Re: HP 2108A key

[Ed Sharpe via cctalk]

I dunno what all thathe means  I am offering to
.look thru shoe box of keys I Ave one if the thin mx processors  do not 
temember what number but I know Keyes not in it... I used to come home after a 
hard day with computers and if I had weird keys 30 plus years ago they went 
into a box or plastic bag..


Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Wednesday, September 20, 2017 Dennis Boone via cctalk 
 wrote:
If we can id the Chicago double-sided key Mike _does_ need, I can
probably make it.

The CCL 4T1427 key, which is NOT what Mike needs, would be cut on an
Ilco S1003A blank, cuts 1427 bow-to-tip.

The CAT99 key I see referenced in the list archives (might open a cab
back door) would be on an Ilco S1000V, cuts 5 bow-to-tip.

De

Re: HP 2108A key

[Dennis Boone via cctalk]

If we can id the Chicago double-sided key Mike _does_ need, I can
probably make it.

The CCL 4T1427 key, which is NOT what Mike needs, would be cut on an
Ilco S1003A blank, cuts 1427 bow-to-tip.

The CAT99 key I see referenced in the list archives (might open a cab
back door) would be on an Ilco S1000V, cuts 5 bow-to-tip.

De

RE: HP 2108A key

[Ed Sharpe via cctalk]

I need a key number... do you have that jay?

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Wednesday, September 20, 2017 Mike Loewen via cctalk  
wrote:

The key is for this switch on the front panel of the 2108A:

http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/HP/2108A/HP2108A-8L.jpg


Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology  http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Ed Sharpe via cctalk wrote:

> what is the key# does mike need???
>
> Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
>
> On Wednesday, September 20, 2017 Jay West via cctalk  
> wrote:
> No, that key won't work. The one Mike is looking for is dual sided key and 
> controls a switch (off, on, standby, etc.). Yours the key is just a latch.
>
> I had a ton of those A machines, but guess I traded them all off. 
> Wouldn't surprise me, I standardized on the newer power supplies and E-series.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jay Jaeger 
> via cctalk
> Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2017 4:13 PM
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
> Subject: Re: HP 2108A key
>
> Well, I don't think you checked with *this* Jay. ;)
>
> Would the key from an HP 2112B likely work? It looks very much like the
> 2108A, just a tad larger (more cards). I have an HP 2112B, and it has
> its key.
>
> See a photo at :
>
> http://webpages.charter.net/thecomputercollection/hp/hp2112b.htm
>
> The key is 1 1/2" long, and has the number 4T1427 stamped on it.
>
> JRJ
>
>
> On 9/19/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone have a key for a HP 2108A? This is one of the original
>> 21MX M-series machines. The key is NOT the same as for the E and
>> F-series machines.
>>
>> I already checked with Jay.
>>
>>
>> Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology
>> http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Ulrich Tagge via cctalk]

Hi Rod,

I have not the chance to go into the basement before Weekend, but have 
document the installation here:

http://www.pdp-11.de/index.php/pdp-11/rt11-5-4g-installation/

My 11/84 have the KDJ11-B (m8190).

Many Greetings
Ulrich

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Ulrich Tagge via cctalk]

Hi Rod,

I missed this in my last reply.
You can also verify the Bootstrap code placed in the KDJ11 EEPROM, maybe 
there is an error in.


Many Greetings
Ulrich

RE: HP 2108A key

[Mike Loewen via cctalk]

   The key is for this switch on the front panel of the 2108A:

http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/HP/2108A/HP2108A-8L.jpg


Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us
Old Technology  http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

On Thu, 21 Sep 2017, Ed Sharpe via cctalk wrote:


what is the key# does mike need???

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Wednesday, September 20, 2017 Jay West via cctalk  
wrote:
No, that key won't work. The one Mike is looking for is dual sided key and 
controls a switch (off, on, standby, etc.). Yours the key is just a latch.

I had a ton of those A machines, but guess I traded them all off. Wouldn't 
surprise me, I standardized on the newer power supplies and E-series.

