Re: 11/93 rebuild
On 5/29/2019 4:01 PM, Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote: > > > Most of the PDP11 SCSI Controllers could build two or more PDP11 disks > > out of one physical device. That is what I meant with partition in this > > case .. There is some logical information on the device, you simply > > don't get the entire raw device on the pdp as you possibly think. > > That's a good point, and perhaps there's no existing way to write a SCSI disk > from a Windoze box in a way that the PDP11 SCSI controllers can grok. I don't > know enough about how they work to answer that. > Perhaps one could use Win32DiskImager to write a block level image onto a SCSI disk, yes? (i.e., no Windows partition, just a bunch of blocks). JRJ
Re: 11/93 Rebuild - SCSI HD now boots RT11
> On May 31, 2019, at 2:40 PM, allison via cctalk wrote: > > On 05/31/2019 02:04 PM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: >> Hi >> >> Well I now have a bootable SCSI drive on my 11/93. Its not RSTS/E >> (yet) but it is RT 11 and reliable. >> >> Its a bit baseline but it runs. >> >> So next up was to see if we could get the RQDX3 to co-exist with the >> SCSI controller. >> >> I switched the base address to 160336 and it does not stop the SCSI >> drive booting as DU0. >> >> Had the RQDX3 been on the normal base address I think you would get the >> HD as DU0 and the two halves of an RX50 as the next two drives. >> >> But what happens to the RX50's when you move the RQDX3 to 160336 ? >> >> Rod >> >> >> > Under RT-11 ... > > RSTS/E the conventions for non standard device addresses are different > but there is a mechanism for addressing that. I've not used that. On RSTS: DU is one of the fairly common kinds of PDP-11 devices that has a fixed CSR assignment for the first controller, and uses floating CSRs for the others. 160336 doesn't sound like a standard float address (it isn't a multiple of the CSR size). RSTS will recognize devices automatically if they have the standard CSR (fixed or float). Anything else you have to give it the CSR address: boot it, at the "Start timesharing" prompt say "NO" then you're in the INIT program. Option "HARDWARE" lets you do stuff like set non-standard CSR addresses; it will also show the devices it has found. MSCP devices have programmable vectors so that's not a concern, RSTS will assign a vector. For most RSTS disks, only one controller is supported. For MSCP, it supports up to four. But unlike VMS, RSTS refers to disks by device type and unit number (such as "DU2:"). So the rule for multiple MSCP controller is that the unit numbers must be distinct. Also, they must be below 16, RSTS does not allow larger unit numbers than that. paul
Re: 11/93 Rebuild - SCSI HD now boots RT11
On 05/31/2019 03:27 PM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > > On 31/05/2019 19:40, allison via cctalk wrote: >> On 05/31/2019 02:04 PM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: >>> Hi >>> >>> Well I now have a bootable SCSI drive on my 11/93. Its not RSTS/E >>> (yet) but it is RT 11 and reliable. >>> >>> Its a bit baseline but it runs. >>> >>> So next up was to see if we could get the RQDX3 to co-exist with the >>> SCSI controller. >>> >>> I switched the base address to 160336 and it does not stop the SCSI >>> drive booting as DU0. >>> >>> Had the RQDX3 been on the normal base address I think you would get the >>> HD as DU0 and the two halves of an RX50 as the next two drives. >>> >>> But what happens to the RX50's when you move the RQDX3 to 160336 ? >>> >>> Rod >>> >>> >>> >> Under RT-11 you have to do a SET CSR and sometimes Vector when you move >> a device off the default. Its how I could have two DD (tu58) on teo >> serial ports. Same for RX02, RL02, with RQDX3 (with RD52 and RX33) >> where the RQDX was set to a nonstandard address. >> >> As I remember the CMD controller is nominally the same as RQDX3 for the >> same address. so likely RQDX at the secondary address (see the manual) >> will be treated well if not use the set utility. It only comes to mind >> as I had two RQDX3s in one machine to make RD52 to RD52 copies at one >> point. Also my BA123 uVAX-II has both CMD SCSI controller (Rz56 x2) and >> RQDX3 for RD52 wher the RD52 was the swap and page disk (QD540s are fast >> but only 31mb) and by having independent channels helped with system >> performance. >> >> RSTS/E the conventions for non standard device addresses are different >> but there is a mechanism for addressing that. I've not used that. >> >> Any of the PDP11 unix again there is a way but the process varies with >> version and is unknown to me. I tried once to get V^ to talk to more >> than RL02. >> >> In the end first make sure you using the suggested secondary controller >> address. Then use the OS dependent tools for installing additional >> drives. >> >> Allison > > Hi > OK lets see if I can understand whats going on. > > 1. The CQD sits at the normal 17772150 base address > 2. RQDX3 is at the alternate 17760334 base address. OK good address and non interfering. > 3. The map function in the 11/93 monitor sees both > 4. The SCSI drive boots RT11 with the RQDX3 in place. OK that means the RQDX is not causing issues but likely the OS does not see it as the DU/DUX driver is not configured to see that address and the 11/93 map function does not communicate with the OS. So unless the OS is told that RQDX3 is additional 334Q address its not even going to bother with it or by it. > 5. So if I connect an RX50 through the cable splitter as normal then > what device(s) is(are) the RX50 No idea, until you set the du1 (the other is du0 I memory hasn't croaked) its a non sequitur. So at the prompt >set du1 CSR=17760334< or something along those lines (syntax) will connect the controller to the OS. At this point since I've not done it in a decade you may need to init the device and media, copy stuff to it then set the boot device. > Rod Beats me! Never got a 11/93. Latest Qbus-11 I have is a J11 -11/73 the smaller dual width card (no PMI). Never seen the map function. However having said that, the CPU may know what disks are there but once the boot operating gets to the disk resident boot then the OS has to be up to it meaning all the initial setups in place or if the device was bootable a script (or manual entry) that loads and set up everything. That much is certain for RT-11. For example I run RT11XM from VM: [memory disk], however first you have to init VM: and put stuff there and set it up so you can boot it. So happens I do that from DD (tu58 tape) but I've done it from RX02, RL02, and DU. For RSTS and others the game is different but you first muct boot from a device already know to the copy of the OS on a device that the system knows how to boot from. One thing that is consistent is that the boot for any device is often the same in that it calls for the device to access the bootable track and sector or base LBA, the MSCP devices [cmd or RQDXn] have their own thing where the controller knows the place for a given media it can use. In that case the system boot in rom is a message to "give me the boot block at xx ram address" and transfers to that. Allison
Re: 11/93 Rebuild - SCSI HD now boots RT11
