I knew roughly what Bill meant by a dram of whiskey -- a modest amount -- but I was curious enough about its exact meaning to look it up. According to the U.S. Customary System, a dram is exactly one eighth of a fluid ounce -- less than a teaspoon. For fender installation, I personally need more whiskey than that!
Sent from my iPhone On Jun 9, 2016, at 1:27 PM, Bill Lindsay <tapebu...@gmail.com<mailto:tapebu...@gmail.com>> wrote: I have five thoughts on this subject 1. I agree that metal fenders look nicer than plastics. I have no gripes with anybody who chooses to use metal fenders exclusively. That said, I think plastics look fine, and are good enough for many things. I use metals and plastics about 50/50 in my stable. 2. If you are doing it right, metal fenders take a bit longer to install than plastics. If it took 3 hours, you were doing it wrong. If it required 3 arms and a box of ambidextrous luck, you were doing it wrong. Doing it right should take about 40 minutes for plastics and about 60 minutes for metal. Maybe 80 minutes for metal if they are not pre-drilled. I'm speaking roughly and generally because usually this process is meditative, and involves a glass of wine or dram of whisky. 3. I agree 100% with Steve Palincsar that the very best fender installs happen on bicycles designed perfectly to accept metal fenders. That means equidistant bridges, with a threaded boss already present at the seatstay bridge, the chainstay bridge and under the fork crown. That install takes a while because you need to custom drill your fenders for the bike, but that's the very best way, in my opinion. Everything else is a workaround. The relative goodness of that workaround is in the eye of the beholder. All of my Rivendells have nice threaded bridges in back. None of my Rivendells have a proper fender attachment point at the fork crown, so I have to use an L-Bracket there. That's a workaround, but I think it's an acceptable workaround. 4. The most common way of "doing it wrong" in my experience, is trying to do a proper fender install with the bike on the ground. Choosing to try to install your own fenders without having the bike in a proper workstand will definitely make the job more challenging and probably more frustrating. Metal fenders in particular, with perfectly designed attachment points, require you to remove and reinstall the wheels multiple times. I don't recommend attempting that without having the bike in a stand. If the bike is on the ground, then that motivates me to try to do everything with the wheels on, and that just makes it harder. 5. I agree with Michael in his OP that whether or not to choose to use a product has little to do with the product itself and almost everything to do with the person holding the wrench. Michael doesn't like installing plastic fenders, so he won't do it anymore. Bravo. Similarly, I find doing a bleed on mineral-oil hydraulic brakes far easier than doing a bleed on D.O.T. fluid hydraulic brakes, so I choose to avoid D.O.T. hydraulic brakes. My choice says little objectively about D.O.T. brakes. My choice says something about my mechanical abilities and proclivities. People who find themselves similar to Michael in ability and experience might also decide to stop using plastic fenders. That's totally cool. I don't like roofing or drain-side plumbing, so I pay people to do those things. I like construction framing and supply-side plumbing, so I do those tasks when they arise. Those choices have more to do with me than they have to do with the nature of the tasks. Bill Lindsay El Cerrito, CA On Thursday, June 9, 2016 at 3:22:49 AM UTC-7, Michael Hechmer wrote: I'm not the world's best bike mechanic, but neither am I a novice. The first pair of plastic fenders I worked with were Bluemels, from the late 70's. Around the turn of the millennium I first installed a pair of SKS fenders. It seemed pretty straight forward and simple. You attached them to the brake bolt and drop outs, threaded the stays through a metal hole, and tightened a nut. You could trim the stays if you wanted to or just put a little plastic cap over the end. Finally you fussed with the alignment. You were done, until they came out of alignment. I migrated to metal fenders. They are just a bit more challenging, I needed to be more careful in getting them aligned, but once that was done, they would stay put for years. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com<mailto:rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com<mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com>. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch. 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