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jay Jaeger via 
cctalk
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2017 4:13 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: HP 2108A key

Well, I don't think you checked with *this* Jay. ;)

Would the key from an HP 2112B likely work? It looks very much like the
2108A, just a tad larger (more cards). I have an HP 2112B, and it has
its key.

See a photo at :

http://webpages.charter.net/thecomputercollection/hp/hp2112b.htm

The key is 1 1/2" long, and has the number 4T1427 stamped on it.

JRJ


On 9/19/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote:


Does anyone have a key for a HP 2108A? This is one of the original
21MX M-series machines. The key is NOT the same as for the E and
F-series machines.

I already checked with Jay.


Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology
http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/

RE: HP 2108A key

[Ed Sharpe via cctalk]

what is the key# does mike need???

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Wednesday, September 20, 2017 Jay West via cctalk  
wrote:
No, that key won't work. The one Mike is looking for is dual sided key and 
controls a switch (off, on, standby, etc.). Yours the key is just a latch.

I had a ton of those A machines, but guess I traded them all off. Wouldn't 
surprise me, I standardized on the newer power supplies and E-series.

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jay Jaeger via 
cctalk
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2017 4:13 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: HP 2108A key

Well, I don't think you checked with *this* Jay. ;)

Would the key from an HP 2112B likely work? It looks very much like the
2108A, just a tad larger (more cards). I have an HP 2112B, and it has
its key.

See a photo at :

http://webpages.charter.net/thecomputercollection/hp/hp2112b.htm

The key is 1 1/2" long, and has the number 4T1427 stamped on it.

JRJ


On 9/19/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote:
> 
> Does anyone have a key for a HP 2108A? This is one of the original 
> 21MX M-series machines. The key is NOT the same as for the E and 
> F-series machines.
> 
> I already checked with Jay.
> 
> 
> Mike Loewen mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology 
> http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/
> 

Re: Alto 5-Key Keyset pictures

[Ian S. King via cctalk]

I've been interviewing people who used the Alto in various scenarios
(system devs, app devs, non-expert users) and NO ONE used the keyset.  It's
fascinating historically, but in part because of its apparent irrelevancy.
 -- Ian

On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 1:21 AM, CuriousMarc via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> I see you have the same problem as I did encounter: a rusting shaft that
> binds the keys together... I agree, they really spent big $ for production
> level tooling (and industrial design and engineering) to make the chordset,
> it is quite impressive.
> Marc
>
>
>
> On Sep 16, 2017, at 1:58 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk 
> wrote:
>
> I had to fix a key on CHM's keyset today, so I shot a bunch of pictures
> while it was apart
> http://bitsavers.org/pdf/xerox/alto/Alto_5-Key_Keyset
>
> They spent a lot of money on this. There are two castings of the same
> material as the keyboard
> and monitors, and two injection molded parts for the keys and the four
> spacers betwen the microswitches.
>
>
>


-- 
Ian S. King, MSIS, MSCS, Ph.D. Candidate
The Information School 
Dissertation: "Why the Conversation Mattered: Constructing a Sociotechnical
Narrative Through a Design Lens

Principal Investigator, "Reflections on Early Computing and Social Change",
UW IRB #42619

Archivist, Voices From the Rwanda Tribunal 
Value Sensitive Design Research Lab 

University of Washington

There is an old Vulcan saying: "Only Nixon could go to China."

RE: HP 2108A key

[Jay West via cctalk]

No, that key won't work. The one Mike is looking for is dual sided key and 
controls a switch (off, on, standby, etc.). Yours the key is just a latch.

I had a ton of those A machines, but guess I traded them all off. Wouldn't 
surprise me, I standardized on the newer power supplies and E-series.

-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Jay Jaeger via 
cctalk
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2017 4:13 PM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Subject: Re: HP 2108A key

Well, I don't think you checked with *this* Jay.  ;)

Would the key from an HP 2112B likely work?  It looks very much like the
2108A, just a tad larger (more cards).I have an HP 2112B, and it has
its key.

See a photo at :

http://webpages.charter.net/thecomputercollection/hp/hp2112b.htm

The key is 1 1/2" long, and has the number 4T1427 stamped on it.

