guy keren wrote: >thanks. i'm glad i finally managed to do something you actually aprove of >whole heartedly ;) > > > Sorry for not making it clear - in fact I approve of most of the stuff I've seen (e.g. the whole Hazor project, this course, the fun attitude, most of the contents, including what I've read so far from your essays in LUPG).
I purposefully try to read critically and comment about stuff I don't understand or disagree with - this is a kind of feedback I'd consider helpful if I was in your place (compliments are fine, but theyr'e not contents and are not what drives me to produce/fix some). <--- snip snip ---> >>to eat it or anything, just appreciating a good idea), and will update >>the wiki sometime soon. >> >> > >like i was saying - i don't think a wiki is a convinient place to hold >discussions. > > > Any form of communication is only useful if all sides involved use it. It's a chicken and egg thing: if *you* prefer mail - mail is the most convenient. I could say alot to try to convince you otherwise, but that's stuff for another thread. I keep the wiki contents mainly for readers who are not subscribed to this list. >how about, instead, taking upon yourself the writing of the slides for >other mini-lectures, in the same style? i'll send you the program i use >(which i "stole" from [EMAIL PROTECTED]) so all lecture slides will have the >same format (even if not necessarily the same spirit)? > > > I know you prefer contents than proofing, but I was not able to write the slides because I did not know your plans (my ideas for solving the problems I'd mentioned involved major reorganization of the first 3 meetings, which I knew you would not like). Please do give a link to the program - I might make use of it next time. <--- snip snip ---> >as you see, i chose the 10-minutes method. i'll probably use a shorter >version of http://nadav.harel.org.il/essays/chofesh/lecture.html - after >adopting it to high-school kids, and for my taste. as such, i'm going o >talk - not show slides. > > maybe put this link in the plan? <--- snip snip ---> >[... example snipped - it is far far far too advanced for people hwo've >never thought of a program. don't know about you, but i remember how i >felt when i learned programming for the first time - i had a problem >writing a simple program to solve the "twice the rice on each chessboard >square" problem :0 and you're talking about implementing algorithms of >this length in pseudo-code? not to mention, having to solve a maze with >pen and paper? i'm trying to attract them - not to push them away ;) > > > Supplying the algorithm and dry-running it as an exercise might be easy enough, yet useful and instructive (gives you a good idea of what an algorithm is). Then you could be guided into understanding the algorithm's limitations, and maybe think of the fix yourself (bonus exercise?). Homework might not be so bad if it's not required and you don't rely on it being done. You were thinking of giving the data structures book as extra reading starting from third lesson, so I was thinking this could act as extra reading for the first lesson. <--- snip snip ---> >>which are not demonstrated in this lesson, and will only be >>encountered (if at all) far later in this course's plan. >> >> > >why not demonstrated? demonstrating doesn't mean "showing a python >program". the can be given analogues from other areas (didn't i do that in >the slides? if not - i'll add some). > > > I was thinking about variables and objects (classes) - for these your examples refer to the robot game, and I did not think the concept clearly follows from the example. Maybe I'm wrong. <--- snip snip ---> >i'll consider using http://www.effbot.org/zone/python-objects.htm to >modify the variables slide. > > > Thanks for the link! I see I did not google hard enough - if I did I might not have written that page (luckily I did that in hebrew, so work is not wasted). <--- snip snip ---> >however! since this intro is not python-specific, i'm not sure i could do >it here. perhaps i should do it on the meeting in which we talk about >variables (the 3rd meeting). > > > As I said in my reply to Nir's comment - might be a good idea to avoid talking about variables at that point at all (you'd waste time explaining an unused concept that will only confuse them). You can mention it in the general discussion about programming languages (some languages do have that), and let them encounter it again when they're off to learn C or similiar. By that time they would hopefully have some experience, and would easily grasp it. <--- snip snip ---> >i don't realy care what "some people with no sence of humor or sense of >self-humor think". i'm not going to change this. > > > The personal lesson I learned from a few unintentional flamewars: never underestimate people's capacity to misunderstand. As much as I dislike it, I now force myself to always put a winking smilie if something is not ment literally. Also - IANAP, so I might be more restrictive - it being non-self-humor. (This is just comments - do whatever you please) <--- snip snip ---> >>* typos: >>() node 4, first point: "milot mafteah" >>() node 10, second point: the closing parenthesis appears reverse (at >>least on my firefox). >>() node 15, fifth point: "shelet" instead of "kelet" >> >> > >fixed those (and another one found along the way, and added 1-2 new >bullets). > > Sorry - couldn't resist: you wouldn't have to fix the typos if it was a wiki page - I'm sure I'm not the first one to notice them, but many people who would not bother to comment about such things by mail, would fix them on wiki (and don't worry - it seems that most people only directly fix simple typos that they are 100% sure of, otherwise they tend to add a comment somewhere else so as not to disturb the original contents).
