Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[Jack Campin]

> I asked a while ago about drum notation [...]  
> The one thing I'm missing is putting the slashes on the stems of
> the notes.  Obviously, an extension to the code is necessary, and
> I'm even willing to  step outside the bounds of the emerging
> abc standard to accomplish my goal, since my real intention is only
> in creating pretty postscript output, suitable for a tunebook of
> printed notation.

BarFly can do everything *except* typeset the slashed stems, using
its macro mechanism.  You can define how many strokes you want for
a particular trick applied to a note of a particular length, and
the program can be configured to interpret that (or not) for either
playback or score generation.  But what it prints will be fully
explicit, like an 18th century army drum score.


> A notation I propose for my usage (might others find it useful as well?)
> is to put slashes "//" _before_ the note on which I want the slashes to
> occur, since, in my first estimation, they should be unambiguous symbols
> (please correct if I am wrong).

I suggested something slightly different a long time ago - a postfix
* to indicate that the previous note or chord was to be split into two
repeated notes or chords, allowing stacking of *'s to get arbitrarily
many power-of-2 repetitions.  Since this would be in the ABC syntax
rather than in the macro system, a typesetter could interpret it with
the slash notation.  This would save a lot of typing for Beethovenish
drum-with-your-left-hand piano chords - your screen fills up fast when
you've got repeated semiquaver four-finger chords in the bass.

Prefix slashes for this will cause ambiguity.  What does "a//b" mean?

-
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
 * food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files, and my CD-ROM "Embro, Embro".
--> off-list mail to "j-c" rather than "abc" at this site, please <--


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Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[Jean-Francois Moine]

On Wed, 30 Jul 2003 17:29:51 -0400, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[snip]
>The result ps looks surprisingly good, with the exception of the slashes on the stems 
>that I want to indicate a roll.  The note should look like this (pardon the ASCII 
>art):
>
> |
> |
> |/
>/|/
>/|
> |
> |
>  000|
> 0
> 0
>  000
[snip]
>Any thoughts?

There is an example of such a feature in deco.abc:

% -- repeat sign in a stem
%%postscript /repst{% usage: x y repst 
%%postscriptM -3 -13 RM 9 3 RL 0 -3 RL -9 -3 RL fill}!

% -- repeat stem
%%deco / 1 repst 0 0 0

.. !/!c4|

This works for down stems. You must adjust the value before the first
'RM' (rmoveto) when the stem goes upwards.

Then, from this skeleton, you should easily implement other symbols
for 2 or more slashes in the stems.

-- 
Ken ar c'hentañ | ** Breizh ha Linux atav! **
|   http://moinejf.free.fr/
Pépé Jef|   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[Bernard Hill]

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Frank Nordberg
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes
>
>
>John Walsh wrote:
>> Chris Meyers writes:
>> 
>> 
>>>The one thing I'm missing is putting the slashes on the stems of the
>>>notes. Obviously, an extension to the code is necessary, and I'm even
>>>willing to  step outside the bounds of the emerging abc standard
>>>to accomplish my goal, since my real intention is only in creating
>>>pretty postscript output,  
>>>
>> 
>> 
>> There are two solutions here. The first is, as has been suggested, include
>> these as "decorations" e.g. !roll-types!; that could be added into the
>> standard right now. Then alias them with one of the letters H--Z for use
>> in the abc itself.  This might be generally useful, since I gather that
>> these also occur as tremolo markers in string music.
>
>Yes, and they're also used as trill/mordent symbols in early music.

What, the slashed stems?


Bernard Hill
Braeburn Software
Author of Music Publisher system
Music Software written by musicians for musicians
http://www.braeburn.co.uk
Selkirk, Scotland

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Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[Frank Nordberg]

John Walsh wrote:
Chris Meyers writes:


The one thing I'm missing is putting the slashes on the stems of the
notes. Obviously, an extension to the code is necessary, and I'm even
willing to  step outside the bounds of the emerging abc standard
to accomplish my goal, since my real intention is only in creating
pretty postscript output,  



There are two solutions here. The first is, as has been suggested, include
these as "decorations" e.g. !roll-types!; that could be added into the
standard right now. Then alias them with one of the letters H--Z for use
in the abc itself.  This might be generally useful, since I gather that
these also occur as tremolo markers in string music.
Yes, and they're also used as trill/mordent symbols in early music.



