Re: [abcusers] Where's Chris Walshaw's page?
John Chambers wrote: http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/ seems to have vanished. For that matter, http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/ doesn't seem to exist, though http://www.gre.ac.uk/ does. Strange. I did notice some time-outs lately, but a 404 is something entirely different of course. I tried to contact him at his gre.ac.uk e-mail address to find out what happened. Let's hope that still works... -- Bert Van Vreckem http://flanders.blackmill.net/ Not all chemicals are bad. Without chemicals such as hydrogen and oxygen, for example, there would be no way to make water, a vital ingredient in beer. -- Dave Barry To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] ABC as Tablature; being my entry in the Obfuscated ABC Contest
I have been trying to transcribe a rather obscure, and as far as I know never-before-transcribed, piece of tablature from a Scottish manuscript of about 1680. The MS gives no clue as to what instrument it's for or what the tuning is, except that it had four strings - the tab is written on four of the five lines of ordinary music paper. Here's the tablature from the MS. This tune only uses the top three strings so that's all I've written. The parens represent a bracket drawn over a group of notes. I don't think occasional bits of horizontal space mean anything, but I've included them anyway. Line break as in the MS. For lute-type tab, a is an open string, then b, c, d,... move down the frets. Not all lute-family instruments use semitone frets: the Skene MS, one of the best-known early Scottish tune manuscripts, is for the mandour, a ukelele-like instrument (usually tuned A,DAda) which was fretted in major pentachords (or at least that's what the tablature describes) and I'm assuming such a system here. Cowgate gigue 2 ---ba---cb--e--|c|-dcbb:||:b dcb--d-|dcb--|c:||:cde--bb(cbabc) -dd|-|-:||:- --b--bcabbbcde--b-|]] a--cde-bbcde--bb-c(abc)a--de--dcbb|]] -cc-cc---c|]] Step one in interpreting this: replace - by x, replace a by A and b by B, make each string a separate voice, and make a plausible guess as to where the midpoint of the second part is: X:1 T:Cowgate gigue M:none L:1/4 V:1 V:2 merge V:3 merge K:none [V:1] xxxBAxxxcBxxexx|c|xdcBB:| [V:2] dcBxxdx|dcBxx|c:| [V:3] xdd|x|x:| % [V:1] xxxBxBxxBcAB [V:2] cdexBBcBABcAxxcdexBB [V:3] ccxx % [V:1] xxxBxBcdexxBx|] [V:2] cdexBBcABcAxxdexxdcBB|] [V:3] xxxccxxxc|] Now we just have to make a guess at the rhythm and the tuning. Without altering any pitch names: X:2 T:Cowgate gigue M:6/4 L:1/4 Q:3/4=100 V:1 middle=G transpose +4 % c string V:2 middle=d merge transpose -3 % F string V:3 middle=a merge transpose -10 % Bb string K:G Minor [V:1] xxx BAx|c2B exx|xxx xx c|xdc B2B:| [V:2] dcB xxd|xxx xxx|d2c B2 x|cxx xxx:| [V:3] xxx xxx|xxx xdd|xxx xx x|xxx xxx:| % [V:1] xxx Bxx|xx xxxx|xxx Bx x|BcA B3 | [V:2] cde xBB|cB/A/B/c/ Axx|cde xB B|xxx xxx | [V:3] xxx xxx|xx xxcc|xxx xx x|xxx xxx | % [V:1] xxx Bxx|xx x xxx|Bcd ex B|xxx xxx|] [V:2] cde xBB|cA/B/cAxx|xxx xd/e/x|xdc B2B|] [V:3] xxx xxx|xx x xcc|xxx xx x|cxx xxx|] which translates as: X:3 T:Cowgate gigue M:6/4 L:1/4 Q:3/4=100 K:G Minor BAG dcB|e2d gEE|B2A G2e |Afe d2d:| ABc dGG|AG/F/G/A/ FDD|ABc dGG |dec d3 | ABc dGG|AF/G/AFDD|def gB/c/d|DBA G2G|] The experimentation which produced that was not too difficult using BarFly, except for that insane numerical transpose notation; keeping the middle= and transpose directives consistent is a huge pain in the arse. Nobody but a guitarist ever thinks of intervals by counting semitones, and in this case (unlike a lute) there is no advantage to be gained by any matching with the tab formalism. The title is the thing about the tune that caught my attention - it's the oldest tune to be named after an Edinburgh street by about thirty years. - Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760 http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack * food intolerance data recipes, Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM Embro, Embro. -- off-list mail to j-c rather than abc at this site, please -- To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature; being my entry in the Obfuscated ABC Contest
