Re: [Ayatana] Extending functionality for the timedate indicator
I think this is what you may be looking for, they are already looking at possible solutions: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-calendar-integration Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2012 23:21:09 +0200 From: pditc...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Extending functionality for the timedate indicator Come on guys , 5 days on a 700 strong mailing list (but I guess that's not really the number) , at least someone should be interested in having some annotation/event functionalities on the calendar . That'll be my last post promoting it , but come on ... maybe ayatana needs promoting:? // (from Brainstorm , http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/28647/ , Solution #7 ) A big panel calendar with simple events/notes : Now , I envision it as being one of the super handy things that Ubuntu has , so bare with me . I've always had trouble keeping track of my daily notes, but I'm frequently around the computer .So when I'm on the computer I want to be able to easily check what the notes/events for the day are and to check them or add more (for any of the upcoming days) .The most handy thing to have is to click on the calendar , which will drop a two-thirds-of-the-screen type of panel (picture : http://dl.dropbox.com/u/42681910/Calendar%20blueprint.png ) , that has the calendar , and in each cell (representing a day) there could be events/notes , that are readable as soon as you expand the applet (and everything hides on Esc or click on the indicator) . I think no other OS has anything similar . So to add an event or to edit one - just click on the cell . An addition to the idea is to have the cell ,that's clicked on, expand (makes it more usable when there's many events/notes) as shown in the picture. What I've drawn is pretty bad , but I guess you could imagine a better coloured version with some transparency and some simple open-animation . Importing/exporting with a mail client and/or Ubuntu One will make the integration complete and enable syncing with other devices through the already existing systems. Best regards , Petko Ditchev ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] HUD design ideas
I also don't generally think we should completely substitute the traditional menus. Let's think for a second how would a company like Apple would do this. I bet they would add a little search Icon next to their global menu which would then open a search-box, just like pressing ALT opens the search on the HUD. Anyway, that's my opinion on how they would implement it if they were to copy it (yes, for competitors am pretty sure will be worth copying :D, so dont be surprised if it happens). So that's what i think. HUD should complement (at least for now till they refine the experience and make it so good that the majority will use it more than the traditional menu). And maybe we could have a windicator with a search icon next to the global menu for mouse user discoverability. Anyway, for apps with lots of options and complicated menus or hidden advanced options, this is awesome. In fact there were some experiments from the Waterloo edu labs with Gimp to do just this and make it very easy to get started with: http://www.adaptablegimp.org/ I must say the difference for a new user using Adaptable gimp is huge and HUD can bring this to almost all apps. Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2012 16:03:56 +0100 From: ma...@e-kirchberger.de To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] HUD design ideas Hi, I read today about new HUD for Unity and I think the idea is brilliant. But at the moment its only orientated to search menu entries. In my opinion the HUD have the potential to cover both. Command Search (Keyboard) and menu structure (Mouse Control) Here some ideas that should work: 1. Remove the whole menu from the Top Bar and replace it with a button. If the user click on the button or hover the HUD should open. Also keep the possibility to start the HUD with Alt. So you don't have anymore the problem that applications with a lot of menu entries overlap with the app indicators (Gimp, LibreOffice). 2. The default view of the HUD should you show the normal menu structure of a application. So you can search a command by clicking through the structure or search by typing. 3. Add the possibility that commands of a application could be add to a favourite list. Every item of this list should be shown as a icon on the right side of the HUD Start Button. So you give the users the possibility to create a own shortcut list for every application. regards, BlueCase ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] [Mockup] Launcher behaviour on always visible mode
i agree. Anyone opened yet a report for this ? From: isan...@gmail.com Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2012 15:02:17 -0700 To: balint...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] [Mockup] Launcher behaviour on always visible mode I think this is a good idea, as long as it stays only when the launcher is configured to never hide/always visible. The panel sliding like that every time the launcher hid or revealed would involve too much motion. On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 14:38, balint...@gmail.com balint...@gmail.com wrote: There is one visual bug when launcher is set to always visible. The window controls look out-of-place. What if the launcher would expand in that mode all to the top? It sadly introduces a smaller visual inconsistency when the desktop is empty :( . (On the first screen you can see the bug, on the second you can see improved window-control placement, and the third is about what would the empty desktop would look like) -- Csonka Bálint @913 ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Video effects when user install programs
you mean install animations? https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/676453 Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 17:27:03 +0100 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Video effects when user install programs From: irone...@gmail.com To: isan...@gmail.com CC: estela...@hotmail.com; ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Yes, this is my idea. This is a nice question. Il giorno 12 gennaio 2012 09:14, Ian Santopietro isan...@gmail.com ha scritto: I think what he's getting at is that it would be nice of when you click to install an app from software center, it moves from the software center to the launcher, to draw the user's focus and help illustrate where the app is now. It's good in concept, but what about installing a support package from the software center? --Ian Santopietro Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup? op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Video effects when user install programs
but how would that work? in the uTV movies/videos use pictures (basically the design from the retail box), while people identify apps mostly by icons. And many apps really dont have promotional pictures. Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 15:01:29 +0100 From: irone...@gmail.com To: m...@canonical.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Video effects when user install programs Hi Matthew, I know that, but it should be nice if the icons to the launcher will be added with a video effect like Ubuntu TV. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Video effects when user install programs
it seems all installed apps will now appear on the launcher by default. Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 21:58:52 +0100 From: irone...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Video effects when user install programs My idea is about an effect that should be added when the user install software from the USC. I mean the effect that can be watched on this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embeddedv=jq_WaOLjdyQ#! at the 1.10 min, when the 'Up' film was buyed. But, if the system on the Ubuntu TV is Ubuntu, why don't use the same effect on the Desktop version? -- Enrico Carafa - Follow me on Twitter, G+ or Facebook. Launchpad profile: https://launchpad.net/~mr.tennents ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover
Talvik, I have been increasingly suffering the same problems you have for a while, then i remembered you mentioning some proposals for a solution. So I opened a bug about the problem here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/908811 Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2011 18:38:29 -0200 From: tal...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] List windows on hover Recently I've done task in which I needed to refer to several spreadsheets and other documents. In Unity, changing between the open documents was quite difficult, I had to think to much to find a window and my focus was constantly shifting from the main task. The Launcher is quite agnostic to multiple window applications, so Unity relies to much on the window manager for this. I found it quite inferior to the more traditional task bar for this type of workflow. I've ended up running another task bar(tint2) to get my work done. When I hover an icon in the Launcher it just shows a tooltip with the application name. I think it would be better if on hover it also listed the window's titles, clicking on an item would bring up only the referred window. This wouldn't affect most of the current behavior. http://ubuntuone.com/1BAZfzHSzpHYCtfW5neY4Uhttp://ubuntuone.com/02CEbphUkex7mRqSdL5Yx7 I know Unity is aiming for simplicity, and is being inspired by newer OSes like android and iOS. But the work that people need to accomplish on the desktop is far more complex than what one does on a mobile. regards,Talvik ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak
I think myUnity would be more appropriate than ubuntu-tweak. http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/12/unity-tweak-tool-myunity-gets-new-look-coming-to-ubuntu-software-centre/ Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2011 16:16:24 -0400 From: rolandi...@gmail.com To: lbsol...@yahoo.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak If Ubuntu-Tweak is broken in that manner, then why don't we fix it and include it. I still don't see how your arguments against inclusion are truly valid. For one thing, we can disable the Computer Janitor plugin by default. Furthermore, IIRC, it does not work the same way as the previous one that cause so much confusion and damage for users. Secondly, as for scrolling on items, while that is a valid (if unlikely) problem, the solution is simply to put a button next to options that can scroll that will cause for the option to be reset. That's a super simple fix (it's the same thing you get in CCSM, which IMO should also be included by default after getting some love to make it look better; and should just simply be invisible to users in the menu by default). If you ask me, the only reason why they are not being included is because of the previous problems with space on the CD, which is now a joke because we've switched to DVDs and USBs. I don't think it's particularly true that, Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything. Ubuntu Tweak still offers computer janitor which has been known to confuse many end users, and even further if you hover the mouse pointer in the wrong area in some tweak areas and scroll you can easily change things with no obvious way to restore defaults. Don't get me wrong, it's a great tool. I love using it to play with themes in Gnome 3, regardless of DE, but it's far from mature enough to be included in the repos. --- On Wed, 12/14/11, Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com wrote: From: Roland Taylor rolandi...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Ubuntu Tweak To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Wednesday, December 14, 2011, 10:17 PM I respectfully disagree. The options that can be tweaked from Ubuntu Tweak and similar tools (concerning Unity) will not break anything, and for the most part can be changed on the fly (without restarting that is). There is no reason not to include such a tool by default. On 12/14/2011 05:00 PM, Ian Santopietro wrote: I think the theory here is that users who want to do it generally know (or can find out) how to install these tools, and those who could break something won't have the option visible. -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 On Wed 14 Dec 2011 01:27:05 PM MST, Christian Rupp wrote: The options to change unity are very rarely installed by default... Wouldn't it be nice to implement the tweaks options for apperance somewhere in the system settings? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Simplifying the actions icons.
yeap many themes already use monochrome icons for apps, ike faenza, and they looks very good. like: http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/4017/screenshotri.png http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4112/5167761022_d618f2821e.jpg Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2011 19:31:59 -0500 From: svela...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Simplifying the actions icons. Hello, I believe the actions icons are too colourful and have way too much detail. They should be more simple, clean, utilitarian. The new software center in oneiric already uses monochrome actions icons. I know that SABDFL already said something about getting a design school involved in redoing the icons. I was wondering if there would be any support if I went ahead and redid just the actions icons? I have some experience. (islingt0ner.deviantart.com) what I mean is would such a project be beneficial? I have actually already started work on it, but was wondering whether its worth finishing? here is what I started yesterday: http://i.imgur.com/N7CLX.png The 'go' and 'arrows' are the headings of the name so for example go-next or arrow-left. I would ofcourse work with any crtique, concerns. I just dont want to be one of those designers that is like, here I made this, put it in. If there is a desire for such a project inside Ubuntu, then I want to work with people, you know? Love Respect profusely apologetic if this is the wrong list, -- Saleel ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Simplifying the actions icons.
yea those action icons just look good: http://www.webupd8.org/2011/12/light-themes-evolved-ambiance-and.html the only icons that are all square are the app icons, which i dont think ubuntu is going to adopt by default. there were plans for a new icon set, but i havent seen anything yet... Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2011 13:31:50 -0500 From: svela...@gmail.com To: isan...@gmail.com; ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Simplifying the actions icons. On Mon, Dec 12, 2011 at 12:30 PM, Ian Santopietro isan...@gmail.com wrote: I don't see how going ahead and doing it would hurt. The worst that could happen is that the set isn't accepted as a default, and there's another nice option for users to install if they want. I'd like to see what you come up with. I recommend keeping a distinct shape for each icon. This is one of my least favorite things about Faenza; all of the icons have the same shape. Again I have no intention on creating an entire iconset, but rather just focusing on the actions subset. Has there been any discussion on this before? -- Saleel ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Listing and Finding Lens?
check the bug, looks like that's what they are going to do now. not sure if they should also add a sections to the lens... Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2011 10:26:31 -0700 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Listing and Finding Lens? From: isan...@gmail.com To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net; docto...@gmail.com What about automatically adding newly installed apps to the launcher, along with an animation to show you where it went. I know there's an option to move an app to the launcher now, but having it by default will make it easier for new users. On Dec 11, 2011 7:55 AM, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: here is the bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/708976 From: docto...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Sun, 11 Dec 2011 11:11:49 + Subject: [Ayatana] Listing and Finding Lens? Hey Gang, Ubuntu 11.10 My good friend said I've installed Inkscape and gimp and i can't find them he continued to try and navigate the Ubuntu lens and got frustrated with not being able to find them. I told him to type them in and he just said What if I can't remember what it's called and then said Oh great I've burned the toast, thanks Ubuntu. He's going to make a folder on the desktop with links to the apps, since the Unity lens and bar isn't sufficient for showing what apps are installed. Any ideas on solving these issues? Martin, ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Clippy has noticed you've been trying to click on notifications...
