Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Hmmm... while I agree with the consensus here that Alligate was out of bounds on this list, and Scott was not on the IMail list ( though it really doesn't matter since it's Declude's list and Barry has settled the issue), Babul is correct in that Scott and others were flamed for pushing Declude. Note that this was not done by IMail, but by members of the list. There was always an uneasy feeling between members of the IMgate and Declude user communities, and to a lesser degree the mxGate and Declude user communities. Darin. - Original Message - From: "Don Brown" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 3:20 AM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway Scott was not assaulted on the Imail list and even if he was, it is not relevant to what is appropriate and acceptable on this list. Never-the-less, Scott had a working relationship with Imail and Declude was not a competitor to Imail until Imail introduced their own Spam solution (which was poor and thank God for Declude, in our humble opinion). Even today, Declude is still listed on Imail's "Utilities and Helper Applications" page: http://www.ipswitch.com/support/imail/helperapps.asp#User Another example is Len Conrad's IMGate solution, which is also listed on Imail's Utilities and Helper Application page. Len frequents the Imail list, but you won't see him on the Declude list because he considers IMGate a direct competitor to Declude. That may be a questionable position in some minds but given the benefit of the doubt, Len respects proper decorum by not posting here. Respectfully, your position is not based upon the facts and it also defies common sense. Thanks, Thursday, January 26, 2006, 1:30:25 PM, Lists - Declude JunkMail <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: LDJ>[SNIP] LDJ> R. Scott Perry got assaulted on the Imail list repeatedly for years for LDJ> pushing his wares. Imail had a gap-in-functionality, Declude seized the LDJ> moment and profited by patching that gap. I was thankful for his LDJ> repeated input/arguments and purchased his product - against Imail's own LDJ> later offering. LDJ> [SNIP] LDJ> Maintain, LDJ> Babul LDJ> LDJ> (210) 696-1130, ext. 102 LDJ> (210) 696-0572 [fax] LDJ> Text Pager Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] LDJ> LDJ> The Montopolis Group, Ltd. - www.montopolis.com LDJ> "Building stronger businesses... with Technology" [SNIP] Don Brown - Dallas, Texas USA Internet Concepts, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.inetconcepts.net (972) 788-2364Fax: (972) 788-5049 --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Scott was not assaulted on the Imail list and even if he was, it is not relevant to what is appropriate and acceptable on this list. Never-the-less, Scott had a working relationship with Imail and Declude was not a competitor to Imail until Imail introduced their own Spam solution (which was poor and thank God for Declude, in our humble opinion). Even today, Declude is still listed on Imail's "Utilities and Helper Applications" page: http://www.ipswitch.com/support/imail/helperapps.asp#User Another example is Len Conrad's IMGate solution, which is also listed on Imail's Utilities and Helper Application page. Len frequents the Imail list, but you won't see him on the Declude list because he considers IMGate a direct competitor to Declude. That may be a questionable position in some minds but given the benefit of the doubt, Len respects proper decorum by not posting here. Respectfully, your position is not based upon the facts and it also defies common sense. Thanks, Thursday, January 26, 2006, 1:30:25 PM, Lists - Declude JunkMail <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: LDJ>[SNIP] LDJ> R. Scott Perry got assaulted on the Imail list repeatedly for years for LDJ> pushing his wares. Imail had a gap-in-functionality, Declude seized the LDJ> moment and profited by patching that gap. I was thankful for his LDJ> repeated input/arguments and purchased his product - against Imail's own LDJ> later offering. LDJ> [SNIP] LDJ> Maintain, LDJ> Babul LDJ> LDJ> (210) 696-1130, ext. 102 LDJ> (210) 696-0572 [fax] LDJ> Text Pager Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] LDJ> LDJ> The Montopolis Group, Ltd. - www.montopolis.com LDJ> "Building stronger businesses... with Technology" [SNIP] Don Brown - Dallas, Texas USA Internet Concepts, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.inetconcepts.net (972) 788-2364Fax: (972) 788-5049 --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re[2]: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
> I see Alligate as an excellent compliment to our Imail 8.15/Declude > 1.82 setup. i.e., it's a completely non-Declude-related product, whose vendor spammed you on the Declude list. And you don't have problem with that, because I don't think you've seen it before on other lists. It's so brazen that you can't believe it's spam. But it is. > I for one was thankful to learn about it through this list, as we've > been struggling with finding an SMTP filtering gateway to sit in > front of our working, stable Imail/Declude setup. "Working, stable": so why are you looking for a gateway? Somebody who truly regards their single MX/mailbox server as stable (one might define this as "coping under peak observed load with no user-facing effects") wouldn't be "struggling" to find a gateway. They might be _browsing_ for a gateway in their idle time and not really pursuing it. But If you're actively "struggling," I can't imagine which Internet you're using that's making it so hard to demo and decide on -- using good ol' "pull technology" -- a suitable solution. And: why haven't you posted to the list about this before, if you creally onsider what you're seeking an innocent "compliment" to Declude that can be readily discussed and even advertised on this list? > I didn't have any prior experience with Alligate or Brian so my > reading of the announcement was strictly informational. Brochurespeak euphemized as "information"! I've gotta hand it to ya. You're totally on board with this thing. Nonetheless, I shall continue to state my case. > I don't see Alligate being a competitor to Imail