JRJ


On 9/19/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote:
> 
>Does anyone have a key for a HP 2108A?  This is one of the original 
> 21MX M-series machines.  The key is NOT the same as for the E and 
> F-series machines.
> 
>I already checked with Jay.
> 
> 
> Mike Loewenmloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us Old Technology 
>
> http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/
> 

Re: HP 2108A key

[Jay Jaeger via cctalk]

Well, I don't think you checked with *this* Jay.  ;)

Would the key from an HP 2112B likely work?  It looks very much like the
2108A, just a tad larger (more cards).I have an HP 2112B, and it has
its key.

See a photo at :

http://webpages.charter.net/thecomputercollection/hp/hp2112b.htm

The key is 1 1/2" long, and has the number 4T1427 stamped on it.

JRJ


On 9/19/2017 6:38 PM, Mike Loewen via cctalk wrote:
> 
>    Does anyone have a key for a HP 2108A?  This is one of the original
> 21MX M-series machines.  The key is NOT the same as for the E and
> F-series machines.
> 
>    I already checked with Jay.
> 
> 
> Mike Loewen    mloe...@cpumagic.scol.pa.us
> Old Technology    http://q7.neurotica.com/Oldtech/
> 

COTROL SYS> Navy using X Boxes to control sub periscopes Check this out!

[Ed via cctalk]

Navy using X Boxes to control sub  periscopesCheck this  out!
http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2017/09/20/us-navy-will-use-xbox-controllers-to-
operate-submarine-periscopes.html

PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Mattis Lind via cctalk]

onsdag 20 september 2017 skrev Rod Smallwood via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org
>:

>
> I installed the RX01 Unibus adapter in slot 5
>
> Then replaced the slot 5 NPG  jumper (RX01 is not DMA) They are underneath
> the motherboard on an 11/94
>
> Next I connected up the RX01 and used original DEC RT-11 v5.4 RX01
> distribution disks.
>
> Then turned on and tried to boot DX.
>
> Same result it says Trying.


Some things to check unless you already done so:

The RX11 (M7846) and  RX211 (M8256) are known working?

Are they correctly configured in regards to address and vector?

Is it possible to access the CSR of the boards through the ODT prompt?

Is it possible to do simple commands through the CSR port using ODT?

After it hangs in the boot can you get into ODT mode and check if the
bootstrap has read in the bootblock to address 0 and onwards ( or whatever
the ROM boot code reads the bootblock to).

/Mattis


> If you have an 11/84 then whats on the KDJ-11 dialog screen would be very
> interesting.
> Which KDJ-11 do you have?
>
> Can you get a picture of your console screen set up to boot from  an RX01
> or RX01?
>
> Rod
>
>
> On 20/09/2017 13:47, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk wrote:
>
>> Hi Rod,  > > I had an similar issue, when trying to boot a RX02 Disk
>> created on
>>
> my > /84 on a /34a. Have bypassed this and have installed a fresh RT11, >
> but had no time to figure out the problem. Would it of interest for > you,
> to get RX02 Images (PDP11GUI) of my RT-11 V5.4 G Distribution > Set? With
> them, you could install your /94 from scratch, ... . > > Many Greetings > >
> Ulrich >
> --
> Wanted one pdp-8/i rocker switch leaver to copy.
>
> 02
>

Re: WTB: SMD drive

[emanuel stiebler via cctalk]

On 2017-09-18 12:48, Camiel Vanderhoeven via cctech wrote:


So, I¹m in the market for an SMD drive. It has to be one of the following
four types though:
* Fujitsu M2351 (Eagle)
* CDC 9766
* NEC D2352
* NEC D2363

And I¹d prefer it to be located somewhere in continental Europe (even
better if it¹s in the Netherlands).