This mockup shows off a bubble with a tail: http://crhis22.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-Mockup-120235202 I do believe people would notice it a lot more, they make it more obvious where the notification is coming from. Studies do show that is hard for humans to pay attention to more than one thing at a time. but not all bubbles need a tail. and some do need to be more persistent. In windows i think they go into a queue and use a priority system, but am not totally sure. Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2011 17:41:33 + From: m...@canonical.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Clippy has noticed you've been trying to click on notifications... -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Evan Huus wrote on 03/12/11 15:43: ... Currently when an event occurs (for example, someone says something in a minimized empathy chat), a notification pops up and the messaging indicator turns blue. They happen at the same time, but the events don't appear related. Technically they are two components of the same event, but they appear on two different, not visibly related UI elements as two separate events. This is made even worse if the notification is delayed because it is queued behind other notifications. In that case the indicator turns blue well before the notification appears, so the user has no idea which notification the blue indicator is associated with. Additionally, the change of colour in the indicator is not particularly noticeable. Anecdotally I have found that people either don't notice it at all, or ignore it because they don't know what it means (was there a usability study on this? I remember one, but couldn't find it any more...) Yes. From https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2011-April/032988.html: Only 2/6 noticed an XChat Gnome notification, despite (1) a notification bubble appearing, (2) the Ubuntu button going blue, (3) the messaging menu envelope going blue, and (4) an emblem appearing on XChat Gnome's launcher. (In 11.10, fewer things change: the Ubuntu button no longer goes blue.) That's the problem. There are a couple of possible solutions, but here's one that makes the most sense to me: - Link notifications to indicators via a speech-bubble-like tail. Volume change notifications get linked to the sound indicator, empathy notifications get linked to the messaging indicator, etc. I believe that just this change on its own will help significantly. Notifications are transient, so people can't interact with them, but with this change the notifications are at least *pointing* to something interactive. They still don't require interaction (which was one of the original design goals I agree with) but they make it obvious how. This should reduce the frustration felt by users who are used to interacting with notifications directly on other operating systems. Three problems there. Most importantly, in the 11.04 test, people didn't see the bubble either. Would a bubble with a tail be much more noticable than one without a tail? Second, giving Ubuntu notification bubbles tails would make them look more like Windows notification balloons ... which are clickable. :-) Third, what would happen when there were two or more bubbles on screen at once? Would the tail of the second obscure the first? ... I personally think the above change would be sufficient, but we have other options as well: - Add a glow effect and a *very* gentle pulse to active (blue) indicators. This will make them slightly more obvious and interactive-looking than currently. We'll have to be careful not to make them too distracting, though. - Change the notification animation to be a magic-lamp like expand and collapse into the appropriate indicator. Could be used instead of or in addition to the speech-bubble-tail. I expect this would end up being too active/busy, but you never know. ... Perhaps when battery is critically low, the battery icon should blink constantly even once you've dismissed the warning alert. - -- mpt -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk7mPMwACgkQ6PUxNfU6ecrKiACgkc5ylUSxk1xguFT2qQAm+7xF 4JIAoL9aD7fJki9WoaL+akYFM+7+N7Ju =kPOQ -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity
A few say the same about overlay scrollbars and uninstall them... but i for one love these dynamic and smart features. They let you focus more on the content. Things like these differentiate ubuntu and let it evolve. After using them, am starting to prefer it over the old ways. i would also like to see some kind of dynamic controls. apps in tablets show us that they limit the beauty and make it less seamless. They just look more natural. And thanks to the unity love handles they can shape up more like that. http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2011/TECH/mobile/02/09/hp.webos/t1larg.hp.tablet.jpg http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2011/09/touchpad.jpg http://cdn.blogsdna.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/webos2.0betastacks.jpg ubuntu still a long way to becoming a good tablet or multidevice OS that can compete with other commercial solutions (linux based or not). is getting there and some have tried it in tablets, but still doesnt feel/look/behave right. http://iloveubuntu.net/ubuntu-1110s-unity-3d-runs-smoothly-acer-iconia-w500-touchscreen Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2011 21:54:35 -0700 Subject: RE: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity From: isan...@gmail.com To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net; frederik.nn...@gmail.com; m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk Oh, I have no problem with the grab handles. It's just they're meant for multi touch screens. They aren't a good replacement for traditional window management utilities. On Dec 7, 2011 6:45 PM, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: Still the feature is being introduced. I think these drag handles are self explanatory just by looking at them and provide that necessary extra surface area for resizing and dragging windows. and you might still be able to use part of the titlebar for dragging. The plugin can even be turn off. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uij2ZMxzVsg People will need to try to adapt to the behavior in the same way they had to adapt to some other stuff in unity or other DEs/OSs. But is a young project and if you think it needs tweaking you can always suggest it and some already have: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1714969 Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2011 16:00:08 -0700 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity From: isan...@gmail.com To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net; frederik.nn...@gmail.com; m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk But users don't expect to not be able to move a window using the title bar, and similarly, we can't expect them to know how to do it any other way. On Dec 7, 2011 2:10 PM, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: you mean Unity love/drag handles ? http://codearmada.com/2011/03/24/unity-has-love-handles/ http://vindsl.com/images/vindsl-desktop-26-mar-2011%282%29.png they are going to incorporate it anyway so it would solve these dragging problems some mention with a few tweaks. i think that this should activate by clicking any corner or optionally via a window control. From: frederik.nn...@gmail.com Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2011 19:33:20 +0100 To: m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 19:00, Matt Richardson m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: Couldn't you solve the draggable area problem by allowing users to move the window by dragging from anywhere on the title bar, including a menu item. at some point it was mentioned that all grey areas in an application window should be draggable areas. this would make a lot of sense to me.. Menus could show on release to prevent them from showing when a user drags the window. indicator menus are aim-click-drag-release.this includes indicator-appmenu so no, show on release is not a solution, so i think. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity
love the mockups. it's still one of the best options for fixing the global menu problem. https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/682788 is affecting more and more users (new and old) each day. From: fuzz...@gmail.com Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2011 16:17:01 + To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity Hi guys, I've not been involved in a mailing list for several years now, so I apologise in advance if I do things wrong!Also sorry if this is the wrong place to post this - I put them on a bug report list a while ago, and somebody suggested that I submit them to you guys. Basically, I made some mockups a while ago (April) for Unity's Global Menu, which everyone seems to be having trouble with.They're quite hard to explain properly, so it's probably easier for you to just look at them. I've tried to explain what's going on in the description of each image. They're obviously not perfect - I've just pulled a bunch of ideas together and tried to make a usable concept.I am now aware that other people have made similar mockups to mine, but at the time I hadn't seen any of them. Here's the link: http://anaershadowynomaly.deviantart.com/gallery/29691776 Please comment and criticize these as much as necessary, then I can try to improve the design. I'm more than happy to make more mockups to incorporate new or different ideas. Hope that all made sense :D Farran ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity
you mean Unity love/drag handles ? http://codearmada.com/2011/03/24/unity-has-love-handles/ http://vindsl.com/images/vindsl-desktop-26-mar-2011%282%29.png they are going to incorporate it anyway so it would solve these dragging problems some mention with a few tweaks. i think that this should activate by clicking any corner or optionally via a window control. From: frederik.nn...@gmail.com Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2011 19:33:20 +0100 To: m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 19:00, Matt Richardson m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: Couldn't you solve the draggable area problem by allowing users to move the window by dragging from anywhere on the title bar, including a menu item. at some point it was mentioned that all grey areas in an application window should be draggable areas. this would make a lot of sense to me.. Menus could show on release to prevent them from showing when a user drags the window. indicator menus are aim-click-drag-release.this includes indicator-appmenu so no, show on release is not a solution, so i think. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity
Still the feature is being introduced. I think these drag handles are self explanatory just by looking at them and provide that necessary extra surface area for resizing and dragging windows. and you might still be able to use part of the titlebar for dragging. The plugin can even be turn off. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uij2ZMxzVsg People will need to try to adapt to the behavior in the same way they had to adapt to some other stuff in unity or other DEs/OSs. But is a young project and if you think it needs tweaking you can always suggest it and some already have: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1714969 Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2011 16:00:08 -0700 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity From: isan...@gmail.com To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net; frederik.nn...@gmail.com; m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk But users don't expect to not be able to move a window using the title bar, and similarly, we can't expect them to know how to do it any other way. On Dec 7, 2011 2:10 PM, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: you mean Unity love/drag handles ? http://codearmada.com/2011/03/24/unity-has-love-handles/ http://vindsl.com/images/vindsl-desktop-26-mar-2011%282%29.png they are going to incorporate it anyway so it would solve these dragging problems some mention with a few tweaks. i think that this should activate by clicking any corner or optionally via a window control. From: frederik.nn...@gmail.com Date: Wed, 7 Dec 2011 19:33:20 +0100 To: m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Global Menu mockups for Unity On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 19:00, Matt Richardson m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: Couldn't you solve the draggable area problem by allowing users to move the window by dragging from anywhere on the title bar, including a menu item. at some point it was mentioned that all grey areas in an application window should be draggable areas. this would make a lot of sense to me.. Menus could show on release to prevent them from showing when a user drags the window. indicator menus are aim-click-drag-release.this includes indicator-appmenu so no, show on release is not a solution, so i think. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] new proposal for notifications / indicators
i like it, i would actually keep the volume always visible since i mouse over it frequently, also in windows, kde, etc. is also kept visible (but is configurable in kde). i do have this area pretty cluttered: glipper, system monitor applet, keyboard language switcher and all the others. so this would help but a person should configure to keep the applets they want visible all the time or on demand, etc.. Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2011 11:05:38 +0100 From: david.reichl...@googlemail.com To: m...@canonical.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] new proposal for notifications / indicators Holy shit gmail removed somehow when i make a new line. Resending my mail: Hi, i didn't explained my idea good enough and you and probably others have understand me wrong. so i try to explain with different words. the basic idea is that when you turn the computer on it shows the minimum of indicators thats possible. http://unity.exemo.net/panel_beginning.png you can expand them by clicking on the arrow: http://unity.exemo.net/panel_expanded.png when an event happens 4 different things can happen: a: show only a notification b: show a notification and show an indicator (if the indicator is already visible add an entry to the menu) c: show a notification and hide an indicator d: remove an entry from an indicator menu (if its the last entry the indicator will be hidden) The nofifications are like now and will fade in and after a few sec. fade out. The indicators will be show at an event and remain visible until later when another event hides it again Examples: Event: Files will be uploaded to ubuntu one What happens: a:-show notification: x files will be uploaded ... Event: You get a new mail What happens: b: - show notification: You got a new mail ... - show message indicator - http://unity.exemo.net/new_mail.png Event: You remove the cable from your laptop What happens - b:- show notification: You have x hours left ... - show batteryindicator - http://unity.exemo.net/mail_and_battery.png Event: You focus the chat window What happens: d- remove the previously added chat-notification-entry from the message menu Event: You connect the cable to your laptop What happens - c: - show notification: Battery will be full in ... - hide battery indicator - http://unity.exemo.net/panel_expanded.png Why? What problem would it be solving? That's a good question (as always ;-))There has been already a lot of work done in the top right corner and i don't see any real problems with what we currently have. The only thing is that i have currently 8 indicators that are always visible. Other users might have more or less. I just think that it would look better when you have a maximised application and you have less indicators visible. (the minimum possible) I think for the same reason that the window buttons are not visible when not needet. If the messaging menu was hidden by default, what use would it be? I didn't mean to use the messaging menu like we have it today. More something like a list of the latest notifications that you got Looking something like this: http://ubuntuone.com/3pQaNx9TdpPXEZHMIjPgdP except not the tabs at the bottom How do you classify devices under notification indicators? What would this notify you of? (using the word notifications was not really a good idea from me.) We could show for example an entry for every device where it makes sense. Every entry could contain a menu with actions For example - UsbStick - Documents (17) // open gnome-documents - Videos (3) // open gnome videos - see all files // open nautilus - Video DVD - Watch Movie // open totem - Import or Rip Movie // open ... etc This could remove the need to open a window in situations like this: If a new printer is plugged in and recognized automatically while neither a Print dialog nor System Settings (any panel) is open, System Settings should open to the Printers panel, the list of printers should scroll to show the new printer, and it should be selected in the list. (This is analogous to a USB storage device window opening when it is connected.) But i have to say that i have not really thought a lot about how the specific indicators could look like. I just wanted to give a few examples. People didn't see the updates notification area item even when it was shown by default. What use would it be if it was hidden? :-) The reason why some people don't see it is in my opinion because we have indicators where some people don't care about. Lets say we have a user who uses his computer only to look his mails (in gmail) and to browse the internet. His first time where he uses ubuntu he look around and finds out how to connect to the internet, ... (or a friend shows him) But after that the internet
