Re: [9fans] How to PXE boot with "two" DHCP servers on one network
Marco Feichtinger writes: > How can I pxe boot other machines, without my file server acting as dhcp se= > rver for the whole network? It might be possible, but not worth the effort. And with the blackbox DHCP server in that router, it's likely impossible. If your file server is up all the time, just make it the DHCP server for the network. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T47150b930c3726bd-M66e55b39ec1885bbc552f3f8 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] Plan 9 Foundation is a 501(c)(3)
This is great news, but just before I start throwing money your way, it would be nice to know what you're planning to do with it. Other than the announcements about the creation of the foundation itself, and now this, it as been pretty much radio silence about what you're planning to get up to. Also, what's the difference between plan9foundation.org and p9f.org? --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T2aea913cd8721bea-M79d4c3156be4c671d81a1951 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] 9p.io down?
Yaroslav K writes: > Do we know what=E2=80=99s up with 9p.io, the current sources host? Pings (v4 and 6) to nearby addresses work, so it looks like the host itself is down. -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T1250ef82fbb8d6ed-Mbf332bb9fb0f83f30583f883 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans]
Thaddeus Woskowiak writes: > Has anyone written any code to deal with SCPI, Standard Commands for > Programmable Instruments, on plan 9? I did a couple of years ago, for the same reason: programmable PSUs and to suck data down from an ocsilloscope. It never worked well, and I have since lost the SD card the code was on (I was using an RPi). I would be interested in pursuing this, though, as I have a growing stack of SCPI-aware test gear. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Td89e32ced039912e-M38b28f4cce675b359623c480 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] different users for different system roles
hiro writes: > > should each system role get his own user? > > Like one user for file servers, one for auth, one for venti, and one for = > cpu > > servers. My was has always been to have a file system user and an auth server user that are used ONLY for those roles. As for CPU servers, it really depends on how you use them. The main reason you might want to have different CPU server owners is to control access to physical hardware. E.g. I have machines that are used to control my radios via their serial and USB interfaces. For those, I don't want the "general pupulation" to have access to that hardware, so I run those servers under a userid that is distinct from the "general purpose" CPU server owner. Oh, the Pi I use for bluetooth dev work has its own host owner, for similar reasons. I'm sure there are other cases, but that's the only one where I've personally had a need for multiple host owners. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T690e4304847a34e4-Md4c6b5c3652a1888a1f863c4 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] Update on RISC-V port
Waaay back in Nov 2020 Skip sent a note to the list about some preliminary work on a RISC-V port. Now that my VisionFive-2 dev board has arrived I'm itching to try to get Plan9 running on it. Has any progress been made since that last update? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/starfive/visionfive-2 --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tbe8c3c69c87794db-M330021ff354696dd4fe2bbe2 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
[9fans] man.cat-v.org tls cert
Duckduckgo isn't happy with the above site's tls cert. Did it expire? Or is something more nefarious happening ... -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T2e78a247283470f3-Mbf8b7ba6235d7be1557ceb04 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] Perhaps someone can give me an advice ...