On 31/05/2019 19:40, allison via cctalk wrote: On 05/31/2019 02:04 PM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: Hi Well I now have a bootable SCSI drive on my 11/93. Its not RSTS/E (yet) but it is RT 11 and reliable. Its a bit baseline but it runs. So next up was to see if we could get the RQDX3 to co-exist with the SCSI controller. I switched the base address to 160336 and it does not stop the SCSI drive booting as DU0. Had the RQDX3 been on the normal base address I think you would get the HD as DU0 and the two halves of an RX50 as the next two drives. But what happens to the RX50's when you move the RQDX3 to 160336 ? Rod Under RT-11 you have to do a SET CSR and sometimes Vector when you move a device off the default. Its how I could have two DD (tu58) on teo serial ports. Same for RX02, RL02, with RQDX3 (with RD52 and RX33) where the RQDX was set to a nonstandard address. As I remember the CMD controller is nominally the same as RQDX3 for the same address. so likely RQDX at the secondary address (see the manual) will be treated well if not use the set utility. It only comes to mind as I had two RQDX3s in one machine to make RD52 to RD52 copies at one point. Also my BA123 uVAX-II has both CMD SCSI controller (Rz56 x2) and RQDX3 for RD52 wher the RD52 was the swap and page disk (QD540s are fast but only 31mb) and by having independent channels helped with system performance. RSTS/E the conventions for non standard device addresses are different but there is a mechanism for addressing that. I've not used that. Any of the PDP11 unix again there is a way but the process varies with version and is unknown to me. I tried once to get V^ to talk to more than RL02. In the end first make sure you using the suggested secondary controller address. Then use the OS dependent tools for installing additional drives. Allison Hi OK lets see if I can understand whats going on. 1. The CQD sits at the normal 17772150 base address 2. RQDX3 is at the alternate 17760334 base address. 3. The map function in the 11/93 monitor sees both 4. The SCSI drive boots RT11 with the RQDX3 in place. 5. So if I connect an RX50 through the cable splitter as normal then what device(s) is(are) the RX50 Rod --
Re: 11/93 Rebuild - SCSI HD now boots RT11
On 5/31/19 1:04 PM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: Hi Well I now have a bootable SCSI drive on my 11/93. Its not RSTS/E (yet) but it is RT 11 and reliable. Its a bit baseline but it runs. So next up was to see if we could get the RQDX3 to co-exist with the SCSI controller. I switched the base address to 160336 and it does not stop the SCSI drive booting as DU0. Had the RQDX3 been on the normal base address I think you would get the HD as DU0 and the two halves of an RX50 as the next two drives. But what happens to the RX50's when you move the RQDX3 to 160336 ? Rod In RT11 the mapping of the controllers (port), drives (unit) and partitions is stored in the device handler of the disk you bootstrap from. You can have customize different configurations on each of your SCSI drives and the RQDX3 HD. You have to make sure that the disk being booted has a valid mapping for the SY disk on its handler (DU.SYS or DUX.SYS). There are no checks on the "SET DU" commands to ensure the resulting configuration is bootable. Check out the RT-11 Device Handlers Manual (section 2.3 in the Aug91 version). Jerry
Re: 11/93 Rebuild - SCSI HD now boots RT11
On 05/31/2019 02:04 PM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > Hi > > Well I now have a bootable SCSI drive on my 11/93. Its not RSTS/E > (yet) but it is RT 11 and reliable. > > Its a bit baseline but it runs. > > So next up was to see if we could get the RQDX3 to co-exist with the > SCSI controller. > > I switched the base address to 160336 and it does not stop the SCSI > drive booting as DU0. > > Had the RQDX3 been on the normal base address I think you would get the > HD as DU0 and the two halves of an RX50 as the next two drives. > > But what happens to the RX50's when you move the RQDX3 to 160336 ? > > Rod > > > Under RT-11 you have to do a SET CSR and sometimes Vector when you move a device off the default. Its how I could have two DD (tu58) on teo serial ports. Same for RX02, RL02, with RQDX3 (with RD52 and RX33) where the RQDX was set to a nonstandard address. As I remember the CMD controller is nominally the same as RQDX3 for the same address. so likely RQDX at the secondary address (see the manual) will be treated well if not use the set utility. It only comes to mind as I had two RQDX3s in one machine to make RD52 to RD52 copies at one point. Also my BA123 uVAX-II has both CMD SCSI controller (Rz56 x2) and RQDX3 for RD52 wher the RD52 was the swap and page disk (QD540s are fast but only 31mb) and by having independent channels helped with system performance. RSTS/E the conventions for non standard device addresses are different but there is a mechanism for addressing that. I've not used that. Any of the PDP11 unix again there is a way but the process varies with version and is unknown to me. I tried once to get V^ to talk to more than RL02. In the end first make sure you using the suggested secondary controller address. Then use the OS dependent tools for installing additional drives. Allison
11/93 Rebuild - SCSI HD now boots RT11
Hi Well I now have a bootable SCSI drive on my 11/93. Its not RSTS/E (yet) but it is RT 11 and reliable. Its a bit baseline but it runs. So next up was to see if we could get the RQDX3 to co-exist with the SCSI controller. I switched the base address to 160336 and it does not stop the SCSI drive booting as DU0. Had the RQDX3 been on the normal base address I think you would get the HD as DU0 and the two halves of an RX50 as the next two drives. But what happens to the RX50's when you move the RQDX3 to 160336 ? Rod --
Re: 11/93 rebuild
> From: Holm Tiffe
>> The "--list" command to 'dd' gives a whole bunch of stuff:
> aha:
> $ dd --list
> dd: unknown operand --list
I was talking about the program I had mentioned in the previous email, "dd
for Windows". The "--list" command to it produced that long list of devices
(the list you edited out of the reply), so it definitely works there.
> Nobody in a PDP11 is interested what Windows thinks about partitions.
Understood, but in my previous email I had given an example using a uSloth
partition:
>> dd-removable if=UnixRoot of=\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 count=4872
seek=131072
so when your reply mentioned "partitions" ("You have to have an already
existing parition structure on the disk") it was natural to assume you meant
those - especially since there was a plausible reading of your comment
involving them (i.e. 'does "dd for Windows" only work on a disk with an
existing uSloth partition structure on it').
> Most of the PDP11 SCSI Controllers could build two or more PDP11 disks
> out of one physical device. That is what I meant with partition in this
> case .. There is some logical information on the device, you simply
> don't get the entire raw device on the pdp as you possibly think.
That's a good point, and perhaps there's no existing way to write a SCSI disk
from a Windoze box in a way that the PDP11 SCSI controllers can grok. I don't
know enough about how they work to answer that.