Re: [Ayatana] new proposal for notifications / indicators
agree with you that they all should be visible, but be able to hide the ones you want or dont use frequently. someone created something like this: http://i.imgur.com/dhHNJ.png (thats not gnome-shell, is jjpanel) video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOp_NGPdkVo http://www.webupd8.org/2011/11/oxygen-appmenu-replace-menu-with.html#comment-371674713 the collapsible applet area could be made in the unity panel. From: isan...@gmail.com Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2011 11:20:32 -0700 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] new proposal for notifications / indicators To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: david.reichl...@googlemail.com; ayatana@lists.launchpad.net I don't really see any problems with letting a user hide indicators manually, but all of them should always be visible by default. The seemingly haphazard hiding of indicators in Windows were, if I'm correct, one of the reasons we developed indicators in the first place. Instead of developing ways to hide indicators, perhaps it would be more useful to refine the interaction when the window title, window menu, and indicators run long and meet? On Tue, Dec 6, 2011 at 10:59, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: i like it, i would actually keep the volume always visible since i mouse over it frequently, also in windows, kde, etc. is also kept visible (but is configurable in kde). i do have this area pretty cluttered: glipper, system monitor applet, keyboard language switcher and all the others. so this would help but a person should configure to keep the applets they want visible all the time or on demand, etc.. Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2011 11:05:38 +0100 From: david.reichl...@googlemail.com To: m...@canonical.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] new proposal for notifications / indicators Holy shit gmail removed somehow when i make a new line. Resending my mail: Hi, i didn't explained my idea good enough and you and probably others have understand me wrong. so i try to explain with different words. the basic idea is that when you turn the computer on it shows the minimum of indicators thats possible. http://unity.exemo.net/panel_beginning.png you can expand them by clicking on the arrow: http://unity.exemo.net/panel_expanded.png when an event happens 4 different things can happen: a: show only a notification b: show a notification and show an indicator (if the indicator is already visible add an entry to the menu) c: show a notification and hide an indicator d: remove an entry from an indicator menu (if its the last entry the indicator will be hidden) The nofifications are like now and will fade in and after a few sec. fade out. The indicators will be show at an event and remain visible until later when another event hides it again Examples: Event: Files will be uploaded to ubuntu one What happens: a: -show notification: x files will be uploaded ... Event: You get a new mail What happens: b: - show notification: You got a new mail ... - show message indicator - http://unity.exemo.net/new_mail.png Event: You remove the cable from your laptop What happens - b: - show notification: You have x hours left ... - show batteryindicator - http://unity.exemo.net/mail_and_battery.png Event: You focus the chat window What happens: d - remove the previously added chat-notification-entry from the message menu Event: You connect the cable to your laptop What happens - c: - show notification: Battery will be full in ... - hide battery indicator - http://unity.exemo.net/panel_expanded.png Why? What problem would it be solving? That's a good question (as always ;-))There has been already a lot of work done in the top right corner and i don't see any real problems with what we currently have. The only thing is that i have currently 8 indicators that are always visible. Other users might have more or less. I just think that it would look better when you have a maximised application and you have less indicators visible. (the minimum possible) I think for the same reason that the window buttons are not visible when not needet. If the messaging menu was hidden by default, what use would it be? I didn't mean to use the messaging menu like we have it today. More something like a list of the latest notifications that you got Looking something like this: http://ubuntuone.com/3pQaNx9TdpPXEZHMIjPgdP except not the tabs at the bottom How do you classify devices under notification indicators? What would this notify you of? (using the word notifications was not really a good idea from me.) We could show for example an entry for every device where it makes sense. Every entry could contain a menu with actions For example - UsbStick - Documents (17) // open gnome-documents - Videos (3) // open gnome videos - see all files // open nautilus - Video DVD - Watch Movie // open totem
Re: [Ayatana] Some thoughts about the home lens
what about these widgets being linked to parent lenses ? clicking on them or on a link more would take you to the lenses. so in essence these widgets would act as previews of the lenses you want in one screen. i like the idea of adding lens previews to the home in the form of blocks/widgets :) would be cool to improve the API to do that. Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 16:06:49 +0100 From: christ...@r-k-r.de To: frederik.nn...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Some thoughts about the home lens Am 04.12.2011 15:59, schrieb frederik.nn...@gmail.com: On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 15:17, Christian Rupp christ...@r-k-r.de wrote: Am 04.12.2011 13:13, schrieb frederik.nn...@gmail.com: On Sun, Dec 4, 2011 at 13:07, Christian Rupp christ...@r-k-r.de wrote: I think that we should use the space for something more informative than the 8 icons... http://ubuntuone.com/5nAsW7hEmAs6jvyiq8Z6on like a widget space, rght? this could be easily achieved by using the Launcher API in the Dash. there would be enough space for all high-interest statuses such as email, instant messaging call services, progress on system update or filetransfer or filedownloads and a visual way of indicating, how many windows the browser has open. Yeah right... Plus more such as weather or a calender. weather i don't know, i'd like it, personally, but some might not. But Calendar, yes, calendar is one important feature that has yet to be properly implemented in the free Desktop Environment. at least a live indication of the next appointment today and a proper date showing the day of the week. Of course you can set everything as you like. In my opinion in the USC a widget section and their you can install and remove them as you like... Pre-installed I would like to see -Calender -Facebook/Twitter/... -Email -Weather -events or things to do for the next week -Music -news (based on google? news or a local service?) ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Some thoughts about the home lens
oh no, linking lenses is optional and only if the user has installed or set them. and some lenses could provide its own preview/widgets. else some previews only link to an app, browser, etc. (or may not link to anything if they are designed that way). sadly for something like this to get implemented , the devs need to open up to the idea that users need to be able to customize some things to their needs. Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 18:34:15 +0100 From: christ...@r-k-r.de To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: frederik.nn...@gmail.com; ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Some thoughts about the home lens Am 04.12.2011 17:27, schrieb Omar B.: what about these widgets being linked to parent lenses ? clicking on them or on a link more would take you to the lenses. so in essence these widgets would act as previews of the lenses you want in one screen. i like the idea of adding lens previews to the home in the form of blocks/widgets :) would be cool to improve the API to do that. Great idea I thought about apps. But preview of lenses is also not bad. But combining both of this would be confusing wouldn't be? Also lenses aren't a good place to display things like mails... Opening Thunderbird directly would be better. But I considering this idea for further improvements ;) I improved my idea this way: Sorry some names are in German ;), forgot to change system language, but I think everybody should be able to understand it though If you click on Apps or Files the filter options for this lenses are shown and the fitting lens with the right filter displayed. If you click on system you'll get some possibilities, more could be added, but I wouldn't bloat it to much. http://ubuntuone.com/0dZEtliYhI9NoQEc2VISud Finally we could make a widget for notes, connect it with u1 and we have a replacement for tomboy^^ ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Clippy has noticed you've been trying to click on notifications...
yea the idea of speech bubbles is very good. They are self explainable and reduce time identifying the element that generated them. Also gnome-shell uses similar on their menus and many popular websites use it for tips/notifications (i.e. fb). for a quick mockup, next time just use a plain 1 color background and cut/paste the notification closer to the panel. Then fill in the empty area with another area of the bg :D From: eapa...@gmail.com Date: Sat, 3 Dec 2011 13:08:54 -0500 To: christ...@r-k-r.de; ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Clippy has noticed you've been trying to click on notifications... On Sat, Dec 3, 2011 at 11:39 AM, Christian Rupp christ...@r-k-r.de wrote: Am 03.12.2011 16:43, schrieb Evan Huus: [1] http://dl.dropbox.com/u/171647/notifications_as_speech_bubbles.png Good idea, but I would move the bubble closer to the panel the distance is silly I know (I made it by taking a screenshot and drawing a triangle on top). If someone with more graphics talent than myself wants to produce a nicer mock-up that would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, Evan ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom
we are discussing the menu on unmaximized windows on this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/682788 Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2011 00:43:55 +0100 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom From: sunil.r...@gmail.com To: isan...@gmail.com CC: estela...@hotmail.com; ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Sorry I think I didn't make myself clear enough.About the circular button I meat the circular shape of the buttons. I think their design being circular is not consistent with the rest of the design of the unity. Which has more squarish throughout. I agree with the global menu bar for maximized window is a great idea; but the point I raised was for non-maximized windows. Its nice to have the windows control available on the ( un-maximized) window it self; but for the windows menu one still have to traverse the mouse pointer to the top bar. I think it would be better to have windows menu also on the (un-maximized) window itself. I got the idea of the design. On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 23:18, Ian Santopietro isan...@gmail.com wrote: So far consistency is concerned I never felt that the circular windows controls consistent with any part of unity. They're used to control the dash. You can't make the Dash full screen without them. They integrate the window controls into the panel for maximized windows because they integrate the menu bar and title bar into the top panel. Doing this saves nearly 50 pixels of vertical screen real estate, which is nice on large monitors, and huge on smaller screens like netbooks. Giving the Dash window controls simply makes it more consistent with the rest of Unity. Transparent panels blend in with the dash, and make it feel more like an extension of the panel and launcher, which it is. With the dash open and full screen, it feels like a single sheet draped over the screen since everything blends together seamlessly. Visually, it's very pleasing. On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 13:44, Sunil Singh Rana sunil.r...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 18:05, Ian Santopietro isan...@gmail.com wrote: I mean that the panel is now disconnected from the rest of Unity. With the panel at the bottom, there's no reason for the panel to turn transparent. There's no reason for the Dash's window controls to be in the panel. Having the launcher on the left side is important, because without that, several other points in unity simply don't make any sense. Hi, May I please request to make those several other points of Unity more clear. Please forgive my ignorance. I agree that there in no reason for the window controls to be in the panel. I personally think there is no reason for any window that is not maximized to have controls and menus on the top panel. It makes unnecessary mouse travels; though I can understand it might me useful for small form factors. I also never understood the philosophy behind making panels transparent when dash is called -- please forgive my ignorance once again. So far consistency is concerned I never felt that the circular windows controls consistent with any part of unity. Personally I don't know much of advantages of having panel in left apart from having more vertical space. But I see the challenges it presents to make a consistent design. On Nov 30, 2011 8:16 AM, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: what do you mean it doesnt work? you just looked at the first screen and havent tried it. here are more screens: http://forum.ubuntu.ru/index.php?topic=171694.0 http://www.webupd8.org/2011/10/how-to-move-unity-launcher-to-bottom-of.html but its still in dev of course. From: isan...@gmail.com Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 13:04:03 -0700 To: sunil.r...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom What happens to the top panel with the launcher at the bottom? What about the Dash window controls? Without sticking the top panel on the left, I don't see how this design works. On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 11:01, Sunil Singh Rana sunil.r...@gmail.com wrote: I think its a great idea. Design can be modified so that it remain consistent if some user chooses it to be on bottom. I don't really see much philosophy behind the current design; for example: I don't know why the top panel or left panel have to have the grey transparent visual effect when dash is called. I wouldn't mind if the dash shows itself in the center of the screen, without blocking the menus and controls of the previous in-focus application. In the later case, I would be able to drag and drop from the dash to any side of the screen, and the design would look more symmetric. Sunil On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 18:45, Swapnil Bhartiya swapnil.bhart...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/29/2011 05:55 PM, Christian Rupp wrote: I know
Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom
