Re: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication

[David Kaseler via CnC-List]

Thanks Steve, this is great information. I'm happy to have found your C 
support site and have already received this and other helpful information.
Dave.

Sent from my iPad

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 6:07 PM, S Thomas via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> This subject has come up a number of times, and due to the difficulty of 
> access, many C owners have opted to screw in a hose fitting in place of the 
> grease cup and run a line to a grease nipple at a more convenient location. 
> As others have mentioned, all is above the water line, so no worries there. 
> The thread into the rudder post should be 1/4" NPT, but it is easy enough to 
> check against a known fitting once you get the old one out. The link is to a 
> site which has what looks to me like the original equipment. I have not dealt 
> with them, but you can see what the grease cups looked like new, and the 
> dimensions.
> 
> http://www.magnetoparts.com/grease_cups.htm
> 
> I used an artist's paint brush to apply transmission fluid to the rudder 
> shaft at the top of the rudder tube, and again where the top bearing comes 
> through the deck, on a boat that had been sitting for a few years. That 
> worked good to free it up, and I recommend it for that purpose, but it won't 
> last. Winch grease or some other kind of water resistant grease will last a 
> lot longer.
> 
> Steve Thomas
> C MKIII
> Port Stanley, ON
> 
> C
> Merritt Island, FL
> 
> - Original Message - From: "David Kaseler via CnC-List" 
> 
> To: 
> Cc: "David Kaseler" 
> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 16:48
> Subject: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication
> 
> 
>> I have a C 33 from 1975 and I have just discovered what appears to be a 
>> very deteriorated grease cup fitting on the fiberglass tube which supports 
>> the rudder post. It appears that the top of the grease cup itself has rotted 
>> away leaving just the sides and a very rusty body. I touched it and some 
>> metal feel off in my fingers. Have other C owners had to deal with this 
>> issue?  What am I looking at? Can this fitting be replaced? Is it screwed 
>> into the glass or just glassed in. Can this be worked on with the boat 
>> afloat or am I going to sink the boat? Any help I can get with this project 
>> will be greatly appreciated.
>> Thanks from a new member,
>> Dave.
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!


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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[S Thomas via CnC-List]

C mark I to IV all have 4.5 foot draft, but the mark 1 and II will be 
better for PHRF racing if not light air and only double handed. The mark III 
and IV versions are faster in light air but more tender and require rail 
meat to work best when the wind picks up. All versions are seaworthy, easy 
to handle, have stand up head room if you are not too tall, and big enough 
for weekend getaways.


There is a shoal draft version of the C that is only 4.5 foot draft, but 
not that many were built. Very similar sailing characteristics to the 27, 
but a bit stiffer.  All of the good stuff above, and a bit more room in the 
cabin for those weekend get aways.


Steve Thomas
C MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

- Original Message - 
From: "John Pennie via CnC-List" 

To: 
Cc: "John Pennie" 
Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 20:09
Subject: Stus-List Help me pick next boat


Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
criteria…


Draft - no more than 4.5’
Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
Cost < $25k
Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails, 
occasional weekend trips

Good in a chop
No restriction on age
Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint

So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a 
Beneteau first 285.


Thanks in advance

John



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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

Mk V C 27.  Ticks all the boxes and puts money back in your pocket.
My friend Bill Dingwell bought one after selling his C 40 and still kicks 
butt in local PHRF on Buzzards Bay.
Chuck Gilchrest
Padanaram, MA

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 8:09 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
> criteria…
> 
> Draft - no more than 4.5’ 
> Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
> Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
> Cost < $25k
> Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails,  
> occasional weekend trips
> Good in a chop
> No restriction on age
> Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
> Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint
> 
> So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a Beneteau 
> first 285.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> John
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!


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Re: Stus-List Depth meter transducer

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

http://www.airmar.com/productinfo.html?category=MT=Marine%20Transducers

Dennis C.

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 9:09 PM, John and Maryann Read via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Have an old Horizon instrument package including digital depth meter which
> has been out of production for many years and parts are no longer
> available.  It operates well but erratically.  Sometimes reads accurately,
> sometimes just 2 short lines indicating power is on but no signal to the
> head, then returns to reading OK.  Have inspected all wiring.  Cleaned
> transducer face.  Suspect transducer has given up the ghost.  Any ideas on
> how to verify?  If so I recall a thread which identified to manufacturer of
> most transducers.  Does anyone recall who that is and know contact info??
>
>
>
> Many thanks
>
>
>
>
>
> John and Maryann
>
> Legacy III
>
> 1982 C 34
>
> Noank, CT
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
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Stus-List Depth meter transducer

[John and Maryann Read via CnC-List]

Have an old Horizon instrument package including digital depth meter which
has been out of production for many years and parts are no longer available.
It operates well but erratically.  Sometimes reads accurately, sometimes
just 2 short lines indicating power is on but no signal to the head, then
returns to reading OK.  Have inspected all wiring.  Cleaned transducer face.
Suspect transducer has given up the ghost.  Any ideas on how to verify?  If
so I recall a thread which identified to manufacturer of most transducers.
Does anyone recall who that is and know contact info??

 

Many thanks

 

 

John and Maryann

Legacy III

1982 C 34

Noank, CT

 

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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

That’s interesting boat Randy.


> On Aug 8, 2016, at 9:43 PM, RANDY via CnC-List  wrote:
> 
> Lorne you're getting out already?  Didn't you just buy that boat?
> 
> John - how about an Islander 28?  It's a Robert Perry design.  Here's one for 
> sale in TX: 
> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1985/Islander-28-2799836/TX/United-States#.V6k0xscnuq0
> 
> Cheers,
> Randy
> 
> From: "Lorne Serpa via CnC-List" 
> To: "cnc-list" 
> Cc: "Lorne Serpa" 
> Sent: Monday, August 8, 2016 6:48:14 PM
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat
> 
> For 25K, that is, sorry not free.
> 
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 8:47 PM, Lorne Serpa  > wrote:
> You can have my 1988 MkII in Jan/Feb.  It's a 30' and in great shape, works 
> great for racing (proven winner) and I currently live on it, fridge, hatch 
> AC, very very good shape!  Have to wait though as it's my house.  Lots of 
> extra sails, way too many recent things to mention.
> ​
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[RANDY via CnC-List]

Lorne you're getting out already? Didn't you just buy that boat? 

John - how about an Islander 28? It's a Robert Perry design. Here's one for 
sale in TX: 
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1985/Islander-28-2799836/TX/United-States#.V6k0xscnuq0
 

Cheers, 
Randy 

- Original Message -

From: "Lorne Serpa via CnC-List"  
To: "cnc-list"  
Cc: "Lorne Serpa"  
Sent: Monday, August 8, 2016 6:48:14 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat 

For 25K, that is, sorry not free. 