> Tapes have no such restrictions
Right, but one has to have a tape drive; the OP may not.
Noel
Re: 11/93 rebuild - Major and Significant Result.
Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > Hi > > Due to the help from Glen Slick. (The only guy to answer the > question as asked.) > > What to do is interesting. How to do it will get you there. > > I now have a SCSI drive on the 11/93 that thinks its an RD54 and is > trying to boot RSTS/E. > > It fails gracefully during the boot giving an error message. ..."an error message"?? Similar to q: "what's on the display?" a: "a flower vase.." ( yes I know, this fits better in german) What error message? Regards, Holm -- Technik Service u. Handel Tiffe, www.tsht.de, Holm Tiffe, Freiberger Straße 42, 09600 Oberschöna, USt-Id: DE253710583 i...@tsht.de Fax +49 3731 74200 Tel +49 3731 74222 Mobil: 0172 8790 741
Re: 11/93 rebuild
Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
> > From: Holm Tiffe
>
> > You have to have an already existing parition structure on the disk and
> > an OS that knows what todo with that.
>
> The "--list" command to 'dd' gives a whole bunch of stuff:
aha:
$ dd --list
dd: unknown operand --list
$
>
> Win32 Available Volume Information
> \\.\Volume{cd4ae459-0daa-11e2-9625-806d6172696f}\
> link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume1
> fixed media
> Mounted on \\.\d:
>
> \\.\Volume{f3c65dd6-01af-11e1-a511-806d6172696f}\
[..]
>
> some of which appear to be entire disks, not partitions.
Nobody in a PDP11 is interested what Windows thinks about partitions.
Most of the PDP11 SCSI Controllers could build two or more PDP11 disks
out of one physical device. That is what I meant with partition in this
case, if you dind'nt like it, call it slice.
There is some logical information on the device, you simply don't get
the entire raw device on the pdp as you possibly think.
Shure, you can write to the entire disk on an PC with some tools, but
what you write has to fit the CQD220 adapters idea how the data structure
has to be if you would boot that.
Tapes have no such restrictions, that's why I suggested using a tape.
Regard's
Holm
--
Technik Service u. Handel Tiffe, www.tsht.de, Holm Tiffe,
Freiberger Straße 42, 09600 Oberschöna, USt-Id: DE253710583
i...@tsht.de Fax +49 3731 74200 Tel +49 3731 74222 Mobil: 0172 8790 741
11/93 rebuild - Major and Significant Result.
Hi Due to the help from Glen Slick. (The only guy to answer the question as asked.) What to do is interesting. How to do it will get you there. I now have a SCSI drive on the 11/93 that thinks its an RD54 and is trying to boot RSTS/E. It fails gracefully during the boot giving an error message. So we have a working Hard Drive and Controller on the target system. No to find out what it does not like. The transfer rig is now working OK. So I can try out more drives if needed Rod --
Re: 11/93 rebuild
> From: Holm Tiffe
> You have to have an already existing parition structure on the disk and
> an OS that knows what todo with that.
The "--list" command to 'dd' gives a whole bunch of stuff:
Win32 Available Volume Information
\\.\Volume{cd4ae459-0daa-11e2-9625-806d6172696f}\
link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume1
fixed media
Mounted on \\.\d:
\\.\Volume{f3c65dd6-01af-11e1-a511-806d6172696f}\
link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume2
fixed media
Mounted on \\.\c:
\\.\Volume{f3c65dd7-01af-11e1-a511-806d6172696f}\
link to \\?\Device\CdRom0
CD-ROM
Mounted on \\.\m:
\\.\Volume{a531c21e-b869-11d9-9977-806d6172696f}\
link to \\?\Device\Floppy0
removeable media
Mounted on \\.\a:
\\.\Volume{89bdc974-217e-11e8-96f6-00038a15}\
link to \\?\Device\Harddisk2\DP(1)0-0+7
removeable media
Mounted on \\.\e:
NT Block Device Objects
\\?\Device\CdRom0
size is 2147483647 bytes
\\?\Device\Floppy0
\\?\Device\Harddisk0\Partition0
link to \\?\Device\Harddisk0\DR0
Fixed hard disk media. Block size = 512
size is 20020396032 bytes
\\?\Device\Harddisk0\Partition1
link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume2
\\?\Device\Harddisk1\Partition0
link to \\?\Device\Harddisk1\DR1
Fixed hard disk media. Block size = 512
size is 10262568960 bytes
\\?\Device\Harddisk1\Partition1
link to \\?\Device\HarddiskVolume1
\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0
link to \\?\Device\Harddisk2\DR6
Removable media other than floppy. Block size = 512
size is 15833497600 bytes
\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition1
link to \\?\Device\Harddisk2\DP(1)0-0+7
Removable media other than floppy. Block size = 512
size is 15829303296 bytes
some of which appear to be entire disks, not partitions.
Since I was trying to write into a specific area of an SD card connected via a
USB adapator, I took the path which seemed to be that of least resistance,
which was to use a partition which covered the blocks I wanted to write.
If I needed to write the boot block (which contains the partition table), I'd
have probably tried using some of the other devices in the list, but since I
didn't need to, I decided not to get diverted from my real goal by trying
other devices.
Maybe it won't work for what he needs to do. But it worked fine for me, doing
something very similar, so I thought I'd mention it.
