Re: Administrivia: DMARC mitigations enabled -- applies to Yahoo addresses, at least (was Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.)

[Todd Zullinger]

First, thanks for replying.  It shows the list changes in
action.  At least it appears to work as intended. :)

Tim via users wrote:
> Allegedly, on or about 27 March 2018, Todd Zullinger sent:
>> All that said, the best solution would be to stop using
>> @yahoo.com as a mail provider -- at least for mailing
>> lists.  They have repeatedly caused grief to the folks
>> that manage the Fedora Project mail systems.
> 
> And that'll only work until the next mail service provider
> does the same thing (insist mail addressed from them goes
> through them).  Which, supposedly, they should all be
> doing.

Yeah.  DMARC isn't the primary reason for bashing Yahoo.
It's more that they have repeatedly blocked all mail from
Fedora domains after a few users signed up for a list,
forgot how to get off it, and marked it as spam.  I've never
managed the Fedora domains, but I've managed others and that
sort of thing always left a lasting impression on me.

> Likewise, with the converse.  Recipient mail service
> providers insisting that mail from somewhere must come
> through them, regardless of the fact that's not always
> practical or possible.
> 
> Case in point; many of us have our own domains, and will
> use them to the fullest extent (use our domain name, post
> through our servers), yet our ISPs interfere (intercept
> passing mail, and route it through their own servers).

Are there (m)any ISPs that block the submission port (587)?
I know many block port 25, but if you're running your own
mail server, you really just need to do it from IP space
that you control.

For me, the worst part of having port 25 blocked these days
is that it makes it slightly harder to diagnose issues with
remote mail servers (but only very slightly).

> In some ways I don't mind the notion that a mail server
> may remove our addresses from the post, preventing spam
> from personally reaching us, and stopping private replies.
> But it heads towards anonymising the mail, making it
> easier for someone to be an ass, or impersonate other
> people.

Indeed.  It's an interesting balancing act.

-- 
Todd
~~
Heathen, n. A benighted creature who has the folly to worship
something that he can see and hear.
-- Ambrose Bierce, "The Devil's Dictionary"



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multiple GUI logins and mounting external drives

[Tim via users]

Hi,

If I use the GUI switch user feature, so that two users are currently
logged into the same PC, graphically (and you can switch between them
using CTRL+ALT+F1 and CTRL+ALT+F2), I frequently find that whenever I
plug in a USB drive, or SD card, that nothing pops up on the login that
I'm using.  It nearly always pops an authentication window on the other
login.

It doesn't matter which one I'm currently using, it nearly always uses
the other one.  Surely the system knows which one is currently on-
display, and should use that one?

-- 
[tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp
Linux 4.15.10-200.fc26.x86_64 #1 SMP Thu Mar 15 17:14:41 UTC 2018 x86_64

Boilerplate:  All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
There is no point trying to privately email me, I only get to see
the messages posted to the mailing list.

George Orwell's '1984' was supposed to be a warning against tyranny,
not a set of instructions for supposedly democratic governments.
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Re: Administrivia: DMARC mitigations enabled -- applies to Yahoo addresses, at least (was Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.)

[Tim via users]

Allegedly, on or about 27 March 2018, Todd Zullinger sent:
> All that said, the best solution would be to stop using
> @yahoo.com as a mail provider -- at least for mailing lists.
> They have repeatedly caused grief to the folks that manage
> the Fedora Project mail systems.

And that'll only work until the next mail service provider does the
same thing (insist mail addressed from them goes through them).  Which,
supposedly, they should all be doing.

Likewise, with the converse.  Recipient mail service providers
insisting that mail from somewhere must come through them, regardless
of the fact that's not always practical or possible.

Case in point; many of us have our own domains, and will use them to
the fullest extent (use our domain name, post through our servers), yet
our ISPs interfere (intercept passing mail, and route it through their
own servers).

In some ways I don't mind the notion that a mail server may remove our
addresses from the post, preventing spam from personally reaching us,
and stopping private replies.  But it heads towards anonymising the
mail, making it easier for someone to be an ass, or impersonate other
people.   

-- 
[tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp
Linux 4.15.10-200.fc26.x86_64 #1 SMP Thu Mar 15 17:14:41 UTC 2018 x86_64

Boilerplate:  All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
There is no point trying to privately email me, I only get to see
the messages posted to the mailing list.

If 2001: A Space Odyssey taught us anything, it's that Siri will,
one day, murder us all.
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Philip Rhoades]

Tom,


On 2018-03-28 10:37, Tom Horsley wrote:

Possibly relevant enhancement that might appear someday
is discussed in this bug report:

https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=766068

(I don't get the impression you should hold out hope
for "someday" to be soon though).



Interesting but it doesn't sound like my problem and you are probably 
right - don't hold my breath again . .


