Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Matthew via CnC-List]

Charlie:

 

You have already gotten a lot of responses, so I apologize if 
this is redundant.  On my 34 I used Baltoplate and am about to return to that 
for my 42.  My routine will be as Dennis described.

 

When I bought the 42 about eight years ago, it needed a lot of 
balsa core hull repair.  When that work was completed, we sealed the bottom 
with about 10 coats of barrier coat.  I decided to use a fancy, environmentally 
friendly bottom paint (ZO-HP), which had gotten good reviews from Practical 
Sailor.  The first several years with that paint were fine.  Curiously, it had 
unusual wear near the waterline, which suggests an ablative quality even though 
it is marketed as a hard paint.  About four years ago I noticed that it started 
cratering (large areas where the paint failed to adhere to an older coat 
underneath).  Ultimately, I decided to return to Baltoplate, which was more 
reliable in my experience.  However, the ZO-HP was a real bear to get off – it 
blew through tons of sandpaper.  Sanding the bottom was taking so long (even 
with two college kids helping) that I decided to put off finishing the job for 
a year.  To maintain the status quo, I applied a gallon of a proprietary 
ablative paint I purchased from Jamestown Distributors, which I figured would 
provide some antifouling but come off easily.  Some additional blistering 
issues arose (unbelievable), which we concluded came from inside the boat.  
These additional repairs took two years (one year on each side), during which I 
applied an additional gallon of the Jamestown paint before each season.  
Frankly, it appeared to work as well as the ZO-HP at 1/3 the cost.  The 
additional repairs are now complete.  We have some fairing to do (caused by the 
repairs), and the plan is to apply two more coats of barrier coat, then 
Baltoplate.  To remove the Jamestown paint – and what’s left of the ZO-HP – I 
hired a mobile blaster who used crushed glass as the medium.  He had to lower 
the PSI from what he first anticipated (from 50 to about 30 as I recall).  He 
started at 8 am and was finished by 3 pm, and it worked great.  Cost: $2,000.  
The Jamestown paint came off easily as expected, and the remaining ZO-HP is 
finally gone.  We will fair, barrier coat, and paint this spring.  I hope to 
finally return to the reliability of Baltoplate I experienced with 10 years of 
owning the 34.

 

Good luck!

 

Matt

C&C 42 Custom 

 

From: cenelson via CnC-List  
Sent: Friday, January 08, 2021 8:26 PM
To: C&C List 
Cc: cenelson 
Subject: Stus-List Bottom painting question

 

My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional 
forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she finished in 
the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat with a similarly 
rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty for an oversized pole.

 

About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the bottom 
paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied and then 
Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they admitted they were 
unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied (afterward), when the 
barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely a result of too thin a 
layer of this paint.

 

I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were familiar, 
and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra expense of 
tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same paint—which they had 
done in the past.

 

I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards have 
agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative Petite Vivid, 
apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually sand/burnish the bottom 
by sanding these coats smooth, basically sacrificing some of the just applied 
paint to ensure a smoother bottom.

 

I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more 
practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current paint 
down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.

 

This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.

 

My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this 
sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next year? 
Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for another $5000? 
If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year bottom refresh is 
tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.

 

So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition year 
to year?

 

Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative that is 
less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to much work 
not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.

 

Charlie Nelson

1995 C&C 36XL/kcb

Water Phantom ex



Se

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Bill Coleman via CnC-List]

John, could you elaborate on these screen sanders of which you speak? I would 
like to see what you are referring to.

 

Thanks

Bill Coleman

 

From: John McCrea via CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com] 
Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2021 11:54 AM
To: Stus-List
Cc: Hoyt, Mike; John McCrea
Subject: Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

 

Yes, but has to be dustless. They have some real high end screen sanders that 
we can rent. 

Sent from my iPhone





On Jan 8, 2021, at 10:40 PM, cenelson via CnC-List  
wrote:

 Yes—at least some do. OTOH I did that once, took about 4+ 8 hr days with a 
sander above my head and all the protective breathing gear on.

 

Swore then that I would “...nevahh...”

Attempt that again. Same feeling after my first and last water skiing 
success—once was enough!!


Sent <https://apps.apple.com/us/app/aol-news-email-weather-video/id646100661>  
from the all new Aol app for iOS

On Friday, January 8, 2021, 8:48 PM, Hoyt, Mike  wrote:

does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?

