[Om2009] currently broken?
Hi folks, I have broken my distrib this morning while doing opkg upgrade. Firstly Paroli does not work because of missing libs, so I made some (lots of) symlinks like libelementary.so.0 -- libelementary-pre-svn-ver-.so.0 I have no problem with renaming lib but then please update paroli to make it depends on these -pre-svn- lib instead of the old missing ones. Secondly, I can now launch Paroli but I have dbus timeout, so no GSM at all. I can see some warnings in frameworkd.log but no error. What can I do to get my phone capacity back ? Regards, Xavier. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Om2009] currently broken?
Hi Xavier, Though this is probably not what you want to hear, I'd strongly suggest to install SHR or another distro of your choice. OM2009 is (to the best of my knowledge) at this point of time unmaintained and more or less discontinued. Refer to emails sent earlier about this subject. Regards, Andreas Xavier Cremaschi wrote: Hi folks, I have broken my distrib this morning while doing opkg upgrade. Firstly Paroli does not work because of missing libs, so I made some (lots of) symlinks like libelementary.so.0 -- libelementary-pre-svn-ver-.so.0 I have no problem with renaming lib but then please update paroli to make it depends on these -pre-svn- lib instead of the old missing ones. Secondly, I can now launch Paroli but I have dbus timeout, so no GSM at all. I can see some warnings in frameworkd.log but no error. What can I do to get my phone capacity back ? Regards, Xavier. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Om2009] currently broken?
I am aware of that, but before doing a migration to another distrib (this week-end maybe ?) I would appreciate a tip to get my phone back... Thanks for your answer ;) Xavier. Andreas Fischer a écrit : Hi Xavier, Though this is probably not what you want to hear, I'd strongly suggest to install SHR or another distro of your choice. OM2009 is (to the best of my knowledge) at this point of time unmaintained and more or less discontinued. Refer to emails sent earlier about this subject. Regards, Andreas Xavier Cremaschi wrote: Hi folks, I have broken my distrib this morning while doing opkg upgrade. Firstly Paroli does not work because of missing libs, so I made some (lots of) symlinks like libelementary.so.0 -- libelementary-pre-svn-ver-.so.0 I have no problem with renaming lib but then please update paroli to make it depends on these -pre-svn- lib instead of the old missing ones. Secondly, I can now launch Paroli but I have dbus timeout, so no GSM at all. I can see some warnings in frameworkd.log but no error. What can I do to get my phone capacity back ? Regards, Xavier. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Om2009] currently broken?
Xavier Cremaschi a écrit : Secondly, I can now launch Paroli but I have dbus timeout, so no GSM at all. I can see some warnings in frameworkd.log but no error. What can I do to get my phone capacity back ? Problem was : this frameworkd requires fso-abyss, which was not installed (nor in dependencies) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009 Maintainer
On 9/6/09, Laszlo KREKACS laszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Angus Ainslienyt...@openmoko.org wrote: now if you want to disable the shr phone apps without removing them comment all of the lines out in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89notifier and /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80ophonekitd If you comment out 80ophonekitd, there will be no sound when you are on line. So the ringing works, but no sound either on the callee side nor on the caller side. However if you dont disable it, it will bring app shr's white screen with the tiny phone number in the middle. Dunno how to disable it. Would be nice to know how a proper calling sequence are built. So what exactly is needed to send on the dbus. Im really lost here. Laszlo Just uncomment scenario handling in rules.yaml. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009 Maintainer
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Angus Ainslienyt...@openmoko.org wrote: now if you want to disable the shr phone apps without removing them comment all of the lines out in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89notifier and /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80ophonekitd If you comment out 80ophonekitd, there will be no sound when you are on line. So the ringing works, but no sound either on the callee side nor on the caller side. However if you dont disable it, it will bring app shr's white screen with the tiny phone number in the middle. Dunno how to disable it. Would be nice to know how a proper calling sequence are built. So what exactly is needed to send on the dbus. Im really lost here. Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Hey, just wanted to add another 2-cents to the bucket, which by now should contain a lot of small change ... Reading some of the mails in this thread I think we need to get the definitions straight: - fso - phoning middleware - shr - a distro which comes with fso preinstalled - om2009 - another distro that comes with fso and paroli preinstalled - paroli - a python daemon that comes with 4 phoning apps and a settings app by default The question here was: should om2009 be continued. Never having tried SHR i can't go down that path deciding by comparison. I heard many good things about SHR, I liked the guys I met at the dev meeting in Braunschweig so I would recommend active devs to go for SHR. As for Om2009 it has always been a one-man show or at least mainly. And that man was Angus. He did the cleanup, made the builds etc etc. Seen that he has limited resources now I would think Om2009 has a dark future ;) So probably best to say good bye while we still have good memories :) I heard there would be efforts to bring paroli to SHR and maybe integrate it better or make it smoother, if anyone wants to do so, just let me know if you need commit access to the paroli git and we'll try to get you into the loop (which can be very chaotic at times ;) ) As for me, due to heavy engagements with Qi Hardware I don't have much time left for paroli right now, every now and again there is a burst of commits but nothing too stable so any help is welcome. /mirko On 29 Aug 2009, at 19:10, Bernhard Reiter wrote: Am Freitag, den 28.08.2009, 21:09 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Krzyszkowiak: Oh guys... I'm SHR developer (once I tried Om2009), but... regarding stablity, SHR and FSO is mainly the same! We both use FSO and we both are affected by FSO bugs. And most of bugs regarding phone functionality came from FSO on both distros (ok, in early stage SHR ophonekitd wasn't perfect, but now it should be rock solid). That's just matter of used versions. Saying om2009 is unstable cause i can't answer call means that this bug probably is (was or even will be) also in SHR, and vice versa. Om2009 was much stabler than SHR-unstable. That's why I liked SHR more ;) Now shr-unstable has bugfixes to most of om2009 issues. That's why shr-unstable is now stabler than om2009. And don't get me wrong - i'm SHR developer, and I love SHR, and I fight with Om2009 (regarding i with SHR want to be better than guys with om2009 ;)), but I really don't like criticizing anything without knowing anything about mentioned issues and causes! Paroli is great work, I just don't like approach everything in one big daemon, but my opinion doesn't make Paroli worse... I'll just use SHR without saying bad words on Paroli. well, so maybe it's because i was using om2009t5 (not unstable), but it having being promoted as stable enough for daily use, i was pretty disappointed to find it was not. and with shr-u (from around 07/31, i think), things worked pretty good. so maybe i really don't know enough about internals and organization, but trust me: with om2009t5, i couldn't pick up about every other incoming call -- or more -- which made it practically useless. with shr-u, i can pick up calls. that's about all i wanted to say about om2009 vs. shr. bernhard Well, probably reality isn't as simple as i presented in this post. But i'm sure it's at least close to ;) And I hope you'll understand what I said. This post can be noisy cause i'm excited with listening to really great concert of polish rock group (Perfect) from 1981 (great time of rock in Poland) which I just got ;) :-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Am Freitag, den 28.08.2009, 21:09 +0200 schrieb Sebastian Krzyszkowiak: Oh guys... I'm SHR developer (once I tried Om2009), but... regarding stablity, SHR and FSO is mainly the same! We both use FSO and we both are affected by FSO bugs. And most of bugs regarding phone functionality came from FSO on both distros (ok, in early stage SHR ophonekitd wasn't perfect, but now it should be rock solid). That's just matter of used versions. Saying om2009 is unstable cause i can't answer call means that this bug probably is (was or even will be) also in SHR, and vice versa. Om2009 was much stabler than SHR-unstable. That's why I liked SHR more ;) Now shr-unstable has bugfixes to most of om2009 issues. That's why shr-unstable is now stabler than om2009. And don't get me wrong - i'm SHR developer, and I love SHR, and I fight with Om2009 (regarding i with SHR want to be better than guys with om2009 ;)), but I really don't like criticizing anything without knowing anything about mentioned issues and causes! Paroli is great work, I just don't like approach everything in one big daemon, but my opinion doesn't make Paroli worse... I'll just use SHR without saying bad words on Paroli. well, so maybe it's because i was using om2009t5 (not unstable), but it having being promoted as stable enough for daily use, i was pretty disappointed to find it was not. and with shr-u (from around 07/31, i think), things worked pretty good. so maybe i really don't know enough about internals and organization, but trust me: with om2009t5, i couldn't pick up about every other incoming call -- or more -- which made it practically useless. with shr-u, i can pick up calls. that's about all i wanted to say about om2009 vs. shr. bernhard Well, probably reality isn't as simple as i presented in this post. But i'm sure it's at least close to ;) And I hope you'll understand what I said. This post can be noisy cause i'm excited with listening to really great concert of polish rock group (Perfect) from 1981 (great time of rock in Poland) which I just got ;) :-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, 27 Aug 2009, Xavier Cremaschi wrote: Angus Ainslie a écrit : Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. As a Om2009t5 user it's a big YES for me. I know that numbers speak against Om2009, but I use and love this distrib. I am using it since 1st july, and I find it : - usable (hi Paroli !) - stable while using (few reboots, only when battery exhausted or when I need to change SIM, which is rare) - stable while upgrading : I was used to break lots of things while upgrading my SHR-U, it's far better with Om2009 i completely agree with xavier; 2009t5 has been both stable and complete enough to be a working phone OS for me for some time now. i would love to see work on it continue, at least to take it across the line from testing-n to release-1 . but i also accept that OM2009 users are few and far between, and it may simply not be the best use of quality development time to maintain it any further. so i'm bracing myself to start looking at SHR. but i do rather get the feeling, reading between the lines, that SHR is so busy forging ahead that it completely lacks any kind of functional stable branch. i acknowledge Michal Brzozowski's suggestion that i just flush one of the SHR-u images that people report as stable and don't upgrade... That's what I do. but identifying which -U images are fully-functional and which are boxes of part-broken bits seems a bit of a black art. any of you SHR chaps care to tell us OM2009 stick-in-the-muds how the knowledge of which releases are functional and which are less so is transmitted? any chance of you developing a release schedule that has a place in it for people who need their phones to work slightly more than they need them to keep forging ahead? -- Tom Yates - http://www.teaparty.net___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