or SmarterMail. It > doesn't provide pop3, imap, webmail, or anything of the things that > our customers call their mail server. It's disingenuous to claim that IMail and SmarterMail are both not used as wrapper MTAs for Declude fronting either internal mailbox servers or remote MXs. The number of people on this list offering such service undermines your position. > It could compete against Declude. Except it works at the initial > SMTP connection level (Pre processing) whereas Declude works after > the SMTP connection is complete (Post processing). It is in fact somewhat comparable to IMGate (PostFix) which as I mentioned is a maybe-free solution that has been advertised on the IMail list for quite a while, by the vociferous and often-wrong Len Conrad. But you're not getting the difference. IMGate is sneakily named IMGate to piggyback on the IMail brand, sure, and the relationship is tenuous at best (only some IMail-aware sync scripts make it anything different from a PostFix HOWTO). I've always been offended by this misleading quality, and I've gotten into bitter wars with Len when it seems that he is specifically upselling the "pay" version to IT newbies that he knows, based on their basic knowledge of SMTP and DNS, will have no chance of following the cookbook themselves. But when he cools off on that, I think his promotion is markedly different; it still intrinsically rubs me the wrong way, given how little he actually knows about IMail, but at least it's more PostFix zealotry than greed. And he at least helps a lot of people with vendor-neutral DNS and SMTP practices. But Alligate is *only* commercial, and has nothing to do with Declude other than being a possible competitor. I don't care about the hamstrung 10-connection version. There are plenty of free gateway-only MTAs that have no connection limits, and that ALSO have nothing to do with Declude! The difference is that their vendors don't spam this list, without putting any current effort into the Declude community. > If Declude offered a stable pre-processing solution, I for one would > sign up immediately. And until then, anyone can spam? I'll get on it. > As I am not aware of any information from Declude stating they have > a solution for this, we've all had to look elsewhere (5XX, Vamsoft, > IMGate, etc). 5XXSink is free. ORF is not advertised here by the vendor. IMGate is not advertised here by the vendor and may be free. > Dictionary attacks are killing us, as is the volume of spammers > hitting our Imail box. ANYTHING to minimize what Imail/Declude has > to process, without costing and arm and a leg, or a forklift upgrade > is welcome! Like I said, I hope we get some more spam so you can see how little you actually believe this. > Alligate is a step above the 5XXSINK, by including tarpitting, > detailed text logs, secondary SMTP AUTH port, connection blocking, > etc. You mean a big shrink-wrapped software company wrote a more fully-featured commercial product than the freeware written by a solo systems programmer? Shocking. > To me it's the right solution at the right time. Sure, because you didn't mind the spam. Had you been spammed by Vamsoft, maybe you'd be
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
I see Alligate as an excellent compliment to our Imail 8.15/Declude 1.82 setup. I for one was thankful to learn about it through this list, as we've been struggling with finding an SMTP filtering gateway to sit in front of our working, stable Imail/Declude setup. I didn't have any prior experience with Alligate or Brian so my reading of the announcement was strictly informational. I don't see Alligate being a competitor to Imail or SmarterMail. It doesn't provide pop3, imap, webmail, or anything of the things that our customers call their mail server. It could compete against Declude. Except it works at the initial SMTP connection level (Pre processing) whereas Declude works after the SMTP connection is complete (Post processing). If Declude offered a stable pre-processing solution, I for one would sign up immediately. As I am not aware of any information from Declude stating they have a solution for this, we've all had to look elsewhere (5XX, Vamsoft, IMGate, etc). Dictionary attacks are killing us, as is the volume of spammers hitting our Imail box. ANYTHING to minimize what Imail/Declude has to process, without costing and arm and a leg, or a forklift upgrade is welcome! Alligate is a step above the 5XXSINK, by including tarpitting, detailed text logs, secondary SMTP AUTH port, connection blocking, etc. To me it's the right solution at the right time. IMGate wouldn't work for us because my staff doesn't do *nix, and I don't want to be the only one to support the box ;) I've got to sleep sometimes. Since we let our Imail support lapse and are holding judgment on SmarterMail until v3 is released, we're in a technical holding pattern while the spammers continue to assault our servers. I don't think I'm alone, which means there is an opportunity for someone and a potential market. While I love all this stuff, I have to eat too, and don't fault anyone for turning my pain into their financial gain so they can eat, if the value proposition is right. R. Scott Perry got assaulted on the Imail list repeatedly for years for pushing his wares. Imail had a gap-in-functionality, Declude seized the moment and profited by patching that gap. I was thankful for his repeated input/arguments and purchased his product - against Imail's own later offering. I hope Declude isn't struggling - they are vital to our business. I also hope that others aren't silent about other available options, competitive or otherwise. This list is so great for learning - where else can one go to learn more about real-world, ISP-level email delivery? Sorry for the ramble, just had to put my .02 in... Maintain, Babul (210) 696-1130, ext. 102 (210) 696-0572 [fax] Text Pager Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Montopolis Group, Ltd. - www.montopolis.com "Building stronger businesses... with Technology" -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sanford Whiteman Posted At: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 5:35 PM Posted To: Lists - Declude JunkMail