From: Alan Lambert Fort Worth, Texas Rhett, You hit the nail on the head and drove it home. Maybe John will start listening to what we have to say. Frank are you listening also. We are getting tired of the waiting game. Alan
________________________________ From: rhettgraves <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 10:18 AM Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...?? --- In mailto:S-Scale%40yahoogroups.com, "John Degnan" <Scaler164@...> wrote: > > Oh I feel quite sure that Kadee did not have S in mind at all when they > designed any their HO line of couplers... >And it was not even intended just for the S market in the first place... it >was intended for S AND the O narrow gauge market. And I have my doubts that >the 802 and 808 would even exist it it weren't for the O narrow gauge market, >as O feel sure that they just saw an opportunity to kill two birds with one >stone. John, I think you already understand this, so I'm not trying to tell you anything new. I'm just trying to clarify the discussion because it seems like we go around and around about once a year on this subject and everyone seems to have forgotten the fundamental idea that underlies the discussion: market share. You say that the #802 wouldn't exist without the O narrow gauge market. Would the #802 exist without the S scale market? Maybe the negative feelings are just a matter of perspective? I'm pretty sure Kadee doesn't have Z, N, HO, S, O or G scale in mind when they make any of their products. What they have in mind is profit. If making something a certain size will yield that profit, then they make it that size. If one of those scale markets is big enough to support a profitable product made to "scale size", then they go for it. If they can make a product to a certain size that will appeal to a majority of modelers in multiple scales (e.g. the 802), then they go for that. They have to make things they can sell at a profit to stay in business. If I'm disappointed with what Kadee or any other company makes, then I need to endeavor to be a big enough part of the market to dictate what they make. As Dad used to say, "Money talks and BS walks." If I showed up at Kadee's doorstep with $500K in cash, they'd likely consider tooling up to do a 100K piece run of an S scale version of the #58. The reason I say a #58 is that they already have most of the design done, they can probably re-use parts (springs, draft gear boxes, etc.), and it'd work with the #802s that their existing customers already use (all part of the sales pitch). If I show up with enough money to cover their risk and a good marketing plan, they'll likely do what I want and make more as the market supports it. Now I know the #58 doesn't meet all of your criteria for the perfect coupler, but that's really a different discussion. If you showed up at Frank Sergent's place with $500K in cash, I'm sure the S scale version of his coupler would show up in short order. Shucks, at that price, you might get some of the other S scale manufacturers interested enough to go into the coupler business! The point is that you (and as many committed friends as you can muster) have to be a big enough part of the coupler market to dictate what you want. Now folks say "I don't have $500K to do this!" There's a few options: 1. Get pre-orders (with payment) for 100K couplers at $5 each. 2. Figure out how you're going to market and sell the couplers for $12 a pair and get a loan from the bank. This will probably involve your house, too... 3. Take your hobby money and buy Lotto tickets! I'd go for option 1 myself... Best Regards, Rhett Graves