but identifying which -U images are fully-functional and which are boxes of part-broken bits seems a bit of a black art. any of you SHR chaps car e to tell us OM2009 stick-in-the-muds how the knowledge of which releases are functional and which are less so is transmitted? any chance of you developing a release schedule that has a place in it for people who need their phones to work slightly more than they need them to keep forging ahead? i think for the most time if you just pick any SHR image and flash it, it will work. yes, there is the odd day when things go wrong, personally i have been quite lucky... but i flash only when upgrade fails :) Petr ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Am Donnerstag, den 27.08.2009, 11:21 -0400 schrieb Warren Baird: I must admit that I switched from OM2009 to SHR-U about a month ago now, since it looked like nothing was happening. I must admit that aside from Paroli (which apparently is coming soon to SHR-U - or already there), it wasn't obvious to me what the difference in goals were - the two environments seemed pretty similar, and seemed to be trying to do basically the same thing. If the effort being put into OM2009 was to instead be put into making an SHR Testing build that is a bit more up-to-date, and is kept stable, that would make me pretty happy. I don't see at this point why it makes sense to continue to put effort into OM2009 as a distro... Warren +1. I tried OM2009t5 around July hoping for a minimal functioning phone distro, and after facing some pretty severe issues (sound quality, not able to pick up phone calls pretty regularly) I switched to SHR-U. Which gave me what I wanted: fairly good sound quality, and most important, no more frustration having to watch my phone ring and not being able to pick it up. Oh, and a couple of nice apps out of the box, too. OM2009 users: are you successfully using your Freerunners as phones (also picking up calls)? Or just for non-phone purposes? My 0,02€: There's SHR, which is pretty advanced, also in terms of plain basic phone functionalityso. I don't see any reason for OM2009 to catch up to where SHR already is. Bernhard ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:47 PM, Bernhard Reiterock...@raz.or.at wrote: OM2009 users: are you successfully using your Freerunners as phones (also picking up calls)? Or just for non-phone purposes? Yes, om2009 unstable. (but I still vote for going to SHR :) r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On 8/28/09, Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi wrote: On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:47 PM, Bernhard Reiterock...@raz.or.at wrote: OM2009 users: are you successfully using your Freerunners as phones (also picking up calls)? Or just for non-phone purposes? Yes, om2009 unstable. (but I still vote for going to SHR :) r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Oh guys... I'm SHR developer (once I tried Om2009), but... regarding stablity, SHR and FSO is mainly the same! We both use FSO and we both are affected by FSO bugs. And most of bugs regarding phone functionality came from FSO on both distros (ok, in early stage SHR ophonekitd wasn't perfect, but now it should be rock solid). That's just matter of used versions. Saying om2009 is unstable cause i can't answer call means that this bug probably is (was or even will be) also in SHR, and vice versa. Om2009 was much stabler than SHR-unstable. That's why I liked SHR more ;) Now shr-unstable has bugfixes to most of om2009 issues. That's why shr-unstable is now stabler than om2009. And don't get me wrong - i'm SHR developer, and I love SHR, and I fight with Om2009 (regarding i with SHR want to be better than guys with om2009 ;)), but I really don't like criticizing anything without knowing anything about mentioned issues and causes! Paroli is great work, I just don't like approach everything in one big daemon, but my opinion doesn't make Paroli worse... I'll just use SHR without saying bad words on Paroli. Well, probably reality isn't as simple as i presented in this post. But i'm sure it's at least close to ;) And I hope you'll understand what I said. This post can be noisy cause i'm excited with listening to really great concert of polish rock group (Perfect) from 1981 (great time of rock in Poland) which I just got ;) -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Om2009 Maintainer
Hi All, After some deliberation and input from the community I am going to stop maintaining Om2009. I'm going work on getting paroli to co-exsist in SHR. If you want to try and run paroli in SHR unstable RFN. Flash the latest shr- unstable image. http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-unstable/images/om-gta02/ the image from 08-08-09 has a minor problem with opkg. to fix it opkg-cl update opkg-cl upgrade then install paroli opkg install paroli fix the conf files that the paroli installer messes with ( I hope to fix the recipe in the next couple of days. ) cp /etc/old_frameworkd.conf /etc/frameworkd.conf cp /etc/freesmartphone/oevents/old_rules.yaml /etc/freesmartphone/oevents/rules.yaml now if you want to disable the shr phone apps without removing them comment all of the lines out in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89notifier and /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80ophonekitd if you want the bind-home to ease upgrades add this line to fstab. /media/card/bind-home /home/root nonebind 0 0 You should now have a functional paroli on SHR setup. Once you have a working setup I would advise against doing opkg upgrades and only upgrade specific packages when needed. Thanks Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009 Maintainer
On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 10:09 PM, Angus Ainslienyt...@openmoko.org wrote: Hi All, After some deliberation and input from the community I am going to stop maintaining Om2009. I'm going work on getting paroli to co-exsist in SHR. If you want to try and run paroli in SHR unstable RFN. Flash the latest shr- unstable image. http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-unstable/images/om-gta02/ the image from 08-08-09 has a minor problem with opkg. to fix it opkg-cl update opkg-cl upgrade then install paroli opkg install paroli fix the conf files that the paroli installer messes with ( I hope to fix the recipe in the next couple of days. ) cp /etc/old_frameworkd.conf /etc/frameworkd.conf cp /etc/freesmartphone/oevents/old_rules.yaml /etc/freesmartphone/oevents/rules.yaml now if you want to disable the shr phone apps without removing them comment all of the lines out in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89notifier and /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80ophonekitd if you want the bind-home to ease upgrades add this line to fstab. /media/card/bind-home /home/root none bind 0 0 You should now have a functional paroli on SHR setup. Once you have a working setup I would advise against doing opkg upgrades and only upgrade specific packages when needed. Will try this right now! Thanks Angus for you work on om2009. And congrats on your new tasks, we'll be here to support you and help to give SHR another nice kick :) r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009 Maintainer
Angus, thanks a lot for your fantastic work on Om2009. It didn't go where we wanted it to go, but still covered a lot of ground. I guess I will switch to SHR too then (good instructions!) :-) Keep in touch, Wolfgang On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 01:09:49PM -0600, Angus Ainslie wrote: Hi All, After some deliberation and input from the community I am going to stop maintaining Om2009. I'm going work on getting paroli to co-exsist in SHR. If you want to try and run paroli in SHR unstable RFN. Flash the latest shr- unstable image. http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-unstable/images/om-gta02/ the image from 08-08-09 has a minor problem with opkg. to fix it opkg-cl update opkg-cl upgrade then install paroli opkg install paroli fix the conf files that the paroli installer messes with ( I hope to fix the recipe in the next couple of days. ) cp /etc/old_frameworkd.conf /etc/frameworkd.conf cp /etc/freesmartphone/oevents/old_rules.yaml /etc/freesmartphone/oevents/rules.yaml now if you want to disable the shr phone apps without removing them comment all of the lines out in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/89notifier and /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80ophonekitd if you want the bind-home to ease upgrades add this line to fstab. /media/card/bind-home /home/root nonebind 0 0 You should now have a functional paroli on SHR setup. Once you have a working setup I would advise against doing opkg upgrades and only upgrade specific packages when needed. Thanks Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OM2009
Angus Ainslie Wrote: Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. The results of Risto's poll were very surprising, at least to me. Everyone should take a look at it (http://doodle.com/sd2c8d8snr23eeqq). 70+ percent of the participants are using SHR. There really is no second place winner. I think we should all concentrate our efforts on SHR. This should not be interpreted as paroli being abandoned as paroli is in the SHR feeds. I haven't tested it, but getting it to work would be one of my first tasks if it doesn't. paroli has a LOT of fans, and your work on it is greatly appreciated! Ken Young ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [om2009] (I) messed up alsa
Dnia 2009-08-26, śro o godzinie 19:21 +0300, Risto H. Kurppa pisze: You can try this: http://kurppa.fi/freerunner/config_files/gsmhandset.state (copy to .. hmm.. let me try.. /usr/share/openmoko/scenarios ) I'll try those also if you do not mind. I am still looking for good scenarios. I still get complaints while talking through FR. -- Kind Regards, Patryk LeadMan Benderz Linux Registered User #377521 () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OM2009
Am Donnerstag, den 27.08.2009, 02:53 -0400 schrieb Ken Young: Angus Ainslie Wrote: Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. The results of Risto's poll were very surprising, at least to me. Everyone should take a look at it (http://doodle.com/sd2c8d8snr23eeqq). 70+ percent of the participants are using SHR. There really is no second place winner. I think we should all concentrate our efforts on SHR. I agree on that - althogh my recent experience with SHR-U was not really convincing. If we get a working Paroli in SHR, I'd be happy to switch to it (if manual suspend works then...) This should not be interpreted as paroli being abandoned as paroli is in the SHR feeds. I haven't tested it, but getting it to work would be one of my first tasks if it doesn't. paroli has a LOT of fans, and your work on it is greatly appreciated! Truly correct! :) -- Marcel ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Angus, a lot of respect goes to you for asking the opinion of the community and listening to our needs! To me it looks like moving over to SHR makes sense: focusing all available resources and skills on one distro instead of trying to keep OM2009 alive with waayy too little resources. I believe this would take us far, to compete with other smart phones, maybe have a non-geek-only -phone one day! OM2009 has been a nice distro but the lack of developers makes it a doomsday machine, dead end, ... And I've also heard that SHR testing has been without care already for a loong time and desperately needs someone to work on it. As you said, your time is also limited so I suggest you take the coordinating/consulting responsibility of that and first try to find a 'core team' to work on testing - I'd think some SHR devels would be happy to make testing work. It might again be a little too much if you try to do it alone so a team to work on it would be good and also make the work more pleasant as you could share your thoughts with others. And a great thing is now that we have Paroli on SHR. I don't know if someone has already tested it or have been able to make a call but I'm looking forward for you and Mirko to fix it :) Did I already post this for everyone to read: http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2009/01/building-community-around-your-foss.html - anyway, read it again, it's a great post. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Blog post about project management (was: Re: Om2009)
Am Donnerstag, den 27.08.2009, 11:01 +0300 schrieb Risto H. Kurppa: Did I already post this for everyone to read: http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2009/01/building-community-around-your-foss.html - anyway, read it again, it's a great post. Wow, read it only halfways through but it already seems great. :D What about placing a link somewhere on the wiki related to building software for the neo? Or more in the philosophy corner, if we have such? I'd be happy to get suggestions, don't know those pages too well yet... :) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 04:39:06PM -0600, Angus Ainslie wrote: Hi All, Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. IMO the numbers speak for themselves, Om2009 might just be a dying horse. This should not be interpreted as paroli being abandoned as paroli is in the SHR feeds. I haven't tested it, but getting it to work would be one of my first tasks if it doesn't. Hmmh, I never followed SHR really, no idea what it uses, but I like Paroli so glad to hear this :) This question also has a caveat. Before the end of the month I will be starting a full time contract which will cut into the time that I will have to devote to Om2009. So if Om2009 does move forward the progress will be slow. In light of a real job, Om2009 hardly seems worth the sacrifice by the above numbers, and I just saw an email where the new showroom would be for SHR... The king is dead, long live the king! -- mjt ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
