On Tue, Jun 13, 2023 at 4:14 PM Tobias Diez <[email protected]> wrote: > > What about a completely different approach: Instead of annotating the > doctests, simply ignore test blocks that fail due to a thrown import error > (or missing feature error) of a package that is not installed in the > modularized test environment?
How do you see the doctest framework distinguishing "real" import errors from the ones caused by modularisation? > That might hide some edge cases, but would in total be a less intrusive way > to handle things. > > At the very least, I would propose to hide these optional tags from the > generated docs. > On Monday, 12 June 2023 at 16:50:11 UTC+8 Dima Pasechnik wrote: >> >> On Mon, Jun 12, 2023 at 1:35 AM 'Travis Scrimshaw' via sage-devel >> <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> > Hi Matthias, >> > >> > Happy to see that you are curious regarding the modularization project, >> > but I don't think it's a good approach to start this discussion with >> > claims that sound authoritative ("nobody will actually maintain", "does >> > not scale", "nearly all end users", etc.) and a policy proposal. >> > >> > >> > Yes, you're right. I do not have any hard analytic data to support what >> > users want and are doing, and that observation is based solely on my years >> > of experience with working with Sage, going to and speaking at SageDays, >> > and convincing people to start using Sage. However, there is clear >> > evidence that the current approach is not scaling by the amount of work >> > that is going in and frequent updates/fixed that is needed to be done. >> > Currently, only you are the one doing this. >> >> What exactly is not scaling? "Vendor everything" approach abandoned ~9 >> years ago obviously didn't scale. >> I think we're not unvendoring things aggressively enough, and that's >> what we quarrel with Matthias about. >> >> I'm about to start a round of discussions here to lead to a vote to >> remove vendored gcc and gfortran. >> We also should be getting rid of Sage-nonspecific things such as >> vendored Python (with the needed dependencies such as openssl), >> and vendored Jupyter and its huge slew of its dependencies (for the >> latter Matthias is on board, I think). >> >> It's also not correct that modularisation is currently only done by >> Matthias. E.g. most recently I worked on unvendoring of Maxima. >> I worked on doing some abstract classes for parts of sage.coding, I >> worked on spinning out prime counting stuff into a separate >> pip-installable module (that was in 2021, though), etc. >> >> The interdependecies of parts of Sage library on each other are >> decreasing, and this is certainly a big deal in terms of >> updating/fixing >> things. (Not importing from sage.all in the library is a big deal). >> >> Dima >> >> >> Some of that is the lack of discussion (which I would like to have >> seen given the large scale nature of this change, which is implicitly >> setting policy by default). You can disagree with my conclusions and >> proposal, but I want to actually talk about that rather than having >> dismissive comments. Can you provide any specific counterpoints and >> your expectations? What you posted on the other thread does not >> address any of these. >> > >> > Best, >> > Travis >> > >> > -- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> > "sage-devel" group. >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> > email to [email protected]. >> > To view this discussion on the web visit >> > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sage-devel/84fbc2ed-00c8-4ca6-8aa7-d4c74e8c2455n%40googlegroups.com. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "sage-devel" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sage-devel/cc125172-2413-4416-b871-f4fdc606a4c7n%40googlegroups.com. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "sage-devel" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sage-devel/CAAWYfq0AQ7oVC7S%3DPwQfHZas-9jyhv3mqYoH25EmTFNLQEwK6g%40mail.gmail.com.
