> > 2. God already did show up and introduce Himself, in the flesh, and > > continues to reveal Himself in history and creation. So He definitely > > exists. > > > > - Bob > > Really? Where? > > As told in the bible? > > You're a totally deluded guy, Bob. Face it, the bible is mostly made > up. > There is no god.
I was like you Helio, only not so closed-hearted on this matter. I rejected God after the Jesuits made me read the four gospels in the original Greek and I realized, starting on page one of Matthew, what a jumble catechism has made of Scripture (no offense, Stephen or other Catholics on the list... just know I have the same view of every denomination now, even the one I've more or less settled down on). I was kind of amazed they let me read it. But every contradiction between Scripture and catechism was "a mystery" and after so many mysteries accumulated I decided there were no answers. It was proof for me of what hypocrites religious people are, and what an impossible fairy tale the Bible is. It says this, but you say it says that... yea, right. And my, some of the things it says! How can anyone today accept them? No wonder the focus is on catechism and not the Bible. Subsequent travels across the denominational divide revealed a similar pattern---everyone picks and chooses the passages they like and builds entire theologies around them, comfortably ignoring the ones that undermine the thrust of their "denominational uniqueness". I went my merry way to a liberal arts college to study political philosophy, chased a girl to the other side of the planet, and one fine day, with no money in my pocket and nothing in English to read but Franz Kafka's The Trial and a plain ol' Gideon Bible, while camping out with some friends on the top of a mountain in Vladikavkaz, Russia, I decided to reread those very gospels, and several other books from the OT and NT that I'd never really read. Job, Ecclesiastes, Proverbs; Romans, Hebrews, and Acts. I discovered to my utter and immediate surprise a single voice, audible beneath the voices of the individual authors, discernible from their own idiosyncrasies and cultural/socio-economic influences over the ages and across wide swaths of geography, and very much present with me on that mountain, trying to comfort me, and I promptly spent the next couple decades of my life running from it, trying to stake out my own theories of everything, to become wise and witty and all that. I didn't hate God like you seem to, but I was definitely not sold that my proverbial mountain-top experience was anything but a delusion. What a cliché, after all! Surely it was the lack of oxygen to my brain. But time and time again the truths I encountered only in Scripture played out as true in my life in tangible ways. Little things at first, then over time as I recognized them for what they were, they grew in scope, not to mention irrefutability. Eventually I gave up trying to ignore God's reality to build my own. (I tried to read Kafka's book after that---it amused me the first time I read it in college---but suddenly it struck me as utterly lifeless, full of lies and deceits at a metaphysical level, and ultimately stupid. No wonder Kafka was so depressed and paranoid.) I understand you can't know God personally from the Bible. Nor will you: You refuse to read it with an open mind, you don't trust its authenticity, and you refuse to accept the testimony of others, whom you mock. You use any apparent contradiction or harsh-sounding snippet or fallen Christian to turn the truth of God into a lie, without spending any effort understanding what it's really saying. This is not wisdom, but foolishness. Moreover, many so called Christians don't exactly make it easier for you to accept. They themselves operate in spiritual bondage, never really letting go of their soulish selves and becoming real disciples, yea not even pastors or priests in many cases, let alone doing the things Jesus did with genuine love or compassion, and so they make it appear all the more absurd. I know, I am one of those kinds of Christians. :) But one fine day you will come face to face with the living God, and it would be better for you if it is on this side of eternity. On the other side, there is no undoing what you have done, no changing your mind, no metanoia. This freedom is a gift we have while we're in the flesh. None of us are worthy, or holy, or even good in and of ourselves---so don't take this as Bob being holier-than-thou. No, I just know my goofs and gaffes and follies and evil deeds are covered, simply because God in his mercy wants to cover them, and that I will have life beyond this temporal existence, simply because I choose to accept the cover I don't deserve. I wish this for everyone now, even folks who hate me, and whom I might have hated in the past. Good luck, friend. BTW, I know you don't hate me, you just think I'm nuts. That can be true and God can still exist. ;) - Bob > > HW _______________________________________________ Post Messages to: [email protected] Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[email protected] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
