Because Adam can’t post his responses to the Public@ list, I’m doing it for him at his request.
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2018 5:46 PM To: Kirk Hall <[email protected]>; [email protected] Subject: [EXTERNAL]RE: Membership Application of Sony All: First, a bit of background. The ATSC 3.0 television broadcast standard (see www.atsc.org<http://www.atsc.org>, or search the web for “ATSC 3.0”), which is generally speaking a modification of the over-the-air digital broadcast system, which is based on a UDP multicast over-the-air (with an optional online aspect, for a hybrid system) – and an attempt to use internet/web/W3C tools when possible. This includes a number of security features (and I chair the security group in ATSC). Among those features are support for content protection mechanisms using EME and CENC … as well as cryptographic signing mechanisms. Deployments plan to use public root(s) for code signing (and signaling signing, more detail below). To answer the questions: Ryan Sleevi: It sounds like the question is "Can we join the Forum without joining a CWG" - but that may not be a correct understanding. That’s not our ask. I’m happy to participate in a (the) CWG, but see below. Kirk Hall: (a) All Forum members must *** meet at least one of the following criteria: *** (3) Certificate Consumer: The member organization produces a software product, such as a browser, intended for use by the general public for relying upon certificates and is a member of a CWG [Chartered Working Group, such as the new Server Certificate Working Group]. Today we only have one Chartered Working Group (CWG). Its charter has the following additional requirement for participation as a browser (Certificate Consumer): (3) A Certificate Consumer can participate in this Working Group if it produces a software product intended for use by the general public for browsing the Web securely. So to participate in this CWG (the only one we have), Sony must “produce[] a software product intended for use by the general public for browsing the Web securely”. Can you tell us if Sony meets that requirement? An ATSC 3.0 TV is a dual-homed device with both a one-way over-the-air interface which receives UDP multicasts, and a traditional IP interface (802.3, 802.11) for an internet connection. This sort of TV includes a HTML5 browser, and our security requirements include mandatory use of DNSSEC and TLS 1.2, 1.3. So, these devices are products with software intended for use by the general public for browsing the web securely … but “browsing the web” is a little bit more constrained than a PC with a browser, more like “browsing [some content on] the web”. As a threshold matter, I think such a TV is hardware bundled with software which is capable of fetching content (including HTML and other content, like audio/video) from the internet and rendering it, which relies upon certificates for security (TLS, DNSSEC). However, of significant interest is the use of cryptographic signing to yield a tamper-evident transmission mechanism for both executable code (like HTML5 apps) and related information (signaling, which includes things like what-content-is-where, and electronic program guide data). It’s our hope that we can participate in the processes for maintaining requirements for public roots for signing certificates. We realize that this is perhaps slightly different from the traditional CA/B Forum area, but at the same time, all or nearly all of the requirements and details for the issuance and management of code signing certificates (and where the CA Security Council refers to the Baseline Requirements, etc.) are directly usable and useful for the embedded systems that are TVs (& related broadcast systems). Hopefully the above is clear, but I’d be happy to elaborate/explain more if that’d be helpful. Regards, Adam Goldberg Director, Technical Standards Technology Standards Office Sony Electronics, Inc. 202-601-4130 (tel) 571-363-9778 (mobile) From: Kirk Hall [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2018 3:36 PM To: Goldberg, Adam <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>; CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Subject: Re: Membership Application of Sony Adam – I just realized that there is a double test for anyone new applying to be a Forum member – one requirement to be a Forum Member, and a second requirement to be a member of a CWG. In the browser (Certificate Consumer) category, the Forum membership requirement is as follows: (a) All Forum members must *** meet at least one of the following criteria: *** (3) Certificate Consumer: The member organization produces a software product, such as a browser, intended for use by the general public for relying upon certificates and is a member of a CWG [Chartered Working Group, such as the new Server Certificate Working Group]. Today we only have one Chartered Working Group (CWG). Its charter has the following additional requirement for participation as a browser (Certificate Consumer): (3) A Certificate Consumer can participate in this Working Group if it produces a software product intended for use by the general public for browsing the Web securely. So to participate in this CWG (the only one we have), Sony must “produce[] a software product intended for use by the general public for browsing the Web securely”. Can you tell us if Sony meets that requirement? Sorry for any confusion – we are just rolling out this new governance structure now. Kirk From: Public [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Kirk Hall via Public Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2018 12:15 PM To: CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Subject: Re: [cabfpub] [EXTERNAL]Re: Membership Application of Sony Good question. The SCWG Charter is shown below. Ben and I are the initial SCWG Chair and Vice Chair until the SCWG elects its own officers. The SCWG was approved in Ballot 206 and already exists, but the changes to the Bylaws don’t become effective until July 3. After that date, I plan to issue an invitation to CABF Members and Associate Members to participate in the SCWG, and ask them to indicate their interest by “registering” on a page on the wiki. Interested Parties can also indicate their interest in the WG, probably by email. We should probably amend Bylaw 5.3.1 - Formation of Chartered Working Groups to include specific procedures for how Forum Members, etc. join new WGs once they are established. Server Certificate Working Group Charter Upon approval of the CAB Forum by ballot, the Server Certificate Working Group (“Working Group”) is created to perform the activities as specified in this Charter, subject to the terms and conditions of the CA/Browser Forum Bylaws and Intellectual Property Rights (IPR) Policy, as such documents may change from time to time. The definitions found in the Forum’s Bylaws shall apply to capitalized terms in this Charter. SCOPE: The authorized scope of the Server Certificate Working Group shall be as follows: 1. To specify Baseline Requirements, Extended Validation Guidelines, Network and Certificate System Security Requirements, and other acceptable practices for the issuance and management of SSL/TLS server certificates used for authenticating servers accessible through the Internet. 