what do you mean it doesnt work? you just looked at the first screen and havent tried it. here are more screens: http://forum.ubuntu.ru/index.php?topic=171694.0 http://www.webupd8.org/2011/10/how-to-move-unity-launcher-to-bottom-of.html but its still in dev of course. From: isan...@gmail.com Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 13:04:03 -0700 To: sunil.r...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom What happens to the top panel with the launcher at the bottom? What about the Dash window controls? Without sticking the top panel on the left, I don't see how this design works. On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 11:01, Sunil Singh Rana sunil.r...@gmail.com wrote: I think its a great idea. Design can be modified so that it remain consistent if some user chooses it to be on bottom. I don't really see much philosophy behind the current design; for example: I don't know why the top panel or left panel have to have the grey transparent visual effect when dash is called. I wouldn't mind if the dash shows itself in the center of the screen, without blocking the menus and controls of the previous in-focus application. In the later case, I would be able to drag and drop from the dash to any side of the screen, and the design would look more symmetric. Sunil On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 18:45, Swapnil Bhartiya swapnil.bhart...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/29/2011 05:55 PM, Christian Rupp wrote: I know it was discussed several times, but a plug-in finally got it working: http://www.webupd8.org/2011/11/install-ubuntu-unity-bottom-launcher.html Should we include it in one of ubuntu next releases as a easy to activate option On second thoughts I believe, it's a good idea (gives some customisation to users). Once at the bottom it will be just like Apple Mac's dock. A good thing may be the option to place the launcher anywhere you want - left/right or bottom. swapnil ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- सुनील राणा Unselfishness is more paying only people have not the patience to practice it. 'I love you' is a wrong sentence as where, there exist 'I' and 'you' love can not. Love is an attribute of the absolute. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom
Yes since this is unofficial, some elements are less tight but users wanting the launcher at the bottom are not picky and many dont even give any thought to the things you pointed out. Still i must credit the individual that managed to make this different setup usable, which has been asked for many, despite his limited time and resources. Anyway IMHO the official design of unity is going to keep changing and some things are going to get dropped/added, specially since they want an interface for a wide range of devices. I for one think it will need to allow more *flexibility* if it wants to succeed in all these areas and for some many different type of users / devices. Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 10:05:42 -0700 Subject: RE: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom From: isan...@gmail.com To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net; sunil.r...@gmail.com I mean that the panel is now disconnected from the rest of Unity. With the panel at the bottom, there's no reason for the panel to turn transparent. There's no reason for the Dash's window controls to be in the panel. Having the launcher on the left side is important, because without that, several other points in unity simply don't make any sense. On Nov 30, 2011 8:16 AM, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: what do you mean it doesnt work? you just looked at the first screen and havent tried it. here are more screens: http://forum.ubuntu.ru/index.php?topic=171694.0 http://www.webupd8.org/2011/10/how-to-move-unity-launcher-to-bottom-of.html but its still in dev of course. From: isan...@gmail.com Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 13:04:03 -0700 To: sunil.r...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] unity at the bottom What happens to the top panel with the launcher at the bottom? What about the Dash window controls? Without sticking the top panel on the left, I don't see how this design works. On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 11:01, Sunil Singh Rana sunil.r...@gmail.com wrote: I think its a great idea. Design can be modified so that it remain consistent if some user chooses it to be on bottom. I don't really see much philosophy behind the current design; for example: I don't know why the top panel or left panel have to have the grey transparent visual effect when dash is called. I wouldn't mind if the dash shows itself in the center of the screen, without blocking the menus and controls of the previous in-focus application. In the later case, I would be able to drag and drop from the dash to any side of the screen, and the design would look more symmetric. Sunil On Tue, Nov 29, 2011 at 18:45, Swapnil Bhartiya swapnil.bhart...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/29/2011 05:55 PM, Christian Rupp wrote: I know it was discussed several times, but a plug-in finally got it working: http://www.webupd8.org/2011/11/install-ubuntu-unity-bottom-launcher.html Should we include it in one of ubuntu next releases as a easy to activate option On second thoughts I believe, it's a good idea (gives some customisation to users). Once at the bottom it will be just like Apple Mac's dock. A good thing may be the option to place the launcher anywhere you want - left/right or bottom. swapnil ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- सुनील राणा Unselfishness is more paying only people have not the patience to practice it. 'I love you' is a wrong sentence as where, there exist 'I' and 'you' love can not. Love is an attribute of the absolute. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
wow, morphing windows, i remember that one :) i really liked how that worked. I wonder how something like this would look/behave today. Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2011 14:54:31 + From: m...@canonical.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Christian Rupp wrote on 15/11/11 16:06: Currently notifications in unity are what they called: notifications: they don't do anything else... I really like in GS to be able to answer immediately or a friend complained that he wants to click on the notification to open the program behind. First of all I would move the bubble closer to the panel That looks much nicer. Then after a short delay i would minimize it if you click on it in this state it would open the application which is linked (in this case banshee) How would people understand that it did something different when clicked in large state vs. small state? I don't know of any other case where something getting smaller indicates that it's clickable. If it would be a chat program and you would hover the minimized bubble it shows a text field, where you can enter a message... if you click on the bubble above the field it would open the chat window ... Chat programs already have an interface for entering a message: the chat window. The design principle of parsimony suggests that we should first try using the same interface for notifying you of a conversation as for participating in the conversation. At the moment, there are two main reasons chat programs don't do that on Ubuntu. The first reason is that a chat window wouldn't be noticable unless it was frontmost; it's difficult (or little-known) to make a window frontmost without making it take focus; and if a window takes focus while you're working, that's annoying. That can be fixed, by figuring out what code makes a window frontmost without being focused, publicizing that code if it's simple, or putting it in a library if it's hard. The second reason is that a chat window would take up much more space than a notification bubble does. That too can be fixed, by making the window small before you click it, and enlarging it after you click it. Here's a mockup of this idea from 2009, for the similar case of a file share. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotificationDesignGuidelines#Morphing_window - -- mpt -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk7U8h8ACgkQ6PUxNfU6ecpDegCcC7kNEniDlVDiXI+r/YEYbHha x78AoI+2dgqfFTttbtCk8Rt94kWsjFMh =zGkQ -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Integrate the top bar with the launcher.
some have suggested dynamic transparency for maximized windows. we already have dynamic transparency on the panel. When we open the dash and the panel turns transparent/chameleon. would be the same thing, but like in reverse. the panel would be transparent when the window is not maximized and matches the window theme when maximized. transparency is only nice to show off the desktop anyway and for consistency/good looks, but not so much when working or using apps, so this would turn back to opaque. Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2011 17:15:40 + From: afccarl1...@hotmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Integrate the top bar with the launcher. IMO, it should use 'chameleon theming' like the launcher and dash. That way, everything is consistent. There has even been talk of lightDM using chameleon theming once the user wallpaper transitions have been implimented, so this would tie in even further. The only issue with this is that applications have started to use a dark toolbar at the top to match the window decorations, and these might look out of place if the window decorations are changed. On Tue 22 Nov 2011 17:00:38 GMT, frederik.nn...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 17:25, Carl Ansell afccarl1...@hotmail.com mailto:afccarl1...@hotmail.com wrote: That would require a new theme, so that the top bar, indicator menus and window borders all look the same. On Tue 22 Nov 2011 11:33:11 GMT, Enrico Carafa wrote: In my opinion the top bar is too isolated from the launcher: the launcher has trasparency and the top bar is all black. We should integrate it better, like it results when the dash is opened. exactly. Everytime i open up an Indicator Menu, i notice how Unity is all transparent except for the indicator menus. Outch. It's like a blind spot in my eye. So-called application windows already do a good job occupying screen real estate with blank nothing, grey areas, chrome and background color, elements which have no purpose but to support the rectangular window metaphor. Starting with Unity, it would be a great step ahead, not to insist on rectangular shapes wherever possible, to keep one interface which is predominantly glass-looking consistent within itself and to start treating interactive display objects and indications independently from what we remember as windows. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] New design: Opening applications and documents automatically at login
Date: Sat, 19 Nov 2011 21:27:08 + From: m...@canonical.com To: Ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] New design: Opening applications and documents automatically at login -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Matthew Paul Thomas wrote on 20/10/11 16:34: ... For some people, it is useful to open particular applications or documents every time they log in. ... I'd appreciate your feedback on the design. https://live.gnome.org/Design/SystemSettings/LoginItems ... Thanks everyone for your feedback. I've made some changes based on your suggestions. https://live.gnome.org/action/info/Design/SystemSettings/LoginItems?action=diffrev2=18rev1=17 Omar B. wrote on 20/10/11 19:37: I like where things are going here, but wouldn't it be better to have a remember session(s) option (currently xfce, kde, etc. have it), Remembering what was open when you logged out is an orthogonal problem: you might want to do that instead, or as well. The Gnome developers seem incapable of implementing it, but there was a session at UDS about making the previous partly-working implementation available once more. https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-gnome-session also kde has Activities which is really great feature, is like having multiple user sessions with its own preferences, but very easy to manage, add , delete, stop ,etc. Can you give some examples of use cases for that? mpt I think a lot of the goals/features are similar, but since am not that familiar with the technical details for kde4 activities, i found these to be much better explained here: http://bsmith1012.blogspot.com/2011/02/my-kde-ideas-activities.html http://bsmith1012.blogspot.com/2011/02/changes-in-kde-46-activities.html ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover
I dont think those items are quicklists by right clicking. I think hes referring to a window list on mouse over (kinda how dockbar X does it, kde, etc. when app windows stack). Is fast way to switch between them. Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2011 09:53:56 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover Den 20. nov. 2011 21:38, skrev Luiz Felipe Talvik: http://ubuntuone.com/1BAZfzHSzpHYCtfW5neY4U http://ubuntuone.com/02CEbphUkex7mRqSdL5Yx7 I know Unity is aiming for simplicity, and is being inspired by newer OSes like android and iOS. But the work that people need to accomplish on the desktop is far more complex than what one does on a mobile. I still don't understand. In the first mockup, you show a quicklist with three spreadsheets. Sure, that could be nice. Doing things like that is what dynamic quicklists are for. It's up to the application to choose what should be displayed in that list. Whether you want to display most popular items, most recent items or the current items, is up to you. The launcher doesn't care about that. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover
Maybe it would be nice to raise the window when you hover an item in the list, so you get the best of both. that would also be very nice. I wonder what would be the devs opinion about this. will you submit this soon ? Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2011 21:03:46 -0200 From: tal...@gmail.com To: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover Window preview are overrated :P Windows from the same application tend to look the same: chat, terminals, file manager, spreadsheets, text editors, all kinds of documents.It also breaks the look and feel from the Launcher pop-up. IMHO, there is nothing easier to scan and search than text in a vertical layout. Maybe it would be nice to raise the window when you hover an item in the list, so you get the best of both. On 20 November 2011 20:10, Jo-Erlend Schinstad joerlend.schins...@gmail.com wrote: Den 20. nov. 2011 21:38, skrev Luiz Felipe Talvik: Recently I've done task in which I needed to refer to several spreadsheets and other documents. In Unity, changing between the open documents was quite difficult, I had to think to much to find a window and my focus was constantly shifting from the main task. The Launcher is quite agnostic to multiple window applications, so Unity relies to much on the window manager for this. I found it quite inferior to the more traditional task bar for this type of workflow. I've ended up running another task bar(tint2) to get my work done. Did you know that you can use alt+BAT (button above tab) to switch between document windows? It's quite efficient. Jo-Erlend schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover
I think you are a little confused. what he proposes is not a right click quicklist entry. Dockbar X already does this on hover (list of open windows): https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-cbKmMTymZ10/TneWpVhTz3I/F_4/Z34C763PuS0/dockbarx_windowlist_theme.png http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/165/9/b/Shinybar1_3_1_for_DockbarX_by_Levviathor.png and also does quicklists by right click: http://ubuntovod.ru/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/dockbarx-unity.png then what he wants is for the open windows in the background to raise when he hovers their entry in preview style. He would only switch to that window when he actually clicks. I personally havent found any issues with what he suggests. Is not very different from what you find in other window managers/docks and i believe it would increase usability, but developers may have something else in mind , so i dont know what they think about it. Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2011 12:57:39 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover Den 21. nov. 2011 12:36, skrev Omar B.: Maybe it would be nice to raise the window when you hover an item in the list, so you get the best of both. that would also be very nice. I wonder what would be the devs opinion about this. will you submit this soon ? I am a little worried about inconsistency here. It would be quite impossible to provide previews for all kinds of quicklist entries. If only some, or even a few, entries would have previews, that could quickly become confusing. The idea is nice, but I'm not sure how it would work in practice. More details are necessary. For instance, how would you generate a preview of a website that isn't open? Or dynamic diagrams of remote data? These are valid use cases for quicklists, but I don't really see how a preview would be easily possible and I think consistency is very important. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover
actually the mailing list is only for discussion. you will see loads of ideas flying around. But some of them may be very hard or impossible to implement. your suggestions seems practical and dockbarX already has something similar, would be great to see it in unity. https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-cbKmMTymZ10/TneWpVhTz3I/F_4/Z34C763PuS0/dockbarx_windowlist_theme.png to submit, file a bug report and assign it to ayatana-design. Am quoting Owais's instructions here: First assign the bug to ayatana-design, this will propagate the message to the design team. Once, they discuss the idea and confirm. They'll mark it as fix-released and then the actual code can land in Unity. Things might be actually bit different but that's how I understand them Good Job and Good Luck! :) -- Owais Lone he...@owaislone.org Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2011 09:45:11 -0200 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover From: tal...@gmail.com To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net I wonder what would be the devs opinion about this. will you submit this soon ? Submit where, how? I thought this mailing list was intended for that. By the way, where are patches discussed and approved? On 21 November 2011 09:36, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: Maybe it would be nice to raise the window when you hover an item in the list, so you get the best of both. that would also be very nice. I wonder what would be the devs opinion about this. will you submit this soon ? Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2011 21:03:46 -0200 From: tal...@gmail.com To: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] List windows on hover Window preview are overrated :P Windows from the same application tend to look the same: chat, terminals, file manager, spreadsheets, text editors, all kinds of documents.It also breaks the look and feel from the Launcher pop-up. IMHO, there is nothing easier to scan and search than text in a vertical layout. Maybe it would be nice to raise the window when you hover an item in the list, so you get the best of both. On 20 November 2011 20:10, Jo-Erlend Schinstad joerlend.schins...@gmail.com wrote: Den 20. nov. 2011 21:38, skrev Luiz Felipe Talvik: Recently I've done task in which I needed to refer to several spreadsheets and other documents. In Unity, changing between the open documents was quite difficult, I had to think to much to find a window and my focus was constantly shifting from the main task. The Launcher is quite agnostic to multiple window applications, so Unity relies to much on the window manager for this. I found it quite inferior to the more traditional task bar for this type of workflow. I've ended up running another task bar(tint2) to get my work done. Did you know that you can use alt+BAT (button above tab) to switch between document windows? It's quite efficient. Jo-Erlend schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
Well we live in a windows world, that's how things are and will be for many years to come (unfortunately). and i already have older gnome2 and lxde (for the oldest) computers setup and also windows computers. The problem is not that people dont like Unity, they do like it, they are attracted to it, but once they start using it, they see that it hides a lot of stuff and doesnt make them as obvious as other OSs/DEs and increasing the learning curve (this is not me saying it, that's the feedback i get). I want to help make unity better. Isnt that why we are at this Mailing list ? Why do you tell me to not use it ? testing unity in different situations is the only way to improve it. yes i have headaches everyday with the customers, some get it , Most dont. But i endure these headaches because they are providing *important feedback* that should not be dismissed ! I think that if ubuntu wants to be as popular as it wants to be, then it must pass the internet cafe test also. And am willing to help here. Now i was thinking about the problem all night and i think there might be a nice practical solution. A small improvement that will keep things how they are for power users but at the same time improve the usability for new users. Once i finish the details i will try to post it. Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2011 06:11:54 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity Den 18. nov. 2011 04:51, skrev Omar B.: - the items that now hide inside the MM are the icons (or what used to be icons in the panel/systray). ref. https://a248.e.akamai.net/assets.github.com/img/15183cadf2a9cdd7781aea9a6a22b84455adf703/687474703a2f2f6935342e74696e797069632e636f6d2f32343136787a6f2e706e67 No, that is not true. The entries are in the menu all the time. It's just the window that's being hidden. It doesn't have anything to do with the indicator. - users used to spot these icons quickly ref. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_FJH0hYZmVtc/TALwoQRxZrI/IBY/4Wxk1JmG-34/s1600/Selection_002.png Read Microsofts description of why that was a horrible idea and why they've wanted to get rid of it for more than a decade. In short, that system was completely incomprehensible because all apps would work in completely different ways. Some would use left-click, others would use right click. Some would use double-click and still some would use middle-click. They also didn't symbolize things in a similar way, so you would have to understand every single icon separately. You've completely drifted off course here, if your point was to make Unity easier to understand and learn. It is very difficult for me to understand why you would force people to use Unity if they want a similar environment to Windows 95. Use Lxpanel instead. Actually, we have panels that make Ubuntu look exactly like Windows. It is an extremely bad idea to have as a main objective that Ubuntu should be automatically useable as long as you're accustomed to Windows. Right. They're not used to it, and that seems to be your entire case. But it is not a valid argument. People used to say that about movies too, before you got sound. «Nobody will ever want to hear an actor speak», they said. «People aren't used to it.» That was also used as an argument against the use of telephone. People were used to sending telegrams, so adding telephone would be a bad idea. People were once used to entering commands, and the thought of using a mouse was difficult to understand. If your type of argument would win, we would still be entering commands for everything. You just can't let peoples habits get in the way of progress, because then there will be no progress. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
i agree with you. My dad has spent over 20.000 hours in front of a computer and he only knows how to use firefox, send an email, open a pdf and maybe login to skype (he cant install it without help). am sure another 10.920 hours will pass and he wont know much else. and as of younger generations i dont see them learning much either. majority of people use computers/internet just to connect with other people and that's it. They dont want to learn an OS. They may know a little of windows/office, because is thought in schools and everyone has windows in some computer. when apps hide inside the MM they are not obvious, is not just emesene. There needs to be a way to make it more obvious. Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2011 22:29:32 +0530 From: staticd.growthecomm...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity Jo-Erlend: If you spend three hours a day using your computer, then you will have spent 10.920 hours during the next ten years. Is it more important that a user can use the system without learning anything, or is it more important that the next 10.919 hours are as pleasant as possible? It is folly to believe that people should be able to be masterful computer users without spending even ten minutes learning how to use it. I agree completely. However that might be the geek in me responding to the geek in you :P (I)Usage case: In the case of my mother, many times she doesn't pick up shortcuts that require a little looking around to discover. This is because she (and maybe other computer users) are not comfortable or interested in experimenting. Things in the corners of the screen may not be obvious. We must keep in mind, that the less an (average) user has to read a manual, the better. (here, take this CD and become a full time ubuntu user) (I)Hence: The notifications are transient, indicators are persistent and invite action principle might need rethinking either in principle or in practice. The ayatana list (IMHO) is the best place to do it. (II)Usage case: 1)When a user is distracted by a notification and wants it to go away, there is no means of doing that 2)When a (new) user mouses over a notification they may want to interact with the associated programme (II)Design principles and Constraints: a)Notifications must not capture input focus when they appear b)Notifications must not suddenly appear below clickable areas, get clicked and do something unexpected c)Notifications must not be used as a means of acquiring user input/ invite action. (barring informing users about things they may act upon in other places) (II)Proposal: 1)To satisfy Design principles and constraints (a) and (b): the notification behaviour remains as it is for the first two seconds, 2)A mouse over after the delay will transform the notification to show a close and a help button(see attachment) 3)Clicking the help button will direct attention to the relevant indicator/ window/ status( How can this be implemented?) ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Making ubuntu more praktical by adding a taskbar
i think what you're asking for is an option for applications *not to stack* ? i think windows vista and kde have this option. that is what you did in your last screen/mockup. But you were duplicating the launcher. What you want is to take what you did in the right side and place that in the left. Now you see there is no need for 2 launchers. now with windows 7 with a quick hover is easy to identify the window you need. From: levancheli...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2011 23:11:38 + Subject: [Ayatana] Making ubuntu more praktical by adding a taskbar ubuntus new dash is not really practical because you lose a lot of time searching folders you are using and running software for exampled here is how my windows looks when i am working http://i.imgur.com/YpCQZ.png you can see task bar shows all the running software and folders i am using so i can choose and switch thru them without loosing any time or focus now how will this look on ubuntu http://i.imgur.com/5WXBa.png I think it is to hard to open your folders all over again or find your running software so what i think is to add a taskbar on the right side just like on the left but this should show running software and opened folders so while working not to loos any time http://i.imgur.com/M23Tm.png Task Bar can be added on the top right hand side in menubar, then dropdown menu appear with all open applications and folders -- This message was sent from Launchpad by Levan Chelidze (https://launchpad.net/~levanchelidze) using the Contact this team link on the Ayatana Discussion team page (https://launchpad.net/~ayatana). For more information see https://help.launchpad.net/YourAccount/ContactingPeople ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
- the items that now hide inside the MM are the icons (or what used to be icons in the panel/systray). ref. https://a248.e.akamai.net/assets.github.com/img/15183cadf2a9cdd7781aea9a6a22b84455adf703/687474703a2f2f6935342e74696e797069632e636f6d2f32343136787a6f2e706e67 - users used to spot these icons quickly ref. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_FJH0hYZmVtc/TALwoQRxZrI/IBY/4Wxk1JmG-34/s1600/Selection_002.png - now they only see this: nothing. And then ask: Sir i lost my app or Sir i see IM notifications but i dont see where app went to is not obvious that the app icon is now hidden inside that panel. Its a shift they are not used to and i see this everyday with dozens of people at the internet cafe (yea is awesome hearing complaints all day..), thus they ask to use other machines with older versions of ubuntu or windows (which i price higher to try to reduce demand). I have no proposal yet to fix this (visual?) regression, as there are too many variables that affect more than 1 party. So any proposal will eventually hear complaints from some power user. Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2011 19:42:42 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity Den 17. nov. 2011 19:17, skrev Omar B.: i agree with you. My dad has spent over 20.000 hours in front of a computer and he only knows how to use firefox, send an email, open a pdf and maybe login to skype (he cant install it without help). am sure another 10.920 hours will pass and he wont know much else. and as of younger generations i dont see them learning much either. majority of people use computers/internet just to connect with other people and that's it. They dont want to learn an OS. They may know a little of windows/office, because is thought in schools and everyone has windows in some computer. when apps hide inside the MM they are not obvious, is not just emesene. There needs to be a way to make it more obvious. Apps do not hide in indicators. Indicators also do not hide applications. The applications themselves make the window hidden. That can be caused by anything and this doesn't have anything to do with indicators at all. Should these notifications present themselves whenever an application was being hidden, for any reason, or do you propose that all applications that is able to hide its window should be patched? What exactly is the proposal, anyway? Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
you are a geek am sure you figure it out in 10 seconds, but i dont think you've actually seen new non technical users trying to use their applications and then getting hidden in that menu: https://github.com/emesene/emesene/issues/829 Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2011 19:23:00 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity Den 15. nov. 2011 19:15, skrev Omar B.: Yes, i think something like that would at least make it easier to understand. for example a popular site like facebook always shows the bubbles pointing to specific places of the screen so the user can spot where it came from or what needs attention. I believe they have made it more intuitive based on the feedback. How intuitive does it have to be? It's explained in less than ten seconds. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
It takes about ten seconds to explain that all kinds of messages is collected in the message menu and that the icon changes color when there is a change in status. Once you know this, the system is much easier, more efficient and comfortable to use than if you would have ten different icons acting in different ways, like we had before. and who will do the explanation ? you ? will you be the one holding the hand of every new non technical user ? will you tell them where their application is hidden ? I dont like to get into arguments and i think mm does help with the clutter, but you frequently like to counter-argument everything saying things are Fine how they are and new users are the ones that are wrong because they havent rtfm yet, but what are you doing to actually help these people ? Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2011 19:27:31 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity Den 16. nov. 2011 18:38, skrev Omar B.: you are a geek am sure you figure it out in 10 seconds, but i dont think you've actually seen new non technical users trying to use their applications and then getting hidden in that menu: https://github.com/emesene/emesene/issues/829 So your argument is that Ubuntu users are incapable of learning and understanding that the symbol for IM is now an envelope instead of a green dot? And I actually do know a little bit about new users since I've spent about fifteen years helping and teaching people how to use different types of technologies. I've worked with elderly, mentally challenged and other groups of people with little experience with computers. I do this, not only because I like sharing the knowledge I've attained by being a geek, but because I like to understand what the difficulties are. Once you understand how things work, you can't not understand it. The problem when people have an agenda, is that they tend to look for evidence to support their views, disregard those that doesn't and last but not least, project their own opinions onto the people they seek to understand. This is why we use the double blind tests, for instance. For instance, if you say Do you think it's intuitive to use the email symbol to symbolise other things than email?, most people will say no. If you ask Does it make sense to use an envelope to symbolise a message, then the answer might be slightly different. The bug report you're posting, is completely irrelevant. That is about Emesene not understanding that it's already running, which obviously it should. But what is it really you're proposing? Should there be a constant notification bubble whenever an app is running? Because that's what this thread is about, not the symbol for applications running in the background. It takes about ten seconds to explain that all kinds of messages is collected in the message menu and that the icon changes color when there is a change in status. Once you know this, the system is much easier, more efficient and comfortable to use than if you would have ten different icons acting in different ways, like we had before. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
