Re: signature capture in 4D

[Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech]

browsing their web site,
perhaps you could start by trying their Active X example inside a 32-bit 4D Web 
Area (system, not WebKit),
then 64-bit Web Area (again, system, not CEF), and see what happens.

https://www.topazsystems.com/sigplusproactivex.html

---

if using Active X inside a Web Area is not an option,
I guess you should skip OCX in C++ and go directly to their C library.

https://www.topazsystems.com/sigpluslibrary.html

---

alternatively the PHP example might fit the bill

https://www.topazsystems.com/web.html

notice COM is among "Modules only available under Windows"

https://doc.4d.com/4Dv17/4D/17.2/PHP-modules-support.300-4386501.en.html

I bought a Topaz T-S460 signature capture device to capture signatures with 4D.

https://sigpluspro.com

Do you have successful experience with such a device and 4D?



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Re: Filter MSC Log File?

[Keisuke Miyako via 4D_Tech]

the 32-bit MSC calls XSLT APPLY TRANSFORMATION to convert XML to HTML.

XSLT support was discontinued in the 64-bit product line for various reasons,

https://doc.4d.com/4Dv15/4D/15/XSLT-commands-deprecated.300-2044605.en.html

but technically, you can still use the same XSLT template to get the classic 
HTML output.

I've posted a converter here:

https://github.com/miyako/4d-utility-classic-msc-log

I tend to agree that the XML+CSS solution is not very practical.
I suppose the idea behind it was to preserve the original XML,
which, to be fair, can be processed using various technologies.


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Re: Filter MSC Log File?

[Lee Hinde via 4D_Tech]

Yea, that was annoying to discover. You can still search for the xml tag in the 
source with a text editor. You had a 'warning' in your example. I think the 
other one of interest is ' On Jun 18, 2019, at 3:11 PM, Wayne Stewart via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> 
> wrote:
> 
> That doesn't work because it's a just a visual element rendered in the
> web browser.

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Re: Filter MSC Log File?

[Wayne Stewart via 4D_Tech]

What you need to do is go to the logs folder and open with bbedit or
notepad++ and then search within the xml file

Regards,

Wayne



On Wed, 19 Jun 2019 at 08:11, Wayne Stewart  wrote:
>
> Tim,
>
> That doesn't work because it's a just a visual element rendered in the
> web browser.
>
> Here's an example from verify structure.
>
> MS Edge: http://cthulhu.casa/images/4d/edge.png
>
> Safari:  http://cthulhu.casa/images/4d/safari.png
>
> Here's the XML:
>
> 
> 
>   Attach_Drop : 10 lines
>   
> 
>   Attach_Drop.Page1.List Box : 59 lines
>   
> Referenced style sheet
> not found for this object: Attach_Drop.Page1.File Names ()
> Referenced style sheet
> not found for this object: Attach_Drop.Page1.Listbox Header
> ()
> 
>   Attach_Drop.Page1.Drop Zone () : 60 lines
>   
> 
>   Attach_Drop.Page1.Delete () : 49 lines
>   
> 
>   Attach_Drop.Page1.Import () : 52 lines
>   
> 
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Wayne
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Wayne
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, 19 Jun 2019 at 07:57, Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech
> <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> >
> > Have you tried Ctrl+F (find in page)?
> >
> > -Tim
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > **
> > 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG)
> > Archive:  http://lists.4d.com/archives.html
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Re: Filter MSC Log File?

[Wayne Stewart via 4D_Tech]

Tim,

That doesn't work because it's a just a visual element rendered in the
web browser.

Here's an example from verify structure.

MS Edge: http://cthulhu.casa/images/4d/edge.png

Safari:  http://cthulhu.casa/images/4d/safari.png

Here's the XML:



  Attach_Drop : 10 lines
  

  Attach_Drop.Page1.List Box : 59 lines
  
Referenced style sheet
not found for this object: Attach_Drop.Page1.File Names ()
Referenced style sheet
not found for this object: Attach_Drop.Page1.Listbox Header
()

  Attach_Drop.Page1.Drop Zone () : 60 lines
  

  Attach_Drop.Page1.Delete () : 49 lines
  

  Attach_Drop.Page1.Import () : 52 lines
  





Regards,

Wayne




Regards,

Wayne




On Wed, 19 Jun 2019 at 07:57, Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech
<4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
>
> Have you tried Ctrl+F (find in page)?
>
> -Tim
>
>
>
>
> **
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RE: Filter MSC Log File?