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 8:47 PM, Lorne Serpa < lorne.se...@gmail.com > wrote: 



You can have my 1988 MkII in Jan/Feb. It's a 30' and in great shape, works 
great for racing (proven winner) and I currently live on it, fridge, hatch AC, 
very very good shape! Have to wait though as it's my house. Lots of extra 
sails, way too many recent things to mention. 
​ 





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Re: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication

[S Thomas via CnC-List]

This subject has come up a number of times, and due to the difficulty of 
access, many C owners have opted to screw in a hose fitting in place of 
the grease cup and run a line to a grease nipple at a more convenient 
location. As others have mentioned, all is above the water line, so no 
worries there. The thread into the rudder post should be 1/4" NPT, but it is 
easy enough to check against a known fitting once you get the old one out. 
The link is to a site which has what looks to me like the original 
equipment. I have not dealt with them, but you can see what the grease cups 
looked like new, and the dimensions.


http://www.magnetoparts.com/grease_cups.htm

I used an artist's paint brush to apply transmission fluid to the rudder 
shaft at the top of the rudder tube, and again where the top bearing comes 
through the deck, on a boat that had been sitting for a few years. That 
worked good to free it up, and I recommend it for that purpose, but it won't 
last. Winch grease or some other kind of water resistant grease will last a 
lot longer.


Steve Thomas
C MKIII
Port Stanley, ON

C
Merritt Island, FL

- Original Message - 
From: "David Kaseler via CnC-List" 

To: 
Cc: "David Kaseler" 
Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 16:48
Subject: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication


I have a C 33 from 1975 and I have just discovered what appears to be a 
very deteriorated grease cup fitting on the fiberglass tube which supports 
the rudder post. It appears that the top of the grease cup itself has 
rotted away leaving just the sides and a very rusty body. I touched it and 
some metal feel off in my fingers. Have other C owners had to deal with 
this issue?  What am I looking at? Can this fitting be replaced? Is it 
screwed into the glass or just glassed in. Can this be worked on with the 
boat afloat or am I going to sink the boat? Any help I can get with this 
project will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks from a new member,
Dave.



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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[Lorne Serpa via CnC-List]

For 25K, that is, sorry not free.

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 8:47 PM, Lorne Serpa  wrote:

> You can have my 1988 MkII in Jan/Feb.  It's a 30' and in great shape,
> works great for racing (proven winner) and I currently live on it, fridge,
> hatch AC, very very good shape!  Have to wait though as it's my house.
> Lots of extra sails, way too many recent things to mention.
> ​
>
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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[Lorne Serpa via CnC-List]

You can have my 1988 MkII in Jan/Feb.  It's a 30' and in great shape, works
great for racing (proven winner) and I currently live on it, fridge, hatch
AC, very very good shape!  Have to wait though as it's my house.  Lots of
extra sails, way too many recent things to mention.
​
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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Good boat, but can’t do it Fred. You know me and Sabre just don’t get along. 
Would love a 33 mkIi centerboard but a bit bigger and a bit pricier than I’m 
thinking right now

John

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 8:19 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> How about a Sabre 28?
> 
> http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1982/Sabre-28-2984425/Erie/PA/United-States#.V6khP2Xiucw
>  
> 
> 
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
> 
>> On Aug 8, 2016, at 7:09 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
>> criteria…
>> 
>> Draft - no more than 4.5’ 
>> Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
>> Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
>> Cost < $25k
>> Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails,  
>> occasional weekend trips
>> Good in a chop
>> No restriction on age
>> Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
>> Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint
>> 
>> So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a Beneteau 
>> first 285.
>> 
>> Thanks in advance
>> 
>> John
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

How about a Sabre 28?

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1982/Sabre-28-2984425/Erie/PA/United-States#.V6khP2Xiucw

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 7:09 PM, John Pennie via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
> criteria…
> 
> Draft - no more than 4.5’ 
> Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
> Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
> Cost < $25k
> Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails,  
> occasional weekend trips
> Good in a chop
> No restriction on age
> Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
> Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint
> 
> So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a Beneteau 
> first 285.
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> John

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Re: Stus-List C 33 Main Sail Sheave

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

+1 for Zephyrwerks.  This past spring, he made up three masthead sheaves to 
replace the aging aluminum ones that came original to the boat.  He actually 
mis-made one; when I measured and found the mistake, he remade it and shipped 
the replacement priority, as I needed to get the mast put back together and 
re-stepped.  The new acetal sheaves are beautifully made, and work just as 
beautifully.

Be prepared to make extremely precise measurements for him before he’ll make up 
your sheaves; I used my digital calipers and gave him dimensions to the 
thousandth of an inch for the sheave pin diameter, sheave shoulder width and 
diameter, and the clearance between the sheave and the box, both for width and 
for line clearance.  The results are worth it.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 7:08 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Most people here accept www.zephyrwerks.com  as 
> the premier source of custom sheaves.  He makes a quality product to exacting 
> standards.  I was satisfied with the 3 sheaves I had made for my boom end 
> fitting.  It was about $45 per sheave.  Each had a pressed in sintered bronze 
> bushing
> 
> Josh Muckley
> S/V Sea Hawk
> 1989 C 37+
> Solomons, MD
> 
> 
> On Aug 8, 2016 6:51 PM, "Free Girls Sailing via CnC-List" 
> > wrote:
> We have a main halyard sheave at the top of the mast that needs replacing. 
> Anyone ever done this? Not sure where to look for parts and if it can be done 
> without stepping the mast. Any advice is appreciated. I have a picture if 
> it's allowed. 
> 
> Jessica 
> 1975 C 33
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Stus-List Help me pick next boat

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

Ok, so situations change and the boat needs to change with it.  Here’s the 
criteria…

Draft - no more than 4.5’ 
Assume moderate air (`10-15 knots true) sailed by a crew of 2
Easy to daysail, PHRF competitive
Cost < $25k
Coastal cruising only.  Primarily daysailing - quick, easy evenings sails,  
occasional weekend trips
Good in a chop
No restriction on age
Outboard power is just too ugly, inboard please
Bigger the cockpit the better but remember weekender constraint

So that’s it.  What would you do?  Leading candidate right now is a Beneteau 
first 285.

Thanks in advance

John





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Re: Stus-List C 33 Main Sail Sheave

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Most people here accept www.zephyrwerks.com as the premier source of custom
sheaves.  He makes a quality product to exacting standards.  I was
satisfied with the 3 sheaves I had made for my boom end fitting.  It was
about $45 per sheave.  Each had a pressed in sintered bronze bushing

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C 37+
Solomons, MD

On Aug 8, 2016 6:51 PM, "Free Girls Sailing via CnC-List" <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

We have a main halyard sheave at the top of the mast that needs replacing.
Anyone ever done this? Not sure where to look for parts and if it can be
done without stepping the mast. Any advice is appreciated. I have a picture
if it's allowed.

Jessica
1975 C 33

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Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Stus-List C 33 Main Sail Sheave

[Free Girls Sailing via CnC-List]

We have a main halyard sheave at the top of the mast that needs replacing.
Anyone ever done this? Not sure where to look for parts and if it can be
done without stepping the mast. Any advice is appreciated. I have a picture
if it's allowed.