I use OM2009T5, with OWrt state files and few SHR libraries. Why OM2009? Simply because it is much more stable than SHR-U. Now someone will start yelling ...but it is called unstable Fine, but SHR means STABLE hybrid release in first place. So i ask, where is this stability? I hate to say this, but in circumstances you are having new full time job, it might be worth to abandon OM2009. What to do on SHR? Definitely take care of _real_ testing branch which would be more stable. This way, some day maybe we will have SHR release which finally will be totally stable. -- Kind Regards, Patryk LeadMan Benderz Linux Registered User #377521 () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 11:52:13AM +0200, Patryk Benderz wrote: I use OM2009T5, with OWrt state files and few SHR libraries. Why OM2009? Simply because it is much more stable than SHR-U. Now someone will start yelling ...but it is called unstable Fine, but SHR means STABLE hybrid release in first place. So i ask, where is this stability? I hate to say this, but in circumstances you are having new full time job, it might be worth to abandon OM2009. What to do on SHR? Definitely take care of _real_ testing branch which would be more stable. This way, some day maybe we will have SHR release which finally will be totally stable. SHR-U from 2009/08/08 is more stable than Om2009t5 on my FreeRunner. I used to have to reboot about once per day, but now days pass without a reboot quite easily! Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Am Donnerstag, den 27.08.2009, 10:58 +0100 schrieb Rui Miguel Silva Seabra: On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 11:52:13AM +0200, Patryk Benderz wrote: I use OM2009T5, with OWrt state files and few SHR libraries. Why OM2009? Simply because it is much more stable than SHR-U. Now someone will start yelling ...but it is called unstable Fine, but SHR means STABLE hybrid release in first place. So i ask, where is this stability? I hate to say this, but in circumstances you are having new full time job, it might be worth to abandon OM2009. What to do on SHR? Definitely take care of _real_ testing branch which would be more stable. This way, some day maybe we will have SHR release which finally will be totally stable. SHR-U from 2009/08/08 is more stable than Om2009t5 on my FreeRunner. I used to have to reboot about once per day, but now days pass without a reboot quite easily! Days pass without a reboot quite easily with 2009T5 here, but SHR-U didn't even show the PIN entry screen twice... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
SHR-U from 2009/08/08 is more stable than Om2009t5 on my FreeRunner. I used to have to reboot about once per day, but now days pass without a reboot quite easily! Rui _ Some days SHR-U is very stable and sometimes it is not as all the latest bleeding stuff comes in. Some of us can fix the SHR-U latest by downgrading+upgrading+force overwriting some stuff etc but for a newcommer to SHR testing build that has atleast gsm+gps working on 2nd boot is required so that he/she atleast gets a chance to experience SHR instead of thinking its a non-functional distribution. Rakshat ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 03:57:18PM +0530, rakshat hooja wrote: SHR-U from 2009/08/08 is more stable than Om2009t5 on my FreeRunner. I used to have to reboot about once per day, but now days pass without a reboot quite easily! Rui Some days SHR-U is very stable and sometimes it is not as all the latest bleeding stuff comes in. Indeed, which is why I said SHR-U from 2009/08/08 and not just SHR-U! Some of us can fix the SHR-U latest by downgrading+upgrading+force overwriting some stuff etc but for a newcommer to SHR testing build that has atleast gsm+gps working on 2nd boot is required so that he/she atleast gets a chance to experience SHR instead of thinking its a non-functional distribution. AFAICT, a 2nd boot is always necessary post install of a new OE image... Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Some of us can fix the SHR-U latest by downgrading+upgrading+force overwriting some stuff etc but for a newcommer to SHR testing build that has atleast gsm+gps working on 2nd boot is required so that he/she atleast gets a chance to experience SHR instead of thinking its a non-functional distribution. AFAICT, a 2nd boot is always necessary post install of a new OE image... Rui I did write working after 2nd boot! Rakshat ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 04:05:52PM +0200, Marcel wrote: Am Donnerstag, den 27.08.2009, 10:58 +0100 schrieb Rui Miguel Silva Seabra: On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 11:52:13AM +0200, Patryk Benderz wrote: I use OM2009T5, with OWrt state files and few SHR libraries. Why OM2009? Simply because it is much more stable than SHR-U. Now someone will start yelling ...but it is called unstable Fine, but SHR means STABLE hybrid release in first place. So i ask, where is this stability? I hate to say this, but in circumstances you are having new full time job, it might be worth to abandon OM2009. What to do on SHR? Definitely take care of _real_ testing branch which would be more stable. This way, some day maybe we will have SHR release which finally will be totally stable. SHR-U from 2009/08/08 is more stable than Om2009t5 on my FreeRunner. I used to have to reboot about once per day, but now days pass without a reboot quite easily! Days pass without a reboot quite easily with 2009T5 here, but SHR-U didn't even show the PIN entry screen twice... Which SHR-U image? That is important, because U is for unstable, but sometimes it is stable (like 2009/08/08). For me, the boot speed isn't much of a problem if I don't have to boot frequently. In Om2009t5 I required a daily boot to have some stability in the platform. As I *do* use the Freerunner as my main phone, and even though SHR is moving the PIM parts to opim, let me tell you one thing which was quickly quite clear for me: paroli in Om2009t5 was *definitly* less stable than the telefony apps in SHR 2009/07/21 and 2009/08/08. Right now I only carry a second phone for the contact lists, since SHR-U wasn't still very ready for a full contact migration, but it's getting quite close to it (many thanks to dos1). I just hope it will handle about 200 contacts without noticeable delays. Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
I think the post was about something different, so please guys, be smart as you sure are. Dear Angus, I think that previous posts are indeed encouraging! And, as you can see, paroli is well apppreciated. AFAICU shr is the best choice for our future, and indeed having a working phone app (actually missing) on shr would be great! thanks for your work and poll d ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Am Donnerstag, den 27.08.2009, 11:43 +0100 schrieb Rui Miguel Silva Seabra: On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 04:05:52PM +0200, Marcel wrote: Am Donnerstag, den 27.08.2009, 10:58 +0100 schrieb Rui Miguel Silva Seabra: On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 11:52:13AM +0200, Patryk Benderz wrote: I use OM2009T5, with OWrt state files and few SHR libraries. Why OM2009? Simply because it is much more stable than SHR-U. Now someone will start yelling ...but it is called unstable Fine, but SHR means STABLE hybrid release in first place. So i ask, where is this stability? I hate to say this, but in circumstances you are having new full time job, it might be worth to abandon OM2009. What to do on SHR? Definitely take care of _real_ testing branch which would be more stable. This way, some day maybe we will have SHR release which finally will be totally stable. SHR-U from 2009/08/08 is more stable than Om2009t5 on my FreeRunner. I used to have to reboot about once per day, but now days pass without a reboot quite easily! Days pass without a reboot quite easily with 2009T5 here, but SHR-U didn't even show the PIN entry screen twice... Which SHR-U image? That is important, because U is for unstable, but sometimes it is stable (like 2009/08/08). I don't remember exactly, was last Friday's image IIRC. Today afternoon I need a working gps device, but I might retry SHR when Paroli is working on it... Don't like the UI of the SHR tel apps. :) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
rakshat hooja schrieb: SHR-U from 2009/08/08 is more stable than Om2009t5 on my FreeRunner. I used to have to reboot about once per day, but now days pass without a reboot quite easily! Rui _ Some days SHR-U is very stable and sometimes it is not as all the latest bleeding stuff comes in. Some of us can fix the SHR-U latest by downgrading+upgrading+force overwriting some stuff etc but for a newcommer to SHR testing build that has atleast gsm+gps working on 2nd boot is required so that he/she atleast gets a chance to experience SHR instead of thinking its a non-functional distribution. For me following distris where unusable (as daily phone, which i need): * paroli * hackable * android (missing tangogps) * shr-testing (delay between answer and can speek) the only _functional_ distri for me is: shr unstable (with all opkg upgrades) Matzehuber -- Mit freundlichen Grüssen Matthias Huber Kohlstattstr. 14 86459 Wollishausen Tel: 08238-7998 LPI000181125 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Please people, stick to the subject! -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Angus Ainslie a écrit : Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. As a Om2009t5 user it's a big YES for me. I know that numbers speak against Om2009, but I use and love this distrib. I am using it since 1st july, and I find it : - usable (hi Paroli !) - stable while using (few reboots, only when battery exhausted or when I need to change SIM, which is rare) - stable while upgrading : I was used to break lots of things while upgrading my SHR-U, it's far better with Om2009 Xavier Cremaschi. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 3:52 PM, Xavier Cremaschiomega.xav...@gmail.com wrote: - usable (hi Paroli !) Availabe now/soon for SHR too - stable while upgrading : I was used to break lots of things while upgrading my SHR-U, it's far better with Om2009 Sorry to tell you but this is because there have been no changes in OM2009 - nothing that could break anything. SHR instead is developed all the time - changes when upgrading - things might eventually break.. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Xavier Cremaschi wrote: Angus Ainslie a crit : Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. >From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. As a Om2009t5 user it's a big YES for me. I know that numbers speak against Om2009, but I use and love this distrib. I am using it since 1st july, and I find it : - usable (hi Paroli !) - stable while using (few reboots, only when battery exhausted or when I need to change SIM, which is rare) - stable while upgrading : I was used to break lots of things while upgrading my SHR-U, it's far better with Om2009 As another OM2009t5 user I'd like to chime in too. Again, I love OM2009t5 compared to other distro's I tried before. It was the first one for me with stable phone and GPS, no lost calls and decent battery. Comparing to OM2007, OM2008 and Qtopia here, not used any other. And yet, I'd prefer the scarce development effort into going to make one distro stable and featureful. If SHR is that one presently, then yes please, let's get SHR stable and have a big repository full of applications available as soon as possible. Just my opinion. -- Vibhav Sharma (khoonirobo) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
[cut] Sorry to tell you but this is because there have been no changes in OM2009 - nothing that could break anything. That is the virtue os stable release. -- Kind Regards, Patryk LeadMan Benderz Linux Registered User #377521 () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: OM2009
On August 27, 2009 12:53:44 am Ken Young wrote: This should not be interpreted as paroli being abandoned as paroli is in the SHR feeds. I haven't tested it, but getting it to work would be one of my first tasks if it doesn't. paroli has a LOT of fans, and your work on it is greatly appreciated! I'd just like to remind everyone that I'm not the one that put paroli together. Mirko Lindner was the chief architect there and Laszlo Krekacs has been doing a lot of work on it recently. So if anyone deserves thanks for paroli it's those 2. Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Risto H. Kurppa a écrit : Sorry to tell you but this is because there have been no changes in OM2009 - nothing that could break anything. SHR instead is developed all the time - changes when upgrading - things might eventually break.. True, but as my gsm, my gps, etc... are ok, no could break anything change seems a good deal. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
2009/8/27 Xavier Cremaschi omega.xav...@gmail.com Risto H. Kurppa a écrit : Sorry to tell you but this is because there have been no changes in OM2009 - nothing that could break anything. SHR instead is developed all the time - changes when upgrading - things might eventually break.. True, but as my gsm, my gps, etc... are ok, no could break anything change seems a good deal. Then just flush one of the SHR-u images that people report as stable and don't upgrade... That's what I do. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