Don't you have an SMD emulator on your web page?
;-)

Cheers

Re: WTB: SMD drive

[Camiel Vanderhoeven via cctalk]

On 9/20/17, 10:37 AM, "emanuel stiebler"  wrote:

>On 2017-09-18 12:48, Camiel Vanderhoeven via cctech wrote:
>
>> So, I¹m in the market for an SMD drive. It has to be one of the
>>following
>> four types though:
>> * Fujitsu M2351 (Eagle)
>> * CDC 9766
>> * NEC D2352
>> * NEC D2363
>> 
>> And I¹d prefer it to be located somewhere in continental Europe (even
>> better if it¹s in the Netherlands).
>
>Don't you have an SMD emulator on your web page?
>;-)
>
>Cheers

I’m working on one, but I’m having trouble debugging it. Getting a real,
supported drive would be a big help I hope.

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Rod Smallwood via cctalk]

I installed the RX01 Unibus adapter in slot 5

Then replaced the slot 5 NPG  jumper (RX01 is not DMA) They are 
underneath the motherboard on an 11/94


Next I connected up the RX01 and used original DEC RT-11 v5.4 RX01 
distribution disks.


Then turned on and tried to boot DX.

Same result it says Trying.

If you have an 11/84 then whats on the KDJ-11 dialog screen would be 
very interesting.

Which KDJ-11 do you have?

Can you get a picture of your console screen set up to boot from  an 
RX01 or RX01?


Rod


On 20/09/2017 13:47, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk wrote:
Hi Rod,  > > I had an similar issue, when trying to boot a RX02 Disk created on 
my > /84 on a /34a. Have bypassed this and have installed a fresh RT11, 
> but had no time to figure out the problem. Would it of interest for > 
you, to get RX02 Images (PDP11GUI) of my RT-11 V5.4 G Distribution > 
Set? With them, you could install your /94 from scratch, ... . > > Many 
Greetings > > Ulrich >

--
Wanted one pdp-8/i rocker switch leaver to copy.

02

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Ulrich Tagge via cctalk]

Hi Rod,

I had an similar issue, when trying to boot a RX02 Disk created on my 
/84 on a /34a.
Have bypassed this and have installed a fresh RT11, but had no time to 
figure out the problem.
Would it of interest for you, to get RX02 Images (PDP11GUI) of my RT-11 
V5.4 G Distribution Set? With them, you could install your /94 from 
scratch, ... .


Many Greetings

Ulrich

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Rod Smallwood via cctalk]

Hi

   1.   The complete RX02 with cable and disk (initialized and 
system copied /boot to it) boots the 11/73 on an RX02 controller so mode 
is correct.


   2.        The 11/94 boot menu allows you to choose DY0 or DY1 and 
both have been tried after moving the floppy of course.


    3.   As the startup messages appear the disk is being read.


Rod




On 20/09/2017 12:30, Ulrich Tagge via cctalk wrote:

Hi Rod,

I'm sure you are aware about, ... the /94 have a MDM card/module, 
where you can set the NPG jumper via switches. Is this set correct for 
all the slots, no mismatch in counting the small switches?
Have you checked the flat ribbon cable - I had much fun with damaged 
cables?

Have you tried dy0 and dy1?
Is the RX02 set to the correct mode?
The known good 8" disk, is a rx02 disk and not a rx01?

Many Greetings

Ulrich



--
Wanted one pdp-8/i rocker switch leaver to copy.

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Ulrich Tagge via cctalk]

Hi Rod,

I'm sure you are aware about, ... the /94 have a MDM card/module, where 
you can set the NPG jumper via switches. Is this set correct for all the 
slots, no mismatch in counting the small switches?

Have you checked the flat ribbon cable - I had much fun with damaged cables?
Have you tried dy0 and dy1?
Is the RX02 set to the correct mode?
The known good 8" disk, is a rx02 disk and not a rx01?

