Pergilah berobat ke psikiater ayub yahya... Anda jelas sudah tidak waras.
Omongan anda suka kacau seperti eibawah ini. Jual laptop anda untuk biayanya. --- In [email protected], ayub wrote: > > si item niru polanya uplik > > uplik, awalnya ummat Islam Mu'tazilah > ujung2 nya Islam di maki2 > > tem.. tunjangan gereja mulai seret ?? > > koq curhatnya ke prols ?? > > hehehe... > > > > ________________________________ > > > --- In [email protected], itemabu2 wrote: > > Â > Uskup Worcester membatalkan Robert Spencer dr JihadWatch sbg pembicara > Â > di sebuah konperensi katolik atas permintaan orang Islam. > Â > Â > Dlm doktrin katolik karangan gereja Vatican, Islam itu emang dianggap > Â > sbg sodara seiman oleh Katolik, jadi ga heran kalo gereja Katolik > Â > rajin ngejilat pantat Islam. > Â > Â > ("But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the > Â > Creator. In the first place among these are the Muslims who, > Â > professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one > Â > and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind." (LG. #16)") > Â > Â > Apa yg dilakukan suryana itu jadinya didukung oleh gereja Katolik, > Â > entah disadari oleh suryana apa kagak. > Â > Â > Memang ada bbrp kekonyolan di beberapa aliran "Kristen" spt Katolik > Â > atau Salsi Yehovah, mereka merasa lbh dekat ke Islam drpd ke aliran > Â > Protestan biarpun dgn alasan yg berbeda2. Katolik mungkin merasa, > Â > musuh dr musuhku adalah temanku, krn Protestan itu ga ngakui kekuasaan > Â > Paus dan Vatican, maka Protestan adalah musuh Katolik, otomatis Islam > Â > jadi teman Katolik. Saksi Yehova merasa Islam dan Saksi Yehova sama2 > Â > unitarian, jadi Islam lbh dekat ke mereka. > Â > Â > Tapi memang ada satu persamaan antara Islam, Katolik dan Saksi Yehova, > Â > Muhammad, gereja Katolik dan Menara Pengawas dari Saksi Yehova itu > Â > adalah tukang tipu semuanya. > Â > Â > Â > http://www.jihadwatch.org/2013/02/worcester-bishop-spencers-talk-about-extreme-militant-islamists-and-the-atrocities-that-they-have-pe.html#comments > Â > Â > Worcester bishop: "Spencer's talk about extreme, militant > Â > Islamists...might undercut the positive achievements that we Catholics > Â > have attained in our inter-religious dialogue with devout Muslims" > Â > Â > Bishop Robert McManus of Worcester, Massachusetts canceled my > Â > scheduled address to this Catholic Men's Conference on March 16 after > Â > pressure from an Islamic supremacist who is an open "friend and > Â > supporter" of a convicted jihad terrorist. In the letter below, he > Â > justifies his action; my comments are interspersed. > Â > Â > Bishop McManus called me last Wednesday morning, but it was a wrong > Â > number: he was calling someone named "Steve" and somehow dialed my > Â > number by mistake. I seized the opportunity, told him who I was, and > Â > asked for a face-to-face meeting (which I have previously requested in > Â > a phone message to his office and in emails to him, his secretary, and > Â > his spokesman). He said he was in the airport in Dallas and would call > Â > me back; he never did, and up to this point I have not received the > Â > courtesy of any kind of reply from anyone to my requests for a > Â > meeting. > Â > Â > Here is the petition that is circulating asking Bishop McManus to > Â > allow me to speak after all. > Â > Â > "Catholic Men's Conference opens ticket sales," from Catholic Free > Â > Press, February 8 (thanks to Tom): > Â > Â > Bishop shares concerns about conference speaker > Â > Â > My dear friends in Christ, > Â > Â > It is fitting that as the universal Church celebrates the fiftieth > Â > anniversary of the opening of the Second Vatican Council, I as your > Â > bishop, who am called to work to implement authentically the teachings > Â > of this historic council, should reflect on the various documents of > Â > this momentous Church event. > Â > Â > In light of my recent decision to rescind the invitation to Mr. > Â > Robert Spencer to speak at the Catholic Men's Conference next month on > Â > the topic of Islam in its relation to Christianity, I should like to > Â > reflect briefly on the conciliar document entitled, The Dogmatic > Â > Constitution on the Church (Lumen Gentium), specifically on paragraph > Â > 16 of Chapter 2 which speaks about the special relationship that > Â > Christianity has to Islam. The paragraph states, "But the plan of > Â > salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the > Â > first place among these are the Muslims who, professing to hold the > Â > faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on > Â > the last day will judge mankind." (LG. #16)" > Â > Â > It is indeed important to "reflect" on what that text means. I do so > Â > at length in my book Not Peace But A Sword, which will be published > Â > March 25 by Catholic Answers. Does it mean that we are not to speak > Â > about the theological difference between Christianity