody stops trying to
disprove everyone wrong so they can prove something new. I welcome
your comments about viruses being alive and I have been aware of the
different opinions, but I think to be honest it is a minority
position. Most scientists consider a viruses not alive, if not
completely dead - for all the reasons I have given and others
supporting both positions.
However, that said, there is some virus that is extremely large.
Mimivirus is a case in point. So is it alive? Well, it is definitely
parasitic as are all viruses. A viruses needs a cell to hijack to
replicate itself but it can also be modified by genes jumping
laterally. What a concept but it happens all the time which kind of
knocks evolution out of the box. In fact I wonder how much our genes
are modified by gene drift? I know it happens and it has nothing to do
with evolution.
Again thanks for your input.
Hank
Addendum:
Science. 2004 Nov 19;306(5700):1344-50. Epub 2004 Oct 14.
* Science. 2005 May 20
The 1.2-megabase genome sequence of Mimivirus.
Raoult D, Audic S, Robert C, Abergel C, Renesto P, Ogata H, La
Scola B, Suzan M, Claverie JM.
Unité des Rickettsies, Faculté de Médecine, CNRS UMR6020,
Université de la Méditerranée, 13385 Marseille Cedex 05, France.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
We recently reported the discovery and preliminary
characterization of Mimivirus, the largest known virus, with a
400-nanometer particle size comparable to mycoplasma. Mimivirus is a
double-stranded DNA virus growing in amoebae. We now present its
1,181,404-base pair genome sequence, consisting of 1262 putative open
reading frames, 10% of which exhibit a similarity to proteins of known
functions. In addition to exceptional genome size, Mimivirus exhibits
many features that distinguish it from other nucleocytoplasmic large
DNA viruses. The most unexpected is the presence of numerous genes
encoding central protein-translation components, including four
amino-acyl transfer RNA synthetases, peptide release factor 1,
translation elongation factor EF-TU, and translation initiation factor
1. The genome also exhibits six tRNAs. Other notable features include
the presence of both type I and type II topoisomerases, components of
all DNA repair pathways, many polysaccharide synthesis enzymes, and
one intein-containing gene. The size and complexity of the Mimivirus
genome challenge the established frontier between viruses and
parasitic cellular organisms. This new sequence data might help shed a
new light on the origin of DNA viruses and their role in the early
evolution of eukaryotes.
--- In [email protected], michael haaheim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Yes, I am aware of all of that. That is the primary argument made on
the part of those biologists who would classify virii as the most
complex non-living organisms. I am just saying that, as of yet, I
don't believe that a consensus has yet been determined on the subject.
Those biologists who argue that they are the simplest of living
organisms would argue that, although they can not reproduce on their
own, they CAN, in fact, reproduce, as well as evolve. They argue that
virii outside of other organisms are in a dormant state. Also, while
they don't take nourishment into themselves, they DO consume
nourishment (externally) in their process of reproduction.
> Again, one of the problems is that biologists have not yet arrived
at a consensus as to what constitutes life. According to SOME
definitions, you are entirely correct. Again, I just point out that
(to the best of my knowledge) a consensus has not been reached.
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Hank Roth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 5:23:51 PM
> Subject: [PNEWS-L] Re: Living on the Edge
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> Viruses can not sustain life by definition without infecting the
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> nucleus of living cells, therefore they are dead genetic material.
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> They are not dead as in decomposed or dead due to necrosis or
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> apoptosis. Viruses are just a few genes, thus they are protein making
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> information. Viruses are extremely small. HIV is only 9 genes. They
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> can't do much on their own. Viruses don't eat anything, What they do
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> is infect; hijack and change genes. Viruses can't reproduce on their
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> own and that is why they are considered dead. They just are there,
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> chunks of genetic material which is also why they are excellent for
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> gene modification and used in all kinds of applications to insert gene
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> information into the DNA of cells where they then spread to all the
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> cells which are targeted. The cell(s) they infect reproduces the new
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> infected cell.
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> Hank
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> --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED] .com, michael haaheim <MIKKELHPANDA@ ...>
wrote:
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> > As I understand it, biologists have STILL not yet come to any
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> definite conclusion as to whether or not virii are living organisms.
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> Part of the problem is that our definitions of "living" organisms are
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> not complete nor universal, and are extremely arbitrary.
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> >
>
> > ----- Original Message ----
>
> > From: adar <adar@>
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> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] .com
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> > Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 12:35:33 AM
>
> > Subject: [PNEWS-L] Living on the Edge
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> > Viruses are not alive. Bacteria and Eukaryotes are alive. Archaea is
[...]