Noel
11/93 Rebuild - Project resumed - PSU replaced
11/93 Rebuild - Project resumed - PSU replaced Rod --
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 5:06 PM ben via cctalk wrote: > > On 5/27/2019 2:56 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: > > On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: > >> On an old XP box? er neither will run > > > > My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool > > for Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there > > are instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for > > Windows, whatever. > > > > Christian > > > > http://www.chrysocome.net/dd > I like this one, used to copy disc images to sd cards. > Ben. Windows 7 I did download and use that chrysocome.net version of dd at some point. Standalone utility without any crap to install. You'd think that after 10 years they could finally have a 1.0 version instead of a 0.6beta3 :)
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
On 5/27/2019 2:56 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: On an old XP box? er neither will run My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool for Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there are instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for Windows, whatever. Christian http://www.chrysocome.net/dd I like this one, used to copy disc images to sd cards. Ben. Windows 7
11/93 rebuild - Project Suspended - PC died
The Acer PC I was using to write the image to the SCSI drive has gone kaput. Clearly PSU (not plugtop mains fuse). Its a non standard PSU and no schematic available. Fall back is to get one of the SLU's (other than the console) on the KDJ11-E going and TU58 it. Rod --
Re: 11/93 rebuild
On 5/27/19 9:58 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > Hi > > Whilst I wait to hear from Glen Slick who has got me this far > (Thanks Glen) I'll restate the problem. > > 1. I now have an old XP system with SIMH on it (PDP11.exe) > > 2. I have created RD54.dsk containing RSTS/E > > 3. Attached to the system is a 2.1Gb SCSI drive via an adaptec 2940 > controller > > 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to put > RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. > > 5. The drive will then be moved to a CQD-220A/TM SCSI controller on my > KDJ11-E based 11/93 and must boot. > > 6. Its just an image copy from one drive to another on the same system. > > 7. Nobody has come up with a tried and tested list of step by step > instructions yet. > > > Rod Smallwood > > Depends on what you mean by tried and tested. I told you to use Ersatz-11 and buld the image directly on the SCSI drive. Ersatz-11 works fine under FreeDOS. Disks are cheap so you just make a different disk for your system. I have used this method to make RT-11, RSTS/E and BSD-211 systems disks that successfully boot and run on my 11/93 with the CQD-220A/TM controller. You could probably boot your image under Ersatz-11 and then copy it to the SCSI but the method above works just as well. bill
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
On 5/27/19 4:56 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: > On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: >> On an old XP box? er neither will run > > My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool > for Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there > are instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for > Windows, whatever. > > Christian Or build a disk with FreeDOS and Ersatz-11. Disks today are cheap. bill
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
On 5/27/19 4:30 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > Hi > > On an old XP box? er neither will run > > Rod > > > On 27/05/2019 08:25, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: >> # dd if=RD54.dsk of=/dev/sda [or whatever the device name is] >> >> Oh, you said Windows... I'd recommend installing Cygwin ;-) > Why would Cygwin not run? I ran it on dozens of XP boxes. bill
Re: 11/93 rebuild
On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 11:26 AM Paul Koning wrote:
>
> Looks like f$cvtime is failing, that's presumably a Y2K issue.
>
> > $ File = F$Left(Today, 2) + F$Mid(Today, 4, 2) + F$Right(Today, 7)
> > $ File = F$Left(Today, 2) + F$Mid(Today, 4, 2) + F$Right(Today, 7)
> >^
> > ?Undefined symbol
>
> "today" is undefined because the previous line was supposed to define it but
> failed.
>
> > $ _if F$Search("OMS$:REQLOG.OMS") .nes. "" Then -
> > Continue: _Rename/NoWarn OMS$:REQLOG.OMS 'File'
> > $ _if F$Search("OMS$:REQLOG.OMS") .nes. "" Then _Rename/NoWarn
> > OMS$:REQLOG.OMS 'File'
> >
> > ^
> > ?Undefined symbol
>
> "file" is undefined because the line that defined it got an error.
>
> So it looks like an error cascade started with a Y2K bug. You might try
> starting with a 20th century date like 1999, I'd expect it to be clean then.
>
> paul
>
Changing the date to 1999 before startup did resolve the issues.
RSTS V10.0-L RSTS (DU0) INIT V10.0-0L
;9.05.27 11:33
Start timesharing? NO
Option: DATE
Today's date? <;9.05.27> 99.5.27
Current time? <11:34>
Option:
Disk is being rebuilt - wait ...
99.05.27 11:34
Proceed with system startup?
Beginning RSTS/E system startup...
99.05.27 11:34 Installing monitor overlays
99.05.27 11:34 Mounting disks
99.05.27 11:34 Assigning logical names
99.05.27 11:34 Starting error logging
99.05.27 11:34 Setting system characteristics
27-May-99 11:34 AM Installing run-time systems and libraries
27-May-99 11:34 AM Starting Operator/Message Services
>>> OMS V10.0-K 27-May-99 11:34 AM <<<
Message 1 from OMS, user [1,2], Detached, job 3
Starting Operator/Message Services
27-May-99 11:34 AM Setting terminal characteristics
27-May-99 11:34 AM Defining system commands
27-May-99 11:34 AM Setting printer characteristics
27-May-99 11:34 AM Starting spoolers
*** From [1,2] on KB0: at 11:34 AM 27-May-99
** RSTS/E is on the air...
>>> OMS V10.0-K 27-May-99 11:34 AM <<<
Message 2 from user [1,2] on _KB0:, job 2
The system startup is complete
Re: 11/93 rebuild
> On May 27, 2019, at 2:15 PM, Glen Slick via cctalk
> wrote:
>
> On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 10:37 AM Paul Koning wrote:
>>
>>> Proceed with system startup?
>>>
>>> Beginning RSTS/E system startup...
>>> 19.05.27 09:50 Installing monitor overlays
>>> 19.05.27 09:50 Mounting disks
>>> 19.05.27 09:50 Assigning logical names
>>> 19.05.27 09:50 Starting error logging
>>> 19.05.27 09:50 Setting system characteristics
>>> 27-May-19 09:50 AM Installing run-time systems and libraries
>>> 27-May-19 09:50 AM Starting Operator/Message Services
>>> ?Invalid time
>>> ?Undefined symbol
>>> ?Undefined symbol
>>
>> This says there's some stuff in your start.com that RSTS is not happy with,
>> but it's not clear what that might be. It doesn't seem to cause any real
>> problems.
>>
>
> It appears that the first two errors are related to a Y2K issue.
>
> The third error appears to be related to "OMS$:REQLOG.OMS". I barely
> know my way around RSTS/E and don't know what that might be without
> further investigation.
>
> From start.log:
>
> $ ! *** Start Operator/Message Services ***
> $ !
> $ OMS_ON := FALSE
> $ _write 0 f$time()+ " Starting Operator/Message Services"
> 27-May-19 11:04 AM Starting Operator/Message Services
> $ Today = F$Left(F$CVTime(), 8)
> $ Today = F$Left(F$CVTime(), 8)
> ?Invalid time
Looks like f$cvtime is failing, that's presumably a Y2K issue.
> $ File = F$Left(Today, 2) + F$Mid(Today, 4, 2) + F$Right(Today, 7)
> $ File = F$Left(Today, 2) + F$Mid(Today, 4, 2) + F$Right(Today, 7)
>^
> ?Undefined symbol
"today" is undefined because the previous line was supposed to define it but
failed.
> $ _if F$Search("OMS$:REQLOG.OMS") .nes. "" Then -
> Continue: _Rename/NoWarn OMS$:REQLOG.OMS 'File'
> $ _if F$Search("OMS$:REQLOG.OMS") .nes. "" Then _Rename/NoWarn
> OMS$:REQLOG.OMS 'File'
>
> ^
> ?Undefined symbol
"file" is undefined because the line that defined it got an error.
So it looks like an error cascade started with a Y2K bug. You might try
starting with a 20th century date like 1999, I'd expect it to be clean then.
paul
Re: 11/93 rebuild
On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 10:37 AM Paul Koning wrote:
>
> > Proceed with system startup?