2. To update such requirements and guidelines from time to time, in order to address both existing and emerging threats to online security, including responsibility for the maintenance of and future amendments to the current CA/Browser Forum Baseline Requirements, Extended Validation Requirements, and Network and Certificate System Security Requirements. 3. To perform such other activities that are ancillary to the primary activities listed above. OUT OF SCOPE: The Server Certificate Working Group will not address certificates intended to be used primarily for code signing, S/MIME, time-stamping, VoIP, IM, or Web services. The Server Certificate Working Group will not address the issuance, or management of certificates by enterprises that operate their own Public Key Infrastructure for internal purposes only, and for which the Root Certificate is not distributed by any Application Software Supplier. Anticipated End Date: None. Initial chairs and contacts: Chair, Kirk Hall, [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; Vice Chair, Ben Wilson, [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>; terms to run concurrently with their terms as Chair and Vice Chair of the Forum, respectively, unless otherwise voted upon by the Working Group. Members eligible to participate: The Working Group shall consist of two classes of voting members, the Certificate Issuers and the Certificate Consumers. The CA Class shall consist of eligible Certificate Issuers and Root Certificate Issuers meeting the following criteria: (1) Certificate Issuer: The member organization operates a certification authority that has a current and successful WebTrust for CAs audit, or ETSI TS 102042, ETSI 101456, or ETSI EN 319 411-1 audit report prepared by a properly-qualified auditor, and that actively issues certificates to Web servers that are openly accessible from the Internet, such certificates being treated as valid when using a browser created by a Certificate Consumer Member. Applicants that are not actively issuing certificates but otherwise meet membership criteria may be granted Associate Member status under Bylaw Sec. 3.1 for a period of time to be designated by the Forum. (2) Root Certificate Issuer: The member organization operates a certification authority that has a current and successful WebTrust for CAs, or ETSI TS 102042, ETSI TS 101456, ETSI EN 319 411-1 audit report prepared by a properly-qualified auditor, and that actively issues certificates to subordinate CAs that, in turn, actively issue certificates to Web servers that are openly accessible from the Internet, such certificates being treated as valid when using a browser created by a Certificate Consumer Member. Applicants that are not actively issuing certificates but otherwise meet membership criteria may be granted Associate Member status under Bylaw Sec. 3.1 for a period of time to be designated by the Forum. (3) A Certificate Consumer can participate in this Working Group if it produces a software product intended for use by the general public for browsing the Web securely. The Working Group shall include Interested Parties and Associate Members as defined in the Bylaws. Voting structure: In order for a ballot to be adopted by the Working Group, two-thirds or more of the votes cast by the Certificate Issuers must be in favor of the ballot and more than 50% of the votes cast by the Certificate Consumers must be in favor of the ballot. At least one member of each class must vote in favor of a ballot for it to be adopted. Quorum is the average number of Member organizations (cumulative, regardless of Class) that have participated in the previous three Server Certificate Working Group Meetings or Teleconferences (not counting subcommittee meetings thereof). For transition purposes, if three meetings have not yet occurred, quorum is ten (10). Summary of the work that the WG plans to accomplish: As specified in Scope section above. Summary of major WG deliverables and guidelines: As specified in Scope section above. Primary means of communication: listserv-based email, periodic calls, and face-to-face meetings. IPR Policy: The CA/Browser Forum Intellectual Rights Policy, v. 1.3 or later, SHALL apply to all Working Group activity. From: Wayne Thayer [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2018 10:32 AM To: Kirk Hall <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>; CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Subject: [EXTERNAL]Re: [cabfpub] Membership Application of Sony The part that I find unclear is how one becomes a member of the Server Certificate WG. The charter defines membership criteria but there doesn't appear to be a process for adding members at the WG level. On Wed, Jun 27, 2018 at 10:21 AM Kirk Hall via Public <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Summary based on quotes from my original email to the list: Original Sony question: “Can you please describe the bylaw requirement of “produces a software product, such as a browser, intended for use by the general public for relying upon certificates and is a member of a CWG”? If we produce a hardware product which includes software which relies upon (public root) certificates, does that meet the definition of “produces a software product”?” Dean Coclin response: “Perhaps you can help clarify by stating whether or not Sony makes the underlying software that runs in the hardware device made by Sony?” Sony response: “Limiting the discussion to televisions (the question at-hand), they’re based on Android TV then with Sony software on top. So, “does Sony make the software” is yes and no. But we *do* write the software that does the cryptographic signature validation.” Bylaws provide as follows: (a) All Forum members must *** meet at least one of the following criteria: *** (3) Certificate Consumer: The member organization produces a software product, such as a browser, intended for use by the general public for relying upon certificates and is a member of a CWG [Chartered Working Group, such as the new Server Certificate Working Group]. From: Ryan Sleevi [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2018 10:13 AM To: Kirk Hall <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>; CABFPub <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> Subject: Re: [cabfpub] [EXTERNAL]Re: Membership Application of Sony I'm having trouble finding a clear summary of the question from the message forwarded. Could you helpfully re-state it? It sounds like the question is "Can we join the Forum without joining a CWG" - but that may not be a correct understanding. _______________________________________________ Public mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> https://cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/public
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