ibrahim via 9fans writes: > While on wait I'm intending to port the freebsd bluetooth stack (netgraph) = > to plan9. I would be surprised if no one started such a project till now so= > if someone shares this goal I would be interested in a cooperative work.=20 Huh. I'd never thought about looking at that ng code as the basis for a port. I wouldn't have thought it's even close to being a natural port, but my netgraph experience is rather limited ... Bluetooth (and BLE) support woould be *very* nice to have. It would be really slick to get my Moolitpass MiniBLE working with factotum. This has been on my todo list for a while now, using USB to connect. I need to do USB anyway to support the older versions of the authenticator hardware. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tdd262593f40f8018-M632ad53f8b0181d6cbd89e8e Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] 9P in Forth
Alex Musolino writes: > Seems so: https://github.com/iru-/9p4 Oh now that's slick! < 200 lines of code. Thanks for the pointer. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T83ca5eda689bd9be-Mc8db77714169537811f62f52 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] building blocks speaking 9p
A short update on the RS-485 network project ... I ordered up an assortment of RS-485 "hats" and USB serial ports to play with. I also have an Axxon LF1006KB PCIe card that will go into the CPU server as the "gateway" for the 485 network. It should already work with the uartpci driver, but I'll have to extend that to add support for the 485-specific card functions. Fortunately Axxon has been very forthcoming with documentation for the card, so this should be pretty straight forward. I decided to take this week off work so I could free up some cycles to get myself orgainized enough to start on this ;-) I need a week just to dig out from under the mess that my apartment has become during lockdown! Mostly I need to (re-)construct a proper Plan 9 environment to base all of this on, so most of this week is dedicated to building CPU and file servers, etc. But just maybe, by the weekend, I'll have a couple of Plan 9 devices chatting over the RS-485 link. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Ta4e584a373b05553-M6753c1dbc56119369a0cc01a Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
[9fans] 9P in Forth
Just curious if anyone has attempted a 9P implementation in Forth? This could be fun to play around with on things like Atmel AVRs. I've had it to -->here<-- with the Arduino programming environment, so *anything* different would be a joy :-) --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T83ca5eda689bd9be-M1239873b63f2d2acc6150554 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
[9fans] Installing 9legacy
I booted 9legacy from a usb image and all is well. But ... how am I supposed to get this installed on the machine's hard drive? I can't find any sign of the installer scripts. -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Tf6db73ba3285a82d-M6728aa5b39eca33f817a6b04 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] 9legacy under OpenBSD's vmm
When you do the initial install, interrupt the boot sequence and type console=0 as the documentation describes. Install the system as usual, then reboot and log in again using the consoole=0 dance. Once you're logged in you can mount the 9fat partition (9fs 9fat) and then edit /n/9fat/plan9.ini to add the console=0 line. The best way to deal with the vm console interface is to mark the vm as 'disabled' in vm.conf and then start it manually with 'vmctl -c start'. This will get you connected to the bios console early enough for you to interrupt the boot process to type those overrides. Once you have plan9.ini tuned to your satisfaction you can change the vm declaration to 'enabled' and let it autoboot. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Te13afbfe31e87665-M2db8c26d4737e829f7ec39c0 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] building blocks speaking 9p
A few thoughts after chewing on this for a day ... I think the major architecture components break down like this: 1) a simple protocol wrapper to enable streaming of 9p over arbitrary transports (e.g. USB, i2c, spi, rs485). 2) an addressing scheme that plugs into dial() and ndb. 3) authentication proxies. 4) device libraries. I think (4) is out of scope for the current discussion, so I won't talk about it further. (1) is the key to the whole thing. We need a consistent way to expose these 9p streams in the kernel in a mount-friendly way. I think the netif/ether kernel framework provides a good starting point, where netif hides (or at least abstracts) the device-specific quirks of the underlying physical medium (e.g. X-Base-T, wifi). In the current case, the netif replacement layer would hide the transport-specific warts of the physical tranport medium (e.g. USB, spi, serial uart). Where it gets interesting is how we address the individual components. E.g. at the "device" layer we need to address specific end-points, such as USB device endpoints, or an i2c chip addresses (for both the i2c driver chip, and the device on its i2c bus we want to talk to). Then above that we should have a way to address the generic 9p stream. Or maybe not -- implementation experience will show if this is required. This naturally leads into (2). (3) gets tricky. Devices not directly connected to a TCP transport can't speak with the auth service. Two ideas come to mind. The upstream "gateway" host could export a namespace that provides just enough to allow the device to chat with the auth service; I haven't thought about how this would work. Another option would be to have the "gateway" provide an auth server relay service that would be part of the 9p streaming encapsulation layer -- basically a 9p bent-pipe proxy to the auth service, listening at a well known "address" within the encapsulation layer. I've been thinking about doing something like this for ages, specifically, to allow me to control a stack of radio transceivers via a collection of controllers wired up to a multidrop RS485 bus. So last night I bit the bullet and ordered up a stack of RS485 interfaces of various shapes and flavours for my collection of Pies, Arduinos, and PCs, with a couple of USB adapters thrown in for good measure :-) When they get here I'll get to work on implementing the RS485 bus layer, and see where it all goes from there. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T18287f976e8461f3-M89dba67665ed6ae12c21e8b4 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
