Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Linn Klimax DS - Network Music Player
Kris;287620 Wrote: Hi Guys Well I can dispell the myths. I have listened to the Akurate DS Vs The Slim Transporter. I spent a good 2-3 days demoing the Transporter in my system (search on the forum for the results) and concluding that the Transporter, whilst good functionality wise sounded awful. Not musical, very thin and anayltical to the point of being difficult to listen to. I tried the Transporter with two DAC's also A Musical Fidelity Xdac V8 the Bel Canto DAC3 - two very good dacs. The results were pretty vague to be honest. The MF colored the sound the most, the Bel Canto sounded almost 100% identical the the TP DAC. Result was, the Transporter DAC was as good as either the MF DAC or the Bel Canto DAC. So, I walked away unhappy. None of the combinations failed to impress me. I was using my Musical Fidelity A5 Integrated Amp (@ $4,000 AUD) with my JM Lab Electra BE Speakers (@ $6,000) so I had some fairly decent other components. I then listened to the Akurate DS with the Majik I integrated Amp ($4k 2 x 100watts) I can say without any doubt, the Akurate DS with the Majik amp BLOWS AWAY ALL COMPETITION. Nothing I've heard sounded this good. The results were STUNNING! It was detailed, musical, very fast, lots of bass - it had everything music should have. Incredible sound stage, the lot.. my gf and I were left speakless after the demonstration. The transporter has nothing on the DS. Fact. Unfortunately you listened in two different systems, one of which was probably not in your normal listening room. So your review is pretty meaningless, sorry You can be very very sure that the difference between rooms and speakers and amps is greater than the difference between digital source components of this level. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=38815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Linn Klimax DS - Network Music Player
harmonic;264242 Wrote: I atended a klimax demo yestoday and alot of the questians asked here was answerd. [...] The system was unfamiliare to me so its hard to describe have it really sounded. But the sound had that special kvality the sondek lp12 SE with the current full specs have, where it seems to pull out so much more detajls in the lower bass regions then what im used to herer from other systems. [...] When i got home and tried to listen to the same recordings whole notes seems to be missing in the bass regioons. You apparently fail to understand that the two greatest influences on a hifi system with a competent digital source that costs anything more than a few hundred pounds are: (1) the speakers and (2) the room. It's pointless to make a comparison like this unless those elements of the test system are at least fairly close to your home setup. This is why I almost always upgrade my hifi by buying equipment (second hand or at keen new prices), using it in my home for a few weeks alongside the old kit and then selling the item that I rate as worse. It's also pointless to spend DS kind of money on a digital source until you have at least spent $20k on speakers and some time and effort in sorting out your room acoustics. You will get a far bigger bang for your buck at that end of the system. THIS is why my speakers cost 6 times as much as my digital source (Squeezebox and Benchmark DAC1). Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=38815 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BW 802D Speakers. Tempted.
haraldo;26 Wrote: I reckon it's difficult to discuss such speakers without bringing the power amplifiers into the loop. Does anybody know which amps the famous UK studios are using? I have read that some studios are using very expensive Chord Poweramps, while I have also heard about Electrocompaniet Nemo. The reasoning behind this, from me, is that I reckon it's not possible to get the full benefit of the larger BW without powerhouse amplifiers. When I auditioned the 802D they were driven by quite expensive / large Classe poweramps, and they were just not able to make the speakers come alive. If you're auditioning speakers, perhaps you should also bring your own amplifier, if possible. It's a significant factor in the equation I bought speakers 15 years ago realizing afterwards that I didn't have the amplifiers to run them properly, that's not much fun. Some reviewers actually use Large Krell amps (like FPB-600cx) when reviewing $1500 BW speakers. No one would use such a setup in the real world An example: the Quattro Wood, will obviously be much easier on the amps because it's got a powered subwoofer and a passive high-pass filter in the signal path before the power amplifier. This makes a significant difference. Regards -H Chord and Bryston are popular amps in the mastering world. Not cheap. But having active speakers like the ATCs solves this drive problem and eliminates a source of distortion (the passive crossover). Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=42808 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BW 802D Speakers. Tempted.
