[backstage] Ofcom opens debate on net neutrality
http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consumer/2010/06/ofcom-opens-debate-on-net-neutrality/ Ofcom today published a discussion paper on the practice of internet traffic management – a technique used by network operators and internet service providers (ISPs) to stem or accelerate the flow of traffic over the web. This practice may allow network operators and ISPs to handle traffic more efficiently, to prioritise traffic by type, to guarantee bandwidth or to block or degrade the quality of certain content. However, it has also led to concerns that network operators and ISPs could engage in anti-competitive behaviour and suppress the quality of content from provider services. Discussion Ofcom has some existing powers and duties which could be applied to traffic management, for example, by requiring suppliers to be transparent about their traffic management practices. These will be strengthened by amended EU rules that will be transposed into UK law in 2011. In addition Ofcom has existing competition powers that may be relevant. The purpose of today’s paper is to open up a discussion on how these existing and future powers might be used to address traffic management concerns and what stance Ofcom should take on any potential anti-competitive discrimination. It also raises questions about transparency and consumers’ awareness of the traffic management policy of the broadband service they have paid for. ‘Further the interests of consumers’ ‘New EU rules give regulators a clear responsibility to address the emerging issues around traffic management. The question is how Ofcom uses these and existing powers to further the interests of consumers, while supporting vibrant, innovative content production and network deployment,’ said Ofcom Chief Executive, Ed Richards. ‘The internet is playing an increasingly central role in the lives of citizens, consumers and industry. It provides access to an ever growing range of content, applications and services that we have come to both expect and depend on. How this access is controlled by ISPs affects us all and is of wide reaching significance. ‘At the heart of this discussion is how to ensure that traffic management practices are transparent and how to ensure that traffic management is not used for anti-competitive discrimination.’ What is net neutrality? Net neutrality is a concept based on the internet being a level playing field for internet traffic. There are several definitions, but all share a concern that traffic management by network operators and ISPs could lead to discrimination between different traffic carried over the internet. What is happening in other countries? In line with the growing significance of the internet and its increasingly central role in peoples’ lives, international interest in ‘net neutrality’ and traffic management has increased significantly over the last two years. Other countries including the US, Canada, France, Norway and Sweden have adopted or are considering some form of regulatory requirements relating to traffic management. The European Commission is due to publish a consultation on the issue this summer. Why is Ofcom involved? Ofcom has existing powers and duties in this area and these will be strengthened by amended EU rules that will be transposed into UK law in 2011. These include potential powers to oblige operators to be transparent about the traffic management techniques that they put in place. What happens next? Ofcom is seeking preliminary views on the issues raised in its discussion paper. It will also conduct a series of roundtables with industry, citizen and consumer groups over the summer. The discussion paper can be found here http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/net-neutrality/ and closes on 9 September 2010. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Ofcom opens debate on net neutrality
Glyn Wintle wrote: http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consumer/2010/06/ofcom-opens-debate-on-net-neutrality/ What is net neutrality? Net neutrality is a concept based on the internet being a level playing field for internet traffic. There are several definitions, but all share a concern that traffic management by network operators and ISPs could lead to discrimination between different traffic carried over the internet. IMO - this is not a particularly useful description. Quotas and other technical measures - deep packet inspection - shaping - bandwidth limits are not put in place - generally - because the ISPs hate us. They are put in place to protect the network. Proritising classes of traffic can be less bad than the alternatives. A) Build out the network to take several times the peak yearly demand. B) Apply a really low quota, to reduce the peak demand, as everyone is scared of blowing it, and not being able to use the net that month. C) (what is usually spoken of as net neutrality) Whitelisting some sites to improve their performance. And other possible alternatives. Speaking in terms of plusnet - they have several classes of users - depending on how much they've paid. Pay a lot, and your connection is flat, and goes at line rate almost all the time (except when extreme once-a-year peaks of demand hit). Pay very little, and your VOIP goes smoothly, without delayed packets, and all interactive protocols are prioritised highly, but bulk file transfers are shaped down to a very small amount in peak hours. Bandwidth is rarely free. Net neutrality is normally not neutrality in terms of protocols, but neutrality in terms of content provider. It's the idea that - for example - the BBC iplayer site runs just as slowly or as fast on any connection, as '4oD', or Dave Doing the Dishes video player. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Ofcom opens debate on net neutrality
