I was referring to a GNU/Linux distro fully suited for development, as I've used a large amount of GNU/Linux distros but none were suited for development (GParted Live, Ubuntu 8.04, 11.04, and 11.10 LiveCD, and a Liberté remaster). Maybe I should specified "development capable GNU/Linux system."
Paul Kocialkowski <[email protected]> wrote: >Le samedi 04 octobre 2014 à 11:48 -0500, Jonathan Petruska a écrit : >> I would do so myself if I had access to a PandaBoard and a true Linux >> system. > >That's exactly where it becomes very obvious that talking about "Linux" >as an operating system makes no sense at all. Please call it GNU/Linux >for respect of the GNU project and the ideas it stands for. It also >avoids useless talks about what is "truly Linux" and what it not. There >is GNU/Linux and there is Android, which both use Linux as a kernel. > >> Many things are starting to shift to being optimized for mobile and >> PC's are getting shut out. That's why I've been trying to port Dalvik >> to Desktop Linux (Ubuntu x86_64, haven't had access to the system in a >> while). It's also why I have a stack of Android x86 CDs. > >Intel chips are making a force entry on the tablet market after they >drastically lowered their prices. I wouldn't be surprised to see AOSP >gaining back interest in x86 pretty soon. > >> Paul Kocialkowski <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >Le samedi 04 octobre 2014 à 10:30 -0500, Jonathan Petruska a écrit : >> >> I wasn't meaning a Pi based phone, I just noticed that a lot of these >> >> (albeit not the Pi, I know the Android struggles there) support >> >> Android and use a lot of open components. I don't think Replicant on >> >> CuBox(I) or PandaBoard would be too hard, especially with CuBox being >> >> designed for Android. Wouldn't be too drastically different from a >> >> tablet build, Pi would be best because of it's vast support, but I >> >> don't think anything based on Android has any hopes on that platform. >> > >> >Note that the Raspberry Pi is still a no-go for freedom as it lacks a >> >proper free bootloader (even though code and documentation releases may >> >soon make a difference). >> > >> >Regarding devices such as the Cubox-i and other Single-Board-Computer, >> >HTPCs and TV dongles, we just don't think it's worth spending time >> >porting Replicant on those (we could also add x86 to the list, >> >especially with 8-10" notebooks). Replicant (like Android in general) is >> >adapted for and runs best on mobile devices, mainly phones and tablets. >> >In other scenarios (all the devices mentioned above), we believe >> >GNU/Linux is still the best shot at having a free system, hence why we >> >decided to focus on mobile devices with Replicant (for which GNU/Linux >> >is not adapted yet). >> > >> >We have nothing against adding a port to a non-mobile-device, but I'm >> >not going to do that work myself, unless I seriously run out of other >> >things to do. >> > >> >> Michael von Glasow <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> >> >On 04/10/14 02:29, Jonathan Petruska wrote: >> >> >> I don't think a fully free cellphone is too unthinkable. Has anyone >> >> >> thought of porting to mini arm PCs like the Pi, or has this already >> >> >> been done >> >> >A proof-of-concept phone has already been built, albeit not with Android: >> >> >http://www.davidhunt.ie/piphone-a-raspberry-pi-based-smartphone/ >> >> > >> >> >As for Android on the Pi, some attempts have been made, but a lot of >> >> >things are still missing: >> >> >http://www.intorobotics.com/raspberry-pi-android-guides-resources/ >> >> > >> >> >Of course, there's also the GTA04, for which a port is under active >> >> >development. >> >> > >> >> >Such projects, however currently have a few hurdles to overcome: >> >> > >> >> >- Hardware sourcing: The typical smartphone nowadays is more than just a >> >> >Raspberry Pi with a touchscreen, modem and battery. Hardware typically >> >> >includes one or two cameras, GPS, WiFi and Bluetooth modules, as well as >> >> >a bunch of environment sensors (accelerometer, magnetometer, gyroscope, >> >> >proximity, ambient light, temperature, humidity). The challenge is to >> >> >find freedom-friendly components, for which free drivers either exist >> >> >already or are doable (i.e. documentation of interface and protocols is >> >> >freely available). >> >> > >> >> >- Momentum: A certain number of people who own and use such a device, >> >> >and a certain percentage of them who contribute to development are >> >> >necessary for any such project to take off. Without this critical mass, >> >> >development won't be able to keep up with the pace of the industry and >> >> >the product will be outdated before it is even finished. Openmoko and >> >> >the GTA02 aka Freerunner was an example of where this worked quite well, >> >> >but IMHO the Freerunner community was just about big enough to get off >> >> >the ground. >> >> > >> >> >- Cost: With the above constraints on hardware, a relatively low number >> >> >of users (i.e. small quantities) and most likely some quality demands, >> >> >such a device is likely to be costly. Take the GTA04, which has a 500 to >> >> >600 euro price tag just for the mainboard. With fully functional phones >> >> >selling for half this price, one does need a lot of enthusiasm to go >> >> >down that road. >> >> > >> >> >- Form factor: The GTA04, just like its GTA02 predecessor, is quite a >> >> >big brick. That probably has to do with hardware sourcing, production >> >> >quantities and also cost. >> >> > >> >> >So how can we tackle this? >> >> > >> >> >- Start with the easier tasks: A ten-inch tablet has fewer issues with >> >> >form factor than a phone – its dimensions are largely determined by the >> >> >screen size, which takes up the bulk