Fascinating! I always knew that somebody would come up for a use for the middle directive which involved shifting the notes by an amount different from an octave. The experimentation which produced that was not too difficult using BarFly, except for that insane numerical transpose notation; keeping the middle= and transpose directives consistent is a huge pain in the arse. Nobody but a guitarist ever thinks of intervals by counting semitones, and in this case (unlike a lute) there is no advantage to be gained by any matching with the tab formalism. Transposing by a fixed number of semitones makes sense in the normal situation, where you want to keep the tune in the same mode, but simply have it played in a different key. In this case, what you need is for the program to play the tune as it appears in the music, and there's no way of doing that using a straightforward transposition. Shifting the note pitches by means of the middle directive is like putting a capo on an Appalachian dulcimer - you change the mode as well as the pitch. You can't make your X:2 version play the same as the X:3 version, even though they produce the same staff display. The second part of the tune sounds good, but I'm not convinced by the first part. It's mainly the big interval from g to E which sounds odd. Then again, we're used to hearing tunes composed for the fiddle, where that would be a difficult interval to play. On a diatonically - fretted instrument tuned in the way you suggest it would be perfectly easy, and might have been common in tunes of the day. How many more tunes are in the MS? Does the same logic produce reasonable sounding music from the others? What you really need here is a program which would accept the original tab and convert it to abc given a set of assumptions about the tuning and fretting of the instrument. You could then experiment with different tuning and fretting schemes until you find one which produces consistently meaningful results for all the tunes in the MS. Phil Taylor To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature; being my entry in the ObfuscatedABC Contest
Jack Campin wrote: I have been trying to transcribe a rather obscure, and as far as I know never-before-transcribed, piece of tablature from a Scottish manuscript of about 1680. Always trust Jack to come up with good an unusual music - and interesting challenges :) The MS gives no clue as to what instrument it's for or what the tuning is, ... Hmmm... I may shed some light on that, but first - in case anybody has abctab2ps - here's Jack's original tab translated into abtab X:1 T:Cowgate gigue M:none L:1/4 K:Bmin Clef=french4tab [,d][,c][,b]ba[,d][,][,]cb[,][,]e[,,d]\ [,,d]|[,d][,c][,b]c|[,c]dcbb:|\ |:[,c][,d][,e]b[,b][,b]([,c][,b][,a][,b][,c]) [,a][,,c][,,c][,c][,d][,e]b[,b][,b]bcab[,c]\ [,d][,e]b[,b][,b][,][,c]([,a][,b][,c])[,a]\ [,,c][,,c]bcde[,d][,e]b[,,c][,d][,c][,b][,b]|] --- Now for the instrument: Fifths-tuning seems to be the only one that works. Diatonic frets is pretty obvious too. This almost certainly means it's a small instrument. Diatonic frets create one problem though. I don't know if anybody else spotted the error in Jack's abc transcription. Here's the correct one: X:2 T:Cowgate gigue M:6/4 L:1/4 Q:3/4=100 K:G Minor BAG dcB|=e2d g_EE|B2A G2=e |Af=e d2d:| ABc dGG|AG/F/G/A/ FDD|ABc dGG |d=ec d3 | ABc dGG|AF/G/AFDD|def gB/c/d|DBA G2G|] This doesn't sound very good to my ears at least. There are two possible solutions to that: *Half-frets - The first string has chromatic frets, the other ones diatonic. But this