[9fans] aiju boards
> The 9front /sys/src/9/zynq port is aiju board's kernel. This reminds me to ask ... what did people get up to using their aiju boards for? Sadly, mine has been sitting on the shelf collecting dust for much too long. I did some early fiddling about, mostly to learn the fpga toolchain, but then real life got in the way of playing. When I bought the board I had intended to use it for some SDR receiver applications I was thinking about: AIS, ADS-B, DRM, etc. I really should do something about that. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Taa49c8d083b69cc5-M3bba113188df97d72f1f9820 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] building blocks speaking 9p
da...@boddie.org.uk writes: > I am using 5a/tc/tl to build bare metal code for a STM32F405 MCU thanks > to some hints from Charles Forsyth. Could you post some notes on how you're doing that? This is something I'd like to take for a spin. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Ta4e584a373b05553-Mec6e5bd345ad735a072a6cc7 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] building blocks speaking 9p
Bakul Shah writes: > - make it very easy to create hardware gadgets by > providing a firmware/hardware building block that > talks 9p on the host interface side & interfaces > with device specific hardware. Amen! I've been thinking about something like this for years. My specific use case involves controlling radio transceivers. Right now I do this with assorted Arduino hardware that speaks GPIO and RS232 (mostly) to the radios, and RS232 to the upstream "controller" host. This burns through a lot of serial ports on the controller. What I would prefer is to have all those Arduinos connected to an RS485 multidrop, each exporting a 9p filesystem for the control interface. Shoveling the data around on the RS485 "bus" just needs a simple frame wrapped around the 9p packets that provides device addressing and a CRC. On the Plan9 side this just becomes another network type, with ndb handling the device addressing. As others have mentioned, having a native Atmel C compiler would be a real boon here, but there's no reason why this couldn't be done with an Arduino 9P library. I haven't investigated if such a thing exists, although I'm sure it does. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Ta4e584a373b05553-M7e3fd4de0f3c256df6dbd436 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] 9legacy under OpenBSD's vmm
David du Colombier writes: > If it works with 9front, the issue is definitely on our side. > Our Virtio drivers are very close to 9front's, so I suspect > the issue may be somewhere else. If you think that's the case then I need to build out enough local infrastructure to be able to build 9legacy ISOs. Then I can start printfing in the kernel to see if I can track this down. That might take a while, though, as I'm quite hardware constrained right now (thus the attempt at the vmm-based VM). --lyndom -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Te13afbfe31e87665-M0efd869d756a7a4e1bb8945c Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] 9legacy under OpenBSD's vmm
David du Colombier writes: > I think the issue is elsewhere, since I've tried on QEMU with > both Virtio 1.0 and Virtio legacy and it worked as expected > (386 and amd64 kernels). That could very well be. vmm(4) is still relatively young, so the bug could very well be there. I think at this point we've ruled out the 9legacy kernel as the culprit. --lyndom -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Te13afbfe31e87665-Me20a6318a72ff59e0e01703d Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] 9legacy under OpenBSD's vmm
It gets a bit further -- now it actually panics :-P : lyndon@orthanc:/u/vm; vmctl start -c clare Connected to /dev/ttyp2 (speed 115200) Boot failed: not a bootable disk PBSR... F5CD 00B2 Plan 9 from Bell Labsi8042: kbdinit failed no vga; serial console only disk loader cpu0: 5200MHz GenuineIntel Core i7 (cpuid: AX 0x206A1 DX 0x79BA97F) ELCR: 02E8 497M memory: 497M kernel data, 0M user, 18M swap panic: no disks (in #S) panic: no disks (in #S) dumpstack ktrace /kernel/path 80018529 81004b10
Re: [9fans] 9legacy under OpenBSD's vmm
David du Colombier writes: > I've just imported Virtio 1.0 support to 9legacy. > Lyndon, please try the latest CD image and let me know if it works for you. Hah! You beat me to it ;-) ISO downloading now, stay tuned ... -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Te13afbfe31e87665-M400da8e1482489f6e7c74e9c Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
[9fans] 9legacy under OpenBSD's vmm
Are any of you running 9legacy under the vmm hypervisor on OpenBSD? The kernel boots, but complains that it cannot find any fixed disks and panics. I was able to boot 9front, so it looks like 9legacy's virtio drivers might be lagging a bit? --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Te13afbfe31e87665-M70c9221f3a817d77039678ed Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] Alternative to fine-grained mouse usage?