[Timothy Penner via 4D_Tech]

Have you tried Ctrl+F (find in page)?

-Tim




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Re: Filter MSC Log File?

[Wayne Stewart via 4D_Tech]

I always open the files with BBEdit and search the text.

I can’t recall the tag but you need to look for the HTML tag.

On Wed, 19 Jun 2019 at 07:11, Keith Goebel via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
wrote:

>
> > On 19/06/2019, at 7:00 am, Tom Benedict wrote:
> > Is there a way to filter the log file that is generated by MSC? I want
> to only see the warnings or errors and filter out the rest. The log is
> hundreds of pages and scrolling through it looking for warnings is tedious.
>
> Tom, I have encountered this also - it makes checking the MSC results a
> real pain.
> Anyone know why 4D decided to do that?
> Cheers, Keith
>
> **
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-- 

Regards,

Wayne
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Re: Filter MSC Log File?

[Narinder Chandi via 4D_Tech]

Maybe this is too obvious or difficult due to the sheer size of the logfile, 
but would it not be possibly to ingest the log file into a database for easy 
searching? You could maybe use 4D :P

Alternatively, how about feeding it into a log monitoring and analysis service 
such as Splunk, https://www.splunk.com or Loggly, https://www.loggly.com?

Regards,
 
Narinder Chandi,
ToolBox Systems Ltd.
-- 

-Original Message-
From: 4D_Tech <4d_tech-boun...@lists.4d.com> on behalf of 4D Tech Mailing List 
<4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
Reply-To: 4D Tech Mailing List <4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
Date: Tuesday, 18 June 2019 at 22:11
To: 4D Tech Mailing List <4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
Cc: Keith Goebel 
Subject: Re: Filter MSC Log File?


> On 19/06/2019, at 7:00 am, Tom Benedict wrote:
> Is there a way to filter the log file that is generated by MSC? I want to 
only see the warnings or errors and filter out the rest. The log is hundreds of 
pages and scrolling through it looking for warnings is tedious. 

Tom, I have encountered this also - it makes checking the MSC results a 
real pain.
Anyone know why 4D decided to do that?
Cheers, Keith



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Re: Backup and journal file configurations

[Narinder Chandi via 4D_Tech]

Tom,

Yup, you're absolutely right. Without automated testing for larger systems the 
risk of shipping a breaking release must be significant. For an internal system 
that is bad enough - for those shipping vertical market products it must be the 
stuff of nightmares.

I have been trying to digest a lot of 4D articles over the last few and I'm 
sure did come across a passing reference to Quality Assurance Automation 
Services - time to dig deeper into the detail of that, thanks.

Regards,
 
Narinder Chandi,
ToolBox Systems Ltd.
-- 

-Original Message-
From: 4D_Tech <4d_tech-boun...@lists.4d.com> on behalf of 4D Tech Mailing List 
<4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
Reply-To: 4D Tech Mailing List <4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
Date: Tuesday, 18 June 2019 at 22:23
To: 4D Tech Mailing List <4d_tech@lists.4d.com>
Cc: Tom Benedict 
Subject: Re: Backup and journal file configurations

I am very interested in increasing the level of support for automated 
testing in 4D. The larger and more complex the code base, the greater the 
testing burden. It has been my experience that the lack of automated test tool 
support in 4D is a roadblock to code refactoring. The cost of manual regression 
testing can easily exceed the programming cost. At the recent 4D World Tour 
Will Taylor presented a short description of Quality Assurance Automation 
Services. It looks very interesting and very modern (finally!). Details at 
https://us.4d.com/quality-assurance-automation-services.

Tom Benedict


> On Jun 18, 2019, at 11:40, Jim Hays via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> 
wrote:
> 
> Hi Narinder,
> 
> We aren't quite that advanced.  We've mostly built test suites that cover
> key functionality.
> For example:
> Run a bunch of reports to Excel xml, or text files.  Manually check them
> for accuracy, then lock the files.
> Nightly, run the same reports and run diffs on them.  If any differences,
> let us know.
> 
> Jim
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 12:14 PM Narinder Chandi via 4D_Tech <
> 4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
>> Jim,
>> 
>> Hi. I'm curious:
 ...in dev-build-test cycle. This is where we run automated, headless
>> builds and tests with multiple data files...
>> 
>> Are you able to describe this in more detail? I would quite like to learn
>> what kind of build/test can be implemented for 4D.
>> 
>> Having worked quite a lot with PHP frameworks, I have worked with test
>> driven development (TDD) and more recently behaviour driven development
>> (BDD). Have you been able implement anything like TDD in 4D or an
>> approximation? Anybody else care to comment on their experience with 
this?
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Narinder Chandi,
>> ToolBox Systems Ltd.
>> --
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> **
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Re: Backup and journal file configurations