and Islam, or > Â > about the Qur'anic roots of Muslim persecution of Christians, or > Â > related issues? I don't think so. Bishop McManus says below that it > Â > means that Catholics should engage in "inter-religious dialogue with > Â > Muslims." Fine. Should that dialogue proceed on the basis of ignoring > Â > unpleasant truths, or of discussing them, respectfully and openly? > Â > Â > As a result of such a theologically salient statement, the > Â > Catholic Church has engaged herself in inter-religious dialogue with > Â > Muslims. This dialogue has produced a harvest of mutual respect, > Â > understanding and cooperation throughout the world and here in the > Â > Commonwealth of Massachusetts. > Â > Â > "A harvest of mutual respect, understanding and cooperation throughout > Â > the world"? I wonder if the bishop would be so kind as to provide even > Â > one example of where inter-religious dialogue between the Catholic > Â > Church and Muslims has "produced a harvest of mutual respect, > Â > understanding and cooperation." Sure, the Muslim leaders in > Â > Massachusetts assure him of their good will -- but remember, in > Â > canceling my appearance he is catering to the demands of a "friend and > Â > supporter" of a convicted jihad terrorist. > Â > > And meanwhile, here is that harvest of mutual respect, understanding > > and cooperation throughout the world over the last few days: > > > > Syria: Jihadist rebels loot Christian church, homes > > > > Libya: Muslims threaten nuns, force them to leave the country > > > > Iran sentences U.S. pastor to eight years prison for threatening > > Iran's "national security" by leading Christian house churches > > > > Egypt: Anti-Christian hostility heats up amid unrest > > > > Turkey: 85-year-old Christian woman repeatedly stabbed, cross carved > > onto her corpse > > > > All this is over just the last few weeks. And there is much, much > > more, as a quick perusal of the Jihad Watch archives will reveal. But > > let's imagine for the sake of argument that Roman Catholics elsewhere > > are indeed reaping a "harvest of mutual respect, understanding and > > cooperation throughout the world" from their dialogue with Muslims. > > Would that dialogue not be more fruitful if it actually discussed real > > difficulties between Christians and Muslims, the root causes of those > > difficulties, and ways to remedy them? > > > > My decision to ask Mr. Spencer not to speak at the Men's > > Conference resulted from a concern voiced by members of the Islamic > > community in Massachusetts, a concern that I came to share. That > > concern was that Mr. Spencer's talk about extreme, militant Islamists > > and the atrocities that they have perpetrated globally might undercut > > the positive achievements that we Catholics have attained in our > > inter-religious dialogue with devout Muslims and possibly generate > > suspicion and even fear of people who practice piously the religion of > > Islam. > > > > Nota bene: He never asked me not to speak. He never communicated with > > me at all, except for that wrong number call. > > > > But in any case, why would a talk about "extreme, militant Islamists > > and the atrocities that they have perpetrated globally" undercut > > dialogue with Muslims who profess to reject those atrocities and the > > interpretation of Islam that underlies and justifies them? If they > > reject the jihadists' understanding of Islam, why wouldn't they > > welcome and applaud an honest discussion of that understanding of > > Islam, which presumably they oppose as much as I do? > > > > And my talk would generate "suspicion and even fear of people who > > practice piously the religion of Islam"? Islamic supremacist talking > > point. I have consistently stood for equality of rights of all people > > before the law and denounced all action against innocent people. Only > > those who wish to discredit my work so as to clear away obstacles > > before the advancing jihad claim otherwise. > > > > In press reports concerning the cancellation of Mr. Spencer's > > presentation, it was inaccurately stated that my decision was based on > > my wanting to avoid a media event unfavorable to the Diocese of > > Worcester. That was not the case. > > > > The source for this is one of his own clergy: "Monsignor Thomas > > Sullivan, lead organizer of the men's conference, told the Telegram & > > Gazette that some groups, including members of the Islamic Society of > > Greater Worcester, perceive Mr. Spencer as anti-Islamic. While the > > diocese does not share that view, he said, the invitation was > > withdrawn to avoid 'a media outcry.'" -- Worcester Telegram > > > > Others in some messages they sent to me, most of which were less > > than charitable and civil, claimed that I had "caved in to the demands > > of Islamic supremacists." > > > > As to caving in to Islamic supremacists, it is a pity that Bishop > > McManus doesn't address