Once they know, they don't need to be taught again. dont get me wrong i like and use MM, but what you say is right, you need to Teach this new behavior. And not every user gets it the first time, i have tried several times and failed, they keep asking where their app has hidden to... Hey where did it go? they ask. or excuse me sir, but it disappeared.. and this is not with one person. I run an internet cafe, so i see up to 100 people each day. This is a great way to see how new users react. I am in a sort of mini usability lab here. some get it, but most dont and its probably one of the areas they have more difficult with (along with global menu on non maximized apps). would be nice if MM displayed some kind of notification telling users their app has minimized inside or something like that. Would help avoid quite a few headaches for both users and employees. From: isan...@gmail.com Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2011 12:17:11 -0700 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity To: estela...@hotmail.com CC: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com; ayatana@lists.launchpad.net and who will do the explanation ? you ? will you be the one holding the hand of every new non technical user ? Yes, i think that's what he's suggesting. I think you missed the entire point of Jo-Erland's message. He's saying with the current design, you won't need to hold their hand for long. It's not hard understand the concepts presented, so even non-technical users will grasp it fairly quickly. Once they know, they don't need to be taught again. On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 12:12, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.com wrote: It takes about ten seconds to explain that all kinds of messages is collected in the message menu and that the icon changes color when there is a change in status. Once you know this, the system is much easier, more efficient and comfortable to use than if you would have ten different icons acting in different ways, like we had before. and who will do the explanation ? you ? will you be the one holding the hand of every new non technical user ? will you tell them where their application is hidden ? I dont like to get into arguments and i think mm does help with the clutter, but you frequently like to counter-argument everything saying things are Fine how they are and new users are the ones that are wrong because they havent rtfm yet, but what are you doing to actually help these people ? Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2011 19:27:31 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity Den 16. nov. 2011 18:38, skrev Omar B.: you are a geek am sure you figure it out in 10 seconds, but i dont think you've actually seen new non technical users trying to use their applications and then getting hidden in that menu: https://github.com/emesene/emesene/issues/829 So your argument is that Ubuntu users are incapable of learning and understanding that the symbol for IM is now an envelope instead of a green dot? And I actually do know a little bit about new users since I've spent about fifteen years helping and teaching people how to use different types of technologies. I've worked with elderly, mentally challenged and other groups of people with little experience with computers. I do this, not only because I like sharing the knowledge I've attained by being a geek, but because I like to understand what the difficulties are. Once you understand how things work, you can't not understand it. The problem when people have an agenda, is that they tend to look for evidence to support their views, disregard those that doesn't and last but not least, project their own opinions onto the people they seek to understand. This is why we use the double blind tests, for instance. For instance, if you say Do you think it's intuitive to use the email symbol to symbolise other things than email?, most people will say no. If you ask Does it make sense to use an envelope to symbolise a message, then the answer might be slightly different. The bug report you're posting, is completely irrelevant. That is about Emesene not understanding that it's already running, which obviously it should. But what is it really you're proposing? Should there be a constant notification bubble whenever an app is running? Because that's what this thread is about, not the symbol for applications running in the background. It takes about ten seconds to explain that all kinds of messages is collected in the message menu and that the icon changes color when there is a change in status. Once you know this, the system is much easier, more efficient and comfortable to use than if you would have ten different icons acting in different ways, like we had before. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https
Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity
For instance, these types of notifications have been used on TV for decades without people trying to touch their screens. the difference is that computers are interactive. if a user clicks a notification is because they want immediate access to it (high priority). While if you hover the mouse is just to see through, and if you dont do anything is because the msg is *low priority*. --- Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2011 18:57:25 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Notifications in unity No reason to discuss this. It is a core design value. Notifications are transient. Indicators are persistent. And it is not more intuitive that a bubble is clickable than it not being clickable. For instance, these types of notifications have been used on TV for decades without people trying to touch their screens. The only reason some people think it's more intuitive to click on bubbles, is that other operating systems have done so in the past. But you know, there are far more computer users in the future than in the past. Sticking to old ideas because they're well known now, is a bad idea. However, it would be very nice if apps started using the notification options in Unity properly. There are quite a few of them, for different purposes. Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] The dash should display recent stuff.
i like the idea. I think the dash should become like a central hub for many things the user does. With enough work it could be one of ubuntu's killa feature. and of course allow for some customization for what the user needs. anyway the discussions for changing the home screen are being held at: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/885738 Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2011 07:49:59 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] The dash should display recent stuff. I think the dash should be used to display recent stuff from your lenses. It should display recent email, recent comments on your blog, recently finished downloads, etc. I think it would also be nice if it only displayed the things you hadn't looked at. I don't know if it's currently possible, but it would be nice if it would order the sections themselves based on what's newest. Then, when something happens, you can very quickly react to it. For instance, when you download something, then can press super and enter to open the thing you downloaded. When you have opened that thing, it is removed from the dash, and the next time you open the dash, it will be sorted again based on the newest unseen thing. This way, it will act both as a personal news page, and as an efficient way to get to stuff you want to get to. What do you think? Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Lots of mockups, but what is the problem you're trying to solve?
some of this is already being looked at: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/885738 Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2011 13:14:53 +1000 From: james.g.jen...@gmail.com To: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Lots of mockups, but what is the problem you're trying to solve? On 13 November 2011 03:14, Jo-Erlend Schinstad joerlend.schins...@gmail.commailto:joerlend.schins...@gmail.com wrote: As I see it, those 8 buttons on the dash should be replaced. With what? The most used items from each section of the most used _private_ scopes. That is to say, it's ok to display music I have on my disk, but not music from music stores. IMHO the best default option for standard users would be to replace the current options with: * a row of the most commonly used programs * a row of the most recently used documents * a row of the most recently used multimedia Only question mark for both is should they be commonly used or recently used. Also an option to remove an entry is important. However for power users I think an option to allow users to choose what to display. Some may like it split and configurable, like a row grouped for music, source code, documents, etc. What other issues are there? There are a few, but those are not design issues, as far as I can see. I think keyboard shortcuts is _the_ thing to solve. Tab should not switch between lenses. It is very inconsistent with all other GUIs I've ever used, or at least that I can remember. Ctrl+tab should be used for that and ctrl+shift+tab to switch in the opposite direction. Tab should be used to switch from the search field to the sections and between them. Alt+num/char (1 to m) should be used as direct accessor for items. I'm so tired at seeing these icons and not be able to access them. I mean, I can run wesnoth about as quickly as I can decide to play. In the lenses, I spend lots of time just accessing things. It's annoying. Agree totally about tab. Using tab is so wrong, and breaks the conventional usage of tab. I don't see many design issues, most of them are purely preference. I would like to see the lens selection at the top and not the bottom, as I feel it should be closer to where your mouse is when you open the launcher with the mouse, but it's not a big issue. Visually, and otherwise technically, I really like the current way the lenses look and feels. If it was up to me, I wouldn't change much. But it isn't, so don't worry :) Funnily enough I kinda agree, however I find I never use the first set of 8 icons, I tend to either use an icon in the launcher or a different lens, generally the application or file one. Cheers, James. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Should we move closer to gnome again?
many of these apps will use clutter, and ubuntu will not include clutter in the LTS. That is why we are still at totem 3.0 (i think) and some older versions of gnome apps. They will after and include most of the latest. anyway, many of those projects just started development so we need to let the dust settles and see how they progress. they look very nice but we dont even know if they will replace or merge with existing apps... else there would be some duplication. and we have lots of eye candy already that people are just asking for more stability. bug fixes and accessibility and customization options ! :) Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2011 12:19:19 +0100 From: christ...@r-k-r.de To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Should we move closer to gnome again? I really like unity and dislike GnomeShell for different reasons. But Gnome plans some really cool stuff such as the recent mockups for various apps. http://afaikblog.wordpress.com/2011/11/10/gnome-design-update/ and http://www.webupd8.org/2011/11/new-updated-gnome-application-designs.htmlhttp://www.webupd8.org/2011/11/new-updated-gnome-application-designs.html#disqus_thread The question is shouldn't Ubuntu move as fast as possible to the latest gnome version so that they can implement most of these thinks in 12.04. 1) Music player: - banshee needs mono, is slow and still is a gtk2 app - rhythmbox looks ugly -- help Gnome implement the music mock up and you have it 2) Chat: the current look of empathy isn't really good 3) Videos: currently we have a video player and banshee: banshee has a library, video player not but banshee will be removed 4) network senntigs look a lot better in gs than in unity (here you have just to change the option in the connection indicator) 5) notifications: i really like the integration of empathy in GS you don't need to open a window just type something... and: Online accounts is nearly useless in unity and their is no calendar (although I prefer Thunderbird we need a calendar) But a think most important is: the farer we got from gnome the bigger the differences and the harder for gnome, canoncial and app developers to handle different shells ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Dash Home Mockup
looks like is following some of what is going to be redesigned https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/885738 Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2011 14:43:00 +1300 From: hairymonkey.e...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Dash Home Mockup Here is my mock up of what I think home dash should look like. -- Evan Lin ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Unity Lens Mockup.
one thing that troubles me about lenses at the moment, is that the entered text doesn't travel along when i move between lenses. The optimum would be, if there were no lenses at all and the computer could read my mind from the text i input. Somehow, Synapse (GnomeDO on steroids) got that one right. But enough of that.. beautiful mockups, especially #2, good lookin! the developers can't read your mind either :p why not open a bug ? oh and i like the lenses on top too, there's another good mockup here: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/11/better-positioning-lenses-within-the-dash-mockups/#comment-360955688 From: frederik.nn...@gmail.com Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2011 13:16:34 +0100 To: hairymonkey.e...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Unity Lens Mockup. On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 05:35, Evan Lin hairymonkey.e...@gmail.commailto:hairymonkey.e...@gmail.com wrote: I don't like how the lens are looking for 11.10 in unity so I made come mock ups. i'm lovin mockup n#2, the lenses integrated into the search bar beautifully, the message behind them being above the text field is that they are categories, i.e. hyper text, i.e. above in english. beautiful! one thing that troubles me about lenses at the moment, is that the entered text doesn't travel along when i move between lenses. The optimum would be, if there were no lenses at all and the computer could read my mind from the text i input. Somehow, Synapse (GnomeDO on steroids) got that one right. But enough of that.. beautiful mockups, especially #2, good lookin! ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] unity launcher position
there is an unofficial way to move it at the bottom: http://www.webupd8.org/2011/10/how-to-move-unity-launcher-to-bottom-of.html Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2011 08:57:07 +0100 From: vidulis...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] unity launcher position I am using unity 6 months. I am missing two things. 1. Why is launcher fixed on the left side? On wide screens there is quite far to reach it if you are on right side. Bottom is closer. But if there is no bottom place for it because of space, there is space on the right side. If I move mouse to the right there should be unity too, why not? I would like to have it on both sides. 2. Faster way to find a started application. Minimised applications are problem. We have alt-tab or i can find it on launcher. But if there is a lot of applications, it takes some time to find the proper window by alt tab. I am thinking of new special button on a launcher or short-cut key combination which would show new launcher with all active applications. It can be the same as alt-tab panel. But when it is not launched by alt- tab, I could choose application by mouse click on that panel. Simon ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] What should Unity look like on Smartphones and Tablets?
