Hugh, Sounds like you may have already found it, based upon your previous comment. But he is a link to the online article https://www.renehersecycles.com/myth-18-wide-tires-need-wide-rims/
Ben On Thursday, February 4, 2021 at 6:11:07 PM UTC-8 Hugh Smitham wrote: > Weston, > > I haven't made it through Jan's entire argument yet still waiting for him > to talk tire pressure. So far he's said that the air not the tire side wall > hold bike and rider. To your point, that seems like a reasonable > expectation, low pressure vs medium to high pressures. To be honest I'm > just not sure, I do recall on my Bantam running DT SWISS XR 551's i-40, > 44mm external wrapped with 3.0 schwabe Rocket Ron's with a pressure in the > neighborhood of 12- 15 psi the sidewall felt squishy and unsettling and led > me to run pressures between 18 and 20 PSI. I think my experience runs a > little contrary to yours in that one instance. I do think that there are so > many tire and rim combinations that it's hard to really pin it down as to > what's the ideal pressure. I think the ideal pressure is whatever the rider > decides based on their comfort and safety level. Obviously based on what > tire and rim combination they're running. > > I need to finish reading Jan's article. I'll report back. > > Hugh > > > On Thu, Feb 4, 2021, 5:48 PM Weston Hein <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Just my experience on the whole rim width debate as a 185lb rider- tire >> pressure is the most important variable. >> >> I run my tires much lower than most (felt by taking their bikes for a >> spin and all the comments that I "have a flat tire") and the narrower the >> rim the easier the tire collapses during low pressure cornering. I've run >> the 55cm Antelope Hills on i18mm rims, same as an A23, and they squirmed >> with the tire pressures I like to run. Around 15psi tubeless says the >> AccuGauge. The Cliffhangers tolerate the lower pressures without any >> instability. >> >> When I pumped either wheelset up to higher pressures there was no >> difference felt between the two, and I think that's where the argument >> comes in that wide rims aren't necessary. If you tend to run higher >> pressure and like your tires firm than it may never be an issue. But if you >> run your tires low to the point where you can see your rear deforming on >> the ground as your ride, it may be worth considering. >> >> Just my 2c, ymmv as always! >> On Thursday, February 4, 2021 at 4:36:50 PM UTC-8 Hugh Smitham wrote: >> >>> Bruce, >>> >>> I think if I'm being totally honest with myself? >>> >>> I'd like the option to run a tire between a 47 mm and a 55 mm. I think >>> I'd like the option to run a narrower tire if I wanted to? I need to figure >>> which rim would be suitable for that range. I'll look at the Atlas. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Hugh >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2021, 4:18 PM Bruce Herbitter <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hello Hugh: >>>> >>>> The A23 is narrow for a 55 to sit well, I think. It’s also shallow >>>> compared to the cliffhanger. The Atlas might actually be one for you to >>>> consider with 55 tires. >>>> >>>> Bruce >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Feb 4, 2021, at 5:30 PM, Hugh Smitham <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi Bruce, >>>> >>>> And thanks for the info. Do you think the A23's would handle a 55mm >>>> tire well? >>>> >>>> Hugh >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2021, 2:47 AM Fullylugged <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Prowheelbuilder.com has the silver color Shimano 105 (R7000) rear hub >>>>> for $61 and front for $36. 105 is a longer tested product than V-O, if >>>>> you >>>>> can live with a non polished finish, and the price is certainly right. I >>>>> built a 650B set with these hubs and Velocity Synergy rims. More >>>>> recently >>>>> I bought a set of wheels with A23 rims and like them so far. I have 38mm >>>>> tires on both wheelsets. A third wheelset has the polished White Ind hubs >>>>> and Synergy wheels and 32mm tires. All of them ride just fine. >>>>> >>>>> On Thursday, February 4, 2021 at 2:34:54 AM UTC-6 Hugh Smitham wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Ben, >>>>>> >>>>>> You don't sound argumentative and I appreciate your opinion. >>>>>> >>>>>> Is that article online? If it is, I'd appreciate a link, I'm curious >>>>>> to read Jan's opinion on this matter. I was expressing someone >>>>>> else's belief which I think I mentioned. I have had various experiences >>>>>> with larger tires and depending on the rim and psi I've felt the tire >>>>>> roll >>>>>> or collapse on cornering. Probably user error, running too low of a tire >>>>>> pressure. I've had 2.1 thunder burts on a 23mm rim and 2.8 and 3.0's on >>>>>> a >>>>>> DT Swiss 40mm rim and on my AHH I ran Velocity A23's with numerous tires >>>>>> from 38 to 42mm. As far as the Pacenti rims I think my buddies opinion >>>>>> was >>>>>> simply the j hook that holds the bead on isn't a good as say the HED's >>>>>> but >>>>>> good god $165 per rim. I actually like the look of the Pacenti rim. >>>>>> Although I can't recall where I heard this but they were difficult to >>>>>> set >>>>>> up tubeless? I may be wrong on this matter. If you have first had >>>>>> experience with the Pacenti I'm happy to listen/hear. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> ~Hugh >>>>>> >>>>>> “Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance, you must keep >>>>>> moving.” ― Albert Einstein >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Feb 3, 2021 at 11:31 PM Ben Miller <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Hugh, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sounds like you know what you are after in terms of rim size, and >>>>>>> yeah as you found I think you're choices in silver are limited. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'm not trying to argue or change you're mind, but I am going to >>>>>>> offer a counterpoint to anyone else you is following this thread. Jan >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> Bicycle Quarterly has opinion that rim width on larger tyres doesn't >>>>>>> effect >>>>>>> handling. He has a brief section in his recent book on this very >>>>>>> subject >>>>>>> called "rim width and cornering" that includes a compelling (to me) >>>>>>> example. And, from my own experience, I have 60 mm wide tyres on >>>>>>> Velocity >>>>>>> Dyads which have an internal width of 18.6 mm. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Everyone has their own experiences and preferences, which is one of >>>>>>> the best things about building up bikes because you get to express >>>>>>> that. >>>>>>> I'm sure you'll be happy with you're piece of mind on wider rims! Best >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> luck. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wednesday, February 3, 2021 at 9:29:32 PM UTC-8 Weston Hein wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> The wheelset on my Clem is built from the previous generation VO >>>>>>>> touring hubs (same manufacturer?) laced to Cliffhangers. I've run >>>>>>>> 2.35 >>>>>>>> G-One speeds and 55mm Antelope hills on them and both tires set up >>>>>>>> very >>>>>>>> easily tubeless using velocity rim tape. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm really happy with the hubs- they feel really smooth and have >>>>>>>> minimal resistance when spinning them in the stand. I'd rate the free >>>>>>>> hub >>>>>>>> as medium loudness. It's not a hub noise that I would "notice" as >>>>>>>> being >>>>>>>> unusually loud if that makes sense. No high pitched buzz or anything >>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>> makes you focus on it. But it's definitely not Shimano quiet. I did >>>>>>>> quiet >>>>>>>> it down some using some Dumonde Tech free hub grease but the effect >>>>>>>> wore >>>>>>>> off and I stopped reapplying it as the hub noise doesn't really bother >>>>>>>> me. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Hubs have been problem free for 3 years of Seattle commuting/light >>>>>>>> touring and off-road riding. The free hub is incredibly easy to >>>>>>>> service and >>>>>>>> the bearings are easy to access too (though I haven't had to replace >>>>>>>> them). >>>>>>>> All in all I think it's a great value for a nice looking, no nonsense >>>>>>>> hub. >>>>>>>> Can't argue with the quality of White, but if you're looking for a >>>>>>>> lower >>>>>>>> price point the VO may be a great option. If I needed another 135 qr >>>>>>>> wheelset, I'd choose these hubs again, especially with the excellent >>>>>>>> customer support that I've had from VO in the past. >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, February 3, 2021 at 8:47:47 PM UTC-8 Hugh Smitham >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi Michael, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Here are the specs for the Cliffhangers and A23's. You'll notice >>>>>>>>> the A23's optimal max tire width is 35mm >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> https://www.velocityusa.com/product/rims/cliffhanger-584 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> And the cliffhanger optimal tire widths are between 45mm and 65mm >>>>>>>>> the schwabe g1's are 2.25 or approximately 56 mm. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> https://www.velocityusa.com/product/rims/cliffhanger-584 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I imagine your going to run a narrower tire? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Best Regards, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hugh >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 3, 2021, 8:33 PM velomann <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Velocity A-23 rims come in silver, are tubeless compatible, and >>>>>>>>>> have a brake track. >>>>>>>>>> I have a pir I'm going to build up for my Sam as soon as I track >>>>>>>>>> down the right hubs. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Mike M >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, February 3, 2021 at 5:32:18 PM UTC-8 Hugh Smitham >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> So as not to offend any long-term members on this list I did >>>>>>>>>>> first do a search and did not find an answer to my question? I >>>>>>>>>>> believe back >>>>>>>>>>> in 2018 William Henderson in PDX after an accident had a wheel set >>>>>>>>>>> built >>>>>>>>>>> with the same hubs I'm considering, if he could chime in that would >>>>>>>>>>> be >>>>>>>>>>> excellent. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On with the question, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Does anybody have experience with the Velo Orange Grand Cru >>>>>>>>>>> 135mm QR Shimano hub? Specifically, has it held up over time? How >>>>>>>>>>> does it >>>>>>>>>>> feel? Does it spin freely? How does it sound? Meaning is it silent >>>>>>>>>>> or does >>>>>>>>>>> it have a loud ratcheting noise? What were your initial impressions >>>>>>>>>>> of the >>>>>>>>>>> build quality and then later impressions. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> It's my aesthetic, I just see my new to me Atlantis built with >>>>>>>>>>> silver shiny hubs otherwise I'd build my new wheels with a DT Swiss >>>>>>>>>>> 350 >>>>>>>>>>> rear hub and be done. I'm considering a White Industries hub but >>>>>>>>>>> that's >>>>>>>>>>> close to $200 more over the VO hub. Just debating whether the extra >>>>>>>>>>> $$ is >>>>>>>>>>> worth it? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I'm going with the Velocity Cliffhangers, wish they came in >>>>>>>>>>> silver :( Planning on running schwabe g ones in 2.25" evolutions >>>>>>>>>>> for cush >>>>>>>>>>> and speed. If you have a recommendation on rims that will allow for >>>>>>>>>>> tubeless, decent tire profile in silver please lmk. FYI not going >>>>>>>>>>> with the >>>>>>>>>>> HED Belgian rims at $165 nope! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I'm also looking for the Riv stem shifters currently out of >>>>>>>>>>> stock on the Riv Hq site. If anyone has a pair that they're willing >>>>>>>>>>> to part >>>>>>>>>>> with let me know? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Best Regards, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hugh in Sunny SoCal Los Angeles to be exact. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Since I'm honorable and might as well ask another question. I >>>>>>>>>>> plan on running aluminum albatross bars any recommendations for >>>>>>>>>>> grips. My >>>>>>>>>>> preference is a easily removed grip like the Ergon which I have. Is >>>>>>>>>>> there >>>>>>>>>>> an esi like grip that's removes simply? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in >>>>>>>>>> the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/b8W1k4G1UUc/unsubscribe >>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email >>>>>>>>>> to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/fbf2c16a-a744-4c77-9227-59306f8e8e0dn%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/fbf2c16a-a744-4c77-9227-59306f8e8e0dn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in >>>>>>> the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/b8W1k4G1UUc/unsubscribe >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>>>>>> [email protected]. >>>>>>> >>>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/c5c5a242-bb3d-4f8c-b8e1-ba08eb2d13d8n%40googlegroups.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/c5c5a242-bb3d-4f8c-b8e1-ba08eb2d13d8n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/b8W1k4G1UUc/unsubscribe >>>>> . >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>>>> [email protected]. >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/efc8d112-8e45-4ae6-8ee0-c11c346deeabn%40googlegroups.com >>>>> >>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/efc8d112-8e45-4ae6-8ee0-c11c346deeabn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>> . >>>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/b8W1k4G1UUc/unsubscribe >>>> . >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>>> [email protected]. >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CA%2BvJTt1PbPVLVXGKM%3Dgz6%2B6GT9VWpW0eBLDp8YpvAj3qx0Tx5g%40mail.gmail.com >>>> >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CA%2BvJTt1PbPVLVXGKM%3Dgz6%2B6GT9VWpW0eBLDp8YpvAj3qx0Tx5g%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >>>> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/b8W1k4G1UUc/unsubscribe >>>> . >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >>>> [email protected]. >>>> >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/482AB81C-E372-4B4C-9D6B-D41D5B1F8DAC%40gmail.com >>>> >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/482AB81C-E372-4B4C-9D6B-D41D5B1F8DAC%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >> Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/b8W1k4G1UUc/unsubscribe >> . >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >> [email protected]. >> > To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/895911c3-4faa-405b-b6ea-dcd2a77784fbn%40googlegroups.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/895911c3-4faa-405b-b6ea-dcd2a77784fbn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. 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