[Tom Benedict via 4D_Tech]

I am very interested in increasing the level of support for automated testing 
in 4D. The larger and more complex the code base, the greater the testing 
burden. It has been my experience that the lack of automated test tool support 
in 4D is a roadblock to code refactoring. The cost of manual regression testing 
can easily exceed the programming cost. At the recent 4D World Tour Will Taylor 
presented a short description of Quality Assurance Automation Services. It 
looks very interesting and very modern (finally!). Details at 
https://us.4d.com/quality-assurance-automation-services.

Tom Benedict


> On Jun 18, 2019, at 11:40, Jim Hays via 4D_Tech <4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Narinder,
> 
> We aren't quite that advanced.  We've mostly built test suites that cover
> key functionality.
> For example:
> Run a bunch of reports to Excel xml, or text files.  Manually check them
> for accuracy, then lock the files.
> Nightly, run the same reports and run diffs on them.  If any differences,
> let us know.
> 
> Jim
> 
> 
> On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 12:14 PM Narinder Chandi via 4D_Tech <
> 4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
> 
>> Jim,
>> 
>> Hi. I'm curious:
 ...in dev-build-test cycle. This is where we run automated, headless
>> builds and tests with multiple data files...
>> 
>> Are you able to describe this in more detail? I would quite like to learn
>> what kind of build/test can be implemented for 4D.
>> 
>> Having worked quite a lot with PHP frameworks, I have worked with test
>> driven development (TDD) and more recently behaviour driven development
>> (BDD). Have you been able implement anything like TDD in 4D or an
>> approximation? Anybody else care to comment on their experience with this?
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Narinder Chandi,
>> ToolBox Systems Ltd.
>> --
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> **
>> 4D Internet Users Group (4D iNUG)
>> Archive:  http://lists.4d.com/archives.html
>> Options: https://lists.4d.com/mailman/options/4d_tech
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Re: Filter MSC Log File?

[Keith Goebel via 4D_Tech]

> On 19/06/2019, at 7:00 am, Tom Benedict wrote:
> Is there a way to filter the log file that is generated by MSC? I want to 
> only see the warnings or errors and filter out the rest. The log is hundreds 
> of pages and scrolling through it looking for warnings is tedious. 

Tom, I have encountered this also - it makes checking the MSC results a real 
pain.
Anyone know why 4D decided to do that?
Cheers, Keith

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Re: Backup and journal file configurations

[Jim Hays via 4D_Tech]

Hi Narinder,

We aren't quite that advanced.  We've mostly built test suites that cover
key functionality.
For example:
Run a bunch of reports to Excel xml, or text files.  Manually check them
for accuracy, then lock the files.
Nightly, run the same reports and run diffs on them.  If any differences,
let us know.

Jim


On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 12:14 PM Narinder Chandi via 4D_Tech <
4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:

> Jim,
>
> Hi. I'm curious:
> >> ...in dev-build-test cycle. This is where we run automated, headless
> builds and tests with multiple data files...
>
> Are you able to describe this in more detail? I would quite like to learn
> what kind of build/test can be implemented for 4D.
>
> Having worked quite a lot with PHP frameworks, I have worked with test
> driven development (TDD) and more recently behaviour driven development
> (BDD). Have you been able implement anything like TDD in 4D or an
> approximation? Anybody else care to comment on their experience with this?
> Thanks.
>
> Regards,
>
> Narinder Chandi,
> ToolBox Systems Ltd.
> --
>
>
>
> **
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Re: Backup and journal file configurations

[Narinder Chandi via 4D_Tech]

Jim,

Hi. I'm curious:
>> ...in dev-build-test cycle. This is where we run automated, headless builds 
>> and tests with multiple data files...

Are you able to describe this in more detail? I would quite like to learn what 
kind of build/test can be implemented for 4D.