Frank Nordberg
http://www.musicaviva.com
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Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[Wil Macaulay]

in addition,Chris your suggested solution would be inadvisable because 
it would be errror
prone:

//C //C
and  
//C//C
look pretty similar, but most parsers use C// as a synonym for C/4

wil

John Walsh wrote:

Chris Meyers writes:

 

The one thing I'm missing is putting the slashes on the stems of the
notes. Obviously, an extension to the code is necessary, and I'm even
willing to  step outside the bounds of the emerging abc standard
to accomplish my goal, since my real intention is only in creating
pretty postscript output,  

   

There are two solutions here. The first is, as has been suggested, include
these as "decorations" e.g. !roll-types!; that could be added into the
standard right now. Then alias them with one of the letters H--Z for use
in the abc itself.  This might be generally useful, since I gather that
these also occur as tremolo markers in string music.
A more elegant solution, which is bound to be done...manana...is
to develop an abc percussion notation, starting from the beginning. This
might be possible, because some presently-used abc notation will be freed
in a percussion clef. The problem, of course, is that it requires someone
who *really* knows about percussion to do this.  Any candidates? (Vicious
circle: Drummers don't use abc because abc doesn't cater to drummers
because drummers don't use...)
Cheers,
John Walsh
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Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[John Walsh]

Chris Meyers writes:

>The one thing I'm missing is putting the slashes on the stems of the
>notes. Obviously, an extension to the code is necessary, and I'm even
>willing to  step outside the bounds of the emerging abc standard
>to accomplish my goal, since my real intention is only in creating
>pretty postscript output,  
>

There are two solutions here. The first is, as has been suggested, include
these as "decorations" e.g. !roll-types!; that could be added into the
standard right now. Then alias them with one of the letters H--Z for use
in the abc itself.  This might be generally useful, since I gather that
these also occur as tremolo markers in string music.

A more elegant solution, which is bound to be done...manana...is
to develop an abc percussion notation, starting from the beginning. This
might be possible, because some presently-used abc notation will be freed
in a percussion clef. The problem, of course, is that it requires someone
who *really* knows about percussion to do this.  Any candidates? (Vicious
circle: Drummers don't use abc because abc doesn't cater to drummers
because drummers don't use...)

Cheers,
John Walsh

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Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[Arent Storm]

From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 
> T:Plain 2/4
> M:2/4
> L:1/8
> K:perc
> %%graceslurs no
> V:1 up
> c|:"7"c{c}c {c}cc-|"7"c{c}c {c}cc-|"7"c{c}c {c}c/Lc/c/c/|\
> [1.2.3. {c}c{c}c {c}cc-:|[2 {c}c{c}c {c}c{c}c||
> 
> The result ps looks surprisingly good, with the exception 
> of the slashes on the stems that I want to indicate a roll.  
> The note should look like this (pardon the ASCII art):
> 
>  |
>  |
>  |/
> /|/
> /|
>  |
>  |
>   000|
>  0
>  0
>   000
This is the perception of a *roll* I am used to ;-) 
I'd suggest that you use a few of the redefinable symbols
(you wont use mordents and the like in percussion do you?)
U: ~ = +roll1+
U: T = +roll2+
U: M = +roll3+
for 1 2 and 3 slashes through. These won't interfere with
the use of / as division. 

Within the interpreteing program, drawing one or more slashes
trough a notestick is very similar as drawing a symbol near it.
BTW,  I think that these symbols ar to be within the new standard
Every notation for mandoline and thelike needs them also. 

Arent

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Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[Bernard Hill]