I must admit that I switched from OM2009 to SHR-U about a month ago now, since it looked like nothing was happening. I must admit that aside from Paroli (which apparently is coming soon to SHR-U - or already there), it wasn't obvious to me what the difference in goals were - the two environments seemed pretty similar, and seemed to be trying to do basically the same thing. If the effort being put into OM2009 was to instead be put into making an SHR Testing build that is a bit more up-to-date, and is kept stable, that would make me pretty happy. I don't see at this point why it makes sense to continue to put effort into OM2009 as a distro... Warren On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 11:01 AM, Michal Brzozowski ruso...@poczta.fmwrote: 2009/8/27 Xavier Cremaschi omega.xav...@gmail.com Risto H. Kurppa a écrit : Sorry to tell you but this is because there have been no changes in OM2009 - nothing that could break anything. SHR instead is developed all the time - changes when upgrading - things might eventually break.. True, but as my gsm, my gps, etc... are ok, no could break anything change seems a good deal. Then just flush one of the SHR-u images that people report as stable and don't upgrade... That's what I do. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Warren Baird - Photographer and Digital Artist http://www.synergisticimages.ca ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:39 AM, Angus Ainslienyt...@openmoko.org wrote: Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. Abandone it if and only if you can lead the SHR stable effort. There are some technical difficulties with it: - most of the shr development and key decisions take place at irc. You are Canada based while most of the shr developers are Europe based, so there are some timing issues here;) - So I think the main developer channel should be something more permanent, like a mailing list. And every key decision should take place on it. However your message generated lot of response, but the main shr developers didnt speak up. So I think until you dont get all the required support (ie, people's agreements, mailing list setup, machine access, or using the available infrastructure, having some policies, etc) there is no question about abandoning om2009. Simply because it is stable, and stays stable. And all we would get is simply one distro less, and no adding value anywhere. This should not be interpreted as paroli being abandonned as paroli is in the SHR feeds. I haven't tested it, but getting it to work would be one of my first tasks if it doesn't. Maybe Im a bit biased here, but for me om2009 was perfect, because paroli got the necessary support, and I didnt care much about the other programs... But these days all special paroli requirements(eg: elementary) are provided by default in SHR, so there is no significant difference anymore. I would like to see the ubuntu approach: 1) Cherry pick a more or less working shr unstable image, and start debugging, contribute bugfixes only. 2) repeat the above step in every 3 month. For the first cherry-pick I would like to see waiting for the new 2.6.31 kernel with all the goodness, and stabilizing it. Just an idea. Best regards, Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Laszlo KREKACSlaszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: Simply because it is stable, and stays stable. And all we would get is simply one distro less, and no adding value anywhere. Oh, and dont forget some really nice features of om2009. One of them is the bind-home method which makes *EASY* of upgrading to newer version... Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Michal Brzozowski a écrit : Then just flush one of the SHR-u images that people report as stable and don't upgrade... That's what I do. I like small fixes, and I don't like huge breaking changes, nor this idea of a unstable, which is stable, which is not so stable please wait before upgrading... ok now! don't move then!. Of course I understand the lack of -testing and/or -stable branch is a suffered constraint and not a choice. I am not *against* SHR, but please do not forget people who prefer stability over bleeding-edge (hello Debian users o/) Xavier Cremaschi. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
SHR Testing and Stable (was: Om2009)
-testing and -stable releases are possible, it's just a matter manpower. Right now, most of the people working on SHR are also developers, who -- by nature of the development process -- need to work on the unstable distro while they're developing their apps. I don't think anyone in the SHR team would object if there would be some people joining who want to concentrate on distilling the unstable packages into a testing (and from there on onwards) a stable distro. :M: ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
Warren Baird a écrit : I must admit that aside from Paroli (which apparently is coming soon to SHR-U - or already there), it wasn't obvious to me what the difference in goals were - the two environments seemed pretty similar, and seemed to be trying to do basically the same thing. Om2007 and Om2008 did not use FSO, so SHR was a community project made to put FSO into them. But the idea behind Om2009 is basically Om2008+FSO AFAIK, so yes they should be very similar. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On 8/27/09, Laszlo KREKACS laszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: However your message generated lot of response, but the main shr developers didnt speak up. That idea (abbandoning om2009 in favor of shr-testing and -stable) came from PaulFertser, DocScrutinizer and few core SHR developers, so I don't think our response is really needed ;) We're rather waiting for Angus decision and watching what community says. About maillists - core decisions are discussed on shr-coreteam list, after that it's discussed publicly on shr-devel list (so when community don't agree with coreteam decission it doesn't have to happen at all). Every big decision regarding image or our apps *has to be* discussed publicly, on shr-devel or shr-user list. Only on IRC are discussed only small issues. Of course discussing big issues starts on IRC, but then it's moved to maillists ;) -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Angus, First I want to thank you for your work on Om2009. This is what I like about Om2009: * Paroli * Focus on stability / a working phone * bind_home directory I played around with SHR as well, and I think that the items mentioned above are missing in SHR. If you could contribute in enhancing SHR in these areas, this would be great for the whole Openmoko community. Kind regards, Jan. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkqW54AACgkQvuFuLCp9giDXBACfQ97xBi59R1oTdeO3EOUXr3Lp xd4AmgIRwuD5cUQHvMEAvkJ1GYjVvC62 =ho1A -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
I like Paroli as an application, but I think there is no need for another similar OE distribution. We should have one very basic image (like we had with FSO) which would contain like shr-extra-lite with basic system programs, FSO and opkg. Plus some scripts to customize them. You want SHR? Run install_shr.sh - it will install ophonekitd and shr applications. Want paroli? Run paroli.sh Want litephone? Run litephone.sh And so on. This is the beauty of OE and FSO. Especially FSO. And of course those images can be generated automatically with bitbake. This way we'll have stable system base and different developers can just concentrate on specific programs. So we won't have to sacrifice some distro functions like for example bind-home in order to use SHR and vice versa. Right now I have SHR and Paroli installed as an application - it works perfectly. I don't see how is it worse than having OM2009 distribution. On the other hand if I would have OM2009 it will take much more effort to install SHR functionality to it. Just my 2 cents. Leonti On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Jan Vlugjan.pub...@famvlug.nl wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Angus, First I want to thank you for your work on Om2009. This is what I like about Om2009: * Paroli * Focus on stability / a working phone * bind_home directory I played around with SHR as well, and I think that the items mentioned above are missing in SHR. If you could contribute in enhancing SHR in these areas, this would be great for the whole Openmoko community. Kind regards, Jan. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkqW54AACgkQvuFuLCp9giDXBACfQ97xBi59R1oTdeO3EOUXr3Lp xd4AmgIRwuD5cUQHvMEAvkJ1GYjVvC62 =ho1A -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[om2009] (I) messed up alsa
Hi I opened up alsamixer and fiddled with most of the 96 sliders. And now, my phone makes a horrible sound (apparently) on the other end of a phone conversation. The sound has been described as BRRiKKKiRRRiRRiZZiZZZSCH I *guess* I messed up the alsa-state files permanently. What's the easiest way to revert them back to their original settings ? I was thinking to opkg-remove, opkg-install something ? *-pike PS. What I was trying to do is get sound out of my external speakers - ffalarms wasn't much good without it. And in fact, that works now :-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [om2009] (I) messed up alsa
On August 26, 2009 09:13:11 am pike wrote: I *guess* I messed up the alsa-state files permanently. What's the easiest way to revert them back to their original settings ? I was thinking to opkg-remove, opkg-install something ? opkg install -force-reinstall openmoko-alsa-scenarios Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [om2009] (I) messed up alsa
[cut] The sound has been described as BRRiKKKiRRRiRRiZZiZZZSCH Congratulations! You have just found undocumented function of FreeRunner - it translates your voice to BrikiriZsh language ;) I *guess* I messed up the alsa-state files permanently. What's the easiest way to revert them back to their original Restore from backup ;) And seriously, i would download stock state files from any distro and `scp` them into FR. [cut] -- Kind Regards, Patryk LeadMan Benderz Linux Registered User #377521 () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [om2009] (I) messed up alsa
You can try this: http://kurppa.fi/freerunner/config_files/gsmhandset.state (copy to .. hmm.. let me try.. /usr/share/openmoko/scenarios ) Or do the opkg magic mentioned above r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Om2009
Hi All, I've been encouraged by a couple of persistent community members to post an update to Om2009. First ( other than taking some time off for the summer ) I'll tell you what I've been working on. I've been working on getting the 2.6.30 kernel with openwrt patches running. After a dismal failure earlier in the month I now have a running system. You can download experimental images to see its current state. I believe it is building and running most days. There are two caveats to using the bleeding edge experimental. 1) SD card are failing to mount on occasion. This may be due to patches missed by me or a function of Om2009 versus openwrt booting. 2) fsousaged crashes whenever it gets a suspend message. I've traced it to the point of fso_usage_low_level_suspend getting called with a NULL argument. So for a working phone suspend will need to be disabled for now. I'd like feedback from anyone brave enough to try it. Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. This should not be interpreted as paroli being abandoned as paroli is in the SHR feeds. I haven't tested it, but getting it to work would be one of my first tasks if it doesn't. This question also has a caveat. Before the end of the month I will be starting a full time contract which will cut into the time that I will have to devote to Om2009. So if Om2009 does move forward the progress will be slow. Looking forward to your responses Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
I personally really like paroli, but dont see the need for a completely separate distro for it. I would like to see more work being done to integrating paroli as an phone-util option into shr (Perhaps down the road even integrating c_c's 'launcher' idea as a part of it?) That would be the ideal phone environment for me. But I'm probably biased as I use SHR-U as my daily phone. ;) Thanks for all the work on paroli and om2009 though Angus! As I mentioned above, I really like paroli, and appreciate all the hard work you have put in thus far and hope that you continue! Paroli as a quick and responsive phone utility is certainly an asset to the om community! Thanks, -Dan Staley On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 6:39 PM, Angus Ainslie nyt...@openmoko.org wrote: Hi All, I've been encouraged by a couple of persistent community members to post an update to Om2009. First ( other than taking some time off for the summer ) I'll tell you what I've been working on. I've been working on getting the 2.6.30 kernel with openwrt patches running. After a dismal failure earlier in the month I now have a running system. You can download experimental images to see its current state. I believe it is building and running most days. There are two caveats to using the bleeding edge experimental. 1) SD card are failing to mount on occasion. This may be due to patches missed by me or a function of Om2009 versus openwrt booting. 2) fsousaged crashes whenever it gets a suspend message. I've traced it to the point of fso_usage_low_level_suspend getting called with a NULL argument. So for a working phone suspend will need to be disabled for now. I'd like feedback from anyone brave enough to try it. Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. This should not be interpreted as paroli being abandoned as paroli is in the SHR feeds. I haven't tested it, but getting it to work would be one of my first tasks if it doesn't. This question also has a caveat. Before the end of the month I will be starting a full time contract which will cut into the time that I will have to devote to Om2009. So if Om2009 does move forward the progress will be slow. Looking forward to your responses Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 04:39:06PM -0600, Angus Ainslie wrote: 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. (...) This question also has a caveat. Before the end of the month I will be starting a full time contract which will cut into the time that I will have to devote to Om2009. So if Om2009 does move forward the progress will be slow. Looking forward to your responses Angus, I think you answered yourself :) With a new job coming up you really should invest smartly on your time. In my perception (which may be totally wrong) is that Om2009 has really few people working on it. Since this is a small community and the OS is such a big task, it is my opinion that it is advisable to avoid duplicating the effort of building and maintening an OS with such few differences. Best of luck with the new gig! :) Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