Jessica
1975 C 33
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Re: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication

[John Russo via CnC-List]

Dave,

If the Cup is salvageable and threads are intact you can have a new cap
fabricated to same dimensions with threads and have a grease fitting screwed
into the cap and then screw it down to the cup and use a small grease gun
thereafter without ever having to unscrew the cap again. This assumes that
what you have left there is sound. Otherwise keep trying the group for a
source of new assembly which is glassed into the rudder sleeve.

John
Arpeggio C 32 1984

-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of David
Kaseler via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 4:48 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: David Kaseler
Subject: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication

I have a C 33 from 1975 and I have just discovered what appears to be a
very deteriorated grease cup fitting on the fiberglass tube which supports
the rudder post. It appears that the top of the grease cup itself has rotted
away leaving just the sides and a very rusty body. I touched it and some
metal feel off in my fingers. Have other C owners had to deal with this
issue?  What am I looking at? Can this fitting be replaced? Is it screwed
into the glass or just glassed in. Can this be worked on with the boat
afloat or am I going to sink the boat? Any help I can get with this project
will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks from a new member,
Dave.

Sent from my iPad

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are greatly appreciated!


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Re: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication

[F Reynolds via CnC-List]

Hi David,

I just signed up for this website, so not sure how it works.  But, about your 
issue - my C 34 from 1980 has the same grease cup.  It is above the 
waterline, so no worries about sinking the boat.  I think you can buy a similar 
fitting and replace what you have by unscrewing the metal base which is (I 
think) threaded into the rudder stock support casing.

Let me know your thoughts...

Cheers,

Fred

 
 
You only live once...make it count.   
In Memory of SER
Quien Nos Quita Lo Gozao!

"Live passionately, even if it kills you, because something is going to kill 
you anyway"
Webb Chiles, 3.5 times circumnavigator


> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 13:48:08 -0700
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Subject: Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> CC: kasel...@q.com
> 
> I have a C 33 from 1975 and I have just discovered what appears to be a 
> very deteriorated grease cup fitting on the fiberglass tube which supports 
> the rudder post. It appears that the top of the grease cup itself has rotted 
> away leaving just the sides and a very rusty body. I touched it and some 
> metal feel off in my fingers. Have other C owners had to deal with this 
> issue?  What am I looking at? Can this fitting be replaced? Is it screwed 
> into the glass or just glassed in. Can this be worked on with the boat afloat 
> or am I going to sink the boat? Any help I can get with this project will be 
> greatly appreciated.
> Thanks from a new member,
> Dave.
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[David via CnC-List]

The RHADC will be at capacity with the Marion to Bermuda Race racers.   Getting 
any accommodations, forget reasonably priced , will be very hard.   Book 
early...if you can.   We are staying onboard during our stay.   

David F. Risch
1981 40-2
(401) 419-4650 (cell)


Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 14:39:58 -0400
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda
From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
CC: joel.aron...@gmail.com

Rick,
The St George dinghy club continues to deteriorate, and the AC will be in 
Hamilton harbor.  It would be at least 2 hours to the race course.
If the Royal Hamilton club can accommodate you I think you will be much happier.
Sounds like an awesome time!
Joel​
On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 1:39 PM, David via CnC-List  
wrote:



Corsair will be racing there again in the Marion Bermuda Race.  Great events, 
observation boat  and dockage at the Royal Hamilton Amateur Dinghy Club. 

http://www.marionbermuda.com/

We have a mentoring program to help folks prepare for the race...

David F. Risch
(401) 419-4650 (cell)


To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2016 12:32:36 -0400
Subject: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda
From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
CC: rickbr...@earthlink.net

It’s not as unreasonable as it sounds!
 
I saw in last month’s issue of Cruising World that Ocean Passage Opportunities 
is organizing several fleets to travel in company from the east coast to St. 
Georges for the Americas Cup finals in Bermuda next June. They seem to have a 
pretty good handle on organization, dockage, and activities. They are calling 
it Rally to the Cup.
 
Here are a couple of links to information on the OPO website:
https://www.sailopo.com/Rally_to_the_Cup_2017.aspx
 
https://www.sailopo.com/Cup_Rally_2017_Details.aspx
 
https://www.sailopo.com/Cup_Rally_2017_FAQs.aspx
 
Imzadi will definitely be going! 
 
My current plan is to join the Annapolis fleet (perhaps as it passes through 
the Norfolk area to save a few days travel in Chesapeake Bay), keep the boat at 
the Dinghy Club in St. Georges for about 2 weeks (so it can be available for 
accommodations), and return to Norfolk/Hampton, VA area after the Cup finals 
and when there is a good weather window. I figure I have room for 3 to 5 crew 
each way, and that there would probably be different crew in each direction. 
Crew slot available if you can’t take your own C to Bermuda.
 
So who wants to have a C rendezvous and watch the America’s Cup in Bermuda 
next summer?  
 
Rick Brass
Imzadi  C 38 mk 2
la Belle Aurore C 25 mk1
Washington, NC
 

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-- 
Joel 
301 541 8551


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Stus-List C 33 Rudder Post lubrication

[David Kaseler via CnC-List]

I have a C 33 from 1975 and I have just discovered what appears to be a very 
deteriorated grease cup fitting on the fiberglass tube which supports the 
rudder post. It appears that the top of the grease cup itself has rotted away 
leaving just the sides and a very rusty body. I touched it and some metal feel 
off in my fingers. Have other C owners had to deal with this issue?  What am 
I looking at? Can this fitting be replaced? Is it screwed into the glass or 
just glassed in. Can this be worked on with the boat afloat or am I going to 
sink the boat? Any help I can get with this project will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks from a new member,
Dave.

Sent from my iPad

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Re: Stus-List Fixing window leak

[Franklin Schenk via CnC-List]

As a lazy person I try the easy things first like tightening the screws.  What 
is the spacing of the screws?  6 to 8 inches is about right.
Frank 

On Monday, August 8, 2016 1:31 PM, Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List 
 wrote:
 

 Our first season with a 1978 C 34-1.  The PO re-did the windows using 
plexiglass over the openings bedded with Sudbury Sealant (found half the tube 
on the boat) and screws.  One window has a slight leak that seems to come in 
from the top of the plexi where water can collect.  I'd like to do a quick fix 
for the rest of the cursing season, then a more involved longer term solution 
(if required) when the season is over.  Any tips?
Thanks,  Jeremy

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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Kevin Driscoll via CnC-List]

Re: Organ Donation. Didn't see Bermuda on any of these lists, but I am sure
the scooters do some damage!