seems to create more problems than it solves, and besides the manuscript seems to be about a hundred years too young for that. So a more likely answer is: *No frets - the player was supposed to know that some of the notes should be fingered slightly lower on the fingerboard. (I don't know of any other examples of French tablature would be used for a fretless instrument, but if it was used (and why shouldn't it?) using the letter a-e for *fingering* seems a very likely solution) So, we have a stringed instrument that: *is relatively small *has four strings *is tuned in fifths *doesn't use the fourth string very much *doesn't have frets *is used for playing jigs *was known and used in late 17th century Scotland Now, what on earth could that be? ;-) Assuming a tuning of GDAE (mind you, it's just a wild guess!) here's what we end up with. (Btw, I've also made a few rhythmic changes to Jack's transcription and halved the note values since 6/8 seems to be a more likely time signature than 6/4 for a late 17th century jig) X:3 T:Cowgate gigue M:6/8 L:1/8 R:jig K:Bmin V:1 dcB fed|g2f bGG|d2c B2g |cag f2f:| |:cde fBB|cB/A/B/c/ AFF|cde fBB |fge f3 | cde fBB|c3/A/B/c/ AFF|fga b3/d/e/f/|Fdc B2B:| X:4 %%tabrhstyle grid T:Cowgate gigue M:6/8 L:1/8 R:jig K:Bmin V:1 dcB fed|g2f bGG|d2c B2g |cag f2f:| |:cde fBB|cB/A/B/c/ AFF|cde fBB |fge f3 | cde fBB|c3/A/B/c/ AFF|fga b3/d/e/f/|Fdc B2B:| V:2 clef=french4tab [,d1][,c1][,b1] b1a1[,d1]|\ c2b1 e1[,,d1][,,d1]|\ [,d2][,c1] [,b2]c1|\ [,c1]d1c1 b2b1:| [,c1][,d1][,e1] b1[,b1][,b1]|\ ([,c1][,b/][,a/][,b/][,c/]) [,a1][,,c1][,,c1]|\ [,c1][,d1][,e1] b1[,b1][,b1]|\ b1c1a1 b3| [,c1][,d1][,e1] b1[,b1][,b1]|\ [,c3/]([,a/][,b/][,c/]) [,a1][,,c1][,,c1]|\ b1c1d1 e3/[,d/][,e/]b/|\ [,,c1][,d1][,c1] [,b2][,b1]|] Frank Nodberg http://www.musicaviva.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature; being my entry in the ObfuscatedABC Contest
Phil Taylor wrote: Fascinating! I always knew that somebody would come up for a use for the middle directive which involved shifting the notes by an amount different from an Seems I got so preoccupied with actual music that I missed a vital point in his posting: I really hope you're not trying to make a new system for tablature in abc that is incompatible with the already existing abctab! Frank Nordberg http://www.musicaviva.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature; being my entry in the ObfuscatedABC Contest
Phil Taylor wrote: The second part of the tune sounds good, but I'm not convinced by the first part. It's mainly the big interval from g to E which sounds odd. I don't know. It sounded odd to me too at first, but now I really like that detail. Then again, we're used to hearing tunes composed for the fiddle, where that would be a difficult interval to play. On a diatonically - fretted instrument tuned in the way you suggest it would be perfectly easy, and might have been common in tunes of the day. The mystery deepens! I more or less stated in a previous post that the fiddle was indeed the original instrument for this tune, but Phil is right: that passage would be really difficult on a bowed instrument. Even so - I can't find a way to correct Jack's typo and retain a musically satisfying result without removing the frets. Does anybody know of a plucked fretless instrument from that period? Or does anybody have a different solution to the problem? Frank Nordberg http://www.musicaviva.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Tune identification
Here's a passage Steeleye Span used as an interlude to All around my
hat. Does anybody know if it's based on some old tune, or is it
something they wrote themselves?
Frank Nordberg
http://www.musicaviva.com
X:1
T:?
R:Jig?
M:6/8
L:1/8
K:C
FC2F {G}FEF|CGEE EDE|FFEF AFA|Fced cdB|
CGcc {d}cBc|GdBB {d}BAB|CcBc edB|Ccde E^F^G|
AA^ce a^ga|Eb^ce dB^G|AA^cA ece|Aa6|]
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