One comment with regard to Rolls AGM’s. I, like yourself, have sold very few AGM’s over the years, preferring lead acid. But I supplied a set of Rolls AGM’s to a client who self installed and didn’t recognize the need for a minimum 85a charge. His inverter/pv combination was unable to supply that and the batteries sulphated within months to an unrecoverable state. $20k down the drain. Most other AGM’s get by with around 50a charge.
Ron > On Jan 12, 2025, at 12:55 PM, Jay via RE-wrenches > <[email protected]> wrote: > > You guys are making my point. > Melting the cases is not a fire. And every melted agm case is due to > incorrect charging mechanisms. > > But there have been some cases on this site of catastrophic lithium failures. > > I am starting to see people asking about fires and lithium. > > These batteries are in the house. Not my design and not an easy fix to move > them. > > Thanks again > > Jay > > > >> On Jan 12, 2025, at 10:52 AM, Tyrone Houck via RE-wrenches >> <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> I had the exact same thing happen(even down to the crowbar) with the only >> set of full river 400 6's I've ever installed. I personally lean away from >> agm though we've had pretty good luck with the Outback and Northstar PLR >> platform over the year.. >> >> >> >> >> On Sun, Jan 12, 2025, 9:39 AM Ray Walters via RE-wrenches >> <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> The only thermal runaway event I've ever seen, was with AGM in an over >>> insulated battery box. Got so hot that the cases fused to each other, and >>> we had to pry the batteries apart with a crow bar. She wants ZERO risk of >>> fire? She needs to live in a concrete bunker with no electricity at all. >>> Every electrical connection, every outlet, every appliance has a risk of >>> fire. Period. >>> >>> Ray Walters >>> Remote Solar >>> >>> On 1/12/2025 9:39 AM, Tyrone Houck via RE-wrenches wrote: >>>> I hate to be the one to say it but LFP has arguably less fire risk than >>>> agm. A short circuit in an agm could be disastrous and AGM is not >>>> necessarily any safer or less prone to thermal runaway events than modern >>>> LFP. I'd recommend a cobalt free LFP like homegrid, simpliphi, or midnite >>>> if it were me.. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sat, Jan 11, 2025, 3:38 PM jay via RE-wrenches >>>> <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>> I was going to try and steer her towards lithium but she wants zero, >>>>> absolutely zero chance of fire, so no lithium. >>>>> >>>>> great batteries though >>>>> >>>>> jay >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> On Jan 11, 2025, at 4:35 PM, MD Electric & Solar via RE-wrenches >>>>>> <[email protected] >>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> 30KWH of LFP from discover energy, fits in one enclosure, around >>>>>> $14000.00 >>>>>> Enclosure is indoor/outdoor rated. >>>>>> >>>>>> https://discoverenergysys.com/products/lithium-batteries/aes-rackmount >>>>>> https://discoverenergysys.com/products/accessories/slimline-enclosure >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sat, Jan 11, 2025 at 3:31 PM jay via RE-wrenches >>>>>> <[email protected] >>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>>>> HI Willam >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks for the input. >>>>>>> I didn’t know that trojan was sold, and from what you say, yeah scratch >>>>>>> them off. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It’s currently at 30kwh. And thats probably a good size. >>>>>>> As always, cost and time is a factor. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I’ll check the others out. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> jay >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > On Jan 11, 2025, at 4:17 PM, William Miller <[email protected] >>>>>>> > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Jay: >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > What AH or Kwh level are you looking for? >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Trojan was acquired by another company a few years ago and quality >>>>>>> > had gone >>>>>>> > downhill. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Rolls is very sensitive to high temperatures. They will deny a >>>>>>> > warranty >>>>>>> > claim if all of your parameters are not exactly right. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > For larger AH systems: >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > I like the Full River DC-400-2. You might be able to do a one string >>>>>>> > installation. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Unigy II is a great system. Very robust. Hard to deliver but I can >>>>>>> > offer >>>>>>> > tips. Lots of AH size options. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > William >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Miller Solar >>>>>>> > 17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422 >>>>>>> > 805-438-5600 >>>>>>> > www.millersolar.com <http://www.millersolar.com/> >>>>>>> > CA Lic. 773985 >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > -----Original Message----- >>>>>>> > From: RE-wrenches [mailto:[email protected] >>>>>>> > <mailto:[email protected]>] On >>>>>>> > Behalf Of jay via RE-wrenches >>>>>>> > Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2025 2:48 PM >>>>>>> > To: RE-wrenches >>>>>>> > Cc: jay >>>>>>> > Subject: [RE-wrenches] AGM battery recommendations >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Hi All >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > I have a customer what is set on AGM. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > It been so long since I’ve bought any, wondering if there are any >>>>>>> > recommendations? >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > The ones I’m looking at: >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Rolls S6-460AGM-RE >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Full river DC-400-6 >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Trojan SAES 06 375 6V >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > sun Xtender brand. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > What’s interesting is the trojan has about 3000 cycles vs the others >>>>>>> > at >>>>>>> > around 1250 cycles to 50%. >>>>>>> > Im wondering if that is a marketing idea or if its real. >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > thanks in advance >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > jay >>>>>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >>>>>>> > <http://re-wrenches.org/> >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > List Address: [email protected] >>>>>>> > <mailto:[email protected]> >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Change listserver email address & settings: >>>>>>> > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try >>>>>>> > the >>>>>>> > other: >>>>>>> > https://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >>>>>>> > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > List rules & etiquette: >>>>>>> > http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > Check out or update participant bios: >>>>>>> > http://www.members.re-wrenches.org >>>>>>> > <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >>>>>>> <http://re-wrenches.org/> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> List Address: [email protected] >>>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>>>>>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try >>>>>>> the other: >>>>>>> https://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ >>>>>>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>>>>>> >>>>>>> List rules & etiquette: >>>>>>> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Check out or update participant bios: >>>>>>> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org <http://www.members.re-wrenches.org/> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Michael D Nelson >>>>>> MD Electric & Solar Inc. >>>>>> Office: 707-412-3181 >>>>>> Cell: 707-684-0064 >>>>>> www.mdelectricsolar.com <http://www.mdelectricsolar.com/> >>>>>> www.facebook.com/mdelectricandsolar >>>>>> <http://www.facebook.com/mdelectricandsolar> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>>>>> >>>>>> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org >>>>>> <http://re-wrenches.org/> >>>>>> >>>>>> List Address: [email protected] >>>>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>>>>> >>>>>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>>>>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>>>>> >>>>>> There are two list archives for searching. 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