Yes, the design is the major factor in terms of how the bike handles and 
rides... however.  The tubing diameter and wall thickness directly influence 
the stiffness (or perhaps more accurately the spring rate) of each tube.  This 
in turn will affect the bike's response to loading whether from weight put on 
the bike or dynamic loading from pedaling, etc.  Take a Roadeo and put 100 lbs 
of stuff in panniers on it and compare it to the same size Atlantis with the 
same load and the bikes will tolerate those loads differently; the odds are 
that the Atlantis will handle much better because the frame won't flex as much 
from the load.

That's an extreme case, though, and for most aspects of the riding experience 
the effects of frame design will be more prominent than whether the belly of 
the tube is .07 or .08.  However, on interwebs forums you'll find a lot of 
argument to the contrary from the princess and the pea crowd.  I remember one 
guy on rec.bicycles hollering blue bloody murder because his custom bike came 
with a top tube like 3 mm off spec center to center and how the builder 
"ruined" his bike.  I am so glad that I am not as sensitive to these things and 
too ignorant to know the difference.

Tim



On Jun 20, 2014, at 12:30 PM, dougP <dougpn...@cox.net> wrote:

> Surely the design is the lion's share of a bike's handling, ride, response, 
> etc.  The raw material would have to be top quality to produce the designer's 
> intent, but likely there are several vendors products that are functionally 
> interchangeable.  Designers like Grant have accumulated years (decades?) of 
> experience.  Remember his "how to design a frame" tutorial a couple of years 
> ago?  Ain't so easy, I suspect.
> 
> dougP
> 
> On Friday, June 20, 2014 8:24:30 AM UTC-7, Joe Bernard wrote:
> My initial comments about my Heron Road generated a good bit of discussion 
> about the perceived wonderfulness of a specific tube, which has been 
> interesting and informative, but possibly misses a salient fact about said 
> bicycle: I've owned several Grant-designed bikes, and they all have an 
> hard-to-describe-if-you-haven't-experienced-it ability to float comfortably 
> down the road; hold a stable line in a turn; yet snap into a different 
> direction on a whim. I've ridden enough other bikes in 25 years to know this 
> is not an universal quality in frame design, which is one of the things that 
> makes Rivendells (and Riv-designed Herons) special. Of course the tubes 
> chosen for each model/size are part of the equation, but I suspect the 
> geometries they are placed into make more of a difference in the 
> ride/handling than the specific properties of the tube themselves. This would 
> be my guess, at any rate.

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