Phil Leigh;264361 Wrote: I'm not disagreeing - commercially, you have to eat your own dogfood... But my point really was that if you can create well-balanced masters then the speakers are fundamentally OK. The sound on these CD's is not just to do with compression (they use plenty, especially on vocals!) or the agreed abscence of brick-wall limiting, but also the quality of the end-to-end recording chain. Anyway, Linn/Naim was just an example. Abbey Road has been all over BW for years and no-one complains about their masters - they are held in high esteem. I'm not a big fan of the BW sound by the way - except for the Nautilus which is just...wow! [...] A good mix makes mastering much easier. Re. Linn/Naim, I was talking about master buss compression rather than track compression. I think you will find that one thing that distinguishes the Linn/Naim approach is the relatively small amount of compression across the main stereo buss either in mixing or mastering. Abbey Road is more famous for recording and mixing than for mastering, I would say. I realise that they also have mastering and surround mastering facilities, and that they mainly use BW Nautilus 801 and 802 (although they have Questeds as well). They wouldn't use bad speakers, even if they got them for nothing. BW are good speakers but I think the active ATCs are possibly better and certainly more convenient in a domestic context (no need to house some mega amps in the system to cope with the hard load). Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=42808 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lavry DA10 DAC: Subjective Impressions and Listening Tests (Long)
I own and use both the Lavry DA10 and the Benchmark DAC1. They are very close in performance (both are very good). Close enough that you could probably choose between them on the basis of features - and I have evaluated them through two fairly critical systems with accurate active monitor speakers. Positives for the Benchmark over the Lavry, in order of importance to ME: 1. You can mute the main output on the BM while still having control over the headphone volume (with the Lavry you need to physically turn off the speakers/ amps if you want to do headphone-only monitoring) 2. The BM has standard RCA phono plug outputs as well as XLR outputs - this is useful flexibility meaning it can be used either as a preamp direct to the monitors (with XLR) or via a conventional consumer preamp (over the RCAs) 3. Analog volume control knob on the BM is nicer to interact with than the Lavry's click thing (but less accurate in setting a repeatable level) 4. Two headphone outputs on the BM rather than one on the Lavry can be useful. Positives for the Lavry over the BM, in order of importance to me: 1. Sound quality is marginally better/ more refined (but you would need a good room and better speakers to tell the difference). 2. Digital volume readout is helpful for mixing and pre-mastering to ensure that I work at consistent volume levels. 3. Front panel display of sample rate has proved useful in eliminating a problem with the digital input setup (some hidden resampling that was going on to a signal leaving a PC). 4. Front panel mono switch can be useful in checking for mono compatibility of mixes (but the stupid inverted polarity state annoys me every time I look over there - why didn't Dan go with pin 2 hot like the rest of the world!). 5. The Lavry doesn't have the armor-piercing blue LED that Benchmark put on the front of their DAC1 (and that I had to cover with a piece of black tape!). Overall, I think the BM probably sits more easily in a domestic hifi environment, whereas the Lavry is a marginally more useful tool in a pro audio environment. There are plenty of pro audio mixing and (especially) mastering studios that use the BM though, so you shouldn't feel that you are being proletarian by going down the BM route. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=42797 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BW 802D Speakers. Tempted.
GuyDebord;263886 Wrote: [...] The truth of the matter is that a lot of mastering is done in a lot of parlance sources including headphones; you said it yourself, Spendor, ATC, Linn and I can add AE's, Dynaudio, Tannoy and so many non audiophile brands, plus double the variety in selecting passive or active monitors. And lets not forget that normally professional monitors cost less than many high-end audiophile monitors. [...] Sorry Guy, I have to pick you up on this. Perhaps you are confusing mixing with mastering. I have never seen or heard of anyone mastering on headphones. Occasionally people may mix or mix-check on headphones. But mastering is a very separate and serious discipline, carried out in highly refined audio environments (lots of acoustic treatment, minimal equipment and distractions, built for the task) on FULL RANGE LOUDSPEAKER SYSTEMS. Mastering is instructive for hifi hobbyists since it is a closer approximation (than mixing) to what they might want to achieve with their own systems. The first lesson from mastering should probably be the importance of improving the listening room environment rather than fiddling with cables and power leads! The speakers used for mastering are often those available at the high end of consumer audio: the big BWs, ATCs, PMCs, Tannoys, Eggleston (I have never heard of a mastering studio using Linn or Naim but I concede that it is possible). Sometimes these are actively driven and sometimes passively with expensive hi-fi type amps made by people like Bryston, Chord and Pass Labs. BW 8xx series are serious speakers and 802s are used for mastering for reasons other than simply the brand name. I agree that they may not be the best value, particularly when combined with a suitably powerful amp, which is why I often suggest people listen to the active ATCs as an alternative. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=42808 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] BW 802D Speakers. Tempted.