Thanks,

Phil.
--
Philip Rhoades

PO Box 896
Cowra  NSW  2794
Australia
E-mail:  p...@pricom.com.au
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Philip Rhoades]

JD,


On 2018-03-28 10:27, JD wrote:

On 03/26/2018 07:53 PM, Philip Rhoades wrote:

Samuel,


On 2018-03-27 12:18, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 03/26/2018 05:59 PM, Philip Rhoades wrote:

but it is not what I want to do - when Chrome goes mad and the whole
system starts grinding to a halt (I know from experience it is
Chrome) I want to try and work out what specific Chrome tab or
window is the problem.  Chrome has its own task manager:


If you run top, which process is using the CPU?  Just kill that one,
then go through your chrome tabs and find out which tab has the sad
face on it.



That usually doesn't work from my recollection, no individual tab
seems to be a problem - it is either Chrome as a whole or a whole
window I think . . obviously shutting down all of Chrome fixes the
problem . . but it is a pain to gradually re-open all the windows I
previously had open again . .

P.

Phil,
How about using the trial and error method.
Kill one window (press the X on the right hand upper corner :)  )
and then check the cpu load in a full screen cli window.
if the load is still high, at least u will have eliminated that window.
so try this with each window and check the cpu load.
The one that brings the load down (after killing it :) )
is the culprit.



The problem is that the GUI becomes VERY unresponsive so that is why I 
preferred a CLI method - because terms seemed relatively unaffected and 
I don't have to use mouse clicks - but also because it would be nice to 
just iterate through a list killing IDs of something and immediately 
know what was happening - it still might require killing every single 
Chrome process of course . .


It is also odd that the graphical CPU and disk activity indicators do 
not show much happening but that might be because of the afore-mentioned 
GUI unresponsiveness - I can definitely HEAR more disk activity and top 
SEEMS to show more CPU activity of Chrome processes.  The problem seems 
to go rapidly exponential from minor interactive delays to the GUI being 
almost unusable with longer and longer waits between the mouse being 
responsive - so I don't have a convenient before and after problem view 
of what was happening with top.  I might see if I can log the top output 
to disk and find a method of reliably recreating the problem . .




While u r  at it, also check the mem usage of chrome. High mem usage
can cause a lot of paging and even swapping if u  r a small ram. But
if you have plethora of RAM, then u need not worry about it. U should
have at least 2 X RAM as SWAP space. Since I run a lot of apps, I have
4X RAM as SWAP on HD.



32GB RAM and 32GB of SWAP which doesn't get used.  I will keep working 
on it but at the moment, it looks like ALL Chrome processes start using 
more RAM and cause more disk activity . .


Thanks,

Phil.
--
Philip Rhoades

PO Box 896
Cowra  NSW  2794
Australia
E-mail:  p...@pricom.com.au
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Joe Zeff]

On 03/27/2018 06:18 PM, JD wrote:

I think you are way way too stressed out.
I am merely trying to reduce my typing as I am not such a good typist.


He wasn't the only one thinking it, though.  I was considering making 
the same comment.

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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[JD]

On 03/27/2018 07:03 PM, Rick Stevens wrote:

On 03/27/2018 04:27 PM, JD wrote:



if the load is still high, at least u will have eliminated that window.
so try this with each window and check the cpu load.




While u r  at it, also check the mem usage of chrome. High mem usage
can cause a lot of paging and even swapping if u  r a small ram. But if
you have plethora of RAM, then u need not worry about it. U should have
at least 2 X RAM as SWAP space. Since I run a lot of apps, I have 4X RAM
as SWAP on HD.

Is it possible that while "u r @ it", you could try typing out the words
instead of using inane social media jargon? This is a mailing list, not
a bloody Twitter feed. I can feel my IQ drop when I see such a posting.

(Sorry, but someone has to say it!)

I think you are way way too stressed out.
I am merely trying to reduce my typing as I am not such a good typist.
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Ed Greshko]

On 03/28/18 09:03, Rick Stevens wrote:
> On 03/27/2018 04:27 PM, JD wrote:
>
> 
>> if the load is still high, at least u will have eliminated that window.
>> so try this with each window and check the cpu load.
> 
>
>> While u r  at it, also check the mem usage of chrome. High mem usage
>> can cause a lot of paging and even swapping if u  r a small ram. But if
>> you have plethora of RAM, then u need not worry about it. U should have
>> at least 2 X RAM as SWAP space. Since I run a lot of apps, I have 4X RAM
>> as SWAP on HD.
> Is it possible that while "u r @ it", you could try typing out the words
> instead of using inane social media jargon? This is a mailing list, not
> a bloody Twitter feed. I can feel my IQ drop when I see such a posting.
>
> (Sorry, but someone has to say it!)

Thank you for that!


-- 
Conjecture is just a conclusion based on incomplete information. It isn't a 
fact.



