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Today's Topics:
1. Rasik Vihari Joshi (Phillip Ernest)
2. Re: simple kavya (peekayar)
3. Re: sanskrit Digest, Vol 14, Issue 16 (A. R. Srikrishnan)
4. Re: Re: sanskrit Digest, Vol 14, Issue 16 (peekayar)
5. Re: simple kavya (Phillip Ernest)
6. manmatha arrows (Desiraju Hanumanta Rao)
7. Re: simple kavya (peekayar)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 27 May 2004 15:32:11 -0400
From: Phillip Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Sanskrit] Rasik Vihari Joshi
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Is anyone familiar with the mahakavyas of the modern kavi Rasik Vihari Joshi?
Phillip
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 27 May 2004 19:07:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] simple kavya
To: sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
How did that kavya land on your hands?. I can suggest several kavyas but some of them
may not be called mahakavyas. In the Indian tradition when
a student studies sanskrit there are various levels of kavyas. Without knowing at
what level you are now,
I do not want to venture.
Phillip Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi group.
Can someone suggest a relatively simple mahakavya for me to read. I have
become completely demoralized by this Sisupalavadha. The slesas at the end of
the sixteenth canto are the most incomprehensible language I have ever laid
eyes on. I want to continue to try to read kavya, but need a work that is not
so far beyond my ability.
Phillip
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Message: 3
Date: Fri, 28 May 2004 09:52:50 +0530
From: "A. R. Srikrishnan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Sanskrit] Re: sanskrit Digest, Vol 14, Issue 16
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 3. Re: simple kavya (Phillip Ernest)
>
>Phillip Ernest uvaacha:
>
>
>>Hi group.
>>
>>Can someone suggest a relatively simple mahakavya for me to read. I have
>>become completely demoralized by this Sisupalavadha.
>>
Hello:
Yes, Sisupalavadha comes somewhat later in the learning curve and
the style may not be appealing to all. In fact, among the famous kaavyas
of Sanskrit, the following order is traditionally treated as in the
increasing level of difficulty to comprehend:
1. SriikrisHNavilaasa kaavya (sorry for poor transliteration !)
2. raghuvamSa
3. kumaarasambhavam
4. kiraataarjuniiyam
5. Sisupaalavadham
6. naisHadham
Of these, the first three have the attribute of "prasaada" (or
transparency & clarity in style of presentation). The greatness of the
other three is undisputed, but usually they are read at an advanced
level of learning/mastering the language.
Talking about the lesser known SriikrisHNa vilaasa (often not counted as
a "mahaakaavya"), its an exquisite work in simple Sanskrit, still
containing all embellishments that you see in other kaavyas- written
in a very pleasing, attractive and natural style. Unfortunately, not all
cantos of this kaavya are available today (to my knowledge), but
whatever little is available demonstrates that simplicity and poetic
excellence can go hand in hand !
Thanks !
Srikrishnan [any resemblance of my name and my adoration for the above
kaavya is purely coincidental...!!]
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 27 May 2004 22:07:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] Re: sanskrit Digest, Vol 14, Issue 16
To: "A. R. Srikrishnan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, sanskrit digest
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
When I studied Sanskrit the first level kavyam was
Sriramodantam. The second level was Srikrishnavilasam. Both these are well known in
Kerala, because their authours were Kerala Brahmins. When anyone approaches me to
learn sanskrit, I recommend them to read Sriramodantam
first. I shall reproduce a few shlokas below to know its simplicity.
1.
shriipatiM praNipatyaahaM shriivatsaa~NkitavakSasam. shriiraamodantamaakhyaasye
shrivaalmikiprakiirtitam..
2.
puraa vishravasaH putro raavaNo naama
raakSasaH. aasiidasyaanujau chaastaaM
kumbhakarNa-vibhiiSaNau..
3.
tetu tiivreNa tapasaa pratyakSiikritya vedhasam.
vavrire cha varaaninSTaan
asmaadaashritavatsalaat.
and so on.
PKRamakrishnan
"A. R. Srikrishnan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 3. Re: simple kavya (Phillip Ernest)
>
>Phillip Ernest uvaacha:
>
>
>>Hi group.
>>
>>Can someone suggest a relatively simple mahakavya for me to read. I have
>>become completely demoralized by this Sisupalavadha.
>>
Hello:
Yes, Sisupalavadha comes somewhat later in the learning curve and
the style may not be appealing to all. In fact, among the famous kaavyas
of Sanskrit, the following order is traditionally treated as in the
increasing level of difficulty to comprehend:
1. SriikrisHNavilaasa kaavya (sorry for poor transliteration !)
2. raghuvamSa
3. kumaarasambhavam
4. kiraataarjuniiyam
5. Sisupaalavadham
6. naisHadham
Of these, the first three have the attribute of "prasaada" (or
transparency & clarity in style of presentation). The greatness of the
other three is undisputed, but usually they are read at an advanced
level of learning/mastering the language.
Talking about the lesser known SriikrisHNa vilaasa (often not counted as
a "mahaakaavya"), its an exquisite work in simple Sanskrit, still
containing all embellishments that you see in other kaavyas- written
in a very pleasing, attractive and natural style. Unfortunately, not all
cantos of this kaavya are available today (to my knowledge), but
whatever little is available demonstrates that simplicity and poetic
excellence can go hand in hand !
Thanks !