Phil Leigh;263952 Wrote: Andrew - the Linn and Naim labels use their own speakers...and their CD sound quality is generally accepted as top notch. I was assuming that was the case - and also discounting it as a special case (a rather biased endorsement). The reason for the high technical quality of the Linn and Naim recordings (I own several of each, not least since I am a former Naimee) is the recording techniques used and the lack of squashing compression applied to the master buss, so that the music still has proper dynamics. I don't think this has much to do with their choice of mastering speakers. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=42808 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Doh! Now we need 24-bit/176.4kHz on the Transporter!
Eric Seaberg;255374 Wrote: I've been in the recording business for over 36 years and have been through all of the stories with the old 'classic' recording consoles where engineers claimed they could hear the 'air' above 25kHz, and maybe you can... but that's a lot of data pushing through your DSP. If the new 'standard' would shift to 24-bit from 16-bit you'd hear a LOT more of an advantage for the extra data throughput. MHO... This is EXACTLY right! I feel like posting it every time someone gets excited about high sample rates and ignores the fact that what is really important is the bit depth, not the sample rate... You don't have to have spent very much time recording and mixing audio to realise the point. I would take 24/44 over 16/192 every day, and 24/44 is much more efficient in terms of saving data space. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=41824 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] HD Music Downloads from iTrax
jaysung;236423 Wrote: Hi, exciting idea. How will you cope with copyright protection? wma with drm? Then I wouldn't be interested. BTW.: All the fuzz about 24bits and 96khz is to be considered with caution. There is a quite lengthy thread here and it basically states that it is hard to hear the differences. Sure a pulse/square wave at 2hz is being degrated to a sine wave for lack of samples but again who cares. I would be happy (or perhaps not) when I'd hear that ultra high frequencies. My hearing maxis out at 15khz and I am 24 years old. Imagine being 50 or 70... I sell my hifi stuff at some point in the future ;). But for now I think if you offer 48khz and 16 or if you like 24 bits I would be up for a beta test. Ah, yep. FLAC!!! I wouldn't want any windoze codecs to polute my archive! ;) And I would like to throw a glance on your web site and check if it is readable by blind persons. It is (yes indeed) possible to do an online shop without flash and even javascript mouseovers and animated gives that do reapoint GWB. Cheers Jeronimo PS.: Web site looks OK for an initial glance. From my experience of recording, the 24 bit part (vs 16 bit) is FAR more important than the 96kHz (vs 44 or 48) part of the specification upgrade. I can certainly hear the bit depth improvement but have trouble hearing the sample rate improvement - it's a waste of storage space in most cases. The majority of wiser heads (and ears) than mine are in agreement, I believe. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=34870 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: [SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Lavry Da10
ErikM;218965 Wrote: Totally agree! I agree too - which is why mastering rooms are sometimes deliberately wired unbalanced (unlike mixing studios which are almost always balanced). Andrew (PS - despite my sig I have another setup with the DA10 feeding a pair of active ATC10s, and it does sound very good, as it should...) -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=34569 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
Re: System Balancing � - your thoughts please
Here's mine (new prices but I bought most of it second hand or ex-dem): Sources: SB3: £180 + DAC: Benchmark DAC1: £650 pre: ATC CA2 £850 amp/speakers: ATC SCM50A £7500 It's well-balanced! Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=34849 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Active Speakers for Conservatory
You could get some used ATC SCM10A-2s for about £800. Fabulous active speakers. They also have permanent tough grills on the front if you are concerned about kids. But they may look a bit modern for a conservatory: +---+ |Filename: eqscm10a-ca2.jpg | |Download: http://forums.slimdevices.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1998| +---+ -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=29665 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Transporter question for the CEO
Phil Leigh Wrote: Hmmm, Naim CDX not really that good I'm afraid... It's not bad - but I owned a CDX, then a CDX with the XPS external power supply, then a CDS2 - and sold them in favour of the vastly cheaper DAC1 (used with a variety of cheap CD players and now with the SB3). The CDS2 is pretty good - smooth and analogue but still detailed. But it is a generation behind the DAC1 in terms of DAC technology and it shows. IMHO Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=25783 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: I need a DAC !