 


  _  


From: cenelson via CnC-List 
Sent: January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
To: C&C List
Cc: cenelson
Subject: Stus-List Bottom painting question 

 

My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional 
forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she finished in 
the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat with a similarly 
rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty for an oversized 
pole. 

 

About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the bottom 
paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied and then 
Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they admitted they were 
unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied (afterward), when the 
barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely a result of too thin a 
layer of this paint.

 

I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were familiar, 
and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra expense of 
tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same paint—which they had 
done in the past.

 

I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards have 
agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative Petite Vivid, 
apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually sand/burnish the bottom 
by sanding these coats smooth, basically sacrificing some of the just applied 
paint to ensure a smoother bottom.

 

I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more 
practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current paint 
down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.

 

This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.

 

My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this 
sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next year? 
Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for another $5000? 
If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year bottom refresh is 
tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.

 

So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition year 
to year?

 

Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative that is 
less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to much work 
not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.

 

Charlie Nelson

1995 C&C 36XL/kcb

Water Phantom ex



Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS 
<https://apps.apple.com/us/app/aol-news-email-weather-video/id646100661> 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Joel Delamirande via CnC-List]

Hi David knecht
I went on messenger look up magic antifoul
His cell 843 696-6404
He gave me magic prop to try I haven’t put it on yet
Sv Delos tried it it seem it came off pretty quick
For the other I used a wood scraper to take off the ablative paint
 Much faster than sanding, just be careful not to make holes
And finish with 80 grit with round sander
And Fiberglass wash

On Sat, Jan 9, 2021 at 11:16 AM John and Maryann Read via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Recently saw an ad for a new Petit paint “Odyssey Triton”.  Contains,
> copper, econea and zinc.  Ablative multi year.  Pricey but supposedly the
> best thing since sliced bread.
>
> No personal experience
>
>
>
> John and Maryann
>
> Legacy III
>
> 1982 C&C 34
>
> Noank, CT
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* David Knecht via CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com]
> *Sent:* Saturday, January 09, 2021 9:32 AM
> *To:* CnC CnC discussion list
> *Cc:* David Knecht
> *Subject:* Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question
>
>
>
> Magic antifouling does not appear to be available for sale yet due to lack
> of EPA approval.  How did you get it?  Have you tried Magic Prop as well?
> Dave
>
>
>
> S/V Aries
>
> 1990 C&C 34+
>
> New London, CT
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 8, 2021, at 10:59 PM, Joel Delamirande via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Me too it was first time taking off ablative paint
>
> It sucks but it looks nice
>
> I put magic anti fouling the application was easy, two people is better to
> get a smooth finish
>
> Sv Delos and sailing zatara tryed it they say it an amazing product and
> gained half a knot on boat speed
>
> For a 30 foot cost me 800$ USA
>
> On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 10:40 PM cenelson via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Yes—at least some do. OTOH I did that once, took about 4+ 8 hr days with a
> sander above my head and all the protective breathing gear on.
>
>
>
> Swore then that I would “...nevahh...”
>
> Attempt that again. Same feeling after my first and last water skiing
> success—once was enough!!
>
>
> Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS
> <https://apps.apple.com/us/app/aol-news-email-weather-video/id646100661>
>
> On Friday, January 8, 2021, 8:48 PM, Hoyt, Mike 
> wrote:
>
> does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?
>
>
> --
>
> *From:* cenelson via CnC-List 
> *Sent:* January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
> *To:* C&C List
> *Cc:* cenelson
> *Subject:* Stus-List Bottom painting question
>
>
>
> My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional
> forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she
> finished in the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat
> with a similarly rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty
> for an oversized pole.
>
>
>
> About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the
> bottom paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied
> and then Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they
> admitted they were unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied
> (afterward), when the barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely
> a result of too thin a layer of this paint.
>
>
>
> I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were
> familiar, and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra
> expense of tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same
> paint—which they had done in the past.
>
>
>
> I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards
> have agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative
> Petite Vivid, apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually
> sand/burnish the bottom by sanding these coats smooth, basically
> sacrificing some of the just applied paint to ensure a smoother bottom.
>
>
>
> I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more
> practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current
> paint down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.
>
>
>
> This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.
>
>
>
> My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this
> sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next
> year? Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for
> another $5000? If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year
> bottom refresh is tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.
>
>
>
> So how do the racing listers k

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Ed,

I switched to Sea Hawk CuKote.  My painter recommended it.  But remember,
he's in Pensacola (salt water) and Touche' is now back in Mandeville
(brackish for the list).