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[389-users] Using PBKDF2_SHA256 Hashes

[Joe Cooter]

Hi,

I’m attempting to build an application using the userPassword attribute, with 
hashes stored using PBKDF2_SHA256.  However, using the passlib hash library for 
pbkdf2_sha256 is complaining about a malformed hash.  Looking at the hash, it 
appears that there aren’t any delimiters between the salt, iterations, etc.

Is there some additional encoding happening on the userPassword attribute?
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Rick Stevens]

On 03/27/2018 04:27 PM, JD wrote:


> if the load is still high, at least u will have eliminated that window.
> so try this with each window and check the cpu load.



> While u r  at it, also check the mem usage of chrome. High mem usage
> can cause a lot of paging and even swapping if u  r a small ram. But if
> you have plethora of RAM, then u need not worry about it. U should have
> at least 2 X RAM as SWAP space. Since I run a lot of apps, I have 4X RAM
> as SWAP on HD.

Is it possible that while "u r @ it", you could try typing out the words
instead of using inane social media jargon? This is a mailing list, not
a bloody Twitter feed. I can feel my IQ drop when I see such a posting.

(Sorry, but someone has to say it!)
--
- Rick Stevens, Systems Engineer, AllDigitalri...@alldigital.com -
- AIM/Skype: therps2ICQ: 22643734Yahoo: origrps2 -
--
--
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Tom Horsley]

Possibly relevant enhancement that might appear someday
is discussed in this bug report:

https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=766068

(I don't get the impression you should hold out hope
for "someday" to be soon though).
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[JD]

On 03/26/2018 07:53 PM, Philip Rhoades wrote:

Samuel,


On 2018-03-27 12:18, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 03/26/2018 05:59 PM, Philip Rhoades wrote:

but it is not what I want to do - when Chrome goes mad and the whole
system starts grinding to a halt (I know from experience it is
Chrome) I want to try and work out what specific Chrome tab or
window is the problem.  Chrome has its own task manager:


If you run top, which process is using the CPU?  Just kill that one,
then go through your chrome tabs and find out which tab has the sad
face on it.



That usually doesn't work from my recollection, no individual tab
seems to be a problem - it is either Chrome as a whole or a whole
window I think . . obviously shutting down all of Chrome fixes the
problem . . but it is a pain to gradually re-open all the windows I
previously had open again . .

P.

Phil,
How about using the trial and error method.
Kill one window (press the X on the right hand upper corner :)  )
and then check the cpu load in a full screen cli window.
if the load is still high, at least u will have eliminated that window.
so try this with each window and check the cpu load.
The one that brings the load down (after killing it :) )
is the culprit.
While u r  at it, also check the mem usage of chrome. High mem usage
can cause a lot of paging and even swapping if u  r a small ram. But if 
you have plethora of RAM, then u need not worry about it. U should have 
at least 2 X RAM as SWAP space. Since I run a lot of apps, I have 4X RAM 
as SWAP on HD.

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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Todd Zullinger]

I wrote:
> That might be sped up if someone reading is interested in
> filing a bug upstream and perhaps even providing a patch to
> hyperkitty.  Someone from the infrastructure team may
> eventually be able to do just that, but I know they have
> many, many items on their list of tasks. :)
> 
> https://gitlab.com/mailman/hyperkitty/issues

I believe the place to add this would be around here in the
source:


https://gitlab.com/mailman/hyperkitty/blob/master/hyperkitty/static/hyperkitty/js/hyperkitty-thread.js#L242

I don't use javascript much and I'm not curious enough to
setup a hyperkitty dev environment to test this, but
something like this might be what's needed:

diff --git i/hyperkitty/static/hyperkitty/js/hyperkitty-thread.js 
w/hyperkitty/static/hyperkitty/js/hyperkitty-thread.js
index bd17e98..fbb2369 100644
--- i/hyperkitty/static/hyperkitty/js/hyperkitty-thread.js
+++ w/hyperkitty/static/hyperkitty/js/hyperkitty-thread.js
@@ -252,10 +252,13 @@ function setup_replies() {
 if (sig_index != -1) {
 quoted = quoted.substr(0, sig_index);
 }
+// set reply attribution
+var attribution = $(this).parents(".email").first()
+.find(".email-body").clone().text() + ' wrote:';
 // add quotation marks
 quoted = $.trim(quoted).replace(/^/mg, "> ");
 // insert before any previous text
-textarea.val(quoted + "\n" + textarea.val());
+textarea.val(attribution + "\n" + quoted + "\n" + textarea.val());
 textarea.focus();
 });
 function set_new_thread(checkbox) {

-- 
Todd
~~
Now, now my good man, this is no time for making enemies.
-- Voltaire, on his deathbed in response to a priest asking that
he renounce Satan.