In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
t>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes
>It feels silly posting this amidst all the talk of standards, etc., but I'm 
>going to post anyway.
>
>I asked a while ago about drum notation (I'm not a drummer, but I'm trying to 
>transcribe the drum music for my Corps).  I have since gotten ALMOST everything 
>I need to do by using the existing functionality of abcm2ps.  
>
>The one thing I'm missing is putting the slashes on the stems of the notes.  
>Obviously, an extension to the code is necessary, and I'm even willing to  
>step outside the bounds of the emerging abc standard to accomplish my goal, 
>since my real intention is only in creating pretty postscript output, suitable 
>for a tunebook of printed notation.
>
>My problem is (and I'm sure many of you will agree that it is only "my problem") 
>that my C skills are pretty minimal (since, obviously, changes to draw.c need to 
>happen), and I don't even know where to start in writing the postscript code to 
>make this happen.
>
>A notation I propose for my usage (might others find it useful as well?) is to 
>put slashes "//" _before_ the note on which I want the slashes to occur, since, 
>in my first estimation, they should be unambiguous symbols (please correct if I 
>am wrong).
>
>Also note that I am abusing the guitar chord functionality to put the number of 
>strokes above the staff where they belong, so my current code looks like this, 
>for the first section of a simple beat:
>
>(Note that there is only 1 line of abc, regardless of whatever line breaking my 
>mail program creates)
>
>T:Plain 2/4
>M:2/4
>L:1/8
>K:perc
>%%graceslurs no
>V:1 up
>c|:"7"c{c}c {c}cc-|"7"c{c}c {c}cc-|"7"c{c}c {c}c/Lc/c/c/|[1.2.3. {c}c{c}c {c}cc-
>:|[2 {c}c{c}c {c}c{c}c||
>
>The result ps looks surprisingly good, with the exception of the slashes on the 
>stems that I want to indicate a roll.  The note should look like this (pardon 
>the ASCII art):
>
> |
> |
> |/
>/|/
>/|
> |
> |
>  000|
> 0
> 0
>  000
>
>So, to make my pickup note in my example a roll using the slashes, how about a 
>notation like this:
>
>//cand if I want 3 or 4 slashes, just put them there, like this:  c
>
>Also, the "7" I put in as a guitar chord is supposed to be the number of strokes 
>for the roll, so we could possibly even incorporate that number into the slash 
>notation, perhaps like this:
>
>//7c
>
>Am I way out there, or is anything like this even conceivable?
>
>I suppose another way of doing the slashes is to use text annotations, perhaps?
>If we could, say, make the literal slashes appear instead of to the left, or 
>right of the note, we could align them with the note, and raise them a certain 
>number of units.  
>
>Any thoughts?
>
>Thanks for reading if you got this far.  :-)
>
>-Chris
>
>Christopher Myers
>em:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>aim: chrismyers001
>
>To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/list
>s.html


The term you describe is called a tremolo, or more explicitly a stem
tremolo. Strings (including guitars and mandolins etc) use it.

In timpani it's called a drum roll and may be notated with tr over the
note rather than the slashed stem.

Ironically it was what I understood a "roll" to mean before I was told
that an abc roll was really a pralltriller and I had implemented it as a
stem tremolo in Music Publisher. :-(



Bernard Hill
Braeburn Software
Author of Music Publisher system
Music Software written by musicians for musicians
http://www.braeburn.co.uk
Selkirk, Scotland

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[abcusers] abcm2ps and 'extras'

[chrismyers]

It feels silly posting this amidst all the talk of standards, etc., but I'm going to 
post anyway.

I asked a while ago about drum notation (I'm not a drummer, but I'm trying to 
transcribe the drum music for my Corps).  I have since gotten ALMOST everything I need 
to do by using the existing functionality of abcm2ps.  

The one thing I'm missing is putting the slashes on the stems of the notes.  
Obviously, an extension to the code is necessary, and I'm even willing to  step 
outside the bounds of the emerging abc standard to accomplish my goal, since my real 
intention is only in creating pretty postscript output, suitable for a tunebook of 
printed notation.

My problem is (and I'm sure many of you will agree that it is only "my problem") that 
my C skills are pretty minimal (since, obviously, changes to draw.c need to happen), 
and I don't even know where to start in writing the postscript code to make this 
happen.

A notation I propose for my usage (might others find it useful as well?) is to put 
slashes "//" _before_ the note on which I want the slashes to occur, since, in my 
first estimation, they should be unambiguous symbols (please correct if I am wrong).

Also note that I am abusing the guitar chord functionality to put the number of 
strokes above the staff where they belong, so my current code looks like this, for the 
first section of a simple beat:

(Note that there is only 1 line of abc, regardless of whatever line breaking my mail 
program creates)

T:Plain 2/4
M:2/4
L:1/8
K:perc
%%graceslurs no
V:1 up
c|:"7"c{c}c {c}cc-|"7"c{c}c {c}cc-|"7"c{c}c {c}c/Lc/c/c/|[1.2.3. {c}c{c}c {c}cc-:|[2 
{c}c{c}c {c}c{c}c||

The result ps looks surprisingly good, with the exception of the slashes on the stems 
that I want to indicate a roll.  The note should look like this (pardon the ASCII art):

 |
 |
 |/
/|/
/|
 |
 |
  000|
 0
 0
  000

So, to make my pickup note in my example a roll using the slashes, how about a 
notation like this:

//cand if I want 3 or 4 slashes, just put them there, like this:  c

Also, the "7" I put in as a guitar chord is supposed to be the number of strokes for 
the roll, so we could possibly even incorporate that number into the slash notation, 
perhaps like this:

//7c

Am I way out there, or is anything like this even conceivable?

I suppose another way of doing the slashes is to use text annotations, perhaps?
If we could, say, make the literal slashes appear instead of to the left, or right of 
the note, we could align them with the note, and raise them a certain number of units. 
 

Any thoughts?

Thanks for reading if you got this far.  :-)

-Chris

Christopher Myers
em:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
aim: chrismyers001

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