Conversation: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway I can't believe what is apparently permissible on this list. Has no one realized that this product is a commercial competitor to IMail or SmarterMail, with no relevance to Declude? Don't try that "mail is stopped before Declude has to deal with it" attempt at association. It is what it is. A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no integral link to the now-struggling Declude. At least Len Conrad's free cookbook for IMGate has the exact same features as the one he charges $500 to install. That's always been the redeeming quality of his plugging model. Guess the game has changed. For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel if Vamsoft started advertising here? Do you think there aren't other people on the list who've kept quiet about similar products and services? --Sandy Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist Broadleaf Systems, a division of Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/download/rel ease/ Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes into IMail Aliases! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2aliases/dow nload/release/ http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2aliases/downloa d/release/ --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for vir
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Anyone willing to share more info on this? Timetable? Thanks, Brian T. - Original Message - From: "John T (Lists)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 9:33 PM Subject: RE: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway Plans for a gateway version of Declude are still alive. John T eServices For You > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:Declude.JunkMail- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt > Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 6:02 PM > To: Declude.JunkMail@declude.com > Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway > > Judging by the responses, I suppose that it is inappropriate, at least > without approaching Barry about promoting this product here. I don't > however believe that the intentions were to snipe customers away from > Declude, but instead to provide a value-added solution to those of us > that require an address-validating gateway or pre-scanner of some sort. > His company has of course previously offered a plug-in for Declude, and > publishes a blacklist that many around here are making use of as well. > I don't believe that they are looking at this product as a big money > maker for them, or even a money maker at all. Even programs like > Sniffer has some potential of competing with Declude, though both are of > course stronger as a result of working together. It would be good for > Declude to offer a gateway solution of some sort or find a partner to do so. > > Matt > > > > Sanford Whiteman wrote: > > >I can't believe what is apparently permissible on this list. Has no > >one realized that this product is a commercial competitor to IMail or > >SmarterMail, with no relevance to Declude? Don't try that "mail is > >stopped before Declude has to deal with it" attempt at association. It > >is what it is. A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no > >integral link to the now-struggling Declude. > > > >At least Len Conrad's free cookbook for IMGate has the exact same > >features as the one he charges $500 to install. That's always been the > >redeeming quality of his plugging model. Guess the game has changed. > > > >For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel if Vamsoft > >started advertising here? Do you think there aren't other people on > >the list who've kept quiet about similar products and services? > > > >--Sandy > > > > > > > >Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist > >Broadleaf Systems, a division of > >Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. > >e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/download/release / > > > >Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes into IMail Aliases! > > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2aliases/downloa d/rel > ease/ > > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2aliases/download/re lease/ > > > >--- > >[This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] > > > >--- > >This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > >unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and > >type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found > >at http://www.mail-archive.com. > > > > > > > > > --- > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] > > --- > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and > type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found > at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
I felt the same way too, Sandy. As one who has endured the ire of some on this list for my occasional and somewhat commercial posts for iPlus Info Browser, which by the way, is not a competitor in any way to either IMail or Declude, I feel especially qualified to say, "Wow! That's blatant commercialism if I have ever seen it!" I'm thinking about taking out a full page ad now. LOL! Just Kidding! Evans Martin --- EVANS MARTIN <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> HOSTING: http://www.martek.net PROGRAMMING: http://www.martekware.com iPlus Info Browser - IPB's IMail Migration Tool, password browser, reporting suite make IPlus Info Browser something no IMail administrator should be without. http://www.martek.net/Default.aspx?tabid=96 > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:Declude.JunkMail- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sanford Whiteman > Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 5:35 PM > To: Brian > Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway > > I can't believe what is apparently permissible on this list. Has no > one realized that this product is a commercial competitor to IMail or > SmarterMail, with no relevance to Declude? Don't try that "mail is > stopped before Declude has to deal with it" attempt at association. It > is what it is. A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no > integral link to the