2009/8/27 Rui Miguel Silva Seabra r...@1407.org: On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 04:39:06PM -0600, Angus Ainslie wrote: 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. (...) This question also has a caveat. Before the end of the month I will be starting a full time contract which will cut into the time that I will have to devote to Om2009. So if Om2009 does move forward the progress will be slow. Looking forward to your responses Angus, I think you answered yourself :) With a new job coming up you really should invest smartly on your time. In my perception (which may be totally wrong) is that Om2009 has really few people working on it. Since this is a small community and the OS is such a big task, it is my opinion that it is advisable to avoid duplicating the effort of building and maintening an OS with such few differences. Best of luck with the new gig! :) Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community I also like paroli a lot, but as Rui and surely others, I think doesn't worth to maintain a full distro for one package, your live will be easier sure, and all your knowledge sure will be very useful to improve the core of SHR distro it self Really really thanks a lot for such great and amazing work you have done maintaining OM2009 and Paroli. I believe SHR is where we have to focus our efforts for an OE based distro for the Neo, and of course other phone devices as long as they are supported -- David Reyes Samblas Martinez http://www.tuxbrain.com Open ultraportable embedded solutions Openmoko, Openpandora, Arduino Hey, watch out!!! There's a linux in your pocket!!! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Om2009
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:39 AM, Angus Ainslienyt...@openmoko.org wrote: [...] Now I have a question of all of you. Should I continue to maintain Om2009. From the recent poll by rhk it seems that SHR users outnumber OM users by ~ 7:1. So what I'd like to know is does anyone still think Om2009 is a worthy venture or should I move over to SHR and see what help I can be there. The logical further step may be to join SHR and have Paroli as an alternative to SHR phone apps or litephone and so on. I really appreciate SHR guys effort, the only thing I do not like is the absence of a testing_to_stable branch, (Yes! I know it was discussed and promised a lot of time for about a year) that becomes a problem due the unstable nature of SHR-U (Yes! I know the meaning of unstable). For that reason I appreciate a lot the way you worked on om2009, the several testing releases, the experimental separation, the decision to use a 2.6.28 more wifi reliable kernel in the release candidate, while trying the 2.6.30 on the experimental, avoiding to touch sensible core parts of OE, as the opkg breaking patches and so on. So if you'll join SHR team, please consider in merging all that aspects, it may be helping in creating the wanted testing branch ;) and please support not shr/E applications other than paroli too, there are some work in progress about nice alternatives. Taking care of that will get +10 not only from me ;) Best Regards, and thanks for your effort! Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Om2009] bluetooth keyboard - key presses not making it to X
for reference, attached is some output from hcidump lsmod on my laptop, where I am able to connect and use the keyboard successfully. Tim laptop.tar.gz Description: GNU Zip compressed data ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Om2009] bluetooth keyboard - key presses not making it to X
My bluetooth keyboard also works very well on my freerunner. (I have an iGo Stowaway keyboardwhich i would highly recommend...its very nice!) -Dan Staley On Mon, Aug 24, 2009 at 6:41 PM, Tim Abell t...@timwise.co.uk wrote: for reference, attached is some output from hcidump lsmod on my laptop, where I am able to connect and use the keyboard successfully. Tim ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
I reflashed om2009 (latest unstable) only to see that paroli can't always login to network (well actually now that I mention it, I was able to see it also on the previous isntallatin - paroli often gave me the about 10 error messages..) here are last lines from /var/log/paroli.log http://pastebin.com/m18850984 otoh frameork log doesn't know anything about this: http://pastebin.com/m37b98cf3 (lines printed with tail) Is it paroli or fso that's failing? I might be able to provide more logs if needed r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
restarting a couple of times lets me use paroli, gps and everything with no problems! I actually was able to run 4 apps at the same time using gps, not bad! And Paroli connects to gsm networks nicely. Thanks! r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
comments inline On Thu, Aug 6, 2009 at 10:19 PM, Onenonen...@free.fr wrote: I changed the subject, in order to try bringing attention to your timeouts issues... good If paroli doesn't run, it wont start at all. This might be because my application does not request the GSM ressource. Thus, if GSM is not up and running, requested by another application, I am not sure of how nice it handles it. Thats what I thought. Requesting the GSM resource might be a good idea, if FSO can handle more than one app doing it: this way I shouldnt have to run other apps if I just want to log stuff. I have some problems with GPS, I feel that Tangogps or openbmap alone can't actually ever see any satelites, but if I first start omgps (using ublox), I get a nice fix and then when I start openbmap or tango, it changes to fso and things sometimes work. Well I request GPS ressource and uses it through FSO API here. So at the moment I can't see my application being guilty here. Understand Sometimes (like every 20th restart - I really mean it, i've wasted hours in the bus trying to run this and it's actually very frustrating...) it starts with no problems but then I can't turn it on (to make it actually store cell info) but it freezes and suddenly shows no UI. Difficult to help without logs... A very quick response would be a timeout about the GPS response (as you explain you meet difficulties with it) which my app does not handle correctly (but this never happened to me so far...). What logs you want? fso? does openbmap strore it's own logs in .openbmap.. will check.. In this case I request a ressource (GPS and CPU, the latter for preventing the phone to suspend, but allow the screen to dim light) through FSO D-Bus API. This calls times out. For some reason I had this bad feeling that actually it's FSO that fails, not openbmap.. Too bad I'm missing many cells, can't get higher in the openbmap stats :) That is very much annoying yes! You should have a backup distribution installed on SD card in case of ;-) Well yes, true.. I just didn't believe it that suddenly sometghint would break so that things stop working if I don't install anything.. I've heard they call Linux stable so I trusted.. :) The only changing thing here is the country and the GSM cells, other than that I really can't come up with anything that has changed. r -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
On 8/7/09, Risto H. Kurppa ri...@kurppa.fi wrote: This might be because my application does not request the GSM ressource. Thus, if GSM is not up and running, requested by another application, I am not sure of how nice it handles it. Thats what I thought. Requesting the GSM resource might be a good idea, if FSO can handle more than one app doing it: this way I shouldnt have to run other apps if I just want to log stuff. FSO can handle more than one app requesting resource (that's what resources are supposed to do by design), but then openBmap will have to implement PIN handling and few other things. And you'll miss calls when you'll use only GSM-aware openBmap without any other phone app. So I can't see much sense with openBmap requesting GSM resource... -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
(om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing
Hi!
I'm travelling with om2009 unstable from about 2 weeks ago. I'm having
hard time running openbmap and recording cells, most of the times it
crashes when I try to start it.
If paroli doesn't run, it wont start at all.
I have some problems with GPS, I feel that Tangogps or openbmap alone
can't actually ever see any satelites, but if I first start omgps
(using ublox), I get a nice fix and then when I start openbmap or
tango, it changes to fso and thigs sometimes work.
Sometimes (like every 20th restart - I really mean it, i've wasted
hours in the bus trying to run this and it's actually very
frustrating...) it starts with no problems but then I can't turn it on
(to make it actually store cell info) but it freezes and suddenly
shows no UI.
It's now been about a week travelling when I haven't been able to
record any cells, because can't start openbmap. It tries to do its
magic for some minutes (I have paroli running, sometimes also omgps
with gps fix)
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 130, in __init__
self._obmlogger = openbmap.logger.ObmLogger()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
832, in __init__
self._gsm = Gsm(self._bus)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line 64,
in __init__
self.get_device_info()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
223, in get_device_info
data = dbus.Interface(obj, 'org.freesmartphone.GSM.Device').GetInfo()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68, in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140, in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did
not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application
did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the
reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was
broken.
or this:
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 132, in __init__
self._obmlogger.init_openBmap()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
1118, in init_openBmap
self.request_ressource('CPU')
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
859, in request_ressource
request = dbus.Interface(obj,
'org.freesmartphone.Usage').RequestResource(resource)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68, in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140, in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply:
Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus)
I have no idea it it's because of openbmap or fso but I'd really
appreciate it if someone could gice me a tip if there's something I
can do to fix this. It just stopped working some days ago without any
upgrade or program installation (I haven't had the phone connected to
internet for a week or so).
Too bad I'm missing many cells, can't get higher in the openbmap stats :)
r
--
| risto h. kurppa
| risto at kurppa dot fi
| http://risto.kurppa.fi
___
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Help with FSO calls timeouts (was: (om2009) OpenBmap client keeps crashing)
I changed the subject, in order to try bringing attention to your
timeouts issues...
Hi Risto,
let's see how I can help you!
Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
If paroli doesn't run, it wont start at all.
This might be because my application does not request the GSM ressource.
Thus, if GSM is not up and running, requested by another application, I
am not sure of how nice it handles it.
I have some problems with GPS, I feel that Tangogps or openbmap alone
can't actually ever see any satelites, but if I first start omgps
(using ublox), I get a nice fix and then when I start openbmap or
tango, it changes to fso and things sometimes work.
Well I request GPS ressource and uses it through FSO API here. So at the
moment I can't see my application being guilty here.
Sometimes (like every 20th restart - I really mean it, i've wasted
hours in the bus trying to run this and it's actually very
frustrating...) it starts with no problems but then I can't turn it on
(to make it actually store cell info) but it freezes and suddenly
shows no UI.
Difficult to help without logs... A very quick response would be a
timeout about the GPS response (as you explain you meet difficulties
with it) which my app does not handle correctly (but this never happened
to me so far...).
It's now been about a week travelling when I haven't been able to
record any cells, because can't start openbmap. It tries to do its
magic for some minutes (I have paroli running, sometimes also omgps
with gps fix)
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 130, in __init__
self._obmlogger = openbmap.logger.ObmLogger()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
832, in __init__
self._gsm = Gsm(self._bus)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line 64,
in __init__
self.get_device_info()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
223, in get_device_info
data = dbus.Interface(obj, 'org.freesmartphone.GSM.Device').GetInfo()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68,
in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140,
in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did
not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application
did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the
reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was
broken.