the fact that in cancelling my talk he was > > acceding to the demands of an open "friend and supporter" of a > > convicted jihad terrorist. But his complaint that most of the messages > > he received were "less than charitable and civil" I regard with > > skepticism. I asked people to write to him "politely and courteously," > > and the overwhelming majority of the many, many such letters that were > > copied to me were indeed polite and courteous. In saying this, he is > > implying that the people who oppose his decision to drop my talk are > > hateful louts, rather than people concerned for the defense of human > > rights against Sharia oppression, and for persecuted non-Muslims in > > Muslim countries. It is unfortunate to see a Roman Catholic bishop > > picking up a smear tactic that Islamic supremacists frequently use to > > try to intimidate people into thinking that there is something wrong > > with speaking out against that oppression and persecution. > > > > This of course is uninformed nonsense. In fact, I based my > > decision solely on the concern that Mr. Spencer's talk would impact > > negatively on the Church's increasingly constructive dialogue with > > Muslims. > > > > "Increasingly constructive dialogue"? Constructive how? Has it > > resulted in fewer Christians being persecuted in Pakistan, Indonesia, > > Egypt, Syria, Iraq, Nigeria, or the other countries were Muslims are > > brutalizing and terrorizing them? Has it resulted in a reform or > > rejection of the Islamic texts and teachings mandating warfare against > > and subjugation of Christians and other non-Muslims (cf. Qur'an 9:29)? > > > > How is dialogue improved by ignoring unpleasant facts? > > > > The Catholic Men's Conference is a wonderful opportunity for men > > to come together to reflect on their spiritual lives and to become > > better informed about their Catholic faith and its implications for > > their daily living. Since the Diocese of Worcester sponsors this event > > annually, we concluded that a speaker whose focus would be on the > > danger of militant Islamist jihad, a topic that might be appropriate > > at a conference on international politics with a forum for debate, was > > not suitable for our conference. > > > > That's another point: that a talk like mine simply wouldn't fit in > > with a conference about faith and spirituality. Fair enough. But the > > conference organizers invited me last June; clearly they thought my > > talk would fit right in. And the Bishop didn't seem to have a problem > > with my being there until the Islamic supremacists and mainstream > > media began making a fuss. Coincidence of coincidences, then he > > discovered my talk just didn't fit in. > > > > It is true that Christians in parts of the world where Islam is > > the dominant religion have suffered and continue to suffer persecution > > at the hands of Islamist extremists and terrorists. Our local Muslim > > leaders themselves have publicly described these violent Muslim > > militants as "heretics" and have condemned such abominable acts. We > > hold our Christian brothers and sisters who are enduring such > > persecution in our prayers as we vigorously support every effort to > > work diplomatically for their protection and well-being. > > > > I'm glad they've condemned the persecutors as "heretics," although I'd > > be interested to know on what Islamic grounds they did so. In any > > case, here again -- if this is so, why would they be so threatened by > > a discussion of the beliefs that gave rise to the persecution in the > > first place, and of how free people can respond effectively to that > > persecution? Shouldn't they be joining in such an honest discussion, > > rather than trying to shut it down? > > > > During this Year of Faith proclaimed by Pope Benedict XVI and > > especially during the holy season of Lent that we are soon entering, I > > ask that we call on the Holy Spirit to encourage us to share our faith > > with others, especially our brothers and sisters of other faiths, in > > order to further the crucial mission of the New Evangelization. As we > > seek to introduce the Lord Jesus to others, let us pray that our > > personal and ecclesial witness of faith may help others to know and > > love Christ who is our Way, our Truth and our Life. > > > > Most Reverend Robert J. McManus > > Bishop of Worcester > > > > I'll be there on March 16 -- at an exhibitor's table or outside. > > Posted by Robert on February 9, 2013 4:32 PM | 10 Comments > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > ------------------------------------ Post message: [email protected] Subscribe : [email protected] Unsubscribe : [email protected] List owner : [email protected] Homepage : http://proletar.8m.com/Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/proletar/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/proletar/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