now-struggling Declude. > > At least Len Conrad's free cookbook for IMGate has the exact same > features as the one he charges $500 to install. That's always been the > redeeming quality of his plugging model. Guess the game has changed. > > For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel if Vamsoft > started advertising here? Do you think there aren't other people on > the list who've kept quiet about similar products and services? > > --Sandy > > > > Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist > Broadleaf Systems, a division of > Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. > e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/download/relea > se/ > > Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes into IMail > Aliases! > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2aliases/downl > oad/release/ > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2aliases/download/ > release/ > > --- > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] > > --- > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and > type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found > at http://www.mail-archive.com. > --- > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re[2]: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
> I don't however believe that the intentions were to snipe customers > away from Declude, No? Not to get some people out of the Declude upgrade path, so they could spend their limited budgets elsewhere? Not to upsell a gateway solution that "takes the heat off" a Declude infrastructure? The history here speaks for itself. Solid Oak decided to get out of the Declude add-on business, forcing CyberSitter users to either put in the Alligate MTA in place of IMail/Declude or stop using CyberSitter's very effective ruleset. It was a bully move, smart capitalism but a pretty dumb way of expressing selflessness. I have no doubt that the new product is an excellent MTA; that does not make competitive spamming okay. > but instead to provide a value-added solution to those of us that > require an address-validating gateway or pre-scanner of some sort. What does that even mean? Please: tell me what product that causes the consumer to incur costs above their baseline is not marketed as a "value-added solution." Of course it has to be claimed to add value; otherwise, no one would pay for it. That's a basic building block of software commerce. It is not a building block of good-heartedness. Do you want a free address-validating gateway that isn't limited to 10 connections? Use 5XXSINK and MS SMTP, for God's sake. Use Mercury/32. Use MailEnable. > His company has of course previously offered a plug-in for Declude, > and publishes a blacklist that many around here are making use of as > well. That they once offered CyberSitter is material because of the *bad* feelings it left behind (see John's e-mail). It doesn't entitle anyone to come back, _still_ without a Declude add-on or integration, and market another product. If offering an well-regarded DNSBL allows you circumvent the rules of spamming, that's quite a surprise. Can the people who run other respected blacklists just pop on an anti-spam vendor support list and sell competitive -- or at the very least non-vendor-aware -- products? News to me. And I doubt you really support that position, once extended. > I don't believe that they are looking at this product as a big money > maker for them Any money is big money when you get it unethically. > or even a money maker at all. This is a slimmed-down version of a product they already built and are/were compensated for. If they failed to break even when they first put out the product, is it up to us to bail them out in this round? I might feel less inclined to rant on if they weren't a comfortably profitable and well-known software vendor, by Brian's own admission, with CyberSitter. They have the time and money in the bank. They aren't trying to pay past-due bills with this thing; they are trying to recoup some labor investment. So far, that's all both common and necessary in business, and not objectionable in its own right. But where it goes dead wrong is spamming this list, or any competitor's list. I don't care if you only stand to make the equivalent of 5 bucks an hour for the development time you put into the product vs. the number of copies you'll sell. You still need to figure standard marketing, not spamming, into your budget. > Even programs like Sniffer has some potential of competing with > Declude, though both are of course stronger as a result of working > together. Sniffer is a legitimate plug-in for Declude. Pete never markets Assert on this list; if people discover it from getting into the Sniffer community through Declude, that's good viral work by ARM. It's the opposite tactic than that used by Solid Oak, in that ARM can use a Declude-aware product as an entry point into their own mailing lists and other products, some of them even competitive. But Sniffer for Declude is not handicapped vs. the Sniffer part of Assert, showing their good-faith maintenance of different integrations. It's not the same thing at all. > It would be good for Declude to offer a gateway solution of some > sort or find a partner to do so. Isn't SmarterMail that partner? IMO, we need another MTA, and Computerized Horizons distracted by such work, like a hole in the head. --Sandy Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist Broadleaf Systems, a division of Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/download/release/ Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes into IMail Aliases! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2aliases/download/release/ http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2aliases/download/release/ --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, j