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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Ed Greshko]

On 03/28/18 06:09, Todd Zullinger wrote:
> I am pretty sure that Hyperkitty simply doesn't include any
> "attribution" on its own.  The "...  wrote" being quoted is
> exactly what Kevin's mail client included.  It's no less
> confusing, but it's not as much a bug as a mis-feature.


OK.  I believe you're right.

As a strictly email client user I hope fewer people will use the HyperKitty 
interface
with these mis-features.  :-)

I'll just add this to the list of things that confuse and/or bug me.  Such as: 
Why as
one gets older they mis-type more frequently and no amount of proof reading 
helps? 
And why do people use the word "one" when they mean "I".  :-) :-)

-- 
Conjecture is just a conclusion based on incomplete information. It isn't a 
fact.



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Re: Administrivia: DMARC mitigations enabled -- applies to Yahoo addresses, at least (was Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.)

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Tue, 2018-03-27 at 18:25 -0400, Todd Zullinger wrote:
> > That seems to be a sensible change. Perhaps one or two yahoo.com users
> > could post here just to check it's working and we gmail.com users can
> > see their messages.
> > 
> > Of course as long as nothing appears we'll have to keep checking HK to
> > see if we're missing something ...
> 
> Or you'll notice replies to messages you've not seen. :)

Indeed.

> Maybe we'll be lucky and everyone will move off @yahoo.com,
> giving the infrastructure team a nice present.

Fat chance :-)

poc
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Re: Administrivia: DMARC mitigations enabled -- applies to Yahoo addresses, at least (was Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.)

[Todd Zullinger]

Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> On Tue, 2018-03-27 at 17:27 -0400, Todd Zullinger wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> As we've discussed in this thread and others recently,
>> messages from subscribers @yahoo.com do not reach
>> subscribers @gmail.com (among others).  This is due to an
>> aggressive policy set by Yahoo which breaks mail sent via
>> the mailing list.
>> 
>> The mitigation enabled should change the From: address of
>> the outgoing mail to the list address.  This should only
>> apply to users of @yahoo.com and other domains which set a
>> similar DMARC policy.  Subscribers at other domains should
>> see no change to the From: address of mail they send to the
>> list.
>> 
>> I believe that only the email address will be changed, and
>> not the sender's name, but I am not certain of that yet.

I did check the mailman source code and it does leave the
user name mostly untouched.  So (presuming @example.com has
a DMARC 'reject' policy),

From: Some User 

would be changed to

From: Some User via users 

>> Hopefully this mitigation will work well and provide an
>> overall improvement to the list.  If not, we'll revert it.
> 
> That seems to be a sensible change. Perhaps one or two yahoo.com users
> could post here just to check it's working and we gmail.com users can
> see their messages.
> 
> Of course as long as nothing appears we'll have to keep checking HK to
> see if we're missing something ...

Or you'll notice replies to messages you've not seen. :)

Maybe we'll be lucky and everyone will move off @yahoo.com,
giving the infrastructure team a nice present.

-- 
Todd
~~
To have a successful relationship, I must learn to make it look like
I'm giving as much as I'm getting.



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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Todd Zullinger]

Ed Greshko wrote:
>> On 03/27/2018 12:03 PM, home user wrote:
>> 
>> It doesn't matter either way.
>> 
>> If you have a yahoo.com address and send from your email client via
>> yahoo's email servers, it still goes to fedoraprojects lists server and
>> sends out from there. If you sent from hyperkitty it sends directly out
>> from there. The problem is yahoo.com telling everyone that all email
>> with a yahoo.com addres must come from a yahoo.com email server. In the
>> case of email lists, this doesn't not happen.
>> 
>> Odd... you should get an email anytime the ticket updates automatically,
>> not sure what is going on. Did you check your spam folder in case it
>> ended up in there?
>> 
>> kevin
> 
> Regardless of what email address is being used, is this
> ticket sufficient to address the quoting problems that the
> Hyperkitty interface has?
>
> I have replied here to a long message posted by "kevin",
> expanded all the sections with the "..." and the reply
> only shows "On 03/27/2018 12:03 PM, home user wrote:" and
> only contains what "kevin" wrote.  Extremely confusing.

I am pretty sure that Hyperkitty simply doesn't include any
"attribution" on its own.  The "...  wrote" being quoted is
exactly what Kevin's mail client included.  It's no less
confusing, but it's not as much a bug as a mis-feature.

So it's really a feature request for Hyperkitty to include
some form of "At ..., $user wrote:" attribution when it adds
a quote from the message.

That might be sped up if someone reading is interested in
filing a bug upstream and perhaps even providing a patch to
hyperkitty.  Someone from the infrastructure team may
eventually be able to do just that, but I know they have
many, many items on their list of tasks. :)

https://gitlab.com/mailman/hyperkitty/issues

I did a quick search for quote and attribution and didn't
see any open items.

-- 
Todd
~~
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn
from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent
disinclination to do so.
-- Douglas Adams



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Re: Administrivia: DMARC mitigations enabled -- applies to Yahoo addresses, at least (was Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.)