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/country-highest-organ-donation-rates/
https://top5ofanything.com/list/5990556d/Countries-with-the-Highest-Organ-Donation-Rates

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 12:28 PM Andrew Burton via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Interesting little scooter-related factoid:
> Bermuda is the biggest per capita source of donor organs in the world.
>
> Andy
> C 40
> Peregrine
>
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> But Joel, consider how much fun a drunken post-race-party scooter ride
>> from Hamilton back to St George’s Dinghy Club would be in the darK…   :^)
>>
>> — Fred
>>
>> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
>> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
>> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Andrew Burton
> 61 W Narragansett Ave
> Newport, RI
> USA 02840
> http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/
> phone  +401 965 5260
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Joe,

The guy who owned it passed away 2 years ago.  His widow has no idea how to
run a club.  They could not even hail a cab for someone because "the list
fell off the wall".  It was dirty and poorly run.  The dock hand and
bartender were competent.  There was no management.  A2B moved to RHADC
this year.  It was like moving from the Bates Motel to the Ritz.  Plus, as
I said, its at the wrong end of the island.

Joel

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 3:45 PM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> What is wrong with the St. Georges Dinghy Club??
>
> Anyway, drunk moped driving is a good way to be spending quality time
> picking coral/limestone bits out of your arms and legs and then wrapping
> said limbs with duct tape to keep leaking blood from attracting sharks on a
> scuba dive. Not that anyone I know did that…….
>
> Joe
>
> Coquina
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Andrew
> Burton via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Monday, August 08, 2016 15:27
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Cc:* Andrew Burton
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda
>
>
>
> Interesting little scooter-related factoid:
> Bermuda is the biggest per capita source of donor organs in the world.
>
> Andy
>
> C 40
>
> Peregrine
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> But Joel, consider how much fun a drunken post-race-party scooter ride
> from Hamilton back to St George’s Dinghy Club would be in the darK…   :^)
>
>
>
> — Fred
>
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V *Oceanis* (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Andrew Burton
> 61 W Narragansett Ave
> Newport, RI
> USA 02840
> http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/
> phone  +401 965 5260
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

Been there (by boat; twice…) and scootered there.  I can see why.

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 2:27 PM, Andrew Burton via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Interesting little scooter-related factoid: 
> Bermuda is the biggest per capita source of donor organs in the world.
> 
> Andy
> C 40
> Peregrine

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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

What is wrong with the St. Georges Dinghy Club??
Anyway, drunk moped driving is a good way to be spending quality time picking 
coral/limestone bits out of your arms and legs and then wrapping said limbs 
with duct tape to keep leaking blood from attracting sharks on a scuba dive. 
Not that anyone I know did that…….
Joe
Coquina


From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Andrew 
Burton via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, August 08, 2016 15:27
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Andrew Burton
Subject: Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

Interesting little scooter-related factoid:
Bermuda is the biggest per capita source of donor organs in the world.
Andy
C 40
Peregrine

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List 
> wrote:
But Joel, consider how much fun a drunken post-race-party scooter ride from 
Hamilton back to St George’s Dinghy Club would be in the darK…   :^)

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI




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--
Andrew Burton
61 W Narragansett Ave
Newport, RI
USA 02840
http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/
phone  +401 965 5260
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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Andrew Burton via CnC-List]

Interesting little scooter-related factoid:
Bermuda is the biggest per capita source of donor organs in the world.

Andy
C 40
Peregrine

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> But Joel, consider how much fun a drunken post-race-party scooter ride
> from Hamilton back to St George’s Dinghy Club would be in the darK…   :^)
>
> — Fred
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Andrew Burton
61 W Narragansett Ave
Newport, RI
USA 02840
http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/
phone  +401 965 5260
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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Fred,

Bermuda already has the highest rate of organ donation in the world.  I
don't want anyone here to add to that number!
Rick, no reason to go to Annapolis just to turn around!

Joel

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Frederick G Street via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> But Joel, consider how much fun a drunken post-race-party scooter ride
> from Hamilton back to St George’s Dinghy Club would be in the darK…   :^)
>
> — Fred
>
> Fred Street -- Minneapolis
> S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI
>
> On Aug 8, 2016, at 1:39 PM, Joel Aronson via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Rick,
>
> The St George dinghy club continues to deteriorate, and the AC will be in
> Hamilton harbor.  It would be at least 2 hours to the race course.
>
> If the Royal Hamilton club can accommodate you I think you will be much
> happier.
>
> Sounds like an awesome time!
>
> Joel​
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Frederick G Street via CnC-List]

But Joel, consider how much fun a drunken post-race-party scooter ride from 
Hamilton back to St George’s Dinghy Club would be in the darK…   :^)

— Fred

Fred Street -- Minneapolis
S/V Oceanis (1979 C Landfall 38) -- Bayfield, WI

> On Aug 8, 2016, at 1:39 PM, Joel Aronson via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Rick,
> 
> The St George dinghy club continues to deteriorate, and the AC will be in 
> Hamilton harbor.  It would be at least 2 hours to the race course.
> 
> If the Royal Hamilton club can accommodate you I think you will be much 
> happier.
> 
> Sounds like an awesome time!
> 
> Joel​

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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Rick,

The St George dinghy club continues to deteriorate, and the AC will be in
Hamilton harbor.  It would be at least 2 hours to the race course.

If the Royal Hamilton club can accommodate you I think you will be much
happier.

Sounds like an awesome time!

Joel​

On Mon, Aug 8, 2016 at 1:39 PM, David via CnC-List 
wrote:

> Corsair will be racing there again in the Marion Bermuda Race.  Great
> events, observation boat  and dockage at the Royal Hamilton Amateur Dinghy
> Club.
>
> http://www.marionbermuda.com/
>
> We have a mentoring program to help folks prepare for the race...
>
> David F. Risch
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
>
>
> --
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2016 12:32:36 -0400
> Subject: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> CC: rickbr...@earthlink.net
>
> It’s not as unreasonable as it sounds!
>
>
>
> I saw in last month’s issue of Cruising World that Ocean Passage
> Opportunities is organizing several fleets to travel in company from the
> east coast to St. Georges for the Americas Cup finals in Bermuda next June.
> They seem to have a pretty good handle on organization, dockage, and
> activities. They are calling it Rally to the Cup.
>
>
>
> Here are a couple of links to information on the OPO website:
>
> https://www.sailopo.com/Rally_to_the_Cup_2017.aspx
>
>
>
> https://www.sailopo.com/Cup_Rally_2017_Details.aspx
>
>
>
> https://www.sailopo.com/Cup_Rally_2017_FAQs.aspx
>
>
>
> Imzadi will definitely be going!
>
>
>
> My current plan is to join the Annapolis fleet (perhaps as it passes
> through the Norfolk area to save a few days travel in Chesapeake Bay), keep
> the boat at the Dinghy Club in St. Georges for about 2 weeks (so it can be
> available for accommodations), and return to Norfolk/Hampton, VA area after
> the Cup finals and when there is a good weather window. I figure I have
> room for 3 to 5 crew each way, and that there would probably be different
> crew in each direction. Crew slot available if you can’t take your own C
> to Bermuda.
>
>
>
> So who wants to have a C rendezvous and watch the America’s Cup in
> Bermuda next summer?
>
>
>
> Rick Brass
>
> *Imzadi  *C 38 mk 2
>
> *la Belle Aurore *C 25 mk1
>
> Washington, NC
>
>
>
> ___ This list is supported by
> the generous donations of our members. If you like what we do, please help
> us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> 
>  Virus-free.
> www.avast.com
> 
> <#m_3464864053069660196_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>


-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
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Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut

[RANDY via CnC-List]

Michael the person who posted about a hand held whisker pole sails on Lake 
Lanier, GA. He described using a hand-held boat hook to pole out his genoa. 
Nobody from the Rocky Mountain region posted about that. 