Dworkin Muller writes: > I have physical issues with trying to perform fine-grained mouse > operations (uncontrollable small hand tremors). [ ... ] > So, my question is, are there any viable alternatives for use with Joining the conversation late ... sorry. Have you thought about mounting a server on top of the mouse device that reads the raw positioning data and passes up a running average of the last n positions? Basically, interpose a low pass filter to help remove some of the jitter. I have no idea if it will work -- it just leapt to mind as I sit here breadboarding RC audio filters ;-) --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T716c5aa0e2aa8a27-Mf23265176eb945efe8e0fc8b Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] SFF 9legacy fileserver hardware
Steve Simon writes: > until last year I still had a dual Atom machine which worked nicely but > is a propper desktop machine even though its a mini ITX. I have at least a half dozen mini-ITX boards lying around that I can fall back on. The problem is I seem to have lost most of the cases and/or power supplies for them. Push comes to shove though and I will use one of them if I have to. There's quite a mix ranging from old i386s to a fairly recent and kick-ass 64 bit board that would make a very nice CPU server. Maybe I should just go on a hunt for replacement cases. The problem last time around was that mini-ITX cases were no longer very "mini" ... --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T055ff8c5321ac6a2-M0f04537551518aecfb3633b8 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] SFF 9legacy fileserver hardware
kokam...@hera.eonet.ne.jp writes: > For the usb issue, amd64(9legacy) does not support usb mouse/keyboard, > only ps2 keyboard/mouse. Is there any such machine having PS/2 > interface around? Pretty much everything supports BIOS mapping from USB->PS/2. This is one of the many reasons I was asking for reports only from people who are ACTUALLY RUNNING THE CONFIGURATION THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T055ff8c5321ac6a2-Mf56869e6c40feaac879638b0 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] SFF 9legacy fileserver hardware
hiro writes: > sure you want just one sata disk for a fileserver? or is the worm all on bl= > uray? One disk is fine for now. The blu-ray is for backing up the arenas, and yes, I'll deal with the xhci driver issues myself. (I can use slower USB ports until I get that part running.) --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T055ff8c5321ac6a2-Mb3102df67c15f1260cfc5c38 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
[9fans] SFF 9legacy fileserver hardware
Time to build out some proper infrastructure at home, and the first order of business is the file+auth server. I don't need screaming fast performance, just something basic, and I have been looking at some of the current crop of small form factor desktops, along the lines of the Intel NUC. (But I'm in no way married to Intel.) I'm curious in hearing from anybody ACTUALLY RUNNING on that sort of machine. The spec's I'm looking for are pretty minimal: * amd64 arch. * a gig-E port I can saturate. * SATA-II SSD disk (2.5 inch is fine), preferably that will max out the SATA interface. PCIe/m.2/whatever is okay, as long as it works with the 9legacy kernel, but remember this is a file server, so I want to be able to pack a fair number of bytes into it, making $$$ an issue for non-SATA storage. * >= 16GB RAM. * 2 x USB1/2 (for kbd/mouse), USB-3 for external blu-ray writer. * basic bitmap video (VGA/VESA is fine). Thanks for any feedback you can give! --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T055ff8c5321ac6a2-M94ac21243973cdb00139f06f Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] APL