Having worked quite a lot with PHP frameworks, I have worked with test driven 
development (TDD) and more recently behaviour driven development (BDD). Have 
you been able implement anything like TDD in 4D or an approximation? Anybody 
else care to comment on their experience with this? Thanks.

Regards,
 
Narinder Chandi,
ToolBox Systems Ltd.
-- 



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Re: Backup and journal file configurations

[Jim Hays via 4D_Tech]

We have an answer for our problem, which might help other 4D'ers.

How to avoid .journal problems in dev-build-test cycle.
This is where we run automated, headless builds and tests with multiple
data files, and we don't want them to hang up looking and asking for
journal files.

1. get data file (just .4DD) from customer (it will always have journaling
turned on)
2. open with 4D Server
3. it asks for journal file - click Create
4. when it asks to do backup now, click Cancel (don't do backup)
5. journal file is not created yet
6. go directly to Database Settings > Backup and uncheck the "use journal"
setting - the journal file won't be created now

Data file is now ready for use within our dev/build system where we don't
want journal files active.

HTH,

Jim



On Tue, Apr 2, 2019 at 3:49 PM Jim Hays  wrote:

> Sorry I have been silent for a week - tied up with other things.
>
> One reason for not keeping backups and logs operating in our dev
> environment is that we often run databases in single user mode, and there
> is no automated backup.  If you do a lot of operations on the data, the
> journal just keeps growing.  I suppose we could put some code in for this
> scenario, to always run a backup when it is shut down, and only keep 1
> backup.
>
> I've found that when we take a copy of a .4DD from a customer, and put it
> on our dev server for testing purposes, the server will ask for the journal
> at startup.
> So the data file knows a journal is in use.
>
> At that point, we need to disable the journal and backup settings.
> If we don't, and then run our automated build and testing system, we run
> into trouble.
> Just moving the 4DB file over to the "build" folder, brings along the
> requirement for a log file, even though the data file used for the build
> had everything turned off before.
> The automated build is interrupted by the UI looking for a journal file -
> you must pick existing, create, or cancel.
> So the structure file also knows a journal is in use.
>
> But there are no controls I know to turn it off programmatically, or by
> some xml setting.
>
> There are also issues if we try to keep all the backup and journal files
> all the time.
> The backup.xml goes with the data.  Each time we get a data file we need
> to get the backup.xml as well, and place it in Preferences\Backup next to
> our structure.
> The backup.xml has a different data file name in it - so in essence, there
> is data information in the 4DB structure folder.
>
> It's quite likely I'm missing something in all this.
> Maybe a good solution for us will be to just triage any data file that
> comes in before we allow it into the "automated" cycle - whether for
> development or testing.
>
> Thanks for listening!
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 25, 2019 at 8:42 PM John DeSoi via 4D_Tech <
> 4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> > On Mar 25, 2019, at 5:11 PM, Tim Nevels via 4D_Tech <
>> 4d_tech@lists.4d.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > When you are moving data files around between systems, just copy the
>> entire data file folder. That will have the .4DD, .4DIndx, .Match and
>> .journal files. If they are all in the same folder you can open that data
>> file with another structure and it will not ask you for the location of the
>> .journal. The key is to have all these files in the same folder and to
>> always move the entire folder between machines.
>>
>> Having the .journal file next to the database file defeats the main
>> benefit of having the journal. If the drive crashes, you could could
>> recreate the database from the last backup and the journal file (assuming
>> both are on another drive).
>>
>> > Now if you copy that datafile folder back to your development machine,
>> you have to copy the .journal file too. I believe .journal file usage is
>> internally stored in a .4DD, so once you have it set up, they must stay
>> together, or you get the messages you are talking about.
>>
>> If your log file is on a second volume in production and your development
>> machine has only one drive, there is no way to automate the restore of the
>> backup without the log file prompts. I also wanted a fully automated
>> restore with no log file or prompts to allow users to test experimental
>> features. This is possible in every database I'm aware of, except for 4D.
>>
>> See feature request from Jeff Kain and other discussion here:
>>
>> https://forums.4d.com/Post/EN/22296877/1/22296878
>>
>>
>> John DeSoi, Ph.D.
>>
>> **
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>
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Options: 

Filter MSC Log File?

[Tom Benedict via 4D_Tech]

Is there a way to filter the log file that is generated by MSC? I want to only 
see the warnings or errors and filter out the rest. The log is hundreds of 
pages and scrolling through it looking for warnings is tedious. 

Thanks for any suggestion.

Tom Benedict
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