I think we need to do more than just shrinking down unity. If we are going to enter late game than we cant offer anything less than the competition if we want to make this new platform really *attractive*. And desing wise the phone unity needs to become a lot better looking than its *current* desktop counterpart. There is a lot to improve in the next 2 years. I believe this is another good read (what open source can learn from S. Jobs's mistakes and achievements): http://www.linuxinsider.com/story/73581.html Lots we can learn from his mistakes and the mistakes of others. Date: Tue, 8 Nov 2011 06:20:33 +0100 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] What should Unity look like on Smartphones and Tablets? Den 08. nov. 2011 00:24, skrev Omar B.: You can get some ideas here (maemo): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuYaOxfoJ1gfeature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhTtsZATwBQ The plans (ubuntu on phones): http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_itempx=MTAxMDY The critics (some very good comments): http://www.linuxinsider.com/rsstory/73688.html After you see and read those, we can get an idea of how to make ubuntu on mobile and hybrids a success. If not we lose... Really? I actually disagreed with most of that. But let's handle the mistakes lots of people are making. They think that Unity is a visual design. Unity is first and foremost a set of APIs. Then, there is a visual design implemented by two primary interfaces, and a few others. For instance, as I understand it, both LXDE and Xfce supports indicators. They don't look and feel identical to how they look and feel in Unity, of course. That's the point. You move the task of displaying these things away from the app and onto the shell. The same is true for all parts of Unity, be it the global menus, indicators, notifications, the launcher or lenses. They don't have to _look_ the same way. They have to have the same features. This is perfectly compatible with mobile phones. So, when people say that Unity will fail because you can't have the same interfaces on different devices, they've completely misunderstood the point, which is that if you know how to make an app for the desktop, then you also automatically know how to make an app for a tablet or for a phone. This is not true for any current operating system, unless you count HTML-apps, which is so user hostile, I don't even understand how anyone can consider it a viable option. As an example, on desktops, if you need help with the current application, then you press F1. The web doesn't even have _that_. Then there is the omnipresent notion that it is too late. Too late? Most people who are alive today, have no experience with computers at all. Of those who do, a great many do not have a strong preference. And loyalty is declining, which is obviously a very good thing for everyone. I've been using web browsers for about twenty years now. Does that mean Google Chrome cannot become a viable option to Internet Explorer and Firefox, who both joined at an early stage? Reality seems to disagree with the people who speculates that it's too late. Another popular claim is that Ubuntu cannot succeed on the phone because Canonical won't get any exclusive partnerships with hardware manufacturers. But I don't agree with the assumption that hardware manufacturers will want these kinds of exclusive partnerships. Why on earth should they refuse to take my money because I prefer Android to Windows Phone, or Ubuntu to Android? Or what if I want to dual boot? I have a Nokia N8. I really love the phone, but the software is so horrible, I can hardly use it. If I could install Android on it, or Ubuntu -- even current Ubuntu with no modifications -- then I would. If Nokia doesn't want to sell me a phone unless use Symbian, then I've bought my last Nokia phone. It's that easy. Hardware manufacturers aren't stupid enough to reject even a few million customers. It is certainly not too late. To learn from that thought, is to admit defeat without even raising the shield -- much less the sword. After all, most computer users haven't even been born yet. Computers is not a fad. Let me quote Churchill: «Now... this is not the end. It is not even the beginning ... of the end. Though, it is perhaps the end of the beginning.» Wow, I didn't intend for this to become so verbose. :) Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list
Re: [Ayatana] What should Unity look like on Smartphones and Tablets?
You can get some ideas here (maemo): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuYaOxfoJ1gfeature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhTtsZATwBQ The plans (ubuntu on phones): http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_itempx=MTAxMDY The critics (some very good comments): http://www.linuxinsider.com/rsstory/73688.html After you see and read those, we can get an idea of how to make ubuntu on mobile and hybrids a success. If not we lose... From: isan...@gmail.com Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2011 14:37:28 -0700 To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] What should Unity look like on Smartphones and Tablets? At UDS-P, Mark announced his plans to have Ubuntu on Tablets, phones, and TVs by 14.04 LTS. You can start too early! http://i.imgur.com/56vDn.jpg I'd like feedback from the Ayatana community on the design. Is there anything that should be changed, or added? Possibly removed? Is there anything that isn't clear? -- Ian Santopietro Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html Eala Earendel enlga beorohtast Ofer middangeard monnum sended Pa gur yv y porthaur? Public GPG key (RSA): http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x412F52DB1BBF1234 ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Fwd: Serious issues
I agree. people like that is pretty and that is great, they become curious. and for browsing the web is fine. but for getting anything done it can be harder and sadly many become frustrated and lose the interest. if ubuntu can fix the bugs for precise it will be awesome. the global needs *lots of work*: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/682788 and the launcher also needs more work too to really get out of the way. gnome-shell is worse at the moment, but is getting Tons of extensions so you can customize it exactly how you want or need it. Unity cant stay behind... From: gespert...@gmail.com Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2011 19:54:09 -0300 To: isan...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Fwd: Serious issues Last week I conducted a workshop on libre graphics tools in an important meeting here in Argentina. The attendees were people who don't use graphics programs regularly (and most of them don't use gnu/linux at all). We had Ubuntu 11.10 with Unity in the classroom's computers. Unity proved to be a negative experience for most of them. The ugliest experience was for people with 17 CRT monitors (some computers had them), where the global menu wasn't wide enough to display the menus. Launcher popping up everytime they wanted to use the main toolbox (GIMP and Inkscape) was another important issue. They also experienced problems with focus of applications. Sometimes GIMP lost focus and using the menu or switching apps with launcher required to make an extra click on GIMP's window. They were regular people using applications that are available in Ubuntu's software centre. They weren't a minority who needs to be productive with graphic design (as I do). Every single person trying to adjust a birthday photo with GIMP or trying to create a christmas card for their relatives with Inkscape will bump with these issues. What's the next excuse? That GIMP and Inkscape are broken for Unity and their developers should work something that wasn't an issue until Unity? Sorry if this seems like I'm trolling, but It's pretty frustrating to get always the same reply when somebody points out a real issue: unity works for the majority. If you can't use it, then you're part of a minority that should use anything else. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Unity Dash mockup
is not bad but is till to be seen how this looks with all the normal elements. maybe a mockup to compare side by side (1px vs current)? Date: Sun, 6 Nov 2011 15:12:19 +0100 From: bogandm...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Unity Dash mockup Hi, I don't really like the current Dash border, so I started working on a mockup (https://plus.google.com/104888645168610370479/posts/BoAcd3c2Ek1). Different separator line, thinner dash border. I think the Dash looks nicer with the 1px border and with the new separator line the content is more focused to the user. What do you think about it? András Bognár ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] option to disable Unity launcher
I don't follow this list consistently, so I am not clear on this, is it a matter of the devs haven't gotten around to it yet, or is the design team outright opposed to doing it? i think it may be the first Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2011 16:26:25 -0400 From: anthropor...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] option to disable Unity launcher For me personally, a garden variety dock on the bottom of my screen is still more useful than the Unity launcher. In this case, I am using Docky, and in the screenshot below, you can see both the launcher and Docky on my desktop, and it just looks more cluttered than it needs to: http://i.imgur.com/vUQcW.jpg Will Canonical ever permit the user to disable the launcher so that he or she can use the dock of their choice (or something else altogether)? I don't follow this list consistently, so I am not clear on this, is it a matter of the devs haven't gotten around to it yet, or is the design team outright opposed to doing it? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] option to disable Unity launcher
i dont understand his reply either but i think this would be a better source: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/11/ubuntu-desktop-designers-clarify-on-configurability Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2011 17:47:32 -0400 From: anthropor...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] option to disable Unity launcher I'm not sure I understand your reply, I cannot tell if you are being facetious or what On 11/01/2011 04:44 PM, Jo-Erlend Schinstad wrote: Den 01. nov. 2011 21:26, skrev anthropornis: Will Canonical ever permit the user to disable the launcher so that he or she can use the dock of their choice (or something else altogether)? Canonical has chosen to permit 100% configurability. Is that awesome, or what? Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] shortcut - open/focus last program that send a notification
gnome-shell lets you click on some notifications, even reply IM. The behavior is per app and is nice. Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 19:43:36 -0400 From: joerlend.schins...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] shortcut - open/focus last program that send a notification Den 31. okt. 2011 19:25, skrev James Jenner: I only say this because often I will see a notification from an application that is on a different workspace and the effort to open said application would be simplified if I could just click the notification (which currently just makes the notification go fuzzy, not sure on the logic for this). Again, maybe it's just the notifications I'm dealing with and maybe other notifications support this. The logic is that it should be possible to notify a user without requiring any action from that user that will be annoying and cause loss of focus. It would be inconsistent if some notifications would require an action and other not. Also, suddenly displaying a clickable notification above your application can have some very unexpected consequences. For instance, say I have Thunderbird maximized and I want to search my emails. I click the search field to give it focus, but at the moment I click, there is a notification. Because I clicked so quickly, I could not see what the notification was about. With your suggestion, it would also open another application and give it focus. Notifications are transient. They do not usually require an action, though I think it's possible for applications to present actionable notifications though they are discouraged. Indicators, on the other hand, is well suited for things that require an action. You also have status information on launcher entries, with quicklists that can make it easy to react to them. In addition to notifications, indicators and launcher entry status, you also have application urgency, which makes the entry shake and the window open arrow turn blue. Because this is urgent, I think it would make sense to have a keyboard shortcut to focus it. The question is what keyboard shortcut to use. Ctrl+BAT might be useful. (BAT == Button Above Tab -- and Tab backwards :)) Jo-Erlend Schinstad ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Dash Buggy Ubuntu 11.10
bug report link ? From: rtg...@gmail.com Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2011 22:48:15 -0500 To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Dash Buggy Ubuntu 11.10 Hi. I have one thing to say about 11.10. When Unity works, it looks fantastic. Sometimes (I have already filed this as a bug), Unity really hangs and graphics lag when an open window is in-minimized, or maximized. Sometimes, I have no issues with this problem. Sometimes though, this problem occurs. Any ideas on why this happens when it does? Thanks! ---Ryan Sent from my iPod ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] semi-transparent indicator menus
As others have mentioned the transparency of the panel should be dynamic. when a windows is maximized it should go back to opaque. It could even be made transparent by default, similar to how the unity greeter (lightdm) looks From: frederik.nn...@gmail.com Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2011 17:00:32 +0100 To: m...@canonical.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] semi-transparent indicator menus On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 23:27, Matthew Paul Thomas m...@canonical.commailto:m...@canonical.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Which do you think is more important: for indicator menus to have the same style as other pull-down menus, or the same style as the Dash? a homogenous surface called Unity, preferrably transparency-enabled, so the Dash. The Dash partly solves this readability problem by using larger text whenever possible. Menus can't. I think the Dash and the Unity Launcher are handsome, because they form a see-through overlay interface above live content, kinda like a sheet of blurry glass. It's a quite comprehensible metaphor, only that the top-right-corner part of this metaphor is broken, i can't see through it. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Indicator menu