pfarrell Wrote: Mike Anderson wrote: ModelCitizen Wrote: I'd be wary of the Benchmark myself (and possibly any oversampling DAC). Some people think they sound clinical, cold, flat, lifeless and two dimensional. Who says that? I love my DAC1, I don't think it sounds clinical, cold, lifeless or flat at all. I love mine as well. I bought it for my recording studio, and it compares well to the 24/96 16 channel unit I have in the studio. I connected it up to my audiophile stereo just as a test, and it is still there. I don't associate any of the adjectives ModelCitizen uses with it. Detailed, you bet. -- Pat http://www.pfarrell.com/music/slimserver/slimsoftware.html And I love my DAC1 too. You can get one for around £700 new in the UK. If you want a mellower DAC then I think the Meridian 203 DAC is very good value (about £120 used from eBay and elsewhere). Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=25690 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Benchmark DAC1, the next step ?
holmsn Wrote: Wow !, what a year !, after initially purchasing a SB to evaluate it for possible in vehicle use ( with MP3's etc) I tried a FLAC rip quite casually on my old home system , including an Audiolab 8000A amp which you folks in the US might have heard of :) and was immediately impressed despite not listening intently or anything as I wasn't expecting a great deal. Now after getting hold of some Spendor S5E's and listening , still with the SB3 Analog o/p's to the system, can it get any better if I get a Benchmark DAC1? Yes it can, if the rest of your system is up to that standard. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=23871 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Active speakers for a large room to replace Quads
Jonathon Wrote: The Quads when standing in the subs DO certainly make a statement - and you are not going to miss them when you go in a room. One of the reasons for the poor WAF behind the need for change. Do you need a DAC between the SB and a speaker - what are people's opinions and if yes, what are people using? Is the digital feed not of sufficient quality to go straight into the Meridians? Not being familiar with the ATCs - do they take a digital feed or analogue? Thanks (again) The DAC would be irrelevant for a speaker with a digital input like the Meridians (if that's what they have). The ATCs take an analogue feed (using an XLR connector, which is a professional audio connection) so you could use a DAC in front of them if you wished. I do so, although the analogue out from the SB3 is really pretty good. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=23172 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Poor listening environment, any point upgrading?
As I'm sure Pat realises, it is all more complicated than this with respect to delay etc. 10ms is a very tiny delay which may slightly thicken the music if you were doing it with two sets of speakers pointing at you, one delayed and the other not. But there are other more significant effects at work with traditional loudspeakers. Firstly, the sound radiating backwards from the speakers will contain very little of the higher frequency information since this is all beamed forwards from the speaker. In the tweeter range (say above 3.5kHz) you will probably be at least 25dB down if you are 90 degrees off axis. So as far as a reflection from the rear wall is concerned (up to 180 degrees off-axis) you can pretty much forget it. However in the bass frequencies (say sub-200Hz) the sound is far less directional and you will have little loss at 90 degrees and although there will be some loss directly behind the speaker there will still be plenty of bass energy there. Which is one reason why the bass tends to be the obvious problem when speakers are too close to rear walls, whereas the problem in the treble and upper mid frequencies (which affect imaging) is more often the result of side wall (or side cupboard!) reflections since they are receiving sound at perhaps 45 degrees off axis. This directional higher frequency effect is another reason why toeing in speakers can often improve imaging/ treble response. By toeing in the speakers you are making the side walls more off-axis to the speakers than they were previously and therefore you are reducing the amount of higher frequency sound that is hitting the walls and able to refract from them. The same effect can be achieved by using acoustically absorbent materials on the walls, of course. Again these will have differing effects at different frequencies. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=22717 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Poor listening environment, any point upgrading?
The Aegis 3s are quite well known for having a boomy bass. This will be accentuated because they have a rear port and you have placed them too close to the wall. If you can't move them out from the wall then you could try placing a pair of rolled up socks into each port (seriously). This may help tighten things up a bit. Also make sure that the spikes are well seated into the floor. If you would like to throw money at the problem and don't mind buying second hand then you cannot do better than a pair of Naim SBLs which are designed to go right up against a solid wall and will not boom at all. They are available used for around £500 a pair and will be in a different league from your current speakers in terms of transparency, accuracy and pace. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=22717 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Sonic Impact Super-T amp with SB - speaker choice?