> >
> > Beginning RSTS/E system startup...
> > 19.05.27 09:50 Installing monitor overlays
> > 19.05.27 09:50 Mounting disks
> > 19.05.27 09:50 Assigning logical names
> > 19.05.27 09:50 Starting error logging
> > 19.05.27 09:50 Setting system characteristics
> > 27-May-19 09:50 AM Installing run-time systems and libraries
> > 27-May-19 09:50 AM Starting Operator/Message Services
> > ?Invalid time
> > ?Undefined symbol
> > ?Undefined symbol
>
> This says there's some stuff in your start.com that RSTS is not happy with,
> but it's not clear what that might be. It doesn't seem to cause any real
> problems.
>
It appears that the first two errors are related to a Y2K issue.
The third error appears to be related to "OMS$:REQLOG.OMS". I barely
know my way around RSTS/E and don't know what that might be without
further investigation.
>From start.log:
$ ! *** Start Operator/Message Services ***
$ !
$ OMS_ON := FALSE
$ _write 0 f$time()+ " Starting Operator/Message Services"
27-May-19 11:04 AM Starting Operator/Message Services
$ Today = F$Left(F$CVTime(), 8)
$ Today = F$Left(F$CVTime(), 8)
?Invalid time
$ File = F$Left(Today, 2) + F$Mid(Today, 4, 2) + F$Right(Today, 7)
$ File = F$Left(Today, 2) + F$Mid(Today, 4, 2) + F$Right(Today, 7)
^
?Undefined symbol
$ _if F$Search("OMS$:REQLOG.OMS") .nes. "" Then -
Continue: _Rename/NoWarn OMS$:REQLOG.OMS 'File'
$ _if F$Search("OMS$:REQLOG.OMS") .nes. "" Then _Rename/NoWarn
OMS$:REQLOG.OMS 'File'
^
?Undefined symbol
Re: 11/93 rebuild
On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 10:37 AM Paul Koning wrote: > > > RSTS V10.0-L RSTS (DU0) INIT V10.0-0L > > > > > > Today's date? 19.5.27 > > > > Current time? 9:50 > > > > ... > > ;9.05.27 09:50 > > Hm, Y2K bug in that version? > It was installed from the RSTS/E 10.0 tape image that recently (2019-05-09) appeared on Bitsavers: http://www.bitsavers.org/bits/DEC/pdp11/rsts/RSTS_V10.ZIP I have installed from a RSTS/E 10.1 tape image in the past and I seem to remember it being more Y2K friendly. I used the Bitsavers 10.0 tape image as an example here because the 10.1 tape image source that I previously used was not public at the time to provide a link. > > Proceed with system startup? > > > > Beginning RSTS/E system startup... > > 19.05.27 09:50 Installing monitor overlays > > 19.05.27 09:50 Mounting disks > > 19.05.27 09:50 Assigning logical names > > 19.05.27 09:50 Starting error logging > > 19.05.27 09:50 Setting system characteristics > > 27-May-19 09:50 AM Installing run-time systems and libraries > > 27-May-19 09:50 AM Starting Operator/Message Services > > ?Invalid time > > ?Undefined symbol > > ?Undefined symbol > > This says there's some stuff in your start.com that RSTS is not happy with, > but it's not clear what that might be. It doesn't seem to cause any real > problems. > Yeah, those messages bug me slightly and I should try to figure out what they mean. I don't remember seeing those when I used a 10.1 install. I just wanted to get this example out there for Rod now, and worry about clean up issues later. Thanks.
Re: 11/93 rebuild
> On May 27, 2019, at 1:23 PM, Glen Slick via cctalk > wrote: > > ... > Then boot from DU0, and if everything worked along the way it should > just work. Assuming it boots OK into RSTS/E 10.0, use the SHOW DISK > command to verify that the reported disk size is the expected 311200 > blocks. Nice. You can run the file system checker -- in INIT, to the "start timesharing" prompt, answer "refresh", then for the system disk, and when asked "Rebuild" say yes. It should complete with no complaints. > The output below is booting from the SCSI disk on a KDJ11-D 11/53. > > 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 > > Commands are Help, Boot, List, Map, Test and Wrap. > Type a command then press the RETURN key: BOOT DU0 > > > DU0 > > RSTS V10.0-L RSTS (DU0) INIT V10.0-0L > > > Today's date? 19.5.27 > > Current time? 9:50 > > ... > ;9.05.27 09:50 Hm, Y2K bug in that version? > Proceed with system startup? > > Beginning RSTS/E system startup... > 19.05.27 09:50 Installing monitor overlays > 19.05.27 09:50 Mounting disks > 19.05.27 09:50 Assigning logical names > 19.05.27 09:50 Starting error logging > 19.05.27 09:50 Setting system characteristics > 27-May-19 09:50 AM Installing run-time systems and libraries > 27-May-19 09:50 AM Starting Operator/Message Services > ?Invalid time > ?Undefined symbol > ?Undefined symbol This says there's some stuff in your start.com that RSTS is not happy with, but it's not clear what that might be. It doesn't seem to cause any real problems. paul
Re: 11/93 rebuild
On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 6:58 AM Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > > Hi > > Whilst I wait to hear from Glen Slick who has got me this far > (Thanks Glen) I'll restate the problem. > > 1. I now have an old XP system with SIMH on it (PDP11.exe) > > 2. I have created RD54.dsk containing RSTS/E > > 3. Attached to the system is a 2.1Gb SCSI drive via an adaptec 2940 > controller > > 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to put > RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. > > 5. The drive will then be moved to a CQD-220A/TM SCSI controller on my > KDJ11-E based 11/93 and must boot. > > 6. Its just an image copy from one drive to another on the same system. > > 7. Nobody has come up with a tried and tested list of step by step > instructions yet. After using sg3_utils sg_format to resize the capacity of the the SCSI drive to match the size of the RD54 disk image, you can the use something equivalent to 'dd' to copy the RD54 disk image to the SCSI drive. On a Windows system I use a simple utility I wrote myself years ago. I will send Rod a copy of that directly off list. Similar utilities can be found online if you search around. I haven't found any that I will recommend myself. After the RD54 disk image has been copied to the physical SCSI drive on your Windows system, move it over to the PDP-11/93 system with the CMD CQD-220 controller. Use the CQD-220 firmware utilities to check that the SCSI drive is recognized and configured as a single DU unit. It might be a good idea to use the 'Z' configuration option to reset the controller to the default settings. The output below was from a CQD-220. The firmware on your CQD-220A may differ slightly with more options, but it is the same general idea. SCSI HOST ADAPTER UTILITY (REV. A8) [ DISK ]: [ TAPE ] 1 = LOGICAL UNIT NUMBER OFFSET :6 = LOGICAL UNIT NUMBER OFFSET 2 = FORMAT DRIVE :7 = ADDITIONAL UTILITIES 3 = QUALIFY DRIVE: 4 = MANUALLY REPLACE BAD BLOCKS : 5 = ADDITIONAL UTILITIES : SELECT OPTION ? 