The RSA for the Rocky Mountain region (SAIL, http://rmsail.org ) follows the 
RRS and doesn't impose any rules of its own, and delegates to the SIs of its 
member clubs. Colorado Sail and Yacht Club's SIs 
(https://csyc.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/2016-CSYC-Spring-Summer-SIs.pdf) 
follow the RRS and don't modify anything to do with equipment (or navigation 
rules, or signal flags, or right of way rules, referring to an earlier post of 
yours). We keep clear of stationary or trolling fishermen with fishing lines 
out as a courtesy. So IMO your disparagement of this region is unfounded. 

In fact I remember one time during the summer of 2013 when High Cotton was RC. 
It was a completely dead-air, glassy-water night at the time of the J/22 start 
sequence. I was on Rick Fox's Merit 25 Gypsy Breeze, in the start sequence 
after the J/22s. We were trying to get out of the way of the J/22 start and had 
to fend off the committee boat, as we were making absolutely no headway and had 
absolutely no steerage. You disqualified us for "hitting the RC boat", which 
was completely inappropriate for several reasons: first, we weren't racing at 
that moment as defined by the RRS; second, if we had been racing the penalty 
for touching a mark (which the RC boat is) is taking a single turn, not a DSQ; 
and third, our boats didn't touch. Not to mention the general friendliness and 
sportsmanship aspects of the whole thing. Perhaps you should brush up on the 
rules and facts before making and communicating judgements. 

BTW you never answered my question in the earlier thread: do you own a C now? 

Regards, 
Randy Stafford 
S/V Grenadine 
C 30-1 #7 
Ken Caryl, CO 

- Original Message -

From: "Michael Cotton via CnC-List"  
To: "cnc-list"  
Cc: "Michael Cotton"  
Sent: Monday, August 8, 2016 1:10:22 AM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut 

This is sailing in the Rocky Mountain region. Their sailing rules are quite 
different from anywhere else I've sailed. I sailed there for a few years. Prior 
to coming to Colorado I sailed under YRALIS (Long Island Sound) and NBYA 
(Narragansett Bay) rules for over 20 years. Not surprised a hand held whisker 
pole is legal under Rocky Mountain sailing. 

Sent from my iPhone 

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Stus-List Fixing window leak

[Jeremy Ralph via CnC-List]

Our first season with a 1978 C 34-1.  The PO re-did the windows using
plexiglass over the openings bedded with Sudbury Sealant (found half the
tube on the boat) and screws.  One window has a slight leak that seems to
come in from the top of the plexi where water can collect.  I'd like to do
a quick fix for the rest of the cursing season, then a more involved longer
term solution (if required) when the season is over.  Any tips?

Thanks,
  Jeremy
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Re: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda

[David via CnC-List]

Corsair will be racing there again in the Marion Bermuda Race.  Great events, 
observation boat  and dockage at the Royal Hamilton Amateur Dinghy Club. 

http://www.marionbermuda.com/

We have a mentoring program to help folks prepare for the race...

David F. Risch
(401) 419-4650 (cell)


To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2016 12:32:36 -0400
Subject: Stus-List C Rendezvous - June, 2017 - St. Georges Bermuda
From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
CC: rickbr...@earthlink.net

It’s not as unreasonable as it sounds! I saw in last month’s issue of Cruising 
World that Ocean Passage Opportunities is organizing several fleets to travel 
in company from the east coast to St. Georges for the Americas Cup finals in 
Bermuda next June. They seem to have a pretty good handle on organization, 
dockage, and activities. They are calling it Rally to the Cup. Here are a 
couple of links to information on the OPO 
website:https://www.sailopo.com/Rally_to_the_Cup_2017.aspx 
https://www.sailopo.com/Cup_Rally_2017_Details.aspx 
https://www.sailopo.com/Cup_Rally_2017_FAQs.aspx Imzadi will definitely be 
going!  My current plan is to join the Annapolis fleet (perhaps as it passes 
through the Norfolk area to save a few days travel in Chesapeake Bay), keep the 
boat at the Dinghy Club in St. Georges for about 2 weeks (so it can be 
available for accommodations), and return to Norfolk/Hampton, VA area after the 
Cup finals and when there is a good weather window. I figure I have room for 3 
to 5 crew each way, and that there would probably be different crew in each 
direction. Crew slot available if you can’t take your own C to Bermuda. So 
who wants to have a C rendezvous and watch the America’s Cup in Bermuda next 
summer?   Rick BrassImzadi  C 38 mk 2la Belle Aurore C 25 mk1Washington, NC 
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Re: Stus-List Adding refrigeration.

[David via CnC-List]

Our compressor is on lazarette shelf.  When the engine key is turned on the 
bilge blower exhaust is also turned on.  Plenty cool in there.



David F. Risch
1981 40-2
(401) 419-4650 (cell)


> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 01:28:51 +
> Subject: Stus-List Adding refrigeration.
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> CC: hayden.a...@hotmail.com
> 
> Hello listers
> 
> I am sure this has been discussed before.   We have decided to add 
> refrigeration to State of Bliss.   Last winter I re-insulated the ice box 
> with a dramatic improvement to keeping ice.  
> 
> We generally do coastal cruising spending 3-4 days away from the dock.   
> 
> For those of you that have refrigeration or added it, where do you keep the 
> compressor or what system have you used?   I have thought of the lazerette 
> behind the ice box, however on the exterior bulkhead is the heat exchanger 
> for the engine.   
> 
> I would also appreciate any insights in the installation
> 
> Regards
> 
> Adam Hayden
> State of Bliss
> C 36
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!




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Stus-List Do Not Send Digest Emails

[Stu via CnC-List]

Maybe it’s new members who are sending Digest Emails and do not know the rules, 
maybe not.  I cannot stop people from sending them nor subscribing to digest 
mode but the next time it happens, your subscription will be changed from 
digest to single messages.

Do Not Send Emails with Digest in the Subject Line – you have been warned!!

Stu___

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Stus-List Whisker pole

[Neil Gallagher via CnC-List]

In PHRF Long Island Sound, the whisker pole length is limited to your LP 
dimension (clew to luff), not sure how other areas address pole length.  
If you sail non-spinnaker and use your spinnaker pole with the jib, you 
can actually get a credit depending on the size of the jib.


