Re: 4D and Subversion

[Sandor Szatmari via 4D_Tech]

So using Lutz Epperlein’s vc-framework is the same process?


Thanks,
Sandor Szatmari


















Senior Software Developer
Bristol Capital Inc. - InfoPlus
201 746 7215
www.infoplusonline.com



 From:   Tom Benedict  
 To:   4D iNug Technical <4d_tech@lists.4d.com>, Sandor Szatmari 
 
 Sent:   1/11/2019 5:10 PM 
 Subject:   Re: 4D and Subversion 

Hi Sandor, 
 
> >From what I gather the process is going to be as follows: 
> > 
> >Install component (may need to create directory) 
> >Reboot server (maybe?) 
> >If not installed in start up method open a method and invoke from macro 
> >method 
> >Go to the directory created by the export and add the files to Subversion 
>  
 
I think you have it figured out. Once the components are installed, (yes, you 
can simply create the folder) they should work ‘automatically’. The new macros 
should appear in the method editor window. The export should happen 
automatically each time you save a method. 
 
Lutz Epperlein’s vc-framework includes import, which you may find useful if you 
are doing distributed development or need to branch. 
 
Tom Benedict

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Re: 4D and Subversion

[Tom Benedict via 4D_Tech]

Hi Sandor,

> >From what I gather the process is going to be as follows:
> >
> >Install component (may need to create directory)
> >Reboot server (maybe?)
> >If not installed in start up method open a method and invoke from macro 
> >method
> >Go to the directory created by the export and add the files to Subversion
> 

I think you have it figured out. Once the components are installed, (yes, you 
can simply create the folder) they should work ‘automatically’. The new macros 
should appear in the method editor window. The export should happen 
automatically each time you save a method.

Lutz Epperlein’s vc-framework includes import, which you may find useful if you 
are doing distributed development or need to branch.

Tom Benedict
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4D and Subversion

[Sandor Szatmari via 4D_Tech]

Has anyone implemented version control with 4D methods and forms?  I am not 
that experienced with 4D administration so some guidance would be greatly 
appreciated.  I am familiar with Subversion so once I get the files exported I 
can take it from there.


I read this Tech Note: https://kb.4d.com/assetid=76559 and the attached 
documentation.
I also found on GitHub: https://github.com/4D/vc-framework-v14
I also found on GitHub: https://github.com/elutz/vc-framework-v17 




For the 4D Tech Note: (method export only I believe)
1.  I'm running v15R5 would this work for me?
2.  The documentation says install 'CodeExport.4dbase' in the 'Components' 
folder, but I don't have that folder in my database folder hierarchy.  Do I 
just create it?
3.  Would you recommend adding the macro to launch the component at database 
startup?  If this is not done how do you interact with the 'CodeExport' 
component?  What is the advantage to having it start automatically vs. start on 
use.
4.  The documentation talks about interacting with the 'CodeExport' component 
via the 'macros' menu.  I don't see this in the client or the server UI menu 
bars (macOS platform).  Is the macro menu being referred to the one in each 
method editor window?




For the vc-framework: (method and forms export)
1.  I'm running v15R5 would either of these work for me?
2.  Has anyone used this?
3.  Does it work well?




From what I gather the process is going to be as follows:


Install component (may need to create directory)
Reboot server (maybe?)
If not installed in start up method open a method and invoke from macro method
Go to the directory created by the export and add the files to Subversion





Thanks for any help you can offer,Sandor Szatmari


















Senior Software Developer
Bristol Capital Inc. - InfoPlus
201 746 7215
www.infoplusonline.com

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otherwise exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the 
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or disclosure of this communication is prohibited. If you have received this 
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RE: v13+ self referentail relations

[Chip Scheide via 4D_Tech]

Thanks
On Fri, 11 Jan 2019 17:19:57 +, Timothy Penner wrote:
>> this used to be possible.
> 
> In 2004 and prior, yes... But it is no longer possible starting with v11.
> 
>> what happens when an older structure with a self referential 
>> relation is upgraded?
> 
> It looks like the relationship is removed once you upgrade to v11.
> 
> -Tim
> 
> 
> 
> Timothy Penner
> Senior Technical Services Engineer
> 
> 4D Inc
> 95 S. Market Street, Suite #240
> San Jose,CA 95113
> United States
> 
> Telephone: +1-408-557-4600
> Fax:   +1-408-271-5080
> Email: tpen...@4d.com
> Web:   www.4D.com
> 
---
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RE: v13+ self referentail relations

[Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech]

> this used to be possible.

In 2004 and prior, yes... But it is no longer possible starting with v11.

> what happens when an older structure with a self referential relation is 
> upgraded?

It looks like the relationship is removed once you upgrade to v11.

-Tim



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Re: 4D Structure Export...

[Tom Benedict via 4D_Tech]

Thanks for the response Lutz. 

This is very helpful and increases my confidence that we will be able to 
provide a solution.