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Tue, 2018-03-27 at 17:27 -0400, Todd Zullinger wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> As we've discussed in this thread and others recently,
> messages from subscribers @yahoo.com do not reach
> subscribers @gmail.com (among others).  This is due to an
> aggressive policy set by Yahoo which breaks mail sent via
> the mailing list.
> 
> The mitigation enabled should change the From: address of
> the outgoing mail to the list address.  This should only
> apply to users of @yahoo.com and other domains which set a
> similar DMARC policy.  Subscribers at other domains should
> see no change to the From: address of mail they send to the
> list.
> 
> I believe that only the email address will be changed, and
> not the sender's name, but I am not certain of that yet.
> 
> Hopefully this mitigation will work well and provide an
> overall improvement to the list.  If not, we'll revert it.

That seems to be a sensible change. Perhaps one or two yahoo.com users
could post here just to check it's working and we gmail.com users can
see their messages.

Of course as long as nothing appears we'll have to keep checking HK to
see if we're missing something ...

poc
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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Ed Greshko]

> On 03/27/2018 12:03 PM, home user wrote:
> 
> It doesn't matter either way.
> 
> If you have a yahoo.com address and send from your email client via
> yahoo's email servers, it still goes to fedoraprojects lists server and
> sends out from there. If you sent from hyperkitty it sends directly out
> from there. The problem is yahoo.com telling everyone that all email
> with a yahoo.com addres must come from a yahoo.com email server. In the
> case of email lists, this doesn't not happen.
> 
> Odd... you should get an email anytime the ticket updates automatically,
> not sure what is going on. Did you check your spam folder in case it
> ended up in there?
> 
> kevin

Regardless of what email address is being used, is this ticket sufficient to 
address the quoting problems that the Hyperkitty interface has?

I have replied here to a long message posted by "kevin", expanded all the 
sections with the "..." and the reply only shows "On 03/27/2018 12:03 PM, home 
user wrote:" and only contains what "kevin" wrote.  Extremely confusing.
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Administrivia: DMARC mitigations enabled -- applies to Yahoo addresses, at least (was Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.)

[Todd Zullinger]

Hi all,

As we've discussed in this thread and others recently,
messages from subscribers @yahoo.com do not reach
subscribers @gmail.com (among others).  This is due to an
aggressive policy set by Yahoo which breaks mail sent via
the mailing list.

The mitigation enabled should change the From: address of
the outgoing mail to the list address.  This should only
apply to users of @yahoo.com and other domains which set a
similar DMARC policy.  Subscribers at other domains should
see no change to the From: address of mail they send to the
list.

I believe that only the email address will be changed, and
not the sender's name, but I am not certain of that yet.

Hopefully this mitigation will work well and provide an
overall improvement to the list.  If not, we'll revert it.

All that said, the best solution would be to stop using
@yahoo.com as a mail provider -- at least for mailing lists.
They have repeatedly caused grief to the folks that manage
the Fedora Project mail systems.

As far back as 2010, the previous lead of the Fedora
Infrastructure team posted about one of the common problems
@yahoo.com caused:

https://mmcgrath.livejournal.com/37248.html

-- 
Todd
~~
If age imparted wisdom, there wouldn't be any old fools.
-- Claudia Young



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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Todd Zullinger]

I wrote:
> I am not familiar enough with DMARC and Mailman3 to know
> whether there are any work-arounds available for this issue
> or not.  There aren't any great solutions to it, in any
> case.

A little further reading tells me that Mailman supports a
few possible work-arounds¹.  I've mentioned these to the list
admins and will see if any of them are worth testing².

¹ https://wiki.list.org/DEV/DMARC
² Only 'Replace From:' or 'Wrap message' would be reasonable
  for this list, IMO.  If it were @aol.com causing this
  trouble, I'd be more inclined to suggest the 'Discard'
  option. ;)

-- 
Todd
~~
Even moderation ought not to be practiced to excess.



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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Todd Zullinger]

Hi Bill,

home user wrote:
> Some of you have neat sayings beneath your signature.  A
> good one in this thread is "Conjecture is just a
> conclusion based on incomplete information. It isn't a
> fact.".
> 
> I'm seeing comments implying that messages from
> yahoo-based member accounts are not reaching members with
> gmail-based member accounts.  I'm wondering if this might
> be one of those conjectures based on incomplete
> information.  Has anyone actually tried to diagnose the
> problem?

Unfortunately, it is not conjecture. :(

> Are the messages disappearing because
> - I use HYPERKITTY to post them?
> - my account is based on a yahoo e-mail address?
> - your account is based on a gmail e-mail address?
> - something else?
> (I realize there could be more than one cause.)

