I hit that wall years ago; this is what I currently use instead of U^:V^:_ in 
similar situations:

   U while V
0&({::)@:((U^:([`1:`(0&({::)@])) ,&< -.@:(1&({::)@:]))^:(''"_ $ 
,@:(V^:([`1:`(0&({::)@]))))^:_^:([`1:`((] ,&< 0:)@])))


This is a modification, following a hint from Henry, of another shorter version 
of while that unfortunately had multiple instances of U or V resulting in 
generating over-sized code.

By the way, what is UCALPHA?




________________________________
From: Dan Bron <[email protected]>
To: Programming Forum <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 8, 2009 11:43:59 AM
Subject: [Jprogramming] Limit limitation

I'm seeking a stylish workaround to the a constraint on applications of 
^:_  .

The idiom  ^:_  is well designed and well documented.  It is one of the
most useful tools in the J kit and has broad applicability.  However,
there are some cases where it's almost, but not quite, applicable.  

Consider the form  f^:g^:_  where  g  is a conditional which determines if
f  is to be applied (again).  Of course if g returns 0, then f isn't
applied, and  f^:g  becomes an identity function, which means its output
will match its input, and  ^:_  will terminate.  So usually  ^:g^:_  acts
as a while loop, independent of the operation of f, terminating iff g is
0. 

But now consider an f that is not one-to-one.  That is, an f where two or
more distinct inputs may produce identical outputs.  Using this f in 
f^:g^:_ becomes problematic.  If f receives two inputs in a row which map
to the same output, then the loop will terminate early (that is, even if g
is 1).

Here's a recent example.  I'm trying to code the "evoluationary algorithm"
from RC  http://rosettacode.org/wiki/Evolutionary_algorithm  .  The code I
have so far reads [1]:

    CHARS    =: ' ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ'
    randomize =: fivePct`mutation}
    fivePct  =: 0.05 >: $ ?...@$  0: 
    mutation  =: (UCALPHA,' ')&(] ,: [ {~ $...@] ?...@$ #...@[)  
    score    =: +/@:~:"1
    copy100  =: 100 $ ,:
    done      =: 1 - -:
    initial  =: CHARS ([ {~ ?...@$&#~ ) [
    
        f        =:  ([ (] {~ (i. <./)@:score) randomize@:copy100@:])

    (f^:done^:_: initial) 'METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL'

The problem I'm hitting is that f here isn't deterministic.  It takes a
"parent", generates a random population, and selects the fittest member of
that population -- which could legitimately be the original parent.  Hence
input and output are identical and  f^:done^:_:  terminates "early".  What
is I want is for  f^:done^:_:  to terminate iff  done  is true (that is, 
'METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL' -: y  ). 

Now, I understand that  ^:_  is doing the right thing.  I just want it to
do a slightly different thing, and I'm asking for elegant ways to achieve
that.  I know I've hit this wall before.  Has anyone else?  Can you
suggest a stylish workaround?

One method I'm considering is artificially (but reversibly) changing the
output of  f  at every iteration, as in  defining  f_new =: -.&.>@:{. ,&<
f  (that is, concatenating a boolean and negating it every iteration).  

-Dan

[1]  Bear in mind this code is still in development, and may suffer from
problems other than the one in question.

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