Tom Benedict

> On Jan 11, 2019, at 01:14, Epperlein, Lutz (agendo) via 4D_Tech 
> <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Tom,
> 
> The use of the VC_Framework component is completely independent of the 
> version control system. I don't know much about the Team Foundation Server, 
> but in AFAIK it has means to manage the source code. 
> 
> But again, the approach works with 4D and the import functionality of the 
> VC_Framework component, but has two limitations:
> 
> - Performing an additional step after checking out the code from the source 
> code administration. The steps are: 
> 1. you need to open a method that you are sure is not included in the current 
> changeset. This is because you cannot import methods that are already open in 
> 4D.
> 2. Then you need to select the import macro. This will trigger the import 
> method within the component. The rest runs automatically. It is always a good 
> idea to perform a syntax check afterwards.
> 
> - The other thing is that methods cannot be deleted during the import. The 
> automatic export by the component deletes previously exported methods, but 
> the re-import is not able to do this. So you have to do this manually and you 
> have to communicate with your team about deleted methods.
> 
> I would recommend from time to time to use a new central copy of the 4D 
> structure file and to do a re-import. There are so many things besides forms 
> that are not handled by the component, e.g. changes in the database structure.
> We copy the current structure file to certain archive folders on our file 
> server during the build process so that we can use that copy.
> 
> But besides all the problems, we have been using the component very 
> successfully for years. We are used to doing the additional steps now, that's 
> not a real problem, you have to keep it in mind.
> 
> Regards
> Lutz Epperlein
> 
> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: 4D_Tech [mailto:4d_tech-boun...@lists.4d.com] On Behalf Of Tom 
>> Benedict via
>> 4D_Tech
>> 
>> Hi Lutz,
>> 
>> Sorry to bug you again, but we’re moving forward on a project where we are 
>> consulting
>> with a client who is setting up an agile development team to use 4D. They 
>> will be
>> managing this team with Microsoft Team Foundation Server. I’m thinking that 
>> TFS
>> should be able to serve as a repository for the 4D code (methods and forms) 
>> using the
>> VC_Framework component that you have updated.
>> 
>>> We have been doing something similar for some time with the VC_Framework
>> component. The original version of the component doesn't support the 
>> re-import of
>> code so we extended it with an import function for methods. The procedure is 
>> a bit
>> inconvenient, you have to do an additional step (the import) manually after 
>> checking
>> out the code from the versioning system (Mercurial in our case) but it works 
>> flawlessly.
>> We use this workflow and the vc_framework component since 4d V13. Look here 
>> if you
>> are interested: https://github.com/elutz/vc-framework-v17
>> 
>> The part that isn’t completely clear to me is the Build/Release Management 
>> part. I’m
>> trying to figure now is how to link code in the repository to TFS work items 
>> so that the
>> release manifest that TFS produces includes all the methods and forms which 
>> are code
>> complete and validated by QA. In your process, how do you know which methods 
>> to
>> import?
>> 
>> Tom Benedict
>> *
>> *
>> 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG)
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RE: 4D Structure Export...

[Epperlein, Lutz (agendo) via 4D_Tech]

Hi Tom,

The use of the VC_Framework component is completely independent of the version 
control system. I don't know much about the Team Foundation Server, but in 
AFAIK it has means to manage the source code. 

But again, the approach works with 4D and the import functionality of the 
VC_Framework component, but has two limitations:

- Performing an additional step after checking out the code from the source 
code administration. The steps are: 
1. you need to open a method that you are sure is not included in the current 
changeset. This is because you cannot import methods that are already open in 
4D.
2. Then you need to select the import macro. This will trigger the import 
method within the component. The rest runs automatically. It is always a good 
idea to perform a syntax check afterwards.

- The other thing is that methods cannot be deleted during the import. The 
automatic export by the component deletes previously exported methods, but the 
re-import is not able to do this. So you have to do this manually and you have 
to communicate with your team about deleted methods.

I would recommend from time to time to use a new central copy of the 4D 
structure file and to do a re-import. There are so many things besides forms 
that are not handled by the component, e.g. changes in the database structure.
We copy the current structure file to certain archive folders on our file 
server during the build process so that we can use that copy.

But besides all the problems, we have been using the component very 
successfully for years. We are used to doing the additional steps now, that's 
not a real problem, you have to keep it in mind.

Regards
Lutz Epperlein


> -Original Message-
> From: 4D_Tech [mailto:4d_tech-boun...@lists.4d.com] On Behalf Of Tom Benedict 
> via
> 4D_Tech
> 
> Hi Lutz,
> 
> Sorry to bug you again, but we’re moving forward on a project where we are 
> consulting
> with a client who is setting up an agile development team to use 4D. They 
> will be
> managing this team with Microsoft Team Foundation Server. I’m thinking that 
> TFS
> should be able to serve as a repository for the 4D code (methods and forms) 
> using the
> VC_Framework component that you have updated.
> 
> > We have been doing something similar for some time with the VC_Framework
> component. The original version of the component doesn't support the 
> re-import of
> code so we extended it with an import function for methods. The procedure is 
> a bit
> inconvenient, you have to do an additional step (the import) manually after 
> checking
> out the code from the versioning system (Mercurial in our case) but it works 
> flawlessly.
> We use this workflow and the vc_framework component since 4d V13. Look here 
> if you
> are interested: https://github.com/elutz/vc-framework-v17
> 
> The part that isn’t completely clear to me is the Build/Release Management 
> part. I’m
> trying to figure now is how to link code in the repository to TFS work items 
> so that the
> release manifest that TFS produces includes all the methods and forms which 
> are code
> complete and validated by QA. In your process, how do you know which methods 
> to
> import?
> 
> Tom Benedict
> *
> *
> 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG)
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> *
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