It's primarily because your address is @yahoo.com.  In 2014,
Yahoo began using an agressive DMARC setting with a policy
to reject all yahoo.com mail that fails DMARC.  Not all
domains which recieve mail respect this, but Gmail is one
that does.  That's why list messages from @yahoo.com
addresses don't reach users @gmail.com.

I am not familiar enough with DMARC and Mailman3 to know
whether there are any work-arounds available for this issue
or not.  There aren't any great solutions to it, in any
case.  If someone knows differently it would be great if
they could reach out to the Fedora Infrastructure team with
details (ideally in the form of a patch ;) ).

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure

If you want to read more about this issue, search the web
for something like: yahoo dmarc mailing lists

-- 
Todd
~~
Disobedience, n. The silver lining to the cloud of servitude.
-- Ambrose Bierce, "The Devil's Dictionary"



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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Stephen Morris]

On 28/3/18 6:34 am, home user wrote:

Some of you have neat sayings beneath your signature.  A good one in this thread is 
"Conjecture is just a conclusion based on incomplete information. It isn't a 
fact.".

I'm seeing comments implying that messages from yahoo-based member accounts are 
not reaching members with gmail-based member accounts.  I'm wondering if this 
might be one of those conjectures based on incomplete information.  Has anyone 
actually tried to diagnose the problem?  Are the messages disappearing because
- I use HYPERKITTY to post them?
- my account is based on a yahoo e-mail address?
- your account is based on a gmail e-mail address?
- something else?
(I realize there could be more than one cause.)

Bill.


Just my 2 cents worth, the email address I have registered on this list 
for emails to be sent to is neither Yahoo nor Gmail, it is an address 
that is specific to my ISP, and I had no issues whatsoever with 
receiving any emails on this thread, but having said that I have 
occasionally on other threads had issues with seeing all the mails, 
based on comments in replies, which indicated either the list didn't get 
the mail because it was sent directly to the OP, or it didn't get to me 
for whatever reason.


regards,

Steve



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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[home user]

Some of you have neat sayings beneath your signature.  A good one in this 
thread is "Conjecture is just a conclusion based on incomplete information. It 
isn't a fact.".

I'm seeing comments implying that messages from yahoo-based member accounts are 
not reaching members with gmail-based member accounts.  I'm wondering if this 
might be one of those conjectures based on incomplete information.  Has anyone 
actually tried to diagnose the problem?  Are the messages disappearing because
- I use HYPERKITTY to post them?
- my account is based on a yahoo e-mail address?
- your account is based on a gmail e-mail address?
- something else?
(I realize there could be more than one cause.)

Bill.
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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Kevin Fenzi]

On 03/27/2018 12:03 PM, home user wrote:
>> On 03/27/18 07:09, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
>> I did not get it either and my domain's email is handled by gmail.  I'm
>> pretty sure I
>> saw where "Home User" (a.k.a. Bill) is a yahoo user.
> 
> Yes, I am a yahoo user.  If it makes a difference, I used HYPERKITTY, not an 
> e-mail client and not yahoo's e-mail browser interface, to post the starting 
> message to this thread, and this reply.

It doesn't matter either way.

If you have a yahoo.com address and send from your email client via
yahoo's email servers, it still goes to fedoraprojects lists server and
sends out from there. If you sent from hyperkitty it sends directly out
from there. The problem is yahoo.com telling everyone that all email
with a yahoo.com addres must come from a yahoo.com email server. In the
case of email lists, this doesn't not happen.
> 
>> Anyway, Hyperkitty does a horrible job of quoting replies.  I've added my 
>> comment,
>> even though I don't use HK, to the ticket.
> 
> Thank-you Ed.  Your comments were definitely better, clearer, than my issue 
> description.  Question: it was your list posting that alerted me that someone 
> commented on the issue.  I received no e-mail that someone commented on the 
> issue.  I would like to be notified by e-mail when someone adds a comment to 
> any of my fedora-infrastructure issues.  I saw no setting related to that.  
> How do I arrange to be notified when someone adds a comment to any of my 
> issues?

Odd... you should get an email anytime the ticket updates automatically,
not sure what is going on. Did you check your spam folder in case it
ended up in there?

kevin



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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[home user]

> On 03/27/18 07:09, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
> I did not get it either and my domain's email is handled by gmail.  I'm
> pretty sure I
> saw where "Home User" (a.k.a. Bill) is a yahoo user.

Yes, I am a yahoo user.  If it makes a difference, I used HYPERKITTY, not an 
e-mail client and not yahoo's e-mail browser interface, to post the starting 
message to this thread, and this reply.

> Anyway, Hyperkitty does a horrible job of quoting replies.  I've added my 
> comment,
> even though I don't use HK, to the ticket.