Willie B Wrote: What do people think of the little sonic impact super-T amp? It has had some great reviews and is very inexpensive (£120 approx i UK)? I am thinking of hooking one up to a modified SB but would welcome advice on speaker choice given the relatively low power of the amp. Off to work soon but will be back online tonight Looking forward to advice and comments Willie B It depends on how far you will be sitting from the speakers. I use a T-amp with a pair of JBL Control 1 speakers with my PC and an external RME soundcard (=high quality) and the combination is really good. Will produce good volume for a small/medium sized room like a typical bedroom or study (and this is with the T-amp volume at the 12 o'clock setting for maximum sound quality). The Control 1s are great value little speakers - about £50 per pair in the UK from various eBay seller. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=22678 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Audiophiles, help out a noob.
Here is what I use on my PC (through an external soundcard that costs more than the Squeezebox). It is a VERY cheap and compact but good quality solution. Sonic Impact T-Amp; Pair of JBL Control 1 monitor speakers You could pick up the whole lot for about $130. Even with the T-amp turned up to just 10 o'clock there is plenty of volume for medium sized rooms. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=22012 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB-3 and external DAC
I was using cheapo optical in, plus Stereovox HDVX coaxial in and nice quality (but not audiofool) XLR cables out made from Van Damme/Neutrik bits. It is possible that the characteristic colorations of the 'briks are making it hard to notice the differences. In which case you shouldn't worry about the external DAC... I used to own a 52 and it is a great preamp. The 250 (which I also used to own) is fine too but the 'briks like lots of power and they are going to give you less distortion and better dynamics run active. But you would need two more stereo amps plus the Aktiv (sic) crossover. The arguments in favour of active operation are set out nicely on page 2 of the Aktiv manual: pdf: http://tinyurl.com/rewcr Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=17948 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB-3 and external DAC
highdudgeon Wrote: I'm wondering how many people have done careful listening comparing the Squeezebox with and without a high-end external DAC? IE, is there much benefit to be gained? Little? None at all? Personally, I think it sounds quite good. I do have a re-clocking DAC on order. Comments, thoughts. Also, comments and thoughts on an external power supply? Worth it? And, surely, there must be a commercial unit available that would be cheaper than one of the audiophile versions (ie, Boulder, etc.). Yes, I have tried the SB3 with and without a good DAC and the difference is fairly clear in a revealing, highish end system (my speakers are $8,000 professional monitors). The Benchmark DAC1 was ahead of the analogue outputs of the SB3 in terms of detail retrieval and perceived depth/ solidity (hard to find the right words). For me the more interesting question was whether there is a difference between using a CD player as a transport and using the SB3 as a transport. I concluded that the answer was little or possibly none. See here: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showpost.php?p=77259postcount=19 Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=17948 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB-3 and external DAC
pfarrell Wrote: On Mon, 2005-11-28 at 22:22 -0800, Brad Smith wrote: I want to jump in here with a more beginner level question... Beginners always welcome. But be warned, this can be an adiction when you are referring to an external DAC, I assume you mean using the optical out to process it by another device, such as a receiver. When audiophiles talk about an external DAC, they mean an external box that just does Digial to Analog Conversion. Whether the optical or SPDIF wire is used is a separate issue. [snip] HTH -- Pat http://www.pfarrell.com/music/slimserver/slimsoftware.html I think you mean optical or coaxial. SPDIF is a digital format, not a physical connection type. So both the optical and coaxial outputs are likely to be SPDIF format in most digital outputs on consumer electronics(there are other professional formats). Sorry to be picky. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=17948 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: What Amp and Speakers Are You Using?