tlaronde pointed me at the APL that shipped in the contrib directory in 4.3BSD. In hindsight I suspect that was the version I spun up at Athabasca U way back when (1989ish). I was quite surprised to see that a substantial chunk of it managed to compile 'out of the box' on OpenBSD 6.8 (albeit with a flood of warnings :-)): : lyndon@broken:/u/lyndon/src/apl/4.3/usr/contrib/apl/src; ls *.[co] Llx.ca4.c a8.o ac.o ag.c ak.c ao.o ax.c gamma.c a0.c a5.c a9.c ad.c ag.o al.c aplcvt.c ax.o lex.c a1.c a6.c aa.c ae.c ah.c am.c aq.c ay.c tab.c a2.c a7.c aa.o ae.o ai.c an.c at.c az.c xed.c a3.c a7.o ab.c af.c aj.c an.o at.o az.o y.tab.c a3.o a8.c ac.c af.o aj.o ao.c aw.c cata.c y.tab.o Seems like a viable candidate to base the port on. --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T233ff29f045d64a9-Mb2cc2b7e0f346fbbd83e53dd Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] APL
o...@eigenstate.org writes: > git clone --single-branch \ > --branch Research-V4-Snapshot-Development \ I must be blind. I completely glossed over 'single-branch'. But I might have to go back to the SCCS archive on the CDs, anyway, since Spinellis' repo doesn't seem to have preserved the actual SCCS commit messages, just the fact they happened. > On plan 9, hot off the press: > git/clone -b $branch \ I don't have the native git installed yet. This might be enough to prod me into it. Thanks! --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T476a1d7b83269775-Mec7fc82154006da06aee1e82 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] APL
Steffen Nurpmeso writes: > It can even be as small as > > #?0|kent:unix-hist$ du -sh . > 179M. > > when not including all the new FreeBSD things (for which i at > least track the FreeBSD git repository directly): Okay, so what's the magic incantation to clone just that subset of branches? git-clone(1) is not helpful ... --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T476a1d7b83269775-Mdd3b46b53bcc065bccf7b218 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] APL
tlaro...@polynum.com writes: > There are various versions of an APL interpreter and, amongst these, > a version by Ken Thompson, Ross Harvey, Douglas Lanam. > > Is that this one you are looking for? That sounds like the one. It's entirely possible the version I started with came from one of the BSD tapes (we were source licensed so we had the full set of tapes from V6 onwards). I have the CSRG CD set, but it's in a box in a storage locker right now. Is there any chance you could pull the above APL source files and leave them someplace I could grab them from? (9p.io would work fine.) Thanks! --lyndon -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T476a1d7b83269775-M1bad1e99ac35796f23d98c47 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
[9fans] APL
Long ago and far away I built/ran Thompson's APL (from the V7 source tape IIRC) on one of the VAXen. This was very much pre-ANSI C code, but the Ultrix 1.1 compiler handled it fine. About 15 years ago I dusted off the source and started converting it to ANSI C, but I got distracted and have since lost the source. Has anyone here done anything similar. I would really like to have a native APL (even an ancient one like above). If anyone did get it converted to ANSI, a native port could be bootstrapped through APE. Failing that, does anybody have a copy of the original source kicking around? Since the virus is going to keep me locked up for a few more months yet, porting would help pass the time :-) --lyndon P.S. Yes I know there are a million other APLs out there, as well as J and the assorted follow-ons. It's the V7 code I'm specifically interested in. Maybe it's tucked away in the bitsaver archives ... -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T476a1d7b83269775-Md699c49a884f9c671dd08404 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