Thank-you Ed.  Your comments were definitely better, clearer, than my issue 
description.  Question: it was your list posting that alerted me that someone 
commented on the issue.  I received no e-mail that someone commented on the 
issue.  I would like to be notified by e-mail when someone adds a comment to 
any of my fedora-infrastructure issues.  I saw no setting related to that.  How 
do I arrange to be notified when someone adds a comment to any of my issues?

thanks,
Bill.
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Re: "Malformed URL" popup when trying to mount an external drive (KDE)

[Rex Dieter]

PropAAS DBA wrote:

> I'm running Fedora 27 KDE spin, fully updated. Every time I plug in an
> external drive, no matter what file system is on the drive (i.e. a
> windows usb stick, an ext4 external ssd drive, etc) and click "Open With
> File Manager"  I get a popup that simply says "Malformed URL" with the
> only option / button of "OK". The drive does mount, but the error is
> annoying.

It's a known bug being worked-on.
https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=370975

-- Rex
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"Malformed URL" popup when trying to mount an external drive (KDE)

[PropAAS DBA]

All;


I'm running Fedora 27 KDE spin, fully updated. Every time I plug in an 
external drive, no matter what file system is on the drive (i.e. a 
windows usb stick, an ext4 external ssd drive, etc) and click "Open With 
File Manager"  I get a popup that simply says "Malformed URL" with the 
only option / button of "OK". The drive does mount, but the error is 
annoying.



Thoughts?


Thanks in advance

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OT: little help for fixing a spreadsheet template

[Antonio Olivares]

Dear kind folks,

I asked for a little bit of help regarding a spreadsheet sports template.  We 
have a different system than the regular 3 points for a win, 1 point for a draw 
and 0 points for a loss.  In our system we have 3 points for a win(in 
regulation), 2 points for a win(in OT/PKS-penalty kick shootout), 1 point for a 
loss(in OT/PKS), and 0 for a loss in regulation.  There is a website that has 
some nice templates to use and all we need is to cut the competition to two 
rounds only as we play round-robin and we need to modify the existing templates 
to figure this out for us.


http://excel-example.com/templates/sport-tournament-template

In the comments section, the question has been asked in the comments section 
but no replies to that question.  Usually the scores are entered as 

Use 1- first half 2- second half OT1  overtime 1st period, OT2- 2nd Overtime 
period and PKS-penalty-kicks 

Team1  1-0 2-0 OT1-0  OT2-0 PKS-3  
Team2  1-0 2-0 OT1-0  OT2-0 PKS-2

so Team1 wins 1 to 0 in PKS there are 0 goals added to the GF and 0 goals added 
to GA and earns 2 points 
Team2 looses 1 to 0 in PKS and gets 0 goals in favor and 0 goals against and 
earns 1 point 
This should happen for all the games to be played.  We were in a 6 team 
district and now we will be moved to an 8 team district.  
We can open the spreadsheet with LibreOffice and keep using xlsx and/or convert 
it to ods.

Thanks for any help/advice/suggestions.

Best Regards,


Antonio 

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Re: The IPA Server hostname must not resolve to localhost (127.0.0.1). A routable IP address must be used.

[Tim]

Allegedly, on or about 27 March 2018, Peter Bittner sent:
> The IPA Server hostname must not resolve to localhost
> (127.0.0.1). A routable IP address must be used. [...]
> 
> Is there any way to make a local install happen? Or what do I have to
> do instead?

It wants an IP that can be reached by other equipment.  It may be
sufficient to use an address that other equipment on your LAN can
access (like the 192.168.0.0 range of IPs), or you may need a public IP
address.

And if you have a routable IP, your computer's hostname should point to
it, too, not the local loopback IP.  So if your /etc/hosts file looks
like this:

127.0.0.1   localhost localhost.localdomain  hostname hostname.localdomain

Move the non-local addresses out of the 127.0.0.1 information line,
more like this kind of thing:

127.0.0.1localhost   localhost.localdomain
192.168.0.1  mycomputer  mycomputer.example.com


-- 
[tim@localhost ~]$ uname -rsvp
Linux 4.15.10-200.fc26.x86_64 #1 SMP Thu Mar 15 17:14:41 UTC 2018 x86_64

Boilerplate:  All mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
There is no point trying to privately email me, I only get to see
the messages posted to the mailing list.

A positive attitude is worth the effort if it annoys enough people.
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Re: The IPA Server hostname must not resolve to localhost (127.0.0.1). A routable IP address must be used.

[Peter Bittner]

I'm an idiot, sorry. (Wrong mailing list!)
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The IPA Server hostname must not resolve to localhost (127.0.0.1). A routable IP address must be used.

[Peter Bittner]

Hi there,

I'm trying to set up an all-in-one infrastructure system (using Vagrant), which 
included FreeIPA, libvirt and The Foreman, and some other software. The Idea is 
that I (locally) bootstrap such a system that helps users to create their 
definite infrastructure management setup in the end.