of the space. The next biggest part >> >> >is the battery – but the other components are the same size as in a >> >> >phone, thus less is gained or lost from shrinking the mainboard or not >> >> >doing so. Also a tablet does not need to include all the hardware >> >> >components of a phone: a basic tablet can work on WiFi only, thus the >> >> >cell modem is not a concern at that time. Once the tablet takes on shape >> >> >and has evolved to a certain degree of maturity, cell connectivity can >> >> >be tackled. >> >> > >> >> >- Plan for a lifecycle: Over time, hardware requirements evolve as >> >> >faster processors, more performant graphics and systems with more memory >> >> >become the norm. Just having finished one platform doesn't mean work >> >> >stops there – rather, this is where work on the next generation begins. >> >> > >> >> >- Keep specs stable: We have just established that hardware evolves – >> >> >and new hardware requires adaptations in software. However, such >> >> >improvements should be as gentle as possible in order to limit the >> >> >changes in software needed. Where possible, newly introduced hardware >> >> >should be compatible with existing drivers, or at the most require only >> >> >smaller modifications to existing drivers, rather than requiring >> >> >completely new drivers. >> >> > >> >> >- Get a company on board: When it comes to industrial manufacturing >> >> >processes and building devices in professional quality, a different set >> >> >of expertise than that of a software developer is needed, and the >> >> >financial limits of a handful of individuals are easily exceeded. The >> >> >founders of Geeksphone one stated that getting their company to the >> >> >point at which they started shipping the One (their first device) >> >> >required investments which roughly equaled the price of a small house. >> >> >The GTA02 benefitted from the involvement of FIC, a manufacturer of >> >> >computer parts. The challenge is to find a company who has a commercial >> >> >interest in the project. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> ; I know there are some built specifically for Android (CuBox, >> >> >> Pandaboard, etc.). I like the idea of Replicant in the tablet world >> >> >> (If you can roughly consider Replicant/Android on mini PCs akin to >> >> >> tablets). >> >> >> >> >> >> [email protected] wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >>> Allan Mwenda <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >>> >> >> >>>> HAHAHA,if only I could. That is a rather gloomy scenario though >> >> >>> My great-grandfathers did it successfully in 1917, and we can do it >> >> >>> again. >> >> >>> >> >> >>> To bring this thread back on-topic, a fully-functional (i.e., unlike >> >> >>> OsmocomBB) GSM cellphone whose baseband firmware is available to every >> >> >>> end user in the form of full source code, compiled using gcc and other >> >> >>> Free Software tools (no blobs or proprietary build tools), and >> >> >>> physically reloadable into the phone, again using only Free Software >> >> >>> tools running under a free OS (GNU/Linux or other Unix), is NOT an >> >> >>> impossibility, and it is becoming closer to reality with each passing >> >> >>> day. The work is being done in a public source repository: >> >> >>> >> >> >>> https://bitbucket.org/falconian/freecalypso-sw >> >> >>> >> >> >>> Look at the commit history, and see for yourself how steadily this >> >> >>> project marches forward. As Che Guevara said, this movement is >> >> >>> growing stronger with each passing day, it will never stop. >> >> >>> >> >> >>> All the talk about legalities is nothing more than a scarecrow. Does >> >> >>> your country's police force employ psychics with extremely advanced >> >> >>> extrasensory perception capabilities? If not, how are they going to >> >> >>> divine that the ordinary-looking cellphone in your hand or your pocket >> >> >>> or your purse lacks some needed regulatory approval if its actual >> >> >>> radio signal emissions are identical to those from any other correctly >> >> >>> functioning GSM cellphone? And how are they going to divine that a >> >> >>> cellphone that physically looks just like any other (standard >> >> >>> commercial quality plastics and all) contains firmware which some >> >> >>> believe might infringe on some copyrights held by some ancient company >> >> >>> which might not even exist any more? >> >> >>> >> >> >>> VLR, >> >> >>> SF >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >> >>> Replicant mailing list >> >> >>> [email protected] >> >> >>> http://lists.osuosl.org/mailman/listinfo/replicant >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> >> Replicant mailing list >> >> >> [email protected] >> >> >> http://lists.osuosl.org/mailman/listinfo/replicant >> >> > >> >> >_______________________________________________ >> >> >Replicant mailing list >> >> >[email protected] >> >> >http://lists.osuosl.org/mailman/listinfo/replicant >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Replicant mailing list >> >> [email protected] >> >> http://lists.osuosl.org/mailman/listinfo/replicant >> > >> >-- >> >Paul Kocialkowski, Replicant developer >> > >> >Replicant is a fully free Android distribution >> > >> >Website: http://www.replicant.us/ >> >Redmine: http://redmine.replicant.us/ >> _______________________________________________ >> Replicant mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.osuosl.org/mailman/listinfo/replicant > >-- >Paul Kocialkowski, Replicant developer > >Replicant is a fully free Android distribution > >Website: http://www.replicant.us/ >Redmine: http://redmine.replicant.us/ _______________________________________________ Replicant mailing list [email protected] http://lists.osuosl.org/mailman/listinfo/replicant