Many Greetings

Ulrich

Re: PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Mattis Lind via cctalk]

2017-09-20 11:58 GMT+02:00 Rod Smallwood via cctalk :

> Well I did get the 11/73 booted from RX50 floppy on an RQDX3.
>
> I then went on to get a SCSI (DEC DSP5200) Hard Drive on a CQD220 booting
> and running RT-11 V5.4.
>
> In the process I established that I have a good working RX01 and a good
> working RX02 that both boot RT-11 V5.4 from 8 inch Floppy.
>
> I have the parts for another RX02 and that only lacks the circuit breaker
> on the PSU. (AIRPAX type anybody got one?)
>
> There is a lot of interaction between RT-11v5.4, RQDX3, CQD220 and the
> RX01 and RX02 controllers.
>
> I have read up all the back references (VCF and so on) on this subject but
> I am not sure I fully understand all of the ramifications.
>
>
> So back to the main event, the 11/94.
>
> This is the last of the PDP/11's and is a hybrid.
>
> KJD-11 CPU in a Q-bus back plane bridged to a Unibus.
>
> The KJD works and all of its monitor and boot controls are available via
> the console terminal.
>
> I have Unibus interface cards for both RX01 and RX02.
>
> So grant and terminator cards in the right places and RX02 Unibus card in
> the correct slot.
>
> Connect up the cable (Red stripe to AA on BERG's)
>
> Known bootable RT-11 8 inch floppy in the RX02.
>
> Turn on RX02 then 11/94 (Nice healthy clonk from the drive)
>
> Pick DY off the boot ROM list and sure enough the system starts to load
> from the RX02.
>
> Then it just hangs.
>
> Comments please



Checked the NPG jumper in the backplane for the RX02 board?


/Mattis


>
>
>
> Rod
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Wanted one pdp-8/i rocker switch leaver to copy.
>
>

PDP-11/73 and 11/94 update

[Rod Smallwood via cctalk]

Well I did get the 11/73 booted from RX50 floppy on an RQDX3.

I then went on to get a SCSI (DEC DSP5200) Hard Drive on a CQD220 
booting and running RT-11 V5.4.


In the process I established that I have a good working RX01 and a good 
working RX02 that both boot RT-11 V5.4 from 8 inch Floppy.


I have the parts for another RX02 and that only lacks the circuit 
breaker on the PSU. (AIRPAX type anybody got one?)


There is a lot of interaction between RT-11v5.4, RQDX3, CQD220 and the 
RX01 and RX02 controllers.


I have read up all the back references (VCF and so on) on this subject 
but I am not sure I fully understand all of the ramifications.



So back to the main event, the 11/94.

This is the last of the PDP/11's and is a hybrid.

KJD-11 CPU in a Q-bus back plane bridged to a Unibus.

The KJD works and all of its monitor and boot controls are available via 
the console terminal.


I have Unibus interface cards for both RX01 and RX02.

So grant and terminator cards in the right places and RX02 Unibus card 
in the correct slot.


Connect up the cable (Red stripe to AA on BERG's)

Known bootable RT-11 8 inch floppy in the RX02.

Turn on RX02 then 11/94 (Nice healthy clonk from the drive)

Pick DY off the boot ROM list and sure enough the system starts to load 
from the RX02.


Then it just hangs.

Comments please


Rod






--
Wanted one pdp-8/i rocker switch leaver to copy.

Re: Alto 5-Key Keyset pictures

[CuriousMarc via cctalk]

I see you have the same problem as I did encounter: a rusting shaft that binds 
the keys together... I agree, they really spent big $ for production level 
tooling (and industrial design and engineering) to make the chordset, it is 
quite impressive.
Marc



On Sep 16, 2017, at 1:58 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk  wrote:

I had to fix a key on CHM's keyset today, so I shot a bunch of pictures while 
it was apart
http://bitsavers.org/pdf/xerox/alto/Alto_5-Key_Keyset

They spent a lot of money on this. There are two castings of the same material 
as the keyboard
and monitors, and two injection molded parts for the keys and the four spacers 
betwen the microswitches.

Let's help Lee Felsenstein

[Evan Koblentz via cctalk]

Lee Felsenstein -- of Free Speech Movement, Community Memory, Homebrew 
Computer Club, Pennywhistle Modem, Processor Technology SOL-20, and 
Osborne fame -- is starting a Patreon. He's also been an avid supporter 
of the vintage computing hobby. Everyone should help him if you can!


http://www.patreon.com/lfelsenstein


Evan Koblentz, director
Vintage Computer Federation
a 501(c)3 educational non-profit

e...@vcfed.org
(646) 546-

www.vcfed.org
facebook.com/vcfederation
twitter.com/vcfederation