Naturally, this entails that FreeIPA is installed on localhost. This, however, 
doesn't seem to work: The `ipa-server-install` script aborts and issues the 
following error message:

The IPA Server hostname must not resolve to localhost (127.0.0.1). A 
routable IP address must be used. [...]

Is there any way to make a local install happen? Or what do I have to do 
instead?

Any thoughts and ideas highly appreciated,
Peter
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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Tue, 2018-03-27 at 00:24 +, Ed Greshko wrote:
> > On Mon, 2018-03-26 at 22:34 +, chicago wrote:
> > 
> > I didn't get the post to which the above is a reply. I can see it in
> > the list archive so perhaps it was sent from a Yahoo account, in which
> > case there is a good chance that Gmail just threw it away, but there
> > doesn't appear to be a way to check if this is the case using the
> > HyperKitty interface.
> > 
> > poc
> 
> FWIW, this reply is coming from Hyperkitty.  
> 
> Bad Kitty, Bad Kitty.  :-) 

Yes, it's really not to my taste at all, much worse than the old
archive interface IMHO. At least the old one didn't try to be a web-
based forum and limited itself to showing archived list messages. This
in my view was a Good Thing and the change of focus is a mistake. I
find it significantly harder to use simply to look up an archived
thread from a specific date, which is what I mainly want it for.

"Do one thing and do it well" seems to have been forgotten.

poc
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Re: HYPERKITTY does not show messages parts being addressed in replies.

[chicago]

>> I didn't get the post to which the above is a reply.

It is just my luck that I'm very good at proving myself wrong. Had I not quoted 
anything (like I initially proposed), people would see just a lone "Thank you, 
Bill" with no context. 

I learned something new. Thanks, hyper kitty :p

Sincerely, 


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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Tue, 2018-03-27 at 12:19 +1100, Philip Rhoades wrote:
> > If enought people scream
> > at google for such an interface, then google /might/ provide such a 
> > cli.
> 
> 
> I won't be holding my breath - there are so many other common-sense app 
> things that Google has not done for years, I wouldn't even bother asking 
> for this . .

This is the main reason I switched to Firefox a couple of months back,
when they released the Quantum version. I find it much better behaved
in general (though it can occasionally start soaking up CPU on some
script-obsessed pages like Facebook it does seem to be less of a memory
hog). YMMV of course.

poc
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Philip Rhoades]

Todd,


On 2018-03-27 15:41, Todd Zullinger wrote:

Philip Rhoades wrote:

On 2018-03-27 12:18, Samuel Sieb wrote:

If you run top, which process is using the CPU?  Just kill that one,
then go through your chrome tabs and find out which tab has the sad
face on it.


That usually doesn't work from my recollection, no individual tab 
seems to
be a problem - it is either Chrome as a whole or a whole window I 
think . .
obviously shutting down all of Chrome fixes the problem . . but it is 
a pain

to gradually re-open all the windows I previously had open again . .


Times like that, 'chrome://restart' is handy.  I use it most
often to pick up updates without waiting for Chrome to see
that it's been updated, but it works well in general.



I will have a look at that but I expect similarly to when Chrome crashes 
with a dozen windows open and with a dozen tabs in each - responding by 
clicking "Recover" to the "Chrome did not shut down properly" message 
seems to be more likely to actually cause the problem I first posted 
about . .  If I have been more disciplined and have had a dozen windows 
open but only a few tabs per window . . it is not so bad . . thankfully 
the "Tabs Outliner" extension helps greatly (although I had to change 
the way I normally worked).


Thanks,

P.
--
Philip Rhoades

PO Box 896
Cowra  NSW  2794
Australia
E-mail:  p...@pricom.com.au
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Re: Killing only selected Chrome windows from the CLI ?

[Philip Rhoades]

Samuel,


On 2018-03-27 15:22, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 03/26/2018 06:53 PM, Philip Rhoades wrote:

On 2018-03-27 12:18, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 03/26/2018 05:59 PM, Philip Rhoades wrote:
but it is not what I want to do - when Chrome goes mad and the whole 
system starts grinding to a halt (I know from experience it is 
Chrome) I want to try and work out what specific Chrome tab or 
window is the problem.  Chrome has its own task manager:


If you run top, which process is using the CPU?  Just kill that one,
then go through your chrome tabs and find out which tab has the sad
face on it.


That usually doesn't work from my recollection, no individual tab 
seems to be a problem - it is either Chrome as a whole or a whole 
window I think . . obviously shutting down all of Chrome fixes the 
problem . . but it is a pain to gradually re-open all the windows I 
previously had open again . .


As far as I can tell, there is one process per tab.  So if there isn't
a specific process that causing the problem, then it must be one of
the core processes and there's nothing you can do but restart the
whole thing.



Yes, it looks that way so far . .

P.
--
Philip Rhoades

PO Box 896
Cowra  NSW  2794
Australia
E-mail:  p...@pricom.com.au
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