  --
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

On Sat, Jan 9, 2021 at 11:58 AM Edward Levert via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Within the hour my C&C 34 was hauled after 2 years since the last. Heavy
> slime only on Petit Trinidad. Brackish water. Petit wants the boatyard
> owner to use its "new" paints but the owner doesn't want to apply paints
> that do not have at least 2 years experience in use.
>
> Ed Levert
> C&C 34 Briar Patch, #336
> New Orleanss, La
>
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Edward Levert via CnC-List]

Within the hour my C&C 34 was hauled after 2 years since the last. Heavy
slime only on Petit Trinidad. Brackish water. Petit wants the boatyard
owner to use its "new" paints but the owner doesn't want to apply paints
that do not have at least 2 years experience in use.

Ed Levert
C&C 34 Briar Patch, #336
New Orleanss, La

> *Subject:* Stus-List Bottom painting question
>
>
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu
>
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[John McCrea via CnC-List]

Yes, but has to be dustless. They have some real high end screen sanders that 
we can rent. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 8, 2021, at 10:40 PM, cenelson via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
>  Yes—at least some do. OTOH I did that once, took about 4+ 8 hr days with a 
> sander above my head and all the protective breathing gear on.
> 
> Swore then that I would “...nevahh...”
> Attempt that again. Same feeling after my first and last water skiing 
> success—once was enough!!
> 
> 
> Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS
> 
> On Friday, January 8, 2021, 8:48 PM, Hoyt, Mike  
> wrote:
> 
> does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?
> 
> 
> 
> From: cenelson via CnC-List 
> Sent: January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
> To: C&C List
> Cc: cenelson
> Subject: Stus-List Bottom painting question
>  
> My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional 
> forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she finished 
> in the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat with a 
> similarly rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty for an 
> oversized pole.
> 
> About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the bottom 
> paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied and then 
> Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they admitted they 
> were unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied (afterward), 
> when the barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely a result of 
> too thin a layer of this paint.
> 
> I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were 
> familiar, and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra 
> expense of tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same 
> paint—which they had done in the past.
> 
> I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards 
> have agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative Petite 
> Vivid, apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually sand/burnish the 
> bottom by sanding these coats smooth, basically sacrificing some of the just 
> applied paint to ensure a smoother bottom.
> 
> I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more 
> practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current 
> paint down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.
> 
> This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.
> 
> My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this 
> sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next 
> year? Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for another 
> $5000? If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year bottom 
> refresh is tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.
> 
> So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition year 
> to year?
> 
> Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative that 
> is less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to much 
> work not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.
> 
> Charlie Nelson
> 1995 C&C 36XL/kcb
> Water Phantom ex
> 
> 
> Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with 
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Andrew Adair via CnC-List]

Hi Charlie:

When I purchased my boat in 2008, I had the yard strip the bottom and apply a 
hard bottom paint.  The second year I applied Petit Vivid and pretty much 
followed the process you described.  This is the method the Petit 
representative recommended:  First, I cleaned the bottom and wiped down using 
many clean cloths and lacquer thinner.  Then, I rolled three thin coats 
(thinned to 10%), using a foam West roller, and had my wife tip with a brush as 
I went along.  (Vivid dries quickly).  After that, we burnished using McGuire’s 
diamond cut on a clean wool pad.  This process made a really nice bottom, but I 
don’t do it anymore.  I still use Vivid and I roll and tip, because I found it 
works well in the brackish water of the Upper Chesapeake.  However, now I do 
not burnish nor do I apply three coats.  I apply between one and two coats as 
needed.  (I use a different color Vivid from the original bottom paint, so I 
can see when it is getting thin).   I do race PHRF and beer can, and find this 
bottom is decent.  (Tipping the paint after rolling is the key).  However, it 
is not quite as smooth as my friends who use a hard paint like VC17 and burnish.

The truth is that Vivid is a “hard” ablative, but it is still an ablative.  As 
a result, it is not as hard as the epoxy paints.  I think James is absolutely 
correct that the benefits of sanding go away in a short amount of time.  
However, I find Vivid is effective, and it’s pretty easy for a decent bottom.  
(It is within my limited ability and time constraints).  I don’t hire a diver, 
but I do go down with a mask and snorkel and wipe down the bottom before bigger 
races.  The Vivid wipes clean easily.  I win or place in a fair share of local 
races, so it is good enough for my needs.  Personally, if I were going to pay 
someone $4,000 to $5,000 for my bottom each year, I would use a hard paint and 
burnish rather than Vivid.