5 ADDITIONAL UTILITIES (REV. A8)SN = 9478 D = DISPLAY SCSI DEVICE & SETUP CONFIGURATION S = SEND SCSI COMMAND TO THE DEVICE T = TEST SCSI DEVICE R = FORMAT RCT BLOCK SELECT OPTION ? D CURRENT CONFIGURATION : DEV0: DU0 SCSI ID 0 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV1: DU1 SCSI ID 1 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV2: DU2 SCSI ID 2 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV3: DU3 SCSI ID 3 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV4: MU0 SCSI ID 4 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Buffer Mode ON, DEV5: MU1 SCSI ID 5 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Buffer Mode ON, DEV6: MU2 SCSI ID 6 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Buffer Mode ON, DEV7 SCSI ID 7 HOST ADAPTER, SCSI Reset ON,Density Mode ON, CHANGE CONFIGURATION ? (Y/N) Y R = Toggle SCSI Reset, M = Toggle Density Mode D = Toggle Disconnect, B = Toggle Buffer Mode (Tape only) S = Toggle Sync/Async, W = Toggle Write w/Verify (Disk only) C = Reconfigure Device, P = Toggle Prevent Medium Removal T = Reset All Device Modes to Default Z = Reset Controller to Default Configuration SELECT OPTION ? Z DEV0: DU0 SCSI ID 0 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV1: DU1 SCSI ID 1 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV2: DU2 SCSI ID 2 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV3: DU3 SCSI ID 3 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV4: MU0 SCSI ID 4 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Buffer Mode ON, DEV5: MU1 SCSI ID 5 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Buffer Mode ON, DEV6: MU2 SCSI ID 6 LUN 0 Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Buffer Mode ON, DEV7 SCSI ID 7 HOST ADAPTER, SCSI Reset ON,Density Mode ON, CHANGE CONFIGURATION ? (Y/N) N SCANNING SCSI DEVICES ATTACHED ... DEV0: DU0 SCSI ID 0 LUN 0 COMPAQPCDDRS-39130W S99C Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV1: DU1 SCSI ID 1 LUN 0 OFFLINE Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV2: DU2 SCSI ID 2 LUN 0 OFFLINE Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV3: DU3 SCSI ID 3 LUN 0 OFFLINE Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Write W/Verify OFF, DEV4: MU0 SCSI ID 4 LUN 0 OFFLINE Disconnect ON,Sync Mode ON,Prevent Medium Removal ON,Buffer Mode ON, DEV5: MU1 SCSI ID 5 LUN 0 OFFLINE
Re: 11/93 rebuild
> On May 27, 2019, at 12:14 PM, Holm Tiffe via cctalk > wrote: > > Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > >> Hi >> >> Whilst I wait to hear from Glen Slick who has got me this far >> (Thanks Glen) I'll restate the problem. >> >> 1. I now have an old XP system with SIMH on it (PDP11.exe) >> >> 2. I have created RD54.dsk containing RSTS/E >> >> 3. Attached to the system is a 2.1Gb SCSI drive via an adaptec 2940 >> controller >> >> 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to put >> RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. >> >> 5. The drive will then be moved to a CQD-220A/TM SCSI controller on my >> KDJ11-E based 11/93 and must boot. >> >> 6. Its just an image copy from one drive to another on the same system. >> >> 7. Nobody has come up with a tried and tested list of step by step >> instructions yet. >> >> >> Rod Smallwood >> > > I don't think that you have any chance to get that to work, since the > data structures on the floppy disk will be different to that needed > structure on the scsi disk. As far as I know the controllers put some > kind of partitioning information to the disks too... Floppy? I don't see that mentioned. RSTS can handle image copies without trouble if the sizes match, or if destination is slightly bigger. Partitions -- there is no such thing on RSTS. Writing disks is no problem if you have a program that can write raw block devies, and an OS that lets you do this. Sufficiently old Windows can do this via the BIOS I/O machinery; I've done it for RX50 floppies though not for hard drives (don't have any). RX50 floppies do have two complications: 10 sectors per track rather than the PC standard 9, and a sector layout with interleaving and track skew. It's not hard to deal with this in software once you have the details reverse engineered. FLX does this, it's how I've created PRO boot floppies on my PC. paul
Re: 11/93 rebuild
On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 6:58 AM Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > > Hi > > Whilst I wait to hear from Glen Slick who has got me this far > (Thanks Glen) I'll restate the problem. > > 1. I now have an old XP system with SIMH on it (PDP11.exe) > > 2. I have created RD54.dsk containing RSTS/E > > 3. Attached to the system is a 2.1Gb SCSI drive via an adaptec 2940 > controller > > 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to put > RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. > > 5. The drive will then be moved to a CQD-220A/TM SCSI controller on my > KDJ11-E based 11/93 and must boot. > > 6. Its just an image copy from one drive to another on the same system. > > 7. Nobody has come up with a tried and tested list of step by step > instructions yet. OK, now that you have an RD54 disk image and a 2GB SCSI drive attached to an Adaptec 2940 controller on a Windows XP system, the first thing I would do is resize the capacity of the 2GB SCSI drive to match the capacity of an RD54 drive. To do that, I would download sg3_utils ( http://sg.danny.cz/sg/sg3_utils.html ). Specifically I would download version 1.37 of the Windows binaries here: http://sg.danny.cz/sg/p/sg3_utils-1.37exe.zip The current version is 1.44, which I have not tried yet. The last time I tried version 1.42 I had some issues so I went back to version 1.37 so that I what I suggest for now. The RD54 disk image that was previously created has a block size of 311,200 and a byte size of 159,334,400. The goal in this step is to resize the capacity of the SCSI drive so that when it is attached to CMD CQD-220, the capacity of the drive as reported through the MSCP interface will match that of the RD54 disk image. What I have observed with the CMD CQD-220 controllers that I have is that they report a capacity of 2 blocks smaller through the MSCP interface than the SCSI drive reports. That is with the CMD CQD-220 controller reset to default settings of a single unit for the drive, not split into 2 or 4 units. So the SCSI drive should report a capacity of 311,202 (311,200 + 2) blocks in this case. With the sg3_utils-1.37 binaries download and extracted on your Windows XP system with the 2GB SCSI drive connected to the AHA-2940 controller, you could do this: // Use sg_scan to see what drives are attached. In this example physical drive "PD1" is the target drive. This will vary depending on the configuration of your system. Find the physical drive name entry that matches your target drive. C:\sg3_utils-1.37>sg_scan PD0 [C] HDS728040PLAT20 PF1OA21B PD1 COMPAQPC DDRS-39130W S99C CDROM0 [Z] TEAC CD-224E 1.7A // Use sg_inq to send a SCSI Inquiry command to the physical drive to verify that the vendor and product information seems correct for the target drive. If you don't want to be making changes to the wrong drive. C:\sg3_utils-1.37>sg_inq pd1 standard INQUIRY: PQual=0 Device_type=0 RMB=0 version=0x02 [SCSI-2] [AERC=0] [TrmTsk=0] NormACA=0 HiSUP=0 