Neil Gallagher
Weatherly, 35-1
Glen Cove, NY


On 8/8/2016 12:22 PM, Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List wrote:
For us, Whisker poles are not treated the same as the spinnaker pole 
which is true for many other regions. Again, no mention of it in the 
phrf docs and everybody's using whisker poles that are long enough to 
be effective.


Truth is: A spin pole's length is woefully inadequate as a whisker 
pole (I have tried it), especially with a 150 % or above genoa. Sorry 
you guys can't use a "real" whisker pole with enough length to fully 
deploy a 150, you're missin' out.



-Francois
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA



Message: 3
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 12:44:03 +
From: "Hoyt, Mike" 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut
Message-ID:
<169e312f80b4c044be2dc1780a7de72f15c...@hfxexc11.impgroup.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

JF - check your PHRF certificate.  It specifies your spinnaker pole 
length.  A whisker pole is in fact treated the same as a spinnaker 
pole and unless your Sis state differently cannot exceed spin pole 
length without penalty.  If a pole longer than that declared is used 
or one that is unmeasurable (boat hook not attached) then you have 
violated your PHRF declaration and are subject to protest and DSQ


Mike
Halifax



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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
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Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut

[Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List]

For us, Whisker poles are not treated the same as the spinnaker pole which 
is true for many other regions. Again, no mention of it in the phrf docs 
and everybody's using whisker poles that are long enough to be effective. 

Truth is: A spin pole's length is woefully inadequate as a whisker pole (I 
have tried it), especially with a 150 % or above genoa. Sorry you guys 
can't use a "real" whisker pole with enough length to fully deploy a 150, 
you're missin' out. 

-Francois
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA 



Message: 3
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 12:44:03 +
From: "Hoyt, Mike" 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut
Message-ID:
 <169e312f80b4c044be2dc1780a7de72f15c...@hfxexc11.impgroup.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

JF - check your PHRF certificate.  It specifies your spinnaker pole 
length.  A whisker pole is in fact treated the same as a spinnaker pole 
and unless your Sis state differently cannot exceed spin pole length 
without penalty.  If a pole longer than that declared is used or one that 
is unmeasurable (boat hook not attached) then you have violated your PHRF 
declaration and are subject to protest and DSQ

Mike
Halifax



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Re: Stus-List Adding refrigeration.

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

The PO installed an Alder Barbour cold machine 200 on my boat.  There is
little difference between it and other systems that use a Danfoss DB35
(IIRC)  Compressor.  They have hermetically sealed components with zero
loss fittings.  Once you mount the cold plate in the fridge and the
compressor anywhere else, you run the copper tubing and attach the
fittings.  The thermostat wires run with the tubing between the comp and
fridge.  12v to the comp and you're good to go.  Regardless of witch system
you use, sticking with a danfoss compressor will allow you to use the
Stainless Lobster fridge controller.

The Alber Barbor modifications are supposed to improve the system but they
actually decrease the reliability.  You CAN eliminate the add on circuit
board and use it the same as any other Danfoss system.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C 37+
Solomons, MD

On Aug 7, 2016 9:29 PM, "Adam Hayden via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> Hello listers
>
> I am sure this has been discussed before.   We have decided to add
> refrigeration to State of Bliss.   Last winter I re-insulated the ice box
> with a dramatic improvement to keeping ice.
>
> We generally do coastal cruising spending 3-4 days away from the dock.
>
> For those of you that have refrigeration or added it, where do you keep
> the compressor or what system have you used?   I have thought of the
> lazerette behind the ice box, however on the exterior bulkhead is the heat
> exchanger for the engine.
>
> I would also appreciate any insights in the installation
>
> Regards
>
> Adam Hayden
> State of Bliss
> C 36
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All
> Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
___

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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List CnC-List Digest, Vol 127, Issue 36

[Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List]

For us, Whisker poles are not treated the same as the spinnaker pole which 
is true for many other regions. Again, no mention of it in the phrf docs 
and everybody's using whisker poles that are long enough to be effective. 

Truth is: A spin pole's length is woefully inadequate as a whisker pole (I 
have tried it), especially with a 150 % or above genoa. Sorry you guys 
can't use a "real" whisker pole with enough length to fully deploy a 150, 
you're missin' out. 


-Francois
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA 



Message: 3
Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2016 12:44:03 +
From: "Hoyt, Mike" 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut
Message-ID:
 <169e312f80b4c044be2dc1780a7de72f15c...@hfxexc11.impgroup.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

JF - check your PHRF certificate.  It specifies your spinnaker pole 
length.  A whisker pole is in fact treated the same as a spinnaker pole 
and unless your Sis state differently cannot exceed spin pole length 
without penalty.  If a pole longer than that declared is used or one that 
is unmeasurable (boat hook not attached) then you have violated your PHRF 
declaration and are subject to protest and DSQ

Mike
Halifax


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what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions are 
greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

JF - check your PHRF certificate.  It specifies your spinnaker pole length.  A 
whisker pole is in fact treated the same as a spinnaker pole and unless your 
Sis state differently cannot exceed spin pole length without penalty.  If a 
pole longer than that declared is used or one that is unmeasurable (boat hook 
not attached) then you have violated your PHRF declaration and are subject to 
protest and DSQ

Mike
Halifax

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of 
Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, August 05, 2016 9:03 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Jean-Francois J Rivard
Subject: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut

The boat hook:  We only do it in really light winds 0-4 knots, were talking 
glassy water on the lake.  It's a cinch do undo and it's a cinch to hold.

We do sail under US Sailing rules and there are no stipulation whatsoever about 
the length of the pole, it's attachment to the mast, or position of the crew as 
long as we are inside the lifelines. I'm not trying to argue against local 
rules as I have seen rules for other areas on the web where there were mentions 
of attachment to the mast etc. On the lake, we don't use local interpretation 
of the rules, we go strictly by the US Sailing / ISAF document.

Here's the actual rule from the ISAF 2013- 2016 document:

Rule 50.3 Use of Outriggers

(a) No sail shall be sheeted over or through an outrigger, except as permitted 
in rule 50.3(b) or 50.3(c). An outrigger is any fitting or other device so 
placed that it could exert outward pressure on a sheet or sail at a point from 
which, with the boat upright, a vertical line would fall outside the hull or 
deck. For the purpose of this rule, bulwarks, rails and rubbing strakes are not 
part of the hull or deck and the following are not outriggers: a bowsprit used 
to secure the tack of a sail, a bumkin used to sheet the boom of a sail, or a 
boom of a boomed headsail that requires no adjustment when tacking.

(b) Any sail may be sheeted to or led above a boom that is regularly used for a 
sail and is permanently attached to the mast from which the head of the sail is 
set.

(c) A headsail may be sheeted or attached at its clew to a spinnaker pole or 
whisker pole, provided that a spinnaker is not set.