For what it is worth, the Vivid works well in my area.  However, the original 
hard paint the yard used as the tie coat is just starting to fail in a few 
areas.

Drew Adair
C&C 32  - Aurora
North East, MD

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[John and Maryann Read via CnC-List]

Recently saw an ad for a new Petit paint “Odyssey Triton”.  Contains, copper, 
econea and zinc.  Ablative multi year.  Pricey but supposedly the best thing 
since sliced bread.

No personal experience

 

John and Maryann

Legacy III

1982 C&C 34

Noank, CT

 

 

 

From: David Knecht via CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com] 
Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2021 9:32 AM
To: CnC CnC discussion list
Cc: David Knecht
Subject: Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

 

Magic antifouling does not appear to be available for sale yet due to lack of 
EPA approval.  How did you get it?  Have you tried Magic Prop as well?  Dave

 

S/V Aries

1990 C&C 34+

New London, CT








On Jan 8, 2021, at 10:59 PM, Joel Delamirande via CnC-List 
 wrote:

 

 

Me too it was first time taking off ablative paint 

It sucks but it looks nice 

I put magic anti fouling the application was easy, two people is better to get 
a smooth finish 

Sv Delos and sailing zatara tryed it they say it an amazing product and gained 
half a knot on boat speed 

For a 30 foot cost me 800$ USA 

On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 10:40 PM cenelson via CnC-List  
wrote:

Yes—at least some do. OTOH I did that once, took about 4+ 8 hr days with a 
sander above my head and all the protective breathing gear on.

 

Swore then that I would “...nevahh...”

Attempt that again. Same feeling after my first and last water skiing 
success—once was enough!!


Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS 
<https://apps.apple.com/us/app/aol-news-email-weather-video/id646100661> 

On Friday, January 8, 2021, 8:48 PM, Hoyt, Mike  wrote:

does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?

 


  _  


From: cenelson via CnC-List 
Sent: January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
To: C&C List
Cc: cenelson
Subject: Stus-List Bottom painting question 

 

My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional 
forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she finished in 
the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat with a similarly 
rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty for an oversized 
pole. 

 

About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the bottom 
paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied and then 
Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they admitted they were 
unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied (afterward), when the 
barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely a result of too thin a 
layer of this paint.

 

I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were familiar, 
and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra expense of 
tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same paint—which they had 
done in the past.

 

I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards have 
agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative Petite Vivid, 
apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually sand/burnish the bottom 
by sanding these coats smooth, basically sacrificing some of the just applied 
paint to ensure a smoother bottom.

 

I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more 
practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current paint 
down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.

 

This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.

 

My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this 
sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next year? 
Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for another $5000? 
If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year bottom refresh is 
tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.

 

So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition year 
to year?

 

Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative that is 
less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to much work 
not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.

 

Charlie Nelson

1995 C&C 36XL/kcb

Water Phantom ex



Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS 
<https://apps.apple.com/us/app/aol-news-email-weather-video/id646100661> 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

-- 

Joel Delamirande

Image removed by sender.

www.jdroofing.ca <http://www.jdroofing.ca/> 

 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

 

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use P

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

Magic antifouling does not appear to be available for sale yet due to lack of 
EPA approval.  How did you get it?  Have you tried Magic Prop as well?  Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



> On Jan 8, 2021, at 10:59 PM, Joel Delamirande via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Me too it was first time taking off ablative paint 
> It sucks but it looks nice 
> I put magic anti fouling the application was easy, two people is better to 
> get a smooth finish 
> Sv Delos and sailing zatara tryed it they say it an amazing product and 
> gained half a knot on boat speed 
> For a 30 foot cost me 800$ USA 
> On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 10:40 PM cenelson via CnC-List  > wrote:
> Yes—at least some do. OTOH I did that once, took about 4+ 8 hr days with a 
> sander above my head and all the protective breathing gear on.
> 
> Swore then that I would “...nevahh...”
> Attempt that again. Same feeling after my first and last water skiing 
> success—once was enough!!
> 
> 
> Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS 
> 
> 
> On Friday, January 8, 2021, 8:48 PM, Hoyt, Mike  > wrote:
> 
> does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?
> 
> 
> 
> From: cenelson via CnC-List  >
> Sent: January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
> To: C&C List
> Cc: cenelson
> Subject: Stus-List Bottom painting question
>  
> My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional 
> forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she finished 
> in the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat with a 
> similarly rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty for an 
> oversized pole.
> 
> About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the bottom 
> paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied and then 
> Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they admitted they 
> were unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied (afterward), 
> when the barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely a result of 
> too thin a layer of this paint.
> 
> I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were 
> familiar, and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra 
> expense of tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same 
> paint—which they had done in the past.
> 
> I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards 
> have agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative Petite 
> Vivid, apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually sand/burnish the 
> bottom by sanding these coats smooth, basically sacrificing some of the just 
> applied paint to ensure a smoother bottom.
> 
> I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more 
> practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current 
> paint down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.
> 
> This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.
> 
> My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this 
> sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next 
> year? Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for another 
> $5000? If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year bottom 
> refresh is tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.
> 
> So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition year 
> to year?
> 
> Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative that 
> is less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to much 
> work not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.
> 
> Charlie Nelson
> 1995 C&C 36XL/kcb
> Water Phantom ex
> 
> 
> Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS 
> 
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with 
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
>   Thanks - Stu
> -- 
> Joel Delamirande
> 
> www.jdroofing.ca 
> 
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with 
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use 
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[james taylor via CnC-List]