In this case, the application calls a D-Bus FSO API in order to get
hardware details. It seems the framework times out :-(
or this:
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 356, in module
hwg = openBmapGTK()
File /usr/bin/openBmapGTK, line 132, in __init__
self._obmlogger.init_openBmap()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
1118, in init_openBmap
self.request_ressource('CPU')
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/openbmap/logger.py, line
859, in request_ressource
request = dbus.Interface(obj,
'org.freesmartphone.Usage').RequestResource(resource)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 68,
in __call__
return self._proxy_method(*args, **keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/proxies.py, line 140,
in __call__
**keywords)
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/dbus/connection.py, line
622, in call_blocking
message, timeout)
dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply:
Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus)
In this case I request a ressource (GPS and CPU, the latter for
preventing the phone to suspend, but allow the screen to dim light)
through FSO D-Bus API. This calls times out.
So my application should handle this much more nicely. But, this is
normal that it refuses to start if one of these calls does not succeed.
The only hint I can give you so far, is that I ran under such issues
under Debian when calling the monitoring interface. When this would
happen, then exiting obm, and trying to relaunch it, would bring
timeouts as you meet.
I could not find much info about this so far though :-( I am not sure
what is happening.
I have no idea it it's because of openbmap or fso but I'd really
appreciate it if someone could gice me a tip if there's something I
can do to fix this. It just stopped working some days ago without any
upgrade or program installation (I haven't had the phone connected to
internet for a week or so).
Too bad I'm missing many cells, can't get higher in the openbmap stats :)
That is very much annoying yes! You should have a
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Guillaume Chereaucharlie...@gmail.com wrote: Beside, even though I stopped working on paroli long before Mirko, I still understand how the core works ; contact me by email (or on this list) if you have any question about it, I can have a -quick- look at it. Thank you very much for your offer, I will compile my list of questions, and shoot at you;) Besides, I would like to talk with you, how can we more collaborate... Best regards, Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 7:27 PM, Laszlo KREKACSlaszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: Thank you very much for your offer, I will compile my list of questions, and shoot at you;) Besides, I would like to talk with you, how can we more collaborate... No problem. You can sometime find me on freenode IRC as charlie137 (usually online around 1pm to 4pm GTM). Cheers, -- Guillaume Chéreau blogs : http://charlie137.blogspot.com/, http://charlie137-2.blogspot.com/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 12:42 AM, Laszlo KREKACSlaszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) I would like to add my 2 cents here;) I didnt stopped working on paroli at all, just my attention was distracted by some hobby project (home-made electric bike) and I was on vacation in the last 2 weeks (hence the late reply). But I agree, what Mirko is doing, are the worst scenario of every possible act, ie. stating he is working on paroli, but his last real work on paroli was exactly two months ago on June 3, with commit 6b47ad3a17814105e7107dcf7cc30dc4f3584387. In addition to this he is not responding to emails, especially which contains programing questions regarding to paroli. (I know, because I shoot 10-15 emails already to him in these 2 months). I have read somewhere some years ago, how to best quit an open source project, but I cant locate it anymore (nor on the web nor in my computer). It addressed this very issue, how to avoid this kind of frustrations. I would like to suggest to Qi company (Mirko's bosses;), to allow (better word: force) Mirko to work on Paroli one hour per week. To answer questions, and integrate others' works. There are many ongoing work, which needs to be integrated into paroli. There are two branches by Dietrich, namely tacheles and rebase. Where tacheles needs some very deep (tichy/paroli) knowledge, to be able to integrate into paroli. Other seems mostly cleanup. We should really need some kind of communication platform, because I for example never met with Dietrich, but I really like his works (on pyneo.org, I based my gps program on his mappad work. It was he or josch) So there are two more possible contributors: Dietrich and josch. They need some attention, to not lost his interests in paroli. I for example have many more or less working programs, which needs some help to properly integrate into paroli. (I have shoot an email like 4 days ago to Mirko, but no answer;) These are: - calculator app (already usable) - gps app, and I would like to develop some predefined gui for it: walking, running, biking, driving, paragliding The basics works, I need edje (.edc file) gui for more advanced things like zoom in, out and panning;) - note taking app (almost working) - calendar app (I have some gui sketches) - some already done (or planned) gui improvements for paroli - I have some gui ideas, where I need consensus from Mirko and Angus, one of them is putting topbar at the bottom. Because the bottom is not really finger usable, so why waste the valuable space at the top (just under illume's topbar). And it makes little sense to have two topbars at the top. Mirko: If you want to step back from paroli for some time (months), please, please integrate people's work before it, and only leave after. There are many things, where we really need you. Im not able to help Dietrich integrate his dbus based multithreading programs. I (for example) need some tichy help. I think everybody got an idea about paroli status. Best regards, Laszlo So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? -- Steven Le Roux Jabber-ID : ste...@jabber.fr 0x39494CCB ste...@le-roux.info 2FF7 226B 552E 4709 03F0 6281 72D7 A010 3949 4CCB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, I am still alive and by no means agree that I am not doing anything. I would agree that I am not coding right now. I am in active contact with the pyneo crew, met with them in Hamburg and talked with fgau of epydial how to get the apps into paroli. MDT of pyneo who has started 2 branches has taken over the part of doing maintenance on paroli's core (formerly tichy) and this is still the plan. Adding features to paroli right now has been opted against as Angus and I still hope to be able to release Om2009. This requires bug- fixing not new features. I am also collaborating with Mirko from OpenWrt to get paroli fully supported on this platform as well. So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? Not on the mailinglists I admit, but I am online on irc regularly these days. Certainly less than during OM times and maybe difficult to catch due to changing nick names. I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? I think a fork would be the worst case scenario. Laszlo also doesn't need to fork, if adding new features is desperately needed how about a branch? Certainly better than splitting the few resources that go into a project. I take part of the blame as I am heavily involved with Qi Hardware at the moment and also do like to socialize and enjoy the sun every now and again. I see a future for paroli and am interested in and working for a revival of a python based multi-purpose device UI. /mirko___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 6:04 PM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Hi, I am still alive and by no means agree that I am not doing anything. I would agree that I am not coding right now. I am in active contact with the pyneo crew, met with them in Hamburg and talked with fgau of epydial how to get the apps into paroli. MDT of pyneo who has started 2 branches has taken over the part of doing maintenance on paroli's core (formerly tichy) and this is still the plan. Adding features to paroli right now has been opted against as Angus and I still hope to be able to release Om2009. This requires bug-fixing not new features. I am also collaborating with Mirko from OpenWrt to get paroli fully supported on this platform as well. So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? Not on the mailinglists I admit, but I am online on irc regularly these days. Certainly less than during OM times and maybe difficult to catch due to changing nick names. Good to know :) I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? I think a fork would be the worst case scenario. And you're right ! It was the last possible scenario to adopt... Laszlo also doesn't need to fork, if adding new features is desperately needed how about a branch? Certainly better than splitting the few resources that go into a project. I take part of the blame as I am heavily involved with Qi Hardware at the moment and also do like to socialize and enjoy the sun every now and again. I see a future for paroli and am interested in and working for a revival of a python based multi-purpose device UI. There is no pb being off for a while... but mails was looking like you're dead 2 month ago ;). So let's stabilize and what non-coding user can do more then adding tickets to the Trac ? /mirko -- Steven Le Roux Jabber-ID : ste...@jabber.fr 0x39494CCB ste...@le-roux.info 2FF7 226B 552E 4709 03F0 6281 72D7 A010 3949 4CCB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hey again, On 3 Aug 2009, at 19:01, Steven Le Roux wrote: On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 6:04 PM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Hi, I am still alive and by no means agree that I am not doing anything. I would agree that I am not coding right now. I am in active contact with the pyneo crew, met with them in Hamburg and talked with fgau of epydial how to get the apps into paroli. MDT of pyneo who has started 2 branches has taken over the part of doing maintenance on paroli's core (formerly tichy) and this is still the plan. Adding features to paroli right now has been opted against as Angus and I still hope to be able to release Om2009. This requires bug-fixing not new features. I am also collaborating with Mirko from OpenWrt to get paroli fully supported on this platform as well. So nobody here has any news from Mirko ? Neither QI-Hardware ? Not on the mailinglists I admit, but I am online on irc regularly these days. Certainly less than during OM times and maybe difficult to catch due to changing nick names. Good to know :) For the record: vegyraupe, mirko-paroli, mirkolindner on irc :) I really like Paroli and would love to see this effort congratulate for example by being integrated into SHR too... but if the maintainer remains w/o news... Laszlo what do you think about a fork to apply your patches ? a continue with welcomed contrib ? I think a fork would be the worst case scenario. And you're right ! It was the last possible scenario to adopt... Laszlo also doesn't need to fork, if adding new features is desperately needed how about a branch? Certainly better than splitting the few resources that go into a project. I take part of the blame as I am heavily involved with Qi Hardware at the moment and also do like to socialize and enjoy the sun every now and again. I see a future for paroli and am interested in and working for a revival of a python based multi-purpose device UI. There is no pb being off for a while... but mails was looking like you're dead 2 month ago ;). Hehe, I did talk with Laszlo every now and again so there was communication, but I completely understand his frustration. So let's stabilize and what non-coding user can do more then adding tickets to the Trac ? Yes and trying to figure out when which errors appear that allows us (coders) to fix the problems faster. There was a problem with the suspend on the last OWrt image which meant I couldn't use the phone as my daily but I am optimistic that this will be solved soon and thus enjoy my own bugs on a daily basis and fix them :) /mirko -- Steven Le Roux Jabber-ID : ste...@jabber.fr 0x39494CCB ste...