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Plans for a gateway version of Declude are still alive. John T eServices For You > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:Declude.JunkMail- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt > Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 6:02 PM > To: Declude.JunkMail@declude.com > Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway > > Judging by the responses, I suppose that it is inappropriate, at least > without approaching Barry about promoting this product here. I don't > however believe that the intentions were to snipe customers away from > Declude, but instead to provide a value-added solution to those of us > that require an address-validating gateway or pre-scanner of some sort. > His company has of course previously offered a plug-in for Declude, and > publishes a blacklist that many around here are making use of as well. > I don't believe that they are looking at this product as a big money > maker for them, or even a money maker at all. Even programs like > Sniffer has some potential of competing with Declude, though both are of > course stronger as a result of working together. It would be good for > Declude to offer a gateway solution of some sort or find a partner to do so. > > Matt > > > > Sanford Whiteman wrote: > > >I can't believe what is apparently permissible on this list. Has no > >one realized that this product is a commercial competitor to IMail or > >SmarterMail, with no relevance to Declude? Don't try that "mail is > >stopped before Declude has to deal with it" attempt at association. It > >is what it is. A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no > >integral link to the now-struggling Declude. > > > >At least Len Conrad's free cookbook for IMGate has the exact same > >features as the one he charges $500 to install. That's always been the > >redeeming quality of his plugging model. Guess the game has changed. > > > >For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel if Vamsoft > >started advertising here? Do you think there aren't other people on > >the list who've kept quiet about similar products and services? > > > >--Sandy > > > > > > > >Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist > >Broadleaf Systems, a division of > >Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. > >e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/download/release / > > > >Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes into IMail Aliases! > > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2aliases/downloa d/rel > ease/ > > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2aliases/download/re lease/ > > > >--- > >[This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] > > > >--- > >This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > >unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and > >type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found > >at http://www.mail-archive.com. > > > > > > > > > --- > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] > > --- > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and > type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found > at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Judging by the responses, I suppose that it is inappropriate, at least without approaching Barry about promoting this product here. I don't however believe that the intentions were to snipe customers away from Declude, but instead to provide a value-added solution to those of us that require an address-validating gateway or pre-scanner of some sort. His company has of course previously offered a plug-in for Declude, and publishes a blacklist that many around here are making use of as well. I don't believe that they are looking at this product as a big money maker for them, or even a money maker at all. Even programs like Sniffer has some potential of competing with Declude, though both are of course stronger as a result of working together. It would be good for Declude to offer a gateway solution of some sort or find a partner to do so. Matt Sanford Whiteman wrote: I can't believe what is apparently permissible on this list. Has no one realized that this product is a commercial competitor to IMail or SmarterMail, with no relevance to Declude? Don't try that "mail is stopped before Declude has to deal with it" attempt at association. It is what it is. A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no integral link to the now-struggling Declude. At least Len Conrad's free cookbook for IMGate has the exact same features as the one he charges $500 to install. That's always been the redeeming quality of his plugging model. Guess the game has changed. For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel if Vamsoft started advertising here? Do you think there aren't other people on the list who've kept quiet about similar products and services? --Sandy Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist Broadleaf Systems, a division of Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/download/release/ Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes into IMail Aliases! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2aliases/download/release/ http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2aliases/download/release/ --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Sandy, I agree with you. That fact that I was going to be silent has to do with my perception of the users on this list, as compared to other lists that I participate on that I am well know to posts rants. The fact of the matter is I was one of the ones heavily (to my knowledge) involved in testing and promoting the former Alligate to the Declude community. And I believe I got burned, as I am sure others did. I spent a lot of time testing and reporting to Brian about Alligate, before it was even that. And then not even 6 months later to have them silently retreat away from the Declude community left a bad taste. I came away with the feeling that I and others were used to help the product along not for the benefit of the Declude community, but for Brian and his company. For those that are not familiar with the former product, an inherent conflict came up as Brian wanted Alligate to have control of the message. We are Declude users because we believe in Declude and want control to remain with Declude. Yes Brian, your post is pure marketing to a list that is essentially a competitor, and that is both unprofessional and unethical. Please, think long and hard about that. Especially since your company deals in products that involve