Resp_data_format=2 SCCS=0 ACC=0 TPGS=0 3PC=0 Protect=0 [BQue=0] EncServ=0 MultiP=0 [MChngr=0] [ACKREQQ=0] Addr16=0 [RelAdr=0] WBus16=1 Sync=1 Linked=1 [TranDis=0] CmdQue=1 [SPI: Clocking=0x0 QAS=0 IUS=0] length=164 (0xa4) Peripheral device type: disk Vendor identification: COMPAQPC Product identification: DDRS-39130W Product revision level: S99C Unit serial number: REGA0360 // Use sg_readcap to send a SCSI Read Capacity command to the physical drive. Make a note of the current number of blocks and write that down in case you might want to return the drive to its native capacity sometime later. C:\sg3_utils-1.37>sg_readcap pd1 Read Capacity results: Last logical block address=17773499 (0x10f33bb), Number of blocks=17773500 Logical block length=512 bytes Hence: Device size: 9100032000 bytes, 8678.47 MiB, 9.10003 GB // Ok, now time to actually use sg_format --resize to change the reported capacity of the drive. The --resize option does not do a low level format of the drive. It uses a SCSI Mode Select command to change the capacity of the drive as reported by a SCSI Read Capacity command. Here the block count is 311,202 (311,200 + 2) blocks. C:\sg3_utils-1.37>sg_format --count=311202 --resize --verbose pd1 inquiry cdb: 12 00 00 00 24 00 COMPAQPC DDRS-39130W S99C peripheral_type: disk [0x0] PROTECT=0 mode sense (10) cdb: 5a 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 fc 00 mode sense (10): pass-through requested 252 bytes but got 28 bytes Mode Sense (block descriptor) data, prior to changes: Number of blocks=17773500 [0x10f33bc] Block size=512 [0x200] mode select (10) cdb: 55 11 00 00 00 00 00 00 1c 00 Resize operation seems to have been successful // Use sg_readcap again to verify that the change took effect as desired. The new disk size of 159,335,424 bytes is 1024 (2 blocks) larger than the disk image size 159,334,400 C:\sg3_utils-1.37>sg_readcap pd1 Read Capacity results: Last logical
Re: 11/93 rebuild
Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote: > > From: Rod Smallwood > > > 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to > > put RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. > > Well, this isn't a list of directions, but... I've had good luck doing > almost this exact same thing (on a Windows XP box, copy a filesystem in > Windoze file onto a device, in my case an SD card on a USB adapter) with > 'dd for Windows', available here: > > http://www.chrysocome.net/dd > > The command line I've worked out to use is: > > dd-removable if=UnixRoot of=\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 count=4872 > seek=131072 > > I don't recall the exact procedure I used to generate that, but I'm pretty > sure it involved the use of the "--list" command to 'dd', to get a list of > the devices on the system. (The "4872" is the size of the RK pack, > obviously.) > > I'm using dd-0.6beta3.zip but there may be a later version that works too. > > Noel You have to have an already existing parition structure on the disk and an OS that knows what todo with that. There is no way that Ron could boot his PDP this way. Regards, Holm -- Technik Service u. Handel Tiffe, www.tsht.de, Holm Tiffe, Freiberger Straße 42, 09600 Oberschöna, USt-Id: DE253710583 i...@tsht.de Fax +49 3731 74200 Tel +49 3731 74222 Mobil: 0172 8790 741
Re: 11/93 rebuild
Rod Smallwood via cctalk wrote: > Hi > > Whilst I wait to hear from Glen Slick who has got me this far > (Thanks Glen) I'll restate the problem. > > 1. I now have an old XP system with SIMH on it (PDP11.exe) > > 2. I have created RD54.dsk containing RSTS/E > > 3. Attached to the system is a 2.1Gb SCSI drive via an adaptec 2940 > controller > > 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to put > RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. > > 5. The drive will then be moved to a CQD-220A/TM SCSI controller on my > KDJ11-E based 11/93 and must boot. > > 6. Its just an image copy from one drive to another on the same system. > > 7. Nobody has come up with a tried and tested list of step by step > instructions yet. > > > Rod Smallwood > I don't think that you have any chance to get that to work, since the data structures on the floppy disk will be different to that needed structure on the scsi disk. As far as I know the controllers put some kind of partitioning information to the disks too... I've installed different PDP11 Os'es from simh to the real pdp11/(53,73,83) using simh's tape interface writing boot tapes. I've converted the simh's tape file with my own utility to an qarter inch tape connected to an Tandberg SLR5 to my FreeBSD box. as far as I know in the meantime there exists an utility similar to mine that could write out tapes from a tape file. I've connected another SLR5 drive to the PDP11 box with an Emulex UC08, Im sure that will work on the CQD220 too. An Tandberg SLR5 and Tapes should be easy to et on ebay. I've installed RT11, RSX11, XXDP and 2.11BSD this way. Regards, Holm -- Technik Service u. Handel Tiffe, www.tsht.de, Holm Tiffe, Freiberger Straße 42, 09600 Oberschöna, USt-Id: DE253710583 i...@tsht.de Fax +49 3731 74200 Tel +49 3731 74222 Mobil: 0172 8790 741
Re: 11/93 rebuild
> From: Rod Smallwood > 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to > put RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. Well, this isn't a list of directions, but... I've had good luck doing almost this exact same thing (on a Windows XP box, copy a filesystem in Windoze file onto a device, in my case an SD card on a USB adapter) with 'dd for Windows', available here: http://www.chrysocome.net/dd The command line I've worked out to use is: dd-removable if=UnixRoot of=\\?\Device\Harddisk2\Partition0 count=4872 seek=131072 I don't recall the exact procedure I used to generate that, but I'm pretty sure it involved the use of the "--list" command to 'dd', to get a list of the devices on the system. (The "4872" is the size of the RK pack, obviously.) I'm using dd-0.6beta3.zip but there may be a later version that works too. Noel
11/93 rebuild
Hi Whilst I wait to hear from Glen Slick who has got me this far (Thanks Glen) I'll restate the problem. 1. I now have an old XP system with SIMH on it (PDP11.exe) 2. I have created RD54.dsk containing RSTS/E 3. Attached to the system is a 2.1Gb SCSI drive via an adaptec 2940 controller 4. I need a tried and tested list of step by step instructions to put RD54.dsk on the SCSI drive. 5. The drive will then be moved to a CQD-220A/TM SCSI controller on my KDJ11-E based 11/93 and must boot. 6. Its just an image copy from one drive to another on the same system. 7. Nobody has come up with a tried and tested list of step by step instructions yet. Rod Smallwood --
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