Important part being part "C" Spinnaker pole or whisker pole but no mention of 
it's description, attachment,  or position of the crew.  I guess someone could 
argue that a boat hook is not a proper whisker pole.  Quite a few of us do it 
on the lake and no one cares. As long a I don't get a protest:  In 0-3 knots I 
don't see any great danger, you can hold it one handed.. It's simply a matter 
of convenience and ease of use. Also it's much quicker / easier to change the 
depth / angle of  a portable pole instead of a heavy thing attached to the 
mast, especially in extremely light winds where any sudden move of the crew can 
upset the sailplan and kill your ever so slight apparent wind.


Just to be clear, here's the actual rule on the crew:

CREW POSITION; LIFELINES 49.1 Competitors shall use no device designed to 
position their bodies outboard, other than hiking straps and stiffeners worn 
under the thighs.

49.2 When lifelines are required by the class rules or the sailing instructions 
they shall be taut, and competitors shall not position any Part 4 OTHER 
REQUIREMENTS WHEN RACING 28 part of their torsos outside them, except briefly 
to perform a necessary task. On boats equipped with upper and lower lifelines, 
a competitor sitting on the deck facing outboard with his waist inside the 
lower lifeline may have the upper part of his body outside the upper lifeline. 
If the class rules do not specify the material or minimum diameter of 
lifelines, they shall comply with the corresponding specifications in the ISAF 
Offshore Special Regulations.

No mention of holding sails or anything else..


As I learned racing my Mustang.. Reading the rules very carefully and knowing 
how to interpret them in a fair is just another item on the long list of what 
makes the difference between the guy out front and the rest..

Here are the rules: 
http://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/ISAFRRS20132016Final-[13376].pdf


-Francois Rivard
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA




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Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

“Third, holding a sail out by hand may also be illegal under the crew position 
rules. “ This does violate sailing rules in most places since one end must be 
attached to the mast.  It is impossible to measure a pole that is not attached 
to a fixed point.  Some casual venues may let you get away with using this but 
you should not do it in any open regattas.

“First, poles to leeward may be illegal in some venues. “ This used to be the 
case over a decade ago but I believe changed in the RRS approx 2003. Prior to 
that was illegal to have two poles (boom and spin pole) same side of boat but 
seems now to be just fine

Mike
Persistence

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, August 05, 2016 6:27 PM
To: CnClist
Cc: Dennis C.
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut

Just a couple comments.  First, poles to leeward may be illegal in some venues. 
 Read the SI's (Sailing Instructions).
Second, a reaching strut holds the spinnaker guy outboard to increase the angle 
and take load off the guy and compressive load off the spin pole.
Third, holding a sail out by hand may also be illegal under the crew position 
rules.  In my area if you didn't get protested, you'd certainly hear about it 
at the bar.  You also can't use a boat hook in most races.  The pole must be 
attached to the mast.
Read your rules and sailing instructions carefully on these practices.
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

On Fri, Aug 5, 2016 at 4:18 PM, Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List 
> wrote:
Hi David,

Yeah we do it all the time, it's also called a reaching strut. On our boats, 
the whisker pole is overkill and kind of too big / heavy anyway.  Since we only 
do it in very light winds I just get Nicholas to grab the boat hook, push the 
clew out with it, hold it by hand  / prop it on the coach roof.

It does make a significant difference in 0-4 knot wind as your genny has some 
kind of shape as opposed to just hanging half folded up.  Last race (Nicholas 
my teenage son was the skipper) and the wind was so slight I was actually 
holding the clue by hand (We were on a close reach), this way I had finer 
control.. And we walked away from everybody by a good margin at the slightest 
puff.  It may not be the ideal angle / shape but it beats the heck out of 
hanging like a limp flag.. Our competition said: Man! at the slightest wheeze 
of wind you guys left us for dead...

Even better: Get a drifter headsail.. It's basically a genoa made out of .5 - 
1.0 oz spinnaker material.. They start pulling at the slightest puff and are 
relatively cheap. As long as it fits on your foil or is hanked on your forestay 
it counts as a genoa, not a spin. It's on my shopping list for sails hopefully 
sooner than later

Also, the boat does really well broad reaching at 148-160 degrees true angle 
wing on wing with the whisker pole forward towards the forestay kind of like 
reaching with a conventional spinnaker.  This way you're wing on wing but have 
a speed advantage compared to DD by being at very advantageous angle from a 
Polars standpoint.  As long as it does not take you too far of course to get to 
your mark that's a good way to go as well.  Good for very slight winds too.


Good luck,

-Francois Rivard
1990 34+ "Take Five"
Lake Lanier, GA





Message: 3
Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2016 16:43:55 -0400
From: David Knecht >
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
>
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race
Message-ID: 
>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

We had a very light wind race on Wednesday and the downwind leg was a reach to 
broad reach   I could not get the genoa to sit well and then I noticed one of 
the other boats had the whisker pole to leeward holding the clew out.  I tried 
it and it seemed to help. Is this something others do?  Dave



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Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Hi Randy

It would be useful to quote wind speed in knots rather than Beaufort scale.  
Saves a lot of mental work for the rest of us …

Congrats on the race.  Was certainly a short one!

Mike
Persistence

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of RANDY via 
CnC-List
Sent: Friday, August 05, 2016 4:47 PM
To: cnc-list
Cc: RANDY
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race

Thanks Chuck.  I'm having a blast.

My knot meter was indicating 5.5-6.25 knots depending on point of sail, but I 
don't know if it's calibrated perfectly.  I didn't have RaceQs running this 
time, to check it against GPS.  My theoretical max hull speed is ~6.67 knots.  
But a month ago the wind piped up to Beaufort 7 after a race and I hit 7.6 
knots on close reach according to GPS before my genoa tore :)  I assume GPS 
doesn't lie.

And thanks for the tips.  I've gotten different opinions on whether to sail 
dead downwind or broad reach and gybe.  But when I saw the more experienced 
(and more winning) skippers and crews and boats sailing DDW wing and wing with 
gennies poled out, and passing me broad reaching, that kind of settled the 
question :)  (at least for that wind speed).

Cheers,
Randy


From: "Chuck S via CnC-List" 
>
To: "CNC boat owners, cnc-list" 
>
Cc: "Chuck S" >
Sent: Friday, August 5, 2016 12:24:42 PM
Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race

Hi Randy,
You sound like you're having a lot of fun racing.  You are definitely doing 
some things right.

Here's some things I would think about::
I had to look up the Beaufort scale to see you had 11 to 16 knots gusting 17 to 
21.  You should have been sailing at hullspeed on all points of sail.  What was 
your hullspeed indicating?  That would be a lot of wind for a 155% on my boat 
and smaller headsail may have pointed higher up wind where you seem to have an 
advantage over the fleet.  Downwind you want the full headsail, so I 
understand.  I agree, Clear Air is essential.  Sailing downwind in that strong 
a wind we would do wing and wing straight to the downwind mark.  I don't always 
set a pole when I'm by myself, but I find it really improves speed when sailing 
dead downwind.  It steadys the sail and keeps it projected straight out from 
the boat.  If you are serious about racing, clean the bottom before every race. 
 Here on the East Coast, that trick won me more races than anything, especially 
when the air was below 8 knots.