to a point ethics and morals. John T eServices For You --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Sanford Whiteman wrote: Has no one realized that this product is a commercial competitor to IMail or SmarterMail, with no relevance to Declude? I missed the post. .I actually had to look in my deleted emails to find the email to which you were referring.. Obviously you are right - I guess because my interest in this list is not what it once was so I skip over most posts. A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no integral link to the now-struggling Declude. This is true. Languishing may be a better term. For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel if Vamsoft started advertising here? Peter wouldn't do that! and if he did he would sure hear it from me. But your point is well taken... -Nick --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Sandy I thought the same and I'm sure many here too. But I preffered ignoring this spam message and withut commenting with the hope to prevent an unnecessary load to a list who's job is to provide support for declude products and nothing else. Markus > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of > Sanford Whiteman > Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2006 12:35 AM > To: Brian > Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway > > I can't believe what is apparently permissible on this > list. Has no one realized that this product is a commercial > competitor to IMail or SmarterMail, with no relevance to > Declude? Don't try that "mail is stopped before Declude has > to deal with it" attempt at association. It is what it is. > A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no integral > link to the now-struggling Declude. > > At least Len Conrad's free cookbook for IMGate has the > exact same features as the one he charges $500 to install. > That's always been the redeeming quality of his plugging > model. Guess the game has changed. > > For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel > if Vamsoft started advertising here? Do you think there > aren't other people on the list who've kept quiet about > similar products and services? > > --Sandy > > > > Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist > Broadleaf Systems, a division of > Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. > e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/do > wnload/release/ > > Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes > into IMail Aliases! > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2a > liases/download/release/ > > http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2alias > es/download/release/ > > --- > [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] > > --- > This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To > unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and > type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be > found at http://www.mail-archive.com. > --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
I can't believe what is apparently permissible on this list. Has no one realized that this product is a commercial competitor to IMail or SmarterMail, with no relevance to Declude? Don't try that "mail is stopped before Declude has to deal with it" attempt at association. It is what it is. A separate, commercial anti-spam gateway with no integral link to the now-struggling Declude. At least Len Conrad's free cookbook for IMGate has the exact same features as the one he charges $500 to install. That's always been the redeeming quality of his plugging model. Guess the game has changed. For everyone who's silently letting this go: how'd you feel if Vamsoft started advertising here? Do you think there aren't other people on the list who've kept quiet about similar products and services? --Sandy Sanford Whiteman, Chief Technologist Broadleaf Systems, a division of Cypress Integrated Systems, Inc. e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] SpamAssassin plugs into Declude! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/SPAMC32/download/release/ Defuse Dictionary Attacks: Turn Exchange or IMail mailboxes into IMail Aliases! http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/exchange2aliases/download/release/ http://www.imprimia.com/products/software/freeutils/ldap2aliases/download/release/ --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude EVA www.declude.com] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type "unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail". The archives can be found at http://www.mail-archive.com.
[Declude.JunkMail] ANN: SMTP Gateway
Hi Everyone, A couple of weeks ago I posted a message regarding our SMTP Gateway. Several users responded and have been using the beta version with no major issues. I appreciate the responses. We now have the Alligate SMTP Gateway available for evaluation for anyone that is interested. We could also use another beta tester or two, preferably someone who uses multiple or backup mail servers. We have decided to make a FREE version available as well. It is limited to a single destination server and a maximum of 5 concurrent connections. For simple installations supporting a single mail server and doing less than 10,000 messages per day, the free (Standard) version may be all you need and there is no cost whatsoever. The Alligate SMTP Gateway has numerous features to help with spam prevention that can be applied at the SMTP level before it ever gets to your mail server and Declude. If you use this with MXRate, and employ the tarpitting and/or blocking options, you can reduce spam volume by 60%+ immediately. We now have an informational page and on-line help with screenshots, so we would like to invite you to check it out. The screenshots and help topics will give you a good idea of its' capabilities. We will also be adding more technical details over the next couple of weeks, including information for programmers who may be interested in incorporating third party external anti-spam and virus programs. Main info page: http://www.alligate.com/smtpgateway.htm Help and Screenshots: http://www.alligate.com/help/Default.htm Thanks, Brian Milburn Solid Oak Software