Charlie, I'm thinking that sanding an ablative paint is a waste of effort.
Since the surface is constantly being refreshed, the smooth surface that
you create by sanding is gone in a short time frame. If you want a super
smooth bottom I would think that it would be better to use a hard,
non-ablative paint and spend a little money having a dive service scrub the
bottom on a monthly basis. For our area, I have had great success with
Trinidad. My last bottom job lasted for more than 5 years.
James Taylor
S/V Delaney
C&C 38
Oriental, NC
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Joel Delamirande via CnC-List]

Me too it was first time taking off ablative paint
It sucks but it looks nice
I put magic anti fouling the application was easy, two people is better to
get a smooth finish
Sv Delos and sailing zatara tryed it they say it an amazing product and
gained half a knot on boat speed
For a 30 foot cost me 800$ USA
On Fri, Jan 8, 2021 at 10:40 PM cenelson via CnC-List 
wrote:

> Yes—at least some do. OTOH I did that once, took about 4+ 8 hr days with a
> sander above my head and all the protective breathing gear on.
>
> Swore then that I would “...nevahh...”
> Attempt that again. Same feeling after my first and last water skiing
> success—once was enough!!
>
>
> Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS
> 
>
> On Friday, January 8, 2021, 8:48 PM, Hoyt, Mike 
> wrote:
>
> does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?
>
>
> --
> *From:* cenelson via CnC-List 
> *Sent:* January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
> *To:* C&C List
> *Cc:* cenelson
> *Subject:* Stus-List Bottom painting question
>
> My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional
> forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she
> finished in the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat
> with a similarly rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty
> for an oversized pole.
>
> About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the
> bottom paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied
> and then Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they
> admitted they were unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied
> (afterward), when the barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely
> a result of too thin a layer of this paint.
>
> I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were
> familiar, and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra
> expense of tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same
> paint—which they had done in the past.
>
> I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards
> have agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative
> Petite Vivid, apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually
> sand/burnish the bottom by sanding these coats smooth, basically
> sacrificing some of the just applied paint to ensure a smoother bottom.
>
> I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more
> practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current
> paint down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.
>
> This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.
>
> My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this
> sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next
> year? Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for
> another $5000? If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year
> bottom refresh is tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.
>
> So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition
> year to year?
>
> Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative
> that is less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to
> much work not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.
>
> Charlie Nelson
> 1995 C&C 36XL/kcb
> Water Phantom ex
>
>
> Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS
> 
>
> Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with
> the costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use
> PayPal to send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks
> - Stu

-- 
Joel Delamirande
*www.jdroofing.ca *
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[cenelson via CnC-List]

Yes—at least some do. OTOH I did that once, took about 4+ 8 hr days with a 
sander above my head and all the protective breathing gear on.
Swore then that I would “...nevahh...”Attempt that again. Same feeling after my 
first and last water skiing success—once was enough!!


Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS


On Friday, January 8, 2021, 8:48 PM, Hoyt, Mike  wrote:

#yiv8608729690 #yiv8608729690 -- P 
{margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;}#yiv8608729690 
does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?