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 12:13, Ian Stirling backstage...@mauve.plus.com wrote: Proritising classes of traffic can be less bad than the alternatives. No, they're a bloody stupid way of doing it. By all means, offer it as an option for those users who don't know how to configure QoS/prioritisation at the CPE side, but charging *more* to turn that off is retarded. Indeed, if you pitch it that way, you can sell it as a value-add instead of having to get embroiled in debates like this. It also gives you more flexibility to deal with the you're mis-classifying my traffic as BitTorrent when it's actually a MMORPG! issues which arise comparatively regularly. But then, sane marketing has never been ISPs' strong suits. A) Build out the network to take several times the peak yearly demand. B) Apply a really low quota, to reduce the peak demand, as everyone is scared of blowing it, and not being able to use the net that month. C) (what is usually spoken of as net neutrality) Whitelisting some sites to improve their performance. Nowadays, net neutrality is commonly used to refer to both. And other possible alternatives. What, you mean like the sensible one? Your 'dumb pipe' connection is throttled back according to how much you're shifting in relation to everybody else (which has been a feature of networking kit for decades, of course). If the user wants to make sure their SSH connections are responsive even when pulling the most a connection will allow at a given time, they can prioritise them at their end. Bandwidth is rarely free. I don't think anybody (sane) has actually claimed it is? Net neutrality is normally not neutrality in terms of protocols, but neutrality in terms of content provider. It's the idea that - for example - the BBC iplayer site runs just as slowly or as fast on any connection, as '4oD', or Dave Doing the Dishes video player. Once upon a time that was the case, until people started rolling out DPI kit to do application-layer throttling. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Ofcom opens debate on net neutrality
Mo McRoberts wrote: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 12:13, Ian Stirling backstage...@mauve.plus.com wrote: Proritising classes of traffic can be less bad than the alternatives. No, they're a bloody stupid way of doing it. And other possible alternatives. What, you mean like the sensible one? Your 'dumb pipe' connection is throttled back according to how much you're shifting in relation to everybody else (which has been a feature of networking kit for This does not take into account the inherently bursty nature of some applications. Regrettably, most people do not know how to setup QOS. Are you seriously arguing that everyone should have a deep understanding of QOS, or a high speed unlimited package if they want their VOIP not to stutter when someone else in the house downloads a 3 meg PDF? IMO - traffic prioritisation - when done in an open transparent manner (and yes, there are issues on traffic trying to pretend to be something it's not) is less bad than the alternatives. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Ofcom opens debate on net neutrality
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 12:48, Ian Stirling backstage...@mauve.plus.com wrote: Regrettably, most people do not know how to setup QOS. yes, which is why I accounted for that right at the beginning of my e-mail... Are you seriously arguing that everyone should have a deep understanding of QOS, or a high speed unlimited package if they want their VOIP not to stutter when someone else in the house downloads a 3 meg PDF? nope. not least because that's not what I said. I'd be interested, though: do plusnet priotise RTP sessions ahead of HTTP? can you differentiate between somebody pulling an RTP stream containing some TV and having a VoIP call? what about SSH? can customers choose the ordering? IMO - traffic prioritisation - when done in an open transparent manner (and yes, there are issues on traffic trying to pretend to be something it's not) is less bad than the alternatives. open and transparent is good. *not mandating it* needs to be part of that, too. make it an extra, a selling point - 'we do it so that you don't have to worry about it, but if you want to, you can always turn it off'. nothing to do with traffic 'pretending to be something it's not', rather it's the fact that inspection technology is inherently (and, depending upon what you're using it, fatally) imperfect. M. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] Ofcom opens debate on net neutrality
Of course bandwidth is free ... (Just confirming peoples suspicions about my sanity). The only thing that isn't free, is widely regarded as free, but then that might become a philosophical discussion. And property rights confuse the issue. You get huge amounts of free extra bandwidth when you purchase a new router. Technology doubles the available bandwidth every twelve months. Haven't they just ratified the 40 and 100 Gb/s standards. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/06/22/ieee_802_dot_3ba_ratified/ http://www.ethernetalliance.org/files/static_page_files/F5BB8944-1D09-3519-ADA94D227208E301/HSE%20FAQ%20_02_0601%20_2_.pdf Don't make me get the George Gilder out ... Seriously make your points, I just wanted to indicate my position. (and have some fun). And then there is the mobile phone networks... - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