Srikrishnan [any resemblance of my name and my adoration for the above
kaavya is purely coincidental...!!]
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Message: 5
Date: Fri, 28 May 2004 08:56:25 -0400
From: Phillip Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] simple kavya
To: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: sanskrit digest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Quoting peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
> How did that kavya land on your hands?. I can suggest several kavyas but
> some of them may not be called mahakavyas. In the Indian tradition when
> a student studies sanskrit there are various levels of kavyas. Without
> knowing at what level you are now,
> I do not want to venture.
I took it up myself. I have read a lot of the Mahabharata, and translated
large parts of it for my professor Arti Dhand, and wanted to read as many
mahakavyas based on the Bharata, as I could. Since I work alone, even though I
am at this university, I can't know what level I am at, but I am sure that the
Sisupalavadha is far too difficult for me. I found that I was able to make
what seemed to be reasonable translations of most of the cantos that I tried to
translate, but the work was usually extremely difficult for me, and I had the
definite feeling that I was usually missing most of the meaning that was not on
the immediate surface. I actually felt that Vasudeva's yamakakavya
Yudhisthiravijaya was much less difficult, as well as Bharavi's Kiratarjuniya,
but again, I feel certain that I was only ever touching the surface of these
poems, and I am certain that I make ludicrous errors all the time, but have no
one to read with. I had forgotten how relatively easy Kalidasa is. I would
appreciate a graded list of kavyas that are traditionally given to beginning
students to read.
Phillip
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Fri, 28 May 2004 06:56:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Desiraju Hanumanta Rao <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [Sanskrit] manmatha arrows
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
ArivNdm! Azaekm! c cUtm! c nv mi�ka
nIlaeTplm! c p<c @te p<c ba[a ASy sayka>.
1.aravinda= a lotus [nelumblum speciosum], 2. ashoka= a flower ofellebore origin, 3.
chutam= mango flower, 4.nava mallika= new jasmine, 5.neela utpala= blue costus, are
the five arrows of Manmatha.
Their functions are: -
%Nmadn> tapn> c zae;[ St<-n> tda,
sMmaehn> c kamSy p<c ba[a> �kIitRta>.
The five states associated with each arrow are: -1.unmaada= maniacal state, tapana=
fervent state, 3. shoshana= wasting away, 4. sthambhana= standstillness, 5. sammohana=
stupifaction.
The Ashoka flower kills natual hunger, Jasmine desciccates, mango flower fades the
colour, and lotusess causes criss-cross thinking, and the costuses incite the desire
for suicide.
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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 28 May 2004 07:05:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: peekayar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Sanskrit] simple kavya
To: Phillip Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, sanskrit digest
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I reproduce what Srikrishna has said in another message. This is what is followed in
Kerala and I agree with that, except that I want to add Sriramodantam at the first
level.
> Yes, Sisupalavadha comes somewhat later in the learning curve and
the style may not be appealing to all. In fact, among the famous
kaavyas
of Sanskrit, the following order is traditionally treated as in the increasing level
of difficulty to comprehend:
1. SriikrisHNavilaasa kaavya
2. raghuvamSa
3. kumaarasambhavam
4. kiraataarjuniiyam
5. Sisupaalavadham
6. naisHadham <
There are also other texts added at various levels
like Panchatantram and Hitopadesham (prose and verse). Ramayanachampu (prose and
verse), Dasakumaracharitam, Kadambari for works in prose. Also khandakavyas like
Meghadutam. Then comes dramas like Sakuntalam.
In olden days there were no printed dictionaries and one has to study by heart
Amarakosham, DhatupaaTham, and declensions of variious nouns and verbal forms.
I have seen shishupaalavadha only once in my younger days. You may see in the book
with you
one chapter which is a sort of poetical gymnastics.
Of all the longer poetical works Ramayana is called the Adikavya or first work in
poetry. If one reads this and also the works of Kalidasa, one can find that Kalidasa
uses upama (simile) in the same way as Valmiki. He has also used the technique of Rama
sending his ring to Sita as an identification (abhijnaana) in his famous drama
abhijnaana-shaakuntalam.
PKRamakrishnan
Phillip Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Quoting peekayar
:
> How did that kavya land on your hands?. I can suggest several kavyas but
> some of them may not be called mahakavyas. In the Indian tradition when
> a student studies sanskrit there are various levels of kavyas. Without
> knowing at what level you are now,
> I do not want to venture.
I took it up myself. I have read a lot of the Mahabharata, and translated
large parts of it for my professor Arti Dhand, and wanted to read as many
mahakavyas based on the Bharata, as I could. Since I work alone, even though I
am at this university, I can't know what level I am at, but I am sure that the
Sisupalavadha is far too difficult for me. I found that I was able to make
what seemed to be reasonable translations of most of the cantos that I tried to
translate, but the work was usually extremely difficult for me, and I had the
definite feeling that I was usually missing most of the meaning that was not on
the immediate surface. I actually felt that Vasudeva's yamakakavya
Yudhisthiravijaya was much less difficult, as well as Bharavi's Kiratarjuniya,
but again, I feel certain that I was only ever touching the surface of these
poems, and I am certain that I make ludicrous errors all the time, but have no
one to read with. I had forgotten how relatively easy Kalidasa is. I would
appreciate a graded list of kavyas that are traditionally given to beginning
students to read.
Phillip
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End of sanskrit Digest, Vol 14, Issue 17
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