@le-roux.info 2FF7 226B 552E 4709 03F0 6281 72D7 A010 3949 4CCB ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) I would like to add my 2 cents here;) I didnt stopped working on paroli at all, just my attention was distracted by some hobby project (home-made electric bike) and I was on vacation in the last 2 weeks (hence the late reply). But I agree, what Mirko is doing, are the worst scenario of every possible act, ie. stating he is working on paroli, but his last real work on paroli was exactly two months ago on June 3, with commit 6b47ad3a17814105e7107dcf7cc30dc4f3584387. In addition to this he is not responding to emails, especially which contains programing questions regarding to paroli. (I know, because I shoot 10-15 emails already to him in these 2 months). I have read somewhere some years ago, how to best quit an open source project, but I cant locate it anymore (nor on the web nor in my computer). It addressed this very issue, how to avoid this kind of frustrations. I would like to suggest to Qi company (Mirko's bosses;), to allow (better word: force) Mirko to work on Paroli one hour per week. To answer questions, and integrate others' works. There are many ongoing work, which needs to be integrated into paroli. There are two branches by Dietrich, namely tacheles and rebase. Where tacheles needs some very deep (tichy/paroli) knowledge, to be able to integrate into paroli. Other seems mostly cleanup. We should really need some kind of communication platform, because I for example never met with Dietrich, but I really like his works (on pyneo.org, I based my gps program on his mappad work. It was he or josch) So there are two more possible contributors: Dietrich and josch. They need some attention, to not lost his interests in paroli. I for example have many more or less working programs, which needs some help to properly integrate into paroli. (I have shoot an email like 4 days ago to Mirko, but no answer;) These are: - calculator app (already usable) - gps app, and I would like to develop some predefined gui for it: walking, running, biking, driving, paragliding The basics works, I need edje (.edc file) gui for more advanced things like zoom in, out and panning;) - note taking app (almost working) - calendar app (I have some gui sketches) - some already done (or planned) gui improvements for paroli - I have some gui ideas, where I need consensus from Mirko and Angus, one of them is putting topbar at the bottom. Because the bottom is not really finger usable, so why waste the valuable space at the top (just under illume's topbar). And it makes little sense to have two topbars at the top. Mirko: If you want to step back from paroli for some time (months), please, please integrate people's work before it, and only leave after. There are many things, where we really need you. Im not able to help Dietrich integrate his dbus based multithreading programs. I (for example) need some tichy help. I think everybody got an idea about paroli status. Best regards, Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi! On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Angus Ainslienyt...@openmoko.org wrote: 3 issues that need solving SIM card full when it's not really full as the messages are stored in the rootfs. Need to look into how to fake incoming sms', because, I dont use sms at all. Contacts disappearing Like loosing contacts permanently? I workarounded it by auto-backup phone contacts. Is this the same issue? I remember Mirko promised he is looking more deeply into opimd, and incorporate into paroli or, develop further paroli's solution. Dunno what is his plan. Display menu is gone. From the settings? I should install the newest unstable image, to see what happened... works for me;) But Im like a month old image. Angus Laszlo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Aug 3, 2009 at 6:42 AM, Laszlo KREKACSlaszlo.krekacs.l...@gmail.com wrote: There are many ongoing work, which needs to be integrated into paroli. There are two branches by Dietrich, namely tacheles and rebase. Where tacheles needs some very deep (tichy/paroli) knowledge, to be able to integrate into paroli. Hello Laszlo, at least for some of the issues concerning tichy, you can look into the actual tichy code, still hosted on its google code website [1]. I don't think you will be able to directly merge from tichy to paroli, for both projects have diverged too much, but I am sure you can get some ideas from it. Beside, even though I stopped working on paroli long before Mirko, I still understand how the core works ; contact me by email (or on this list) if you have any question about it, I can have a -quick- look at it. Regards, -Gui [1] http://code.google.com/p/tichy/ -- Guillaume Chéreau blogs : http://charlie137.blogspot.com/, http://charlie137-2.blogspot.com/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009 - exceptional dbus.exceptions exception
Am Dienstag, den 28.07.2009, 01:49 +0200 schrieb pike: an interesting exception I noticed when playing with mdbus - when I interrupt a mdbus call with control-c, it throws a python exception at me saying (eventually) DBus in the version that we currently ship is broken wrt. SIGINT behaviour. It has just been fixed in HEAD IIRC, so we can expect this to improve when the new versions hit the feeds. :M: ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, On Fri, 24.07.2009 at 08:40:45 +0200, Mirko Lindner vegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. I'm a bit out-of-sync with all of you, due to other work, but still have problems in Om2009r5 that I've just flashed my FR A6. These are my first impressions: 1. Booting is _very_slow_. I didn't measure it, but it feels much slower than with Om2009r4 (which had a whole lot of other problems, though, including no keyboard after a while in the dialer). 2. I've changed the profile to Illume on the first boot after flashing. On the second boot, when it asks for a PIN, the following problems manifest: 2.1 There is a strip of rainbow colours (much like a garbled C64 screen) on the top of the screen. 2.2 The string Enter PIN is cut off at the lower half. 2.3 The profile was reset to Paroli. 3. I changed the profile setting to paroli-serenity. This resultet in an error message about a missing module that could not be loaded. 4. If I call myself to test, although sound quality is _poor_ (like an old military radio device - I think I need the buzz fix), there's immediate, and increasing, acoustic feedback. I have to go several meters away from the other phone to stop it. 5. I didn't yet find out how to adjust the keyboard to eg. German. Preferably, I'd have the Terminal keyboard (not that magic I guess and scramble your writing-keyboard) plus a method to enter accented characters. 6. When conducting a phone call, there's a weird mixed call-and-hangup sign which looks like if the two images were overlayed as transparencies. 7. Keyboard reaction is MUCH slower than it was in r4 while I had a keyboard there. Some general remarks: * I didn't yet find out where my data goes. With r4, I had some messages, and, in theory, GPS tracks that I tried to recover using SSH, but I could not locate them on the file system. So I lost it all after re-flashing. * There should be an easy way to inspect and manipulate backup images (eg. jffs2 format) in a regular Linux desktop machine. Maybe this is in the wiki already, but I'd like something along pmount image-file directory to mount an image and work with the contents. * So far, I'm only able to use half of my 8gig micro SD card in the phone, but all of it in a regular computer's card reader. * Battery life appears to be very low. Just dabbling a bit with the new image drained three quarters of the battery, according to Illume's status display, but the can battery icon appeared to suggested the * battery to be half full. Kind regards, --Toni++ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, I meant to say On Wed, 29.07.2009 at 22:04:16 +0200, Toni Mueller supp...@oeko.net wrote: I'm a bit out-of-sync with all of you, due to other work, that I'm sorry if there's a bit of duplication, and I also don't expect a quick fix. I have one feature request, though: * Ability to explicitly refuse to accept a call, so it does not go to the voice mailbox (my normal configuration for calls I don't accept), either. Draining the voice mailbox is both expensive and very time consuming. Kind regards, --Toni++ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. I must admit this whole thread is starting to worry me. I don`t mean to pester but could someone please provide some clarrification on the status of Om2009 / Paroli? If it is a case of not enough man power, It might be good to assemble a list, as mirko suggested, of tasks that still need to be done for a release. Then we can start knocking them down. regards, Adolph -- Adolph J. Vogel BEng(Hons) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
[cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] -- Kind Regards Patryk Benderz IT Specialist Linux Registered User #377521 +48 22 538 6292 ERSTE Securities Polska S.A. ul. Królewska 16 Warszawa 00-103 KRS 065121 NIP 526-10-27-638 REGON 011136053 Kapitał akcyjny: 15.500.000 złotych (w pełni opłacony) This message and any attached files are confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any publication, transmission or other use of the information by a person or entity other than the intended addressee is prohibited. If you receive this in error please contact the sender and delete the material. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions as a result of the transmission. Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 12:41, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: [cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] No, I don't agree. It's natural than packages builded on your own will be outdated some time in future. That's why I think opkg.org is bad idea as www repo (it should be rather app overview). If someone wants to have his package available in SHR, then we're accepting bb files, and if they builds - then packages are added to feed. And author of app doesn't have to care about packaging, and everyone is happy. Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
2009/7/27 Sebastian Krzyszkowiak seba.d...@gmail.com Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. No it's not bad by design, because some people use other distros than SHR, like Om2008. Plus if someone publishes a new app or a new version, everyone can just 'opkg install url' instead of waiting for SHR developers to include the app in their repository (assuming everyone uses SHR). ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 13:14, Michal Brzozowskiruso...@poczta.fm wrote: 2009/7/27 Sebastian Krzyszkowiak seba.d...@gmail.com Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. No it's not bad by design, because some people use other distros than SHR, like Om2008. Having one package for few incompatible systems is even worse :P Plus if someone publishes a new app or a new version, everyone can just 'opkg install url' instead of waiting for SHR developers to include the app in their repository (assuming everyone uses SHR). For interesting apps from Openmoko community we're setting AUTOREV, so it's always the newest version. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 01:14:45PM +0200, Michal Brzozowski wrote: 2009/7/27 Sebastian Krzyszkowiak seba.d...@gmail.com Packaging apps on your own is bad by design (unless you're packaging closed source apps, but they are also bad :P), not changes in SHR. No it's not bad by design, because some people use other distros than SHR, like Om2008. Yes, it is *very* bad by design. It would be much better if opkg.org would contain several repo's, each oriented to a specific distro, and when one ould upload a package one would specify the distros it will work on, and then it get's added to the local repo. Plus if someone publishes a new app or a new version, everyone can just 'opkg install url' instead of waiting for SHR developers to include the app in their repository (assuming everyone uses SHR). You don't have to use only the pre-defined repo's, you can set your own repo and point at it. No need to wait for the distro developers, this is not Apple Store :) Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Dnia 2009-07-27, pon o godzinie 13:01 +0200, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak pisze: On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 12:41, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: [cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] No, I don't agree. It's natural than packages builded on your own will be outdated some time in future. That's why I think opkg.org is bad idea as www repo (it should be rather app overview). Read again what Nicola wrote: *I never saw a backport to testing... I neither saw, did you? *actually shr is...way...to use...FR in a modern way out of the box again agree and I think you agree too :) *please provide a really supported testing *branch* and not a snapshot Do you think SHR devs shouldn't provide genuine testing branch? These are the points i agree with. Probably you just looked at the last sentence, cause i have cited whole paragraph? [cut] -- Kind Regards Patryk Benderz IT Specialist Linux Registered User #377521 +48 22 538 6292 ERSTE Securities Polska S.A. ul. Królewska 16 Warszawa 00-103 KRS 065121 NIP 526-10-27-638 REGON 011136053 Kapitał akcyjny: 15.500.000 złotych (w pełni opłacony) This message and any attached files are confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any publication, transmission or other use of the information by a person or entity other than the intended addressee is prohibited. If you receive this in error please contact the sender and delete the material. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions as a result of the transmission. Email secured by Check Point ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On July 27, 2009 03:04:30 am Adolph J. Vogel wrote: I must admit this whole thread is starting to worry me. I don`t mean to pester but could someone please provide some clarrification on the status of Om2009 / Paroli? Om2009 is moving forward very slowly at the moment. My time is currently very limited for this volunteer project. The current issue I'm trying to solve is WSOD with the 2.6.29-rc2 kernel by jumping to the 2.6.30 kernel. This work is going on in the experimental branch and will be pushed into unstable at some point. If it is a case of not enough man power, It might be good to assemble a list, as mirko suggested, of tasks that still need to be done for a release. Then we can start knocking them down. 3 issues that need solving SIM card full when it's not really full as the messages are stored in the rootfs. Contacts disappearing Display menu is gone. Fixes for these and other problems you may find can be sent as patches, Angus ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 14:00, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: Dnia 2009-07-27, pon o godzinie 13:01 +0200, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak pisze: On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 12:41, Patryk Benderzpatryk.bend...@esp.pl wrote: [cut] You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a [...] guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). Well, Sebastian, i have to say Nicola has a point here. I agree. [cut] No, I don't agree. It's natural than packages builded on your own will be outdated some time in future. That's why I think opkg.org is bad idea as www repo (it should be rather app overview). Read again what Nicola wrote: *I never saw a backport to testing... I neither saw, did you? *actually shr is...way...to use...FR in a modern way out of the box again agree and I think you agree too :) *please provide a really supported testing *branch* and not a snapshot Do you think SHR devs shouldn't provide genuine testing branch? These are the points i agree with. Probably you just looked at the last sentence, cause i have cited whole paragraph? [cut] But these are the points I already said I agree with, and I also said that SHR is going this way. I thought I don't have to repeat it :x -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