I would love it if anyone on this list who maintains a wiki for PDP-11's could collect all of the various methods and instructions. I am still far from ready to do things like this (moving images to a PDP) but it is in my future. I could go through all the emails in the archive on the subject (thats fine) but a wiki to go to where everything is consolidated would be enormously helpful From: cctalk on behalf of Paul Koning via cctalk Sent: Monday, May 27, 2019 9:03 AM To: Rod Smallwood; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Subject: Re: 11/93 Rebuild Or FLX. FLX 2.6 uses DJGPP and runs on old stuff, possibly as far back as actual DOS and certainly should have no problem with XP. It doesn't do image copy, though. You could steal some of the code and make an image copy tool. Or you could use it to initialize the destination disk, copy all the files, and "hook" to write the boot block. paul > On May 27, 2019, at 5:25 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk > wrote: > > I think the answer may be PUTR but I'll wait and see what Glen says .. He's > been right so far. > > Rod > > > On 27/05/2019 09:56, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: >> On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: >>> On an old XP box? er neither will run >> >> My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool for >> Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there are >> instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for >> Windows, whatever. >> >> Christian > > -- > >
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
Or FLX. FLX 2.6 uses DJGPP and runs on old stuff, possibly as far back as actual DOS and certainly should have no problem with XP. It doesn't do image copy, though. You could steal some of the code and make an image copy tool. Or you could use it to initialize the destination disk, copy all the files, and "hook" to write the boot block. paul > On May 27, 2019, at 5:25 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk > wrote: > > I think the answer may be PUTR but I'll wait and see what Glen says .. He's > been right so far. > > Rod > > > On 27/05/2019 09:56, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: >> On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: >>> On an old XP box? er neither will run >> >> My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool for >> Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there are >> instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for >> Windows, whatever. >> >> Christian > > -- > >
RE: 11/93 Rebuild
> -Original Message- > From: cctalk On Behalf Of Christian Corti > via cctalk > Sent: 27 May 2019 09:57 > To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts > > Subject: Re: 11/93 Rebuild > > On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: > > On an old XP box? er neither will run > > My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool for > Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there are > instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for Windows, > whatever. > > Christian There are windows based, so GUI disk imaging tools for windows. I think I used WIN32DISKIMAGER las time I needed this. https://sourceforge.net/projects/win32diskimager/ Dave
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
I think the answer may be PUTR but I'll wait and see what Glen says .. He's been right so far. Rod On 27/05/2019 09:56, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: On an old XP box? er neither will run My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool for Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there are instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for Windows, whatever. Christian --
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: On an old XP box? er neither will run My reply was meant as a hint. You should be able to find a dd-like tool for Windows yourself ;-) Either by using a old version of Cygwin (there are instructions how to find them), by installing a stand-alone "dd" for Windows, whatever. Christian
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
Same command will work from a linux live cd > On May 27, 2019, at 9:30 AM, Rod Smallwood via cctalk > wrote: > > Hi > > On an old XP box? er neither will run > > Rod > > > On 27/05/2019 08:25, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: >> # dd if=RD54.dsk of=/dev/sda [or whatever the device name is] >> >> Oh, you said Windows... I'd recommend installing Cygwin ;-) > > -- > >
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
Hi On an old XP box? er neither will run Rod On 27/05/2019 08:25, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: # dd if=RD54.dsk of=/dev/sda [or whatever the device name is] Oh, you said Windows... I'd recommend installing Cygwin ;-) --
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
On Mon, 27 May 2019, Rod Smallwood wrote: In addition to the normal IDE drive it has an additional SCSI controller and drive Using SIMH I have created an image (RD54.dsk) containing a RSTS system. I am awaiting the final instructions as to how to copy the image to the SCSI drive in such a way I can connect it to the SCSI controller in the 11/93 and have it boot. # dd if=RD54.dsk of=/dev/sda [or whatever the device name is] Oh, you said Windows... I'd recommend installing Cygwin ;-) Christian
11/93 Rebuild
Hi Thanks to Glen Slick I now have a old windows xp system running SIMH Its connected to my LAN so web and file access are OK In addition to the normal IDE drive it has an additional SCSI controller and drive Using SIMH I have created an image (RD54.dsk) containing a RSTS system. I am awaiting the final instructions as to how to copy the image to the SCSI drive in such a way I can connect it to the SCSI controller in the 11/93 and have it boot. Rod Smallwood --
Re: 11/93 Rebuild
Rod, others, I have so far been unsuccessful getting my CQD220A for SCSI HD, and RQDX3 for floppy to coexist in an 11/83, at least with bsd2.11. I am eager to hear whether you get both controllers working in the same box, and how. Mark Mark G. Thomas (m...@misty.com), KC3DRE > On May 18, 2019, at 15:10, Rod Smallwood via cctalk > wrote: > > Hi Guys > >Well the RD53 in my 11/93 finally clapped out. > >The CPU is a late model KDJ11-E with everything on the one board. > >So its a switch from MFM to SCSI Drives. > >A CQD220A will drive the hard disk and the RQDX3 will stay to look > after the RX50 > >I've put the Hard Drive on the primary CSR address (17772150) and I > will shift the RQDX3 to an alternate CSR > >Comments as to if this is the right way round and what CSR's to use > for the two controllers invited. > > Rod > > > -- > >
11/93 Rebuild
Hi Guys Well the RD53 in my 11/93 finally clapped out. The CPU is a late model KDJ11-E with everything on the one board. So its a switch from MFM to SCSI Drives. A CQD220A will drive the hard disk and the RQDX3 will stay to look after the RX50 I've put the Hard Drive on the primary CSR address (17772150) and I will shift the RQDX3 to an alternate CSR Comments as to if this is the right way round and what CSR's to use for the two controllers invited. Rod --