yea, but almost everything in gnome-shell is customizable. and the menus can look so much prettier: https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-5N8Q3f3yUSw/Tfcv9xypOcI/E5A/ctcueAJBfIk/before-patch.png https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_1QSDkzYY2vc/Tay4A75Y9hI/EBY/zfSw55W1Lgs/gnome-shell-atolm1.png would like to see similar in unity or at least more options for theming. From: peterson@gmail.com Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 09:59:05 -0200 To: kostas.syt...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Indicator menu This is one of the things I persoanlly hate on Gnome 3. At least the default theme and spacing of everything makes it look a little bit childish. Don't bash on me: I'm actually kind of hooked into the way it handles workspaces and windows; I can't help but joyfully play with it when I'm using my girlfriends' account =P However, its looks are so... 'Basicky' and so unrefined. What I guess I'm trying to say is that Mac OS X and its rounded corners: I'm all in for them, if they don't have them patented. But that baloon? Seems like a circus to me =( (Btw, I'm aware that they are on the Unity Launcher (sorta), and I think that's one of the subconscious reasons I don't use the right-click on it so much, even if I have two of three quicklists set up =P) Peterson http://petercast.net On 29 October 2011 06:16, Kostas Sytske kostas.syt...@gmail.commailto:kostas.syt...@gmail.com wrote: I think it looks better when Ubuntu will use the same kind of pop-up balloon as Gnome 3 does. You can see what I mean in the screenshot. In Apple OS X the menu looks more smooth because of subtle round corners. http://osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/wireless-info-airport-menu.jpg The subtle changes make a OS look good. Best regards, Kostas ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.netmailto:ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Indicator menu
GS has many very good looking themes already. While i do use unity, i do envy some of their themes and things that can be customized. if you search you can find many, but here are a few i found: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/10/five-pretty-awesome-gnome-shell-themes/ and on webupd8.org From: peterson@gmail.com Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 15:54:09 -0200 Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Indicator menu To: estela...@hotmail.com Omar what's the name of that theme on the second picture? It looks a 10 million times more professional and good-looking. Goddess. Peterson http://petercast.net On 29 October 2011 14:23, Omar B. estela...@hotmail.commailto:estela...@hotmail.com wrote: yea, but almost everything in gnome-shell is customizable. and the menus can look so much prettier: https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-5N8Q3f3yUSw/Tfcv9xypOcI/E5A/ctcueAJBfIk/before-patch.png https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/_1QSDkzYY2vc/Tay4A75Y9hI/EBY/zfSw55W1Lgs/gnome-shell-atolm1.png would like to see similar in unity or at least more options for theming. From: peterson@gmail.commailto:peterson@gmail.com Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 09:59:05 -0200 To: kostas.syt...@gmail.commailto:kostas.syt...@gmail.com CC: ayatana@lists.launchpad.netmailto:ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Indicator menu This is one of the things I persoanlly hate on Gnome 3. At least the default theme and spacing of everything makes it look a little bit childish. Don't bash on me: I'm actually kind of hooked into the way it handles workspaces and windows; I can't help but joyfully play with it when I'm using my girlfriends' account =P However, its looks are so... 'Basicky' and so unrefined. What I guess I'm trying to say is that Mac OS X and its rounded corners: I'm all in for them, if they don't have them patented. But that baloon? Seems like a circus to me =( (Btw, I'm aware that they are on the Unity Launcher (sorta), and I think that's one of the subconscious reasons I don't use the right-click on it so much, even if I have two of three quicklists set up =P) Peterson http://petercast.net On 29 October 2011 06:16, Kostas Sytske kostas.syt...@gmail.commailto:kostas.syt...@gmail.commailto:kostas.syt...@gmail.commailto:kostas.syt...@gmail.com wrote: I think it looks better when Ubuntu will use the same kind of pop-up balloon as Gnome 3 does. You can see what I mean in the screenshot. In Apple OS X the menu looks more smooth because of subtle round corners. http://osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/wireless-info-airport-menu.jpg The subtle changes make a OS look good. Best regards, Kostas ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.netmailto:ayatana@lists.launchpad.netmailto:ayatana@lists.launchpad.netmailto:ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.netmailto:ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Indicator menu
gs elegance theme would fit better on your mockup :) http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-OzLTDEl2Y9k/Tp2HANU6u9I/BYo/8YiAkSsI804/s1600/Elegance+Gnome+Shell+Theme.png http://www.ubuntuvibes.com/2011/10/elegance-gnome-shell-theme.html Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2011 10:16:31 +0200 From: kostas.syt...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] Indicator menu I think it looks better when Ubuntu will use the same kind of pop-up balloon as Gnome 3 does. You can see what I mean in the screenshot. In Apple OS X the menu looks more smooth because of subtle round corners. http://osxdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/wireless-info-airport-menu.jpg The subtle changes make a OS look good. Best regards, Kostas ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] semi-transparent indicator menus
Would look more consistent and nice. some mockups: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_JSR8IC77Ub4/TTRwD1iIvKI/BoM/yxWXeJR6ZCo/s1600/unity_global_menu_idea_by_musl1m-d3400kk.png http://musl1m.deviantart.com/art/Unity-Global-Menu-Idea-188117732 Also, gnome-shell menus look way better, so unity is very far behind here and is looking outdated compared to many shells, even the commercial ones. From: frederik.nn...@gmail.com Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 13:12:56 +0200 To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] semi-transparent indicator menus Unity introduces a new look, but Indicators Menus, which were there before the Dash, are not yet up to date in that respect. Obviously, there is no alpha for indicator menus, no way to set transparency in CCSM for them. I'd like to have control over that as a power user, power user being the bridge between designers, developers and plain users. the main reason i see for having transparent indicator menus is visual consistency: finally, we'd have one unified look for all of Unity, of which Indicator Menus imo are a part. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] semi-transparent indicator menus
totally agree with dynamic transparent only when no maximized windows. Transparency is only needed anyway when no window is maximized. Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 21:18:49 +0200 From: faiface2...@gmail.com To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] semi-transparent indicator menus But take a look on how it looks when window is maximized in attached pictures. As I proposed some time ago, panel should be dynamic, transparent only when there is no maximized window and normal when there is. On 10/28/2011 08:48 PM, Omar B. wrote: Would look more consistent and nice. some mockups: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_JSR8IC77Ub4/TTRwD1iIvKI/BoM/yxWXeJR6ZCo/s1600/unity_global_menu_idea_by_musl1m-d3400kk.png http://musl1m.deviantart.com/art/Unity-Global-Menu-Idea-188117732 Also, gnome-shell menus look way better, so unity is very far behind here and is looking outdated compared to many shells, even the commercial ones. From: frederik.nn...@gmail.com Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2011 13:12:56 +0200 To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: [Ayatana] semi-transparent indicator menus Unity introduces a new look, but Indicators Menus, which were there before the Dash, are not yet up to date in that respect. Obviously, there is no alpha for indicator menus, no way to set transparency in CCSM for them. I'd like to have control over that as a power user, power user being the bridge between designers, developers and plain users. the main reason i see for having transparent indicator menus is visual consistency: finally, we'd have one unified look for all of Unity, of which Indicator Menus imo are a part. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Dash More Apps and Find Files options are redundant
Yes, that is true we now need 5 clicks. And if you close and reopen the dash that is another 2 or 3 extra clicks. Anyway the question is what is that users are looking for ? the dash has lots more potential to be easier and smarter than the old menus... -Example1: Is it a recently installed app ? Then the recently installed could appear when you open dash (right in the main dash screen where new users will spot it quickly and not just in the apps lens. Do they even know or need to know what is an apps lens). -Example2: Is it an app that the user uses on a regular basis but prefers not to have it cluttering the launcher or visible to everyone (like work stuff)? I think the user should be able to customize the dash shortcuts from a configuration screen. Linuxmint has a configuration utility that lets you config those shortcuts in the menu. They dont want inexperience users to mess up the menu either, so the configuration is separate. mint menu config example: http://slashsarc.com/tag/linux-mint/ The Main dash screen indeed needs work and some customization to become and practical. Search should not be used for everything, but for when the user really needs to. Search is great, but it has always been for when users cant find things easily, is not something they want to do every 5 minutes for the same thing. That reminds me about search history... Configuring shortcuts will always be essential. I for one dont want to search for this mailing list everytime, it's why i added it to my bookmarks/shortcuts and to my mail, which is faster and takes less effort than doing another search. Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2011 18:19:01 +0100 From: m.richardson.1...@hotmail.co.uk To: ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Ayatana] Dash More Apps and Find Files options are redundant Another potential would be to have the dash initial view show large icons for other lenses, followed by small icons for each of the application categories. The application categories would address the bugbear of some users who transition from gnome 2 in that opening applications by category (as in the old style gnome 2 menu) using the mouse now requires the user to click the dash, click the applications lense, click filter results, click the category they want to view and then click the application (5 clicks compared to the old style menu of 2 clicks). If the categories were shown on the dash it would reduce this to 3 clicks (dash category application) Thoughts? Matt On 21/10/11 10:59, Matt Richardson wrote: With the inclusion of the Applications and Files lenses in the dash, the two buttons More Apps and Find Files on the initial view of the dash are somewhat redundant. Perhaps a better use of these buttons would be Office Apps and Settings, with each behaving similar to the Media Apps or Internet Apps buttons. This would make it easier for new users to find commonly used software (office) and find how to change settings. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] New design: Opening applications and documents automatically at login
I like where things are going here, but wouldn't it be better to have a remember session(s) option (currently xfce, kde, etc. have it), also kde has Activities which is really great feature, is like having multiple user sessions with its own preferences, but very easy to manage, add , delete, stop ,etc. From: eapa...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2011 12:50:57 -0400 To: m...@canonical.com CC: Ayatana@lists.launchpad.net; seb...@ubuntu.com Subject: Re: [Ayatana] New design: Opening applications and documents automatically at login On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Matthew Paul Thomas m...@canonical.com wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi folks For some people, it is useful to open particular applications or documents every time they log in. (For example, every day when I log in at work, I launch XChat, Firefox, and a time sheet text document.) Every version of Ubuntu has had a Startup Applications settings window for choosing applications to open automatically at login. Gnome 3 in Ubuntu 11.10 now has an integrated System Settings window (gnome-control-center). But it does not yet integrate these particular settings. So, yesterday I finished a design for these settings in the System Settings window. My design extends the existing User Accounts panel; this avoids adding an extra panel, lets administrators troubleshoot login items for other accounts, and lets them set items for the guest account. It also allows opening files, not just applications. I'd appreciate your feedback on the design. https://live.gnome.org/Design/SystemSettings/LoginItems Very nice, I quite like it! One thing that I would like it to support is mounting partitions. I have my music on a separate internal NTFS partition so that it can be accessed by Windows. At the moment, the first thing I have to do when I log in is browse to that folder in Nautilus so that it gets mounted (by gvfs?). The only way currently to have a partition auto-mount on login is via /etc/fstab, which affects all users and requires root access. An Add Partition... option below the Add Shell Command... option would be absolutely fantastic. (Obviously the label and location are subject to change). Just my two cents, Evan ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