cliveb Wrote: Mike, can you elaborate on your experiences with the DEQ2496? I was interested in this device to try and smooth out some minor bass humps dips in my room, but after posting a question in rec.audio.pro (where many professionals hang out), got the impression that at best it might improve matters in a single sweet spot while making things worse elsewhere in the room. While I'm here, may as well contribute to the poll. Mine is a truly minimalist setup: SB2 analogue output directly feeding a pair of ATC SCM100A active monitors. Nice speaker choice... when I get minimal then I run mine off the variable output of the DAC1 - but I still have other sources to deal with. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=21643 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB-3 and external DAC
pfarrell Wrote: Patrick Dixon wrote: I think you mean optical or coaxial. SPDIF is a digital format, not a physical connection type. So both the optical and coaxial outputs are likely to be SPDIF format in most digital outputs on consumer electronics(there are other professional formats). My understanding is the S/PDIF (Sony/Philips Digital Interconnect Format) specifies a 75R coaxial cable and phono connectors. The optical version (which uses the same data formatting) was developed by Toshiba and is commonly called Toslink. That was my understanding as well, I also could be wrong. Phono or is it really supposed to be BNC? (since it is hard if not impossible to stay 75 ohm with RCA) I am also pretty sure that the AES/EBU is essentially the same digital bitstream over XLR connected three wire cable. AESS/EBU obviously doesn't even have the silly consumer anti-fair use flags, but most consumer gear can be set to ignore those flags anyway. -- Pat http://www.pfarrell.com/music/slimserver/slimsoftware.html There is an explanation here: http://www.answers.com/topic/s-pdif S/PDIF is specified as an RCA connector but has an optical alternative also within the S/PDIF standard. The optical alternative is known as Toslink (Toshiba link) but uses the S/PDIF rather than the AES/EBU standard as far as the control bit is concerned. But it is common to call the RCA connector version of S/PDIF SPDIF and the optical connector version of S/PDIF Toslink. The more important difference is between AES/EBU (which has a much higher voltage electrical interface) and S/PDIF. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - ATC CA2 pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=17948 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: piano solos
Murray Perahia's version of Goldberg Variations is superbly played and recorded. This is the version that finally made me understand what they were all about. http://www.sonyclassical.com/music/89243/index.html Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=20611 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB3 - Benchmark DAC-1 versus Analogue Out
P Floding Wrote: A word of caution though: Just hooking up something to you hifi is most likely to alter the sound of the system, regardless of wether you are listening to it or not! The only exception is hooking up things via optical. (Although there is still a possibility that the pattern of sound-induced mechnical vibrations throughout you DAC can alter depending on what is hanging from it's back!) I can easily switch my system from serious high-end with sound you can listen to all day, and which really swings to somewhat fatiguing, lacking in excitement and dynamically compressed just by plugging in my A/V preamp to the analouge inputs on the high-end pre! (Admittedly, in this case, via long RCAs. But the effect is also there for other equipment with shorter cables.) Yes, but I did my tests with simultaneous alternate connections into and out of the DAC1. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=19850 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Recommended inexpensive Linear PSU Wallwart for SB3?
ModelCitizen Wrote: Sorry to subvert the thread but. I'd be very interested to know what you think of the SB3/2 with the Dac 1. I have one and still the sound does not match the Naim CDX CD player. In comparison the SB output is cold, thin, flat and uninvolving. The Naim drags you into the music but the SB/Dac 1 leaves you talking to the other persons in the room. It's very detailed though... it just does not sound as lovely as the CDX. For me. MC I've owned a CDX, CDX+XPS and CDS2 + XPS. I have run the first two through a top end Naim active SBL system (52 preamp, 250 etc) and the last into that system and then into my (much better) ATC active system. I then replaced the CDS2 with a DAC1 and old Meridian CD player. The CDX is a good CD player, even by modern standards. It is particularly lively and involving, with a punchy sound. Adding the XPS to it gives you more of the same, with a bit of added weight and definition. The CDS2 is entirely different in approach: much more organic and analogue sounding. At first you think it has smoothed everything over and lost details but then you realise that all the detail is there, it's just very well integrated. It's a fine CD player but then it should be since it was over £7k new (and is still around £3k on the used market). The DAC1 is a more truthful device, especially in the lower mids which the Naims overemphasise, and is also more detailed, has a bigger soundstage and is better at the frequency extremes. It is not in the least thin or flat-sounding to my ears. It is less warm than the Naims but gives you more of what is on the CD (or server). What's the rest of your system? Are the speakers perhaps to blame? Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=19452 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB3 - Benchmark DAC-1 versus Analogue Out