om2009 - exceptional dbus.exceptions exception
Hi an interesting exception I noticed when playing with mdbus - when I interrupt a mdbus call with control-c, it throws a python exception at me saying (eventually) ImportError: no module named dbus.exceptions Now, that sounds .. wrong. It's trying to properly raise an exception, but it can't ? It also killed my phone at the time, and i had to pop the battery (again..), but retrying it now my phone survives. Is it a known issue, or not an issue at all ? I can't find anything about it. $2c, *-pike ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Friday 24 July 2009 23:40:14 Risto H. Kurppa wrote: I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! I heard that multiple times now, I think the UI really has something to it. Unfortunately the problem with Zhone's software design is that it hasn't any -- while I accept patches, I kind of refuse to add more to it on my own. Then again, I'd love to get back into doing actual applications again (middleware is so boring... ;), which means I'm going to write something like Zhone is now -- this time in Vala and covering more features though. :M: ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 04:11, Nicola Mfbnicola@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: [...] r - someone unhappy feeling that no-one is working on Paroli or bugfixing it.. I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! Hi Risto, If I remember well Mickey announced that zhone will not get anymore improvements and the one in fso 5.5 is basically the same of 5.1 :(. I suppose that FSO/SHR joint will mean that while FSO will be improved and extended SHR applications will be the natural candidate for their testing and reference implementation. As there is a distro based on zhone I do not know if at least their guys will improve it. The problem is that SHR promised on late 2008 a stable milestone, after that it was forgotten, they promised again on 22 may 2009, a lot of unstable to test fork where done and abandoned. Finally I just realized that it's a real nice hacking distro with tons of bleeding edge and regular breaking updates and there is no real interesting on stabilize it. I do not want to hurt anyone is only my opinion. With om2009 release plan I just thought: SHR has no man power or will to maintain two different branch, the stable and the developing at least now, the same for OM guys with OM2009, but I'm lucky and I may have OM2009 on the flash to have a stable working device, and shr on the SD to test and enjoy bleeding edge. I'm really afraid of all the shots that our device is taking while I think that the community is completely unorganized and the term community driven completely abused. m2c Nicola We just don't want to release crap as stable. There were problems with either FSO, SHR, build system etc. We wanted to start releasing testing images regular every week... week ago. But there is opkg problem, which is preventing us from doing that. Do you really want buggy and unstable system marked as stable, only due to deadline? And unstable is bleeding-edge. As it should be. -- Sebastian Krzyszkowiak dos ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Sebastian Krzyszkowiakseba.d...@gmail.com wrote: [...] We just don't want to release crap as stable. There were problems with either FSO, SHR, build system etc. We wanted to start releasing testing images regular every week... week ago. But there is opkg problem, which is preventing us from doing that. Do you really want buggy and unstable system marked as stable, only due to deadline? And unstable is bleeding-edge. As it should be. You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a backport to testing, peoples are inclined to use unstable in every case (and I really hope your future effort on testing will go differently). Add the fact that actually shr is the unique way for the *average* user to use its freerunner in a modern way out of the box, add the fact that some software run only on shr and you'll get shr-unstable everywhere. You cannot ignore all that with it's unstable, flash another distro if you do not like it shr has just now the great task to realize an happy community, so if unstable is bleeding-edge please provide a really supported testing *branch* and not a snapshot, demonstrating it's a really Community Driven distro (and avoiding boring threads from me and other users and developers that instead of coding has to guess why their software crashes on latest shr, rebuild and upload again on opkg.org and so on). About crap/stability, why all the the OE problems comes in SHR as their appears? it may be better to focus only on FSO and SHR phone applications, backporting that to testing or the wished stable may be easy instead of taking care of all the git commits. You may consider stable OE branches too as a source. Please do not repeat OM mistakes wasting time on too many tasks, they returned to the basic to improve user experience demonstrating at least to listen the community in some cases, shr is Community Driven, so please perform better :) Again m2c. Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 17:21, Nicola Mfbnicola@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 12:38 PM, Sebastian Krzyszkowiakseba.d...@gmail.com wrote: [...] We just don't want to release crap as stable. There were problems with either FSO, SHR, build system etc. We wanted to start releasing testing images regular every week... week ago. But there is opkg problem, which is preventing us from doing that. Do you really want buggy and unstable system marked as stable, only due to deadline? And unstable is bleeding-edge. As it should be. You should feel the air. As in the past testing was only a snapshot and AFAIK I never saw a backport to testing, peoples are inclined to use unstable in every case (and I really hope your future effort on testing will go differently). That's exactly what we want to change now and what i said, but making -testing which is can't be upgraded doesn't make sense. So for -testing you have to wait until actual problems with opkg are solved (and that's unfortunately our fault, not OE or someone else). ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 12:40:14AM +0300, Risto H. Kurppa wrote: On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. Hard to believe: http://git.paroli-project.org/?p=paroli.git;a=summary - last changes 12 days ago, the commits before that are from 3 weeks ago.. (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) This is precisely why I think I decided to follow SHR from now on (unless something dramatically changes, with all the work at Qi I don't know how much time Mirko will have for Paroli, as much as might like it. A core app like Telephony for the Freerunner should not depend on one or two people... :( Rui -- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
Hi, On 24 Jul 2009, at 02:04, Nicola Mfb wrote: Hi! Is om2009 and paroli in a temporary sleeping status or was development terminated? Somethings changed in the last days and may be now there is less man power to improve them. Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. Regards, /mirko ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Hi, On 24 Jul 2009, at 02:04, Nicola Mfb wrote: Hi! Is om2009 and paroli in a temporary sleeping status or was development terminated? Somethings changed in the last days and may be now there is less man power to improve them. Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. Hi! Mirko, I really like to see the final version of Om2009, so I'm happy there is still the plan to release it. We need a legacy milestone for some reasons: *) we of course may choose between different distros, but the great part are not easy to setup correctly while other are bleeding edge and breaks things every week, we need to give a sort of stability to users. *) developers wastes their time doing self distro mantaining and struggling with a fast changing underlying system, it may be better that they will focus on code, instead of rebuilding software, caring of api/library changes and so on. Om2009 should so take the place of Om2008, developers may target it and support users in a decent way instead of guessing problem that are distro related. *) in this dark phase that will help the reorganization of community Best Regards p.s. good luck for the new job/company :) Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 9:40 AM, Mirko Lindnervegyra...@paroli-project.org wrote: Less man power is the right way of putting it. There still is development on both projects but less than before. Laszlo is doing a great job improving things in paroli which I am very thankful for. Hard to believe: http://git.paroli-project.org/?p=paroli.git;a=summary - last changes 12 days ago, the commits before that are from 3 weeks ago.. (I understand that Laszlo didn't get the support needed but got some of his code rejected - lost interest.. ) There still is the plan to release a final version of Om2009. It would be good if we could assemble a list of problems in paroli that need fixing for the release. How about http://www.paroli-project.org/trac/report/1 or http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Paroli-issues ? r - someone unhappy feeling that no-one is working on Paroli or bugfixing it.. I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! -- | risto h. kurppa | risto at kurppa dot fi | http://risto.kurppa.fi ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009/paroli status
On Fri, Jul 24, 2009 at 11:40 PM, Risto H. Kurppari...@kurppa.fi wrote: [...] r - someone unhappy feeling that no-one is working on Paroli or bugfixing it.. I actually tried Zhone the other day (when Paroli or FSO failed to delete SMS's from the SIM) and was very pleased with it - I'd really like to see it developed further! Hi Risto, If I remember well Mickey announced that zhone will not get anymore improvements and the one in fso 5.5 is basically the same of 5.1 :(. I suppose that FSO/SHR joint will mean that while FSO will be improved and extended SHR applications will be the natural candidate for their testing and reference implementation. As there is a distro based on zhone I do not know if at least their guys will improve it. The problem is that SHR promised on late 2008 a stable milestone, after that it was forgotten, they promised again on 22 may 2009, a lot of unstable to test fork where done and abandoned. Finally I just realized that it's a real nice hacking distro with tons of bleeding edge and regular breaking updates and there is no real interesting on stabilize it. I do not want to hurt anyone is only my opinion. With om2009 release plan I just thought: SHR has no man power or will to maintain two different branch, the stable and the developing at least now, the same for OM guys with OM2009, but I'm lucky and I may have OM2009 on the flash to have a stable working device, and shr on the SD to test and enjoy bleeding edge. I'm really afraid of all the shots that our device is taking while I think that the community is completely unorganized and the term community driven completely abused. m2c Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009 activating wifi
On Thursday 23 July 2009, pike wrote: Hi Is there a way to request WiFi activation from FSO straight from the command line ? Yes, if you search the archive you'll find some mdbus or dbus-send examples, or as saied you may use fsoraw. Sorry, I found none. I'm sure I just dont really know what I'm looking for. Anyway, mdbus helped me out: alltogether this is my way to get wifi from scratch that doesnt die every 20 secs : # keep the screen alive mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.ousaged /org/freesmartphone/Usage \ org.freesmartphone.Usage.SetResourcePolicy \ Display enabled # power up wifi mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.odeviced \ /org/freesmartphone/Device/PowerControl/WiFi \ org.freesmartphone.Device.PowerControl.SetPower True This one would be better: mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.ousaged /org/freesmartphone/Usage \ org.freesmartphone.Usage.SetResourcePolicy \ WiFi enabled # bounce eth0 ifdown eth0; ifup eth0 # more custom stuff thanks, *-pike ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: om2009 activating wifi
Most of the time I use only one essid, so I have this script to activate wlan: mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.ousaged /org/freesmartphone/Usage org.freesmartphone.Usage.SetResourcePolicy WiFi enabled iwconfig eth0 essid ESSID_NAME ifup eth0 -Aapo Rantalainen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
om2009/paroli status
Hi! Is om2009 and paroli in a temporary sleeping status or was development terminated? Somethings changed in the last days and may be now there is less man power to improve them. Regards Nicola ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
