I'm in the under 35 crowd (for a bit longer, anyway), and I think that's a good way forward! :-) +1 to Discord, +1 to email!
Best, -Michael On Sat, May 27, 2023 at 11:43 AM Alex Band <[email protected]> wrote: > Looking at the people who replied to this thread so far, this discussion > appears to have all the makings of a self-fulfilling prophecy. Gert, Jim, > Joe… All people I’ve known for over a decade or more in the RIPE Community, > saying on a mailing list that they prefer email. :) > > I guess it’s no surprise that none of the younger generation, or people > who do not like email (style) communications, are here to say that they > prefer something else instead. They’re all on on Discord servers like > DisNOG, BGPeople, or the RPKI Community server talking to like-minded > people, solving problems and having a good time. > > I would really hope we can at least get beyond the point of acknowledging > that mailing lists are not for everyone. But even then, we can do a ton of > research looking of the holy grail of platforms that is open source, > decentralised, publicly archived, freely available, has favourable Terms > and Conditions, and what have you. There’s a good chance there’s always > going to be some solution that someone doesn’t like, ultimately leading to > no action being taken. > > I get that this may not be what you want to hear - I am an open source, > open standards advocate at heart - but if you want to attract a different > crowd and get a different kind of interaction, simply start a Discord > server. There are so many vibrant communities out there who can attest to > this. Choose anything else and the RIPE Community will miss out on a ton of > people who may have something valuable to contribute. > > My suggestion: keep the mailing lists as is for the people who prefer > that, and add Discord to the mix. > > Be bold. Give it a shot. > > -Alex > > > > > On 26 May 2023, at 09:41, Leo Vegoda <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Dear RIPE community, > > > > At yesterday’s community plenary I asked whether mailing lists are > > sustainable as our main communication channel. For those who were not > > able to attend, the slide and a recording are available here: > > > > - > https://ripe86.ripe.net/wp-content/uploads/presentations/12-Mailing-Lists-RIPE-86.pdf > > - https://ripe86.ripe.net/archives/video/1115 > > > > I am obviously concerned that discussion lists might not serve us with > > fidelity in the future. If that is the case, I want us to manage any > > change we need to make. We should not be bounced into rapid change. > > > > There was more discussion than I expected. I’m sending this message to > > ask the questions: > > > > - Am I wrong? Are e-mail discussion lists a sustainable communication > > channel for the foreseeable future? > > - Are e-mail discussion lists an acceptable technology to people > > joining the industry? > > > > The text below is similar to something I shared with the WG Chairs > > several months ago. > > > > Kind regards,. > > > > Leo > > > > ripe-781 describes four fundamental principles supporting our policy > > development process. The first two principles are openness and > > transparency. > > > > Changes in the treatment of e-mail by large industry players presents > > a challenge to these two principles. > > > > In 1992, when ripe-001 was published, anyone could run e-mail services > > on any Internet infrastructure they could use. It is now far more > > difficult to run e-mail services. Technology developments, like DMARC, > > have made discussion mailing lists less effective. > > > > Validation failures increase the probability of messages being treated > > as junk. Subscribers to RIPE's discussion lists will miss messages > > when their e-mail services provider treats them as junk. > > > > When a legitimate message to a RIPE discussion list is treated as junk > > the sender's voice has been moderated by a third-party mail provider. > > RIPE's transparency is diminished when its discussion lists are > > subjected to gatekeeping by third-party mail providers. > > > > In 1992, e-mail was an improvement to postal services and telephony > > protocols. In 2023, we have a wide choice of communication protocols > > and platforms. > > > > I believe that new protocols and platforms are preferred over e-mail > > by potential participants in RIPE at the start of their careers. We > > want these people to take part in RIPE. They are the future of > > coordination for the operators of IP networks in Europe and the rest > > of the world. > > > > We must offer all current and potential participants in RIPE an > > effective set of tools. Any tools we use must support the principles > > of openness and transparency. > > > > An ideal set of tools might have features like this: > > > > 1. An open protocol available for implementation by anyone. > > 2. Free(ly available) software implementations for popular operating > > systems (Android, iOS, Linux, macOS, and Windows). > > 3. Allows a user to choose to have activity pushed to them. They must > > not be forced to maintain a login to be informed of activity they are > > interested in. > > 4. A public archive that cannot be retrospectively edited (barring > > exceptional situations). > > > > While the technology choices need to support the principles of > > openness and transparency, they do not need to do all the work. > > Announcements, blog posts, and other kinds of communications can be > > built into our processes. > > > > The combination of technology and process can make the whole more > effective. > > > > -- > > > > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, get a password reminder, or > change your subscription options, please visit: > https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ripe-list > > > -- > > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, get a password reminder, or change > your subscription options, please visit: > https://lists.ripe.net/mailman/listinfo/ripe-list >
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