Glad to read your story.  Please keep sending those as you improve.

Chuck
Resolute
1990 C 34R
Broad Creek, Magothy River, Md


From: "RANDY via CnC-List" >
To: "cnc-list" >
Cc: "RANDY" >
Sent: Thursday, August 4, 2016 1:16:47 AM
Subject: Stus-List Finally Won a Race

I finally won a race tonight - the first time all season out of some 15 races - 
so I thought I'd share what went right.  Finally beat the winning boats in the 
fleet - two Catalina 27s - boat-for-boat and I don't think they'll correct over 
me.

1. The wind was about perfect for the 30-1, blowing Beaufort 4 gusting Beaufort 
5.  I was able to carry full main and 155% genoa without excessive weather 
helm, and I had six people on board so plenty of rail meat.

2. Had a good start at the committee boat end of the line on starboard tack.  A 
barger caused a logjam in front of me and I managed to duck under it all and 
crossed the line first.  Led the fleet to and around the windward mark with 
only two tacks upwind.  I had clean air and they couldn't close the gap.  Sail 
trim was good on both sails.

3. The Catalina 27s passed me downwind as did a Cal 22.  They went wing and 
wing the whole time, while I started out broad reaching and gybing to keep both 
sails hotter.  I eventually switched to wing and wing too, but couldn't retake 
them.  One of them had his genny poled out, and I didn't.  They flew their 
sails better than me, but I tried to limit my losses.

4. When rounding the leeward mark I was able to cut inside and above the Cal 22 
and one of the Catalina 27s, and retook them both on close reach to the offset 
mark.  Only one Catalina 27 remained ahead of me.

5. At the offset mark that leading Catalina 27 tacked, so I gambled and just 
hardened up to close-hauled.  That turned out to be a lucky move. I only had to 
tack once, several minutes later, to make the finish line.  I was able to point 
high enough to make the pin end on starboard tack and hold off the Catalina 27 
who was finishing on port tack, but he wasn't close enough to make it an issue. 
 Fortunately for me he just sailed a longer / slower course after the offset 
mark, given the wind direction.

I think 

Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut

[Michael Cotton via CnC-List]

This is sailing in the Rocky Mountain region. Their sailing rules are quite 
different from anywhere else I've sailed. I sailed there for a few years. Prior 
to coming to Colorado I sailed under YRALIS (Long Island Sound) and NBYA 
(Narragansett Bay) rules for over 20 years. Not surprised a hand held  whisker 
pole is legal under Rocky Mountain sailing. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 6, 2016, at 2:24 PM, Michael Brown via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> The US Sailing rules reference the ISAF Equipment Rules of Sailing.
> ERS defines a spinnaker pole in F.1.4 (d) (i) as:
> 
> > A spar attached to the mast spar to set a spinnaker.
> 
> Similarly a whisker pole as:
> 
> > A spar attached to the mast spar and a headsail clew.
> 
> So while the US Sailing rules do not mention the mast attachment
> point it is covered by the ERS definition of a spinnaker ( or whisker ) pole.
> 
> 
> I take the interpretation ( which may differ by region ) that the broad
> meaning of an outrigger is anything projecting past the hull or deck
> used to push out a sheet or sail. That would include hands, feet,
> boat hooks, fishing rods or a pole not attached to the mast.
> 
> Michael Brown
> Windburn
> C 30-1
> 
> 
> Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2016 09:45:29 -0400 
> From: "Gary Nylander"  
> To:  
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut 
> Message-ID: <004f01d1efe8$cb7cf430$6276dc90$@atlanticbb.net> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" 
> 
> Our (Chesapeake) PHRF rules do state - must be attached to the mast, must be 
> less than J length without penalty. No hand holding a stick... 
> 
> 
> 
> Gary 
> 
> 
> 
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of 
> Jean-Francois J Rivard via CnC-List 
> Sent: Friday, August 5, 2016 8:03 PM 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> Cc: Jean-Francois J Rivard  
> Subject: Stus-List Finally Won a Race now reaching strut 
> 
> 
> 
> The boat hook:  We only do it in really light winds 0-4 knots, were talking 
> glassy water on the lake.  It's a cinch do undo and it's a cinch to hold.   
> 
> We do sail under US Sailing rules and there are no stipulation whatsoever 
> about the length of the pole, it's attachment to the mast, or position of 
> the crew as long as we are inside the lifelines. I'm not trying to argue 
> against local rules as I have seen rules for other areas on the web where 
> there were mentions of attachment to the mast etc. On the lake, we don't use 
> local interpretation of the rules, we go strictly by the US Sailing / ISAF 
> document. 
> 
> Here's the actual rule from the ISAF 2013- 2016 document: 
> 
> Rule 50.3 Use of Outriggers 
> 
> (a) No sail shall be sheeted over or through an outrigger, except as 
> permitted in rule 50.3(b) or 50.3(c). An outrigger is any fitting or other 
> device so placed that it could exert outward pressure on a sheet or sail at 
> a point from which, with the boat upright, a vertical line would fall 
> outside the hull or deck. For the purpose of this rule, bulwarks, rails and 
> rubbing strakes are not part of the hull or deck and the following are not 
> outriggers: a bowsprit used to secure the tack of a sail, a bumkin used to 
> sheet the boom of a sail, or a boom of a boomed headsail that requires no 
> adjustment when tacking. 
> 
> (b) Any sail may be sheeted to or led above a boom that is regularly used 
> for a sail and is permanently attached to the mast from which the head of 
> the sail is set. 
> 
> (c) A headsail may be sheeted or attached at its clew to a spinnaker pole or 
> whisker pole, provided that a spinnaker is not set. 
> 
> Important part being part "C" Spinnaker pole or whisker pole but no mention 
> of it's description, attachment,  or position of the crew.  I guess someone 
> could argue that a boat hook is not a proper whisker pole.  Quite a few of 
> us do it on the lake and no one cares. As long a I don't get a protest:  In 
> 0-3 knots I don't see any great danger, you can hold it one handed.. It's 
> simply a matter of convenience and ease of use. Also it's much quicker / 
> easier to change the depth / angle of  a portable pole instead of a heavy 
> thing attached to the mast, especially in extremely light winds where any 
> sudden move of the crew can upset the sailplan and kill your ever so slight 
> apparent wind. 
> 
> 
> Just to be clear, here's the actual rule on the crew: 
> 
> CREW POSITION; LIFELINES 49.1 Competitors shall use no device designed to 
> position their bodies outboard, other than hiking straps and stiffeners worn 
> under the thighs. 
> 
> 49.2 When lifelines are required by the class rules or the sailing 
> instructions they shall be taut, and competitors shall not position any Part 
> 4 OTHER REQUIREMENTS WHEN RACING 28 part of their torsos outside them, 
> except briefly to perform a necessary task. On boats equipped with upper and 
> lower lifelines, a