to keep ripping through my CD collection. It's a great device, well implemented. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=19850 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB3 - Benchmark DAC-1 versus Analogue Out
ezkcdude Wrote: I thought the DAC-1 is supposed to remove jitter through a combination of buffering and re-clocking. If that is the case, shouldn't the digital signal be perfectly reconstructed in either case (toslink or coax)? This doesn't jive well with what I've been thinking, if you truly do hear a difference. Theoretically, it shouldn't be possible. I was similarly surprised with my result. Although the difference was very slight, I DO think there was a difference. But it wasn't a proper DBT so perhaps I was imagining it. In contrast, the difference between the output from the SB3's DAC and the output from the Benchmark was quite marked, as I describe above. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=19850 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB3 - Benchmark DAC-1 versus Analogue Out
ezkcdude Wrote: I can believe the comparison between different DACs. If you do indeed hear a difference going through the DAC-1, though, either you're ears are wrong, or the Benchmark literature is wrong. Either is of course possible. I'd be inclined to believe the manual, although I suppose it is conceivable that the optical cable was somehow so awful that it degraded the sound. Anyway, the key point was that the DAC1 was better than the DAC in the SB3 by some margin - just in my opinion. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=19850 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: SB1 digital out compared to SB2 and SB3
pfarrell Wrote: :[color=blue] Humans have evolved for a long time to pay critical attention to phase and frequency. It meant telling where the lion was. But audiophiles also love tube gear, which any engineer knows has bad bandwidth (aka rolloff, aka warmth) and all sorts of intermodulation distortions. I'd love a cite to some science or engineering about the meaning of jitter at audio frequencies or redbook data rates. -- Pat Farrell http://www.pfarrell.com Tube preamps can have flat frequency response when properly engineered. Tubes are inherently superior to transistors in some respects. See this series of interviews with the great (and slightly odd) Tim de Paravicini: http://www.ear-usa.com/timdeparavicini.htm YOU USE VACUUM TUBES IN MANY OF YOUR DESIGNS. SOME PEOPLE HAVE SAID THAT TUBES HAVE EUPHONIC EVEN-ORDER HARMONIC DISTORTION. DO YOU RELY ON THIS TUBE NONLINEARITY TO ACHIEVE THE SOUND OF YOUR MODS, OR DO YOU ALWAYS RUN THE TUBES IN THEIR LINEAR REGION? I do not rely on tube nonlinearity. I don't want a sound in my machines. What comes out must sound the same as what went in. The warmth in a lot of tube electronics is due to their dismal top end, the bad transformers they use, and the loading down of their high-impedance outputs. Because of the output transformer and the feedback used, many tube circuits have a partial bass instability that gives a bloated bass. Any warmth in the tube sound is a defect, but listeners don't want to know that. I don't have to use tubes in my designs; I only do it for marketing reasons. I've got an exact equivalent in solid state. I can make either type do the same job, and I have no preference. People can't pick which is which. And electrons have no memory of where they've been! The end result is what counts. Most transistor-circuit architecture was different from tube-circuit architecture, and that's what people were hearing, more than the device itself. The main advantage of tubes is that an average tube has more gain than an average transistor. Second, tubes don't have the enormous storage times of transistors, so they are very fast. Tubes go to 100 MHz without trying. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=18116 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: Replaygain affecting sound quality?
I'm using 6.2.1. A lot of the tracks seem to have over 6dB of gain reduction. Anyway, I've turned it off for now and am very happy with the sound quality. Thanks Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=18948 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] Re: optical out ?
One reason that optical is superior to coaxial is that it eliminates the possibility of ground loops between equipment. This can make a big difference to the sound quality as well as removing annoying hum. I experienced this first hand recently when I tried a borrowed TAG DVD transport in place of my usual cheapo one into a variety of DACs, including a Chord DAC64 and a Benchmark DAC1. The Benchmark is essentially immune to incoming jitter and is as transport agnostic as any DAC I've ever heard (in fact I think it is completely irrelevant which transport you use it with) and the Chord DAC is pretty good in this respect too. But there was a clear problem with the sound just collapsing when the TAG DVD was used with a coaxial lead instead of an optical. Also when you are trying to get sound out of a computer soundcard you will often experience ground loop issues if using coaxial. Andrew -- Andrew B. = SB3- Benchmark DAC1 - EAR864 valve pre - ATC SCM50ASL active speakers... nice! Andrew B.'s Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2619 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=18772 ___ audiophiles mailing list audiophiles@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/audiophiles