From: cenelson via CnC-List 
Sent: January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
To: C&C List
Cc: cenelson
Subject: Stus-List Bottom painting question My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly 
for local club racing with occasional forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is 
reasonable and at CRW she finished in the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker 
racing boat for boat with a similarly rated J-30 whose rating was the same 
because of a penalty for an oversized pole.
About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the bottom 
paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied and then 
Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they admitted they were 
unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied (afterward), when the 
barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely a result of too thin a 
layer of this paint.
I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were familiar, 
and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra expense of 
tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same paint—which they had 
done in the past.
I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards have 
agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative Petite Vivid, 
apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually sand/burnish the bottom 
by sanding these coats smooth, basically sacrificing some of the just applied 
paint to ensure a smoother bottom.
I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more 
practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current paint 
down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.
This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.
My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this 
sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next year? 
Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for another $5000? 
If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year bottom refresh is 
tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.
So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition year 
to year?
Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative that is 
less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to much work 
not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.
Charlie Nelson1995 C&C 36XL/kcbWater Phantom ex

Sent from the all new Aol app for iOS



Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Charlie,

Up until this last year I kept a burnished Baltoplate racing bottom on
Touche'.  Here's the breakdown of the cost in 2018

Prep and spray $1512  (36 hrs @ $42/hr)
Baltoplate and thinner  $540
Wet sand and burnish  $220  (4 hrs @ $55/hr)
Total (x-taxes and haul out fees)  $2260

Your yard's labor rate may be quite different than my yard's 2018 rates.

Keep in mind this was annual "maintenance" bottom paint and was the 3rd or
4th since having the bottom faired, barrier coated and painted with
Baltoplate the first time.  The first time around with fairing, barrier
coat and the initial coats of Baltoplate was quite a bit more.

I also had a diving company that cleaned the bottom every 4 weeks at $80 a
pop.  Divers in your area may be more expensive.
  --
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA

>
> My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this
> sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next
> year? Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for
> another $5000? If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year
> bottom refresh is tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.
>
> So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition
> year to year?
>
> Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative
> that is less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to
> much work not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.
>
> Charlie Nelson
> 1995 C&C 36XL/kcb
> Water Phantom ex
>
>
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu

Stus-List Re: Bottom painting question

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

does your yard allow owners to sand their own bottoms?



From: cenelson via CnC-List 
Sent: January 8, 2021 9:26 PM
To: C&C List
Cc: cenelson
Subject: Stus-List Bottom painting question

My 1995 C&C 36XL/Kcb is used mainly for local club racing with occasional 
forays to CRW. I think her PHRF of 120 is reasonable and at CRW she finished in 
the middle of her PHRF class in spinnaker racing boat for boat with a similarly 
rated J-30 whose rating was the same because of a penalty for an oversized pole.

About 2 years ago, I had to strip the bottom to the gel coat since the bottom 
paint build-up was excessive. Two coats of barrier coat were applied and then 
Petite Black Widow was improperly sprayed on by my yard—they admitted they were 
unfamiliar with how much it needed diluted to be applied (afterward), when the 
barnacles showed up much sooner than expected, likely a result of too thin a 
layer of this paint.

I had them repaint the bottom with Petite Vivid, with which they were familiar, 
and they rolled it on with a short nap roller to avoid the extra expense of 
tenting, etc. for a spray paint application of the same paint—which they had 
done in the past.

I am contemplating going back to a smoother bottom and several local yards have 
agreed that the solution is to rough up the current hard ablative Petite Vivid, 
apply/roll 2 more coats of the same and then manually sand/burnish the bottom 
by sanding these coats smooth, basically sacrificing some of the just applied 
paint to ensure a smoother bottom.

I get it, especially since 2 independent yards proposed this, as more 
practical/less expensive than my initial thoughts of sanding the current paint 
down and then spraying several coats of Vivid.

This work by the yard will cost ~$4-5000.

My question for the list, especially the racers, is how do I maintain this 
sanded bottom when I must reapply another coat or 2 of bottom paint next year? 
Must I repeat the process (roll on 2 coats and sand smooth) for another $5000? 
If so, I am not sure if I should proceed. A ~$2000 per year bottom refresh is 
tolerable—a $5000 per year is NOT.

So how do the racing listers keep your boat bottom in ‘racing’ condition year 
to year?

Must I ‘bite the bullet’ at $5000 each year or is there an alternative that is 
less expensive and thus more reasonable? I will not do it myself—to much work 
not to mention the hazard of the paint dust/vapors/etc.

Charlie Nelson
1995 C&C 36XL/kcb
Water Phantom ex


Sent from the all new Aol app for 
iOS
Thanks to all of the subscribers that contributed to the list to help with the 
costs involved.  If you want to show your support to the list - use PayPal to 
send contribution --   https://www.paypal.me/stumurray  Thanks - Stu