I don't think Bill is spreading falsehoods about metal fenders. He is not saying that plastic fenders absolutely have more clearance than metal fenders. I think that he is saying in the situation of trying to cram as large a tire as possible and a fender into a given frame/brake combination, and considering the stock hardware that comes with most fenders (which, on metal fenders, often involves darumas or bolts with nuts on the inside of the fender), it may be easier to achieve the desired result with the current SKS fenders than the current commonly available metal fenders.
I certainly agree that with metal fenders, especially those that aren't pre-drilled for hardware, are much more adaptable in terms of how you mount them. If you have access to riveting tools you can rivet L-brackets to them. You can bolt them to dedicated mounts on the frame and racks (assuming your frame and racks were built with them) with button head bolts. My wife's bike (Heron Touring) has some Honjo fenders that came to me with special plates to attach the fender stays rather than darumas, and those definitely take up relatively little space on the inside of the fender (I see them now on the SimWorks website, listed as the "Stay Band Set": https://sim.works/collections/small-parts-simworks-by-honjo). But all of this is a lot more customization and effort when compared to what it takes to install a pair of SKS fenders. I am in a similar situation to the OP: my Rambouillet (an older Rivendell road bike that also used 47-57mm reach brakes) came with 28mm tires and hammered Honjo fenders. The fenders are the narrowest Honjos I've seen but the daruma bolts at the fork crown and stay mounts are definitely the limiting factor. I could cut down threaded ends of the darumas and maybe use thinner nuts, but I'd still probably be hesitant to run anything much wider than 28mm. I've thought about switching the fenders out for some 45mm longboards I have and seeing if I could run 32-33mm tires. At the same time, my primary motivation for going to larger tires is riding gravel and dirt, so maybe it's better to just ditch the fenders entirely and run tires in the 35mm range. I live in California and rain isn't a year-round phenomenon here. -Jeremy Till Sacramento, CA On Tuesday, May 14, 2019 at 11:01:07 AM UTC-7, lconley wrote: > > I mount my own fenders. I can put a metal fender on any of my bikes and > equal or better the clearance of a plastic fender. You can use crimp on > mounts anywhere on a metal fender - you can even cut off the crimp and > rivet them to the outside of the fender and presto! - more clearance than a > plastic. Through bolts are NOT required. > > I rode plastic fenders in the 70s and 80s. I prefer metal, but I have a > lot of tools and have been collecting fender hardware for years and I have > been working on bikes for 50 years. If you prefer to have plastic fenders > good for you, but don't spread falsehoods about metal fenders. > > Laing > Cocoa, FL > > On Tuesday, May 14, 2019 at 12:37:18 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote: > >> The idea that metal fenders have less clearance than SKS generally stems >> from the fact that most metal fenders have bulky hardware that you run >> inside the fender to attach the stays. SKS fenders have that flat plate >> riveted to the fender, so there's almost nothing inside the fender in the >> way of hardware. In virtually all cases, the stay is held in place by a >> daruma bolt. There's a nut inside at least. Some people run a washer >> inside as well. Some run the daruma cups inside. The stack up of that >> standard hardware is at least 4mm tall. In my experience Velo Orange >> daruma bolts are over-long, so if you don't scrub off the excess, that >> stack up could be taller. >> >> Additionally, the rolled edge of most metal fenders can be another issue, >> particularly through the fork crown. That edge in a SKS fender is much >> flatter. People like Jan recommend a 10mm gap (or more) from the fender >> surface to the tire, everywhere. Bulky hardware eats into that 10mm in >> spots. The rolled edge may drop that 10mm to 7mm, but that's OK. >> >> People who don't actually care about fender clearance and instead want to >> find the larger possible tire they can run with fenders with no rubbing, >> generally find that combination with plastic fenders. I don't think I've >> ever heard a mechanic claim they could make room for fatter tires by >> swapping from plastic fenders to metal. >> >> On my 57cm Leo Roadini, I run 28mm tires when the bike has metal fenders >> on it. >> >> Bill Lindsay >> El Cerrito, CA >> >> >> On Tuesday, May 14, 2019 at 6:20:03 AM UTC-7, lconley wrote: >>> >>> The idea that metal fenders have less clearance than SKS is false. You >>> can buy wider metal fenders than you can plastic. You can press/pound a >>> recess into metal fenders at the fork crown, front brake area to increase >>> the overall clearance in other areas. Some Honjo fenders can be had >>> pre-clearanced for this purpose. You cannot put a recess in the SKS plastic >>> fenders without cutting. If you want to maximize clearance, you can always >>> cut the fenders (plastic or metal) at the fork crown, front brake area, >>> this cures the open brake - fender interference issue. The forward part of >>> the fender can be held in place with a modified "diving board" rack mount, >>> fender stay, rack or some combination thereof. Rivendell will even do this >>> for you. >>> >>> Laing >>> Cocoa, FL >>> >>> On Monday, May 13, 2019 at 9:24:28 PM UTC-4, Matt D wrote: >>> >>>> My 61 Roadini is set up with 17mm Alexrims G6000 rims, Panaracer >>>> Gravelking 32c tires (which run true to size), and Tektro R539 brakes. I'm >>>> headed to merrie olde England in June with bicycle in tow and I'd like to >>>> prepare for the rain that seems to go along with the island but I'm not >>>> sure I can fit them. >>>> >>>> My research has only turned up this - Paul Gong on a RBWOB facebook >>>> group says: >>>> *"I have a Roadeo which has the same designed-in clearances. I can just >>>> fit Jack Browns and SKS P45 Longboards with careful installation. This was >>>> a combo that Rivendell often featured on their website and Instagram. I'm >>>> pretty certain metal fenders like VO and Honjo wouldn't fit with Jack >>>> Browns. Their design and hardware require more clearance than Longboards."* >>>> >>>> Jack Browns, of course, being 33.3mm. That makes me suspect that >>>> Rivendell's limit of 28 with fenders might be a little conservative. I >>>> don't intend to ride many loose surfaces or gravel so I'm not all too >>>> worried about things getting caught under it. Is anyone else running >>>> fenders above 28mm on their Roadini or Roadeo and if so, what do you >>>> suggest I use? >>>> >>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/588374a3-